I have to admit...I am struggling. The current political climate is causing some soul-searching....

[NRaleighLiberal]

The struggle is not wanting to damn a whole group of mostly faceless people - ie Republicans - for what some of their so-called leadership is saying and doing. I don't want to become bitter - or a hater. It is a weakness of mine to sometimes resort to hyperbole, to overreact, to generalize - so the Catholic church sex abuse scandal makes me wonder why anyone would want to remain a member of that faith. And now - between Mitt and the taxes, Ryan and the medicare lies, then the Ohio crap about denying minority early voting, and the last straw - the redefinition of rape and bizarre urban legends about how a woman's body under stress will "take care of it" - the idiocy, the rottenness, the willful ignorance and manipulation - I find myself there again - wondering how anyone can remain a member of party with such a rotted, fetid base and heart and message....

So I guess I either need to step away, turn it off, get away from it - but somehow get back to some peace of mind...my tendency at this moment is to pretty much turn my back on all Republicans - even if they are friends or familly...

Anyone else here understand this feeling? How are you dealing with it?

[RagAss]

1. Ha !...I have no problem turning my back on them....

Trust your gut. They certainly are that hateful and evil. You said it yourself - "redefinition of rape" - that can only come from the bowels of hell itself.

[NYC_SKP]

2. Akin and his ilk are zealots, they're mad, and, yes, it's hard to fathom that degree of bigotry...

...and ignorance, and shocking how many are out there like him.

Sorry. At least we all have one another.

[freefallinrefugee]

6. i totally agree

it is really rough it is hard to hear someone you normally like or even respect when they say stuff like this. Especially if you know what they are saying is absolutely false and they think it is absolutely true. it is hard not to call them on these things and say stuff you might not want to say but under attack from such stupidity and ignorance you might say something you regret to someone you love. it's not good. it is hard to be in the presence of willfull ignorance and not get made or say something.

[Rhiannon12866]

58. I agree, too. And it's terribly frustrating.

I discovered politics fairly late, always voted, mostly for Democrats, but didn't actually start educating myself and becoming politically active until 9/11 scared me witless. Joining DU in 2003 during the lead up to the Iraq war and working for my congressman (NY-20) during his last two campaigns have certainly taught me a lot.

I'm fortunate that it turns out that my long-time friends feel exactly the way I do, in fact two also joined DU. But then there's my brother, watches FIXED News and votes Republican, never doubting he could possibly be wrong, or that he's being lied to. I try to talk to him, but he likes to remind me that he has a Masters in Political Science.

Welcome to DU, freefallinrefugee! It's great to have you with us!

[coalition_unwilling]

65. OTOH, to 'love' someone who believes such ridiculousness brings the whole

question of 'love' itself into question and makes it contested territory.

[grasswire]

3. not the first time that a schism has developed in our people

Think about the Civil War. Think about the Revolutionary War. The politics, the policies literally split families apart, and friends and neighbors as well. I have family members who were loyal to the Crown and left for Canada (or were hounded out) and family members who stayed on the patriot side and were leaders in New England states as the colonies formed a union. Bitterness probably was rampant in the hearts and minds of both sides.

How do we deal with it? We each must choose our path; tyranny or liberty. And then we stand up for our choice. Tyranny or liberty. At some point families fracture. Friendships fracture. There is no other way.

[Bluenorthwest]

4. Dealing with it? That's what I call being a Democrat, kiddo. I was raised to turn my back on

Republican is a synonym for bigot. Being friends with people who are bigots is like feeding the sharks where the kids swim, nice for the sharks but overall a bad idea.

[Zorra]

35. But, but...just because they support and promote political

candidates who will make every effort to pass laws that are specifically designed to prevent millions of Americans from attaining their fully deserved equal rights does not make them bigots!!!

Just because these Good Americans self-identify with, and/or are members a group that has denying millions of Americans their equal rights as one of its main platforms doesn't make them bigots!!!

