Would anybody here be interested in a non-fundamentalist atheist group?

[old as dirt]

This discussion thread was locked as off-topic by EarlG (a host of the General Discussion forum).

I've noticed that religious folks have several groups here, but that us atheists have only one group, and non-fundamentalist atheists don't have any groups at all.

As I see it, non-atheists would also be welcome in this group, so long as they are respectful of us non-fundamentalist atheists.

I imagine a serious group based on respect and science, not on silly internet memes.

ARETHA FRANKLIN SINGS "RESPECT" LIVE 1967!

Would you be interested in such a group?

18 votes, 0 passes | Time left: Poll closed
	Yes.
	5 (28%)
	No.
	13 (72%)
	0 DU members did not wish to select any of the options provided.
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[old as dirt]

2. I'm a life-long atheist.

Just not a fundamentalist.

[Silent3]

3. Explain "non-fundamentalist atheist"

Lacking belief in deities is all you need to be an atheist. Not a lot of “fundamentals” to get fundie about.

Do you mean not trying to impose atheism on others the way Christian Nationalists try to impose Christianity on others? That pretty much covers most atheists I know.

Do you mean not having a book that is taken as word-for-word literal truth, which dare not be challenged? Again, that fits most atheists I know.

Oh, I get it! You mean quiet, meek atheists who are never assertive or confrontational, who think religion is a wonderful thing for those who want to have it, atheists who are practically apologetic about being atheists.

[old as dirt]

8. Sounds good to me.

Do you mean not trying to impose atheism on others the way Christian Nationalists try to impose Christianity on others?

[old as dirt]

9. Actually, fundamentalist atheists accuse us militant atheists of burning down churches.

Oh, I get it! You mean quiet, meek atheists who are never assertive or confrontational, who think