Um....wait, yeah, better scratch that. This does make them bigots. These "Good Americans" really are all bigots.

Probably best to shun assholes who do this type of things, and never make a pretense of condoning their hatred and bigotry. The validity of promoting and legislating of unwarranted hatred and bigotry can never be considered "just a matter of opinion" by any reasonably ethical society.

[kentuck]

5. Yeah, I know what you mean...

I guess we could be all Machiavellian about it and tell them that all politicians are just alike, even though we know they are not, and persuade them to not vote at all, then be the first in line to vote at election time...?

Or...

We could continue to discuss our side's argument in the most civil and rational way possible, hoping that they will see the light and agree with us, even though we know this is the most difficult route to go?

Since they have shown themselves to be rather weak in rationalization and comprehension and open to manipulation, perhaps the first route might be the way to go.

Or...

Just don't discuss politics at all.

[JDPriestly]

20. We can't have a constructive with conservatives because they speak

a language all their own.

They don't mean the same things we mean by terms like entitlement, taxes, regulations (for me a very positive thing that protects our environment, wages, families, food, everything). . . .

Yesterday a Republican told me he thought it was terrible that people who lost their jobs got two years of unemployment insurance. He apparently does not know that a small part of every paycheck goes into an employer tax that supports the unemployment insurance fund and that, were it not for the Bush recession, the money in the unemployment insurance fund would have sufficed to pay all the benefits needed.

This man used the term unemployment insurance, but he had no clue as to what it means or where the money is supposed to come from. He also had no clue as to how we got in to our recession. No clue whatsoever. And what is more he is not well enough educated to have learned to listen patiently while someone else speaks.

So I don't think that talking to conservatives will work.

[coalition_unwilling]

21. Not sure about where you live but in California unemployment insurance is

funded solely by taxes ("premiums&quot on employers. Employees are not taxed to pay for UI. (One can argue that employee wages are reduced somewhat b/c employers must pay the UI premium, but that's different than saying that employees are 'taxed' to pay for UI.

[JDPriestly]

23. Yes. But theoretically all costs of employment are actually the employee's wages.

Same for Worker's Comp. Insurance. For the employer that is a cost associated with the pay for the individual worker. It is not a tax on the employer's income or profits, but rather a tax related to employing the worker.

So I agree with you, but I see a complexity beyond saying that the employer pays that tax. When the employer pays a tax resulting from the employment of the employee, in my perspective that is also a charge to the employee.

Theoretically, if the employer did not have to pay that tax, the employee could negotiate a higher wage. Further, if the employer did not pay the tax, then the employer's profits -- taxable profits -- would be presumably higher (minus the loss for the income the employee generates).

I'm not an economist, but having worked in the management of a non-profit, I see all costs associated with hiring and paying an employee, all costs that result from hiring and paying an employee as costs attributed to the employment and the employee. If you fire the employee and don't hire someone to replace him, you don't pay the unemployment insurance.

[coalition_unwilling]

34. I don't work in HR, so am relying only on apocryphal info here, but I've always heard that

if an employee is fired for anything other than cause, the employer's UI costs go up, b/c the UI premium increases. Not sure if that is true, though, just something I seem to have picked up along the way.

Other than that, agree with everything you've written here.

[JDPriestly]

37. Maybe, but that would not work well since if a company folds,

it can't pay UI costs any more. That would put the burden of paying for UI on defunct as well as functioning companies.

[Bandit]

40. There are State unemployment insurance and federal unemployment insurance

Everybody that draws a paycheck contributes a small amount to the federal unemployment insurance program. There is also State unemployment insurance and in my state, my business pays 6.03% and the employee pays .62% for a total of 6.65% paid every paycheck...

[FLyellowdog]

7. I am right there with you.

I don't think I can honestly enjoy the company of most of the Republicans I know because I can not justify ANYTHING they stand for. If they don't take a stand against some of the filth and garbage that's being spewed by the Republican candidates and their supporters, then they are, at best, condoning it or at the worst, supporting it.

I cannot find even one right wing issue that I can agree with and that's pretty unbelievable. NOT ONE.

Most (if not all) the republicans I know are hate-filled bigots who are basically still mad that a black man is in the White House. This is a most egregious paradigm to me and I will gladly sacrifice my friendships rather than appear to accept such rhetoric by keeping politics out of our relationships.

I, for one, will not tolerate the intolerable.

But then, that's just me.

[Kalidurga]

8. My apolitical SO leans right...

He is 57 years old. After listening to him tonight talk about health care, I am starting to get it. He really doesn't like himself at all. He says he would rather die than have thousands spent on his medical care. I tried to explain to him that the ACA and the medicare debates outcome will effect our children more. He is starting to get it, but I have a long way to go with him on this issue plus many others. But, at least he isn't one of the angry ones and he doesn't vote, he just doesn't get the issues.

[Demonaut]

9. alien to my mind, the level of hate

[kestrel91316]

10. I have just a few Republican friends. One seems to be

leaning a tiny bit lefter since we caught up on FB with each other after over 25 years.

The other is a RINO at this point. Heck, 30 years ago in college I would never have guessed that he was a R even then. He's the one who sends ME all the anti-RW stuff on FB, lol. He thinks the R party has gone completely around the bend. But he's a pro-gun fiscal conservative in the old, not-crazy way.

A very very old family friend appears to be a TEABAGGER, which is so strange because she has been on disability for MS for many years. She didn't even graduate from HS, I don't think, so as one of the less educated her uber-patriotic, anti-gubmint, American exceptionalism is right out of the cliche book.

[Skittles]

17. again

there is NO such thing as a "fiscal conservative". NO SUCH THING!!!!!!!!!!!

[airplaneman]

11. K&R I am beginnig to really belive they are insane!

[Jamaal510]

12. I feel you. I don't get their mindset, especially non-rich GOPhers.

I don't know any personally. But judging from what I see on TV and read online, most of them are willfully ignorant and pt their fingers in their ears when presented with facts that clash with their views. You could try telling them that trickle-down economics is a failure and that there have been 0 terrorist attacks under Obama's watch, and that Mitt R0bme pays an abnormally low tax rate compared with others of lower income. But they'll still find a reason to hate on Obama and liberals in general. Reasoning with a GOPher is like talking to a brick wall.
Luckily, the G0Pee could become irrelevant in a few decades.

[bobbyblack]

13. But my "friends" damn me so easily...

I say something I do not about a policy, or a stance I take umbrage with, or a politician who says ot does something I disagree with and I get attacked, I get called yes...NAZI....I swear, the modern southern bible belt poor white no health=care having voter/friend blames "you damned liberals" for every problem under the sun even as the party they vote for without hesitation no matter who and what is sending them down the cattle chutes toward the slaughterhouse. I have no words sometimes because their heat and white-hot rage at my feelings, no matter how carefully worded and painfully explained they are, just puts me aback, and sometimes I just say...wow...thank you so much for sharing, and leave the conversation...it is mind-numbing.

[Raine1967]

47. Welcome to DU.

They are not your friends, imo. Friends respect your opinion or debate it. Friends don't bully.

[truebluegreen]

53. They have to blame SOMEBODY

for the fact that their lives didn't turn out like they planned...Somebody ELSE.

My sister is one of them. Her life has been very hard, despite a good beginning (upper-middle class, good mind, good education)--extreme poverty, welfare, homelessness, etc.--all of it traceable to her own bad decisions (starting with dropping out of college and marrying an un-employed or employable authoritarian jerk and then having 4 children in quick succession). He wouldn't ALLOW her to work outside the home, even before their first child--and she acquiesced. She always has.

Now they are doing OK, thanks to government programs that allowed him to go back to school and obtain a degree. But she's a full-on born-again evangelical and he's a government-hating self-made man. They revere Rush Limbaugh and watch nothing but Fox News. And all their past problems were Someone Else's Fault.

We don't speak.

[Historic NY]

14. I go to a car show, an acquaintance from yrs ago..

shows up with an older car barn find. He was asking for advise I walk around the car and there is a new bagger yellow stain sticker. I walked back around and said I'm sure you can find some catelogues and walked away. I no longer have the time or patience for these people.

[nolabear]

15. I think you're witnessing the dissolution of the party.

I understand the feelings. It's horrifying. I think you have to remember exactly what you know--that there are many layers to this, that some terribly scary people are involved but there are a whole lot of just ordinary people who are trying to figure out their lives. I disagree with a lot of them but sympathize with their struggle and their fear. It's the controlling, hypocritical, powermongerers in the leadership that infuriate me, and the willfully ignorant that frustrate me, but I do hold onto the hope that enough of us will keep the country going long enough for some benefits to kick in and deceptions to be revealed, and it'll get better.

I don't know about you but I see the next generation as very different, with far different attitudes about things, and if the hyperGOP don't just plain destroy the economic base by pillaging the whole country they will manage things very, very differently.

[FedUp_Queer]

16. I feel the same way...

about voting for Obama (or being a Democrat). How can I identify with a party who has a president who refuses to hold people accountable for war crimes (the Bush cabal); how can I identify with a party whose leader reserves the right to assassinate American Citizens without a trial, without charge and with no due process; how can I identify with a party whose leader has proposed slashing the community services block grant by 50%. I've come to a conclusion myself. I won't support a party or president who does so. I will support candidates who do not. In all seriousness, I understand. As a gay Catholic, how can I identify with a Church who is so awful on LGBT issues? I'm torn because that same Church is also the largest provider of services to HIV+ and AIDS patients in New York City. This is the same Church (my parish) that paid my rent when I was out of a job. This is the same Church where I've met wonderful activists fighting for the poor and outcast. I guess the point is there are no organizations that are all good or that don't have skeletons in their closet. There are certain positions, however, which seem to be the "last straws." For me, it was the abuse scandal in the Church. I will go to Mass; I will attend Mass; I will worship. I will not give money to anything but my Parish (nothing for the Cardinal's Appeal); on matters of faith or morals, the Bishops have nothing to say to me. In other words, I'm a Catholic because of what I believe, not because I want to identify with the label. Similarly, I will not vote for Obama; I will not give him money; I will not give him time. I will, however, support local Democrats; I will continue to believe in the tenets of what I thought a Democrat was (and is). In short, I am a Democrat because I believe in a progressive income tax; I believe that the rich should pay the most; I believe in health care as a right; I believe that our spending priorities should focus on money for roads and bridges, on education, on making sure people have food, a place to stay and other necessities; I believe in pursuing peace and forsaking war; I believe in human rights.

[Skittles]

18. excellent response, FUQ

you show so many ways we can be torn and yet still resolute

[brush]

22. Agreement with a candidate

No one agrees with everything a candidate does. You listed several things that you believe in that the President is fighting for. You also list several policy points of the President that you disagree with. We are all in that same boat. There are things that the President hasn't done ( ormaybe hasn't gotten to yet because of the huge amount of Bush garbage he had to clean up) that I wish he had but I agree with him and the dems on many more things than I do the repugs. And remember all the obstructionists repugs who have made it extremely difficult for the President and his party to accomplish many things. Even his major accomplishment, the Affordable Care Act had to be watered down just to get it passed but I'm thinking that the President takes the long view on things and understands that the ACA as presently written is the gateway to eventually getting single payer healthcare for everyone. I'm saying all that to simply say that no candidate is going to think exactly like you and do exactly what you want done when you want it done. Politically sometimes it's not possible and sometimes things take more time to get done than anticipated. Please don't regret wasting your vote if Rmoney gets in because then you'll really have a president that you don't agree with.

[FedUp_Queer]

44. Generally, I agree.

However, on too many issues that are important to me, Obama IS Bush (or Romney (enter fascist name here)). In that regard, there are too many areas where he had no Republican pushback (such as on the items I mentioned, particularly on the CSBG) that preclude me from voting for him. I just can't do it. If not for those issues, I could hold my nose and vote. With those, I can't. Maybe it's because I have the luxury of living in a solidly blue state. The one thing that really gets me about him is the CSBG proposal. This was not something the GOP forced him into. This was an item he proposed in his budget in the State of the Union. What's so bad is that this is a program that had bi-partisan support going back to Uncle Newty when he was Speaker. In fact, it was GOPhers who saved it from Obama's knife. That burns me. My father works in this area. He works for a Community Action Partnership (conference going on right now in New York City). I met with Dad yesterday and remarked that I always figured that I didn't think we would have to fear cuts to this vital program coming from a Democratic President. I just doesn't compute for me. I couldn't vote for a GOPher candidate who was for marriage equality but who did the things Obama has done on these two (for me) lines in the sand. In that regard, as I said before, all I can do is stay true to principle and fight against a Democratic President. Talk about schizophrenia.

[Raine1967]

48. Obama is NOT Bush.

or -- any fascist, period.

You don;t want to vote? Fine, but stop advocating NOT voting, please. That is against the TOS here at DU. Let me give you a link:

Vote for Democrats.
Winning elections is important — therefore, advocating in favor of Republican nominees or in favor of third-party spoiler candidates that could split the vote and throw an election to our conservative opponents is never permitted on Democratic Underground. But that does not mean that DU members are required to always be completely supportive of Democrats. During the ups-and-downs of politics and policy-making, it is perfectly normal to have mixed feelings about the Democratic officials we worked hard to help elect. When we are not in the heat of election season, members are permitted to post strong criticism or disappointment with our Democratic elected officials, or to express ambivalence about voting for them. In Democratic primaries, members may support whomever they choose. But when general election season begins, DU members must support Democratic nominees (EXCEPT in rare cases where were a non-Democrat is most likely to defeat the conservative alternative, or where there is no possibility of splitting the liberal vote and inadvertently throwing the election to the conservative alternative). For presidential contests, election season begins when both major-party nominees become clear. For non-presidential contests, election season begins on Labor Day. Everyone here on DU needs to work together to elect more Democrats and fewer Republicans to all levels of American government. If you are bashing, trashing, undermining, or depressing turnout for our candidates during election season, we'll assume you are rooting for the other side.

[NYC_SKP]

50. Keyboard Komando!

Tough self-proclaimed progressive, oooh!!!



People who will not vote for the democratic nominee make me

Really, they should go about their business and not stir shit here, not during election season.

[FedUp_Queer]

55. FYI.

I nowhere referred to myself as a "progressive." If a couple inconvenient facts hurts your sensibilities "during election season," I suggest politics is a little too "rough" for you. If not "during election season," I'd love to hear when facts ARE appropriate...particularly ones that don't fit the narrative we have created.

[NYC_SKP]

59. Never mind.

I'm pretty sure you misinterpreted the OP, who will be voting for Obama.

[FedUp_Queer]

61. I'm pretty sure you can't think...or read.

How obtuse.

[FedUp_Queer]

54. Normally, I wouldn't respond to someone who completely distorts what I write.

However, I won't stand by and watch garbage like your characterizations. What I said is that I cannot vote for Obama...I just can't. On at least some of the issues that are important to me, he is worse than Bush. That's a fact. Bush, as awful as he was, never reserved the right in no uncertain terms to assassinate American citizens on his whim. Bush, as awful as he was, never proposed to decimate the CSBG. Would I vote for Bush over Obama? NEVER. Would I forgo voting for Obama and vote down ticket? Yes. Sorry, but Democrat does not equal good. I will vote for people who agree with me. I will vote for people who are in favor of the issues I am in favor of. I will not label myself a liberal, progressive or Democrat. We elected a Democratic House and Senate in 2006. What happened? Accountability for war crimes rivaling the worst war criminals in world history went completely by the way side. Where is the accountability for the crimes of the bankers? Unpunished. In fact, the Obama administration dropped the case against Goldman Sachs. I guess the bottom line is that you put party over principle. That's your choice. You can vote for someone blindly because they have a "D" behind their name regardless of how they treat the poor. If your only concern is electing people in a bucket called "Democrat" regardless of their actions, have at it. How is that different from the monolithic behavior Democrats accuse Republicans of? So...again, I'm not telling anyone to not vote. I didn't suggest that anyone should not vote. I didn't say I wouldn't vote. I DID say I will not vote for a president who reserves the right to declare a fellow citizen has no entitlement to due process and kill that person or who proposes gutting one of the most important social programs for poor and lower income people, which has been successful for years. I would argue that a president who does those things is not a Democrat at all but a center-right Republican corporatist. If a person who does those things but who happens to be a "Democrat" is supposed to receive my vote because he's a Democrat, it's not going to happen. So...for me, I will not vote for Obama. I will note advocate for anyone. I WILL vote for Charlie Rangel (though I think his best days are past). I will vote for my current State Senator and Assemblyman. I will vote for Melissa Mark-Viverito (my council member).

[brush]

57. Question

What the hell are you advocating? Are you voting the Romney/Ryan cabal or not? Just say it and stop wasting peoples time. And if you're not voting that's wasting your time as well. Who needs this crap now when we're talking about the possibility of Romney/Ryan getting in to help corporations off shore the remaining good jobs here while they continue the repug attack on women's rights. And you're here talking about not voting for a sitting Democratic president. You're not the only fed up, buddy.

[NYC_SKP]

62. I think you're filling this thread with insults. "I will not vote for Obama"

And I think you're duly busted for your reply and can't take it.

We don't need you. We don't need your kind, your kind that won't support Obama.

Pathetic.

[LWolf]

49. I hear you.

[Arugula Latte]

19. At this point I know only two Republicans, really.

One is an old friend who is smart, but also rich and greedy. Okay, I get her motive for being Republican. She's actually fairly moderate to liberal on a lot of issues, but likes to cling to her Republican roots to be different and daring in her crowd.

One is someone I wish didn't have to be in my life, but is because he's dating a close relative. He's a nice enough, pleasant person to be around, but dumber than a box of rocks. So that explains his affiliation; he's an old white guy who doesn't read much and has the intellectual depth of a puddle in the desert.

[Doctor_J]

24. Anyone still voting for these people is either terminally stupid

or evil. Period. They are of course brainwashed by Big Media and Hate Radio, but there is no way to deal with them like you would with sensible humans. They are the enemies of America and Americans.

[mnhtnbb]

25. We have a lot of Republican relatives--not many friends because friends we can choose--and

it's become increasingly difficult to be around them.

I find myself either biting my tongue when with them or avoiding opportunities to be with them.


I do not know how the Republicans of the Eisenhower era have allowed the Republican party to drift
so far to the right and to become so unempathic. Republicans have become a party of liars,
assholes, cheats and greedy people.

[southernyankeebelle]

26. My husband has alway told me I should never question a relationship of a person and their god. That

is between them. I am a catholic and I know there are many terrible priests. Both not all priests are bad. I have worked with and met many in the past. I have stopped going to church because the bishops think it is ok to get involved in politics. The church has left me and the working people. You can also find terrible religious people in all religions not just the catholic religion.

[uponit7771]

27. "...the Ohio crap ..." This is what brings me to a similar point

[reformist2]

28. Be patient. The GOP is going to collapse.

[randome]

39. I see that happening soon, just like the fall of the USSR took us by surprise.

[Doctor_J]

43. Been hearing that one for 18 years since Gingrinch & Limpballs took over the country.

It's still not true. They are not going to "collapse" as long as they have a stronghold on the media.

[stillwaiting]

46. Also, since the Democrats are beholden to corporate interests now as well.

So many around here thought the Republicans would be irrelevant after 2008.

Then, 2010 happened.

That wasn't long was it?

We need systemic change in Washington. Until the rules are changed on what is ALLOWED to happen in D.C. this will continue. A perpetual cycle of hope to dashed hopes to hope again. It's all they are currently allowing us to have and it is purposefully demoralizing.

[lunatica]

29. Just remember it's a Presidential election year

Crazies like the Teabaggers come out with a vengeance. It isn't wrong to want to beat them back into the closet or back under their rocks. They're banshees, screeching till our ears bleed.

Hyperbole is a good release in years like this. It keeps us sane.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

30. Sometimes I have to take a break. I neither watched nor listened to any political commentary this

weekend. I do podcast Ed, Stephanie and Randi Rhodes. Well, Randi was out all last week, so tha saved me. Ed was hit or miss, so I didn't pay too much attention. That leaves Stephanie Miller, and she and the Mooks always bring me comic relief when I need it.

As for the t.v., Martin Bashir was out. I didn't watch Rachel, Ed, Rev. Al or Larry O.

Sometimes you just need to take a break from all the political madness or you'll drive yourself crazy!!

[valerief]

52. Excellent point. It's true. I need to take breathers every so often to avoid implosion. nt

[spin]

31. As far as the Catholic church sex scandal ...

I don't view it as a problem with Catholics or even the Catholic faith as it is basically a problem involving some priests and their leadership.

I have often stated, "The problem with Christianity is not the religion itself but is instead some Christians."

I could also state that the problem with politics in our nation is politicians. I personally find the philosophy of the Democratic Party far more reasonable in most areas than the Republican philosophy. However, I suspect that many of the people we elect to represent our interests find themselves bought and owned by the 1%, the big corporations and Wall Street. This is largely due to the enormous expense of running a political campaign today. All those irritating negative TV advertisements might be effective but they are also very expensive.

A very wise old Irish uncle of mine once told me when we were discussing politics. "Before the election, politicians kiss your ass, after you usually find you kiss theirs."

We don't live in a perfect world and probably never will.

[GoCubsGo]

32. Yep. I understand.

Just this morning, I went to my Facebook page, only to see a post from my jackass brother ranting that Illinois is charging a tax to people who patronize strip joints.in order to pay for rape crisis centers. He got the story from foxnews.com, which he frequents, sadly. I have already removed him from my news feed, because he has been posting a lot of right-wing garbage as of late. I clicked on the "family" tab just to see what was going on with my family, and that's how I saw this shit. Part of me wants to just reply, "Awwww! Poor widdle pervies having to pay a sin tax. Cry me a fucking river." But, a bigger part of me wants nothing to do with him right now. So, I will probably just let it go, and let my sister reply, like she did the last time. I suspect it was aimed at me anyway. Not going to engage him, because he'll just go back to trying to defend Mitt the Twit for not making his tax returns public. I kid you not.

[riverwalker]

33. I am a bitter hater

after the crimes of Bushco, Iraq war, Abu Ghraib, the hundreds of thousands of deaths and suffering, the teabagger insanity, dismantling of FDR's legacy, etc, etc, I get a visceral physical reaction in my solar plexus when near a Republican, an old-brain survival instinct kicks in, call it "fight or flight" whatever. My hatred is primeval: These people want to destroy me. The bitterness is a tool, a bullshit detector, and removes any naive illusions that these people love this country and it's citizens.

[cbdo2007]

36. It gives me a major sense of loss and grief because my dad is a Repube....

and I feel like I can't have a relationship with him anymore because he's so crazy with all this irrational shit all the time.

[randome]

38. Don't EVER give up on trying to remain objective.

You owe it to both your friends and your enemies. And yourself.

[Doctor_J]

41. WTF is that supposed to mean?

That we should calmly and reasonably consider the arguments of the birthers and teabaggers?

I loathe bromides, especially when they are delivered non sequitor

[randome]

42. He spoke about resorting to hyperbole and overreaction.

My point was to not give in to that.

If you lose your calmness and objectivity, then you lose the ability to see clearly.

[Bluerthanblue]

45. I wish I could say I didn't understand...

but I do.

All too well. I have never felt as challenged to not simply give up on people who talk and promote Romney/Ryan and their strange, hypocritical, hateful garbage.

It seems impossible to get away from it- the mail, the radio, the newspaper, conversations at the gas station, the farmers market, post office- bumper stickers and yard signs... no matter where you look the constant reminders are there.

I could at least respect that those who call themselves republicans because of sincere policy issues stood behind a candidate that was a strong supporter of that stand, but it is SO clear that Romney/Ryan's sole purpose is to make the rich richer- and they will adopt any social stand that they think will get them elected.

It is clear to me that the republicans I know, are simply supporting RR because they are not Pres. Obama- not because they support Romney.

It is depressing to see. wish I had some encouraging words.

I'm looking forward to reading the replies here, in hopes that there are some positive suggestions.

Thank you for voicing this- I share your struggle.

[valerief]

51. Rich republicans are greedy, soulless assholes and not-rich republicans are ass-for-brains morons.

It's really difficult to not face the obvious.

[indie9197]

56. There is no hope for them until they learn to think on their own

I grew up in a Rep home- dad was ex military and had a fairly high position in the State Dept (Senior Executive Service). As a result, I always kind of assumed I was Rep also. Liked Reagan, etc. I seriously started questioning things during the first Bush when he was pushing NAFTA and the "New World Order". Also the Gulf War was a disgusting display of propaganda I thought. My favorite motto is "actions speak louder than words". "Follow the money" is my second favorite. Republicans are notorious for saying one thing and doing the exact opposite (second Bush and the Wall St bailouts). IMO their tax cuts for the upper brackets are what got us into this deficit. Until your friends stop listening to AM talk radio and start doing their own research they are hopeless.

[NYC_SKP]

63. I cope by remaining in "survival mode"... It's us or them.

I don't have to damn every member of the party, I pity them.

I do, however, damn those who I think know better but fan the flames of bigotry nonetheless.

It doesn't bother me to be resolute in my damnation of them.

This is increasingly about survival, there isn't much freedom or time left to act, so we have to be bold.

You might have to turn your back on some, bite your tongue, be diplomatic.

Just remember that sometimes lashing out at them makes them uglier, so if you can stay calm it's better.

[coalition_unwilling]

64. I turned my back on all Republicans after Operation Shocking and Awful and

the lies and rationalizations used for it. Nothing I've seen since has prompted a moment of reconsideraton or of regret for that decision.

[gattaca82]

66. taking a step back

look if your family and freinds are good poeple they just disagree with you politically its no reason to just turn your back on them. if you go take any poll online or on the phone or and it could be anything.. it could be about the presidential campaign all the way to whats your fav color. you WILL ALWAYS get peopel who think differently and want different things.. poeple you truely care about.

to turn your back on them everytime you disagree with someone because u disagree with there politics.. is just wrong in my oponion. some of the best poeple in your life and i mean best.. the ones who save your life end up being someone you might have disagreed before strongly. just remmeber that.

[NRaleighLiberal]

67. I've not responded to anyone in this thread yet, but there are many ideas, thoughts, wisdom...

and caring in these responses - I've read - and continue to read - the various opinions and views. I've found great value in them - and hope there are more - I will continue to keep an eye on it, and hopefully find time to comment on some. I think it's an important topic - and it is clear that most of us here at DU struggle with our feelings - none of us live in a bubble of just liberal or just Dem only, so how we interact with others in these charged political times is pretty damn important, I think.

Thanks to all for your comments. You've given me much to ponder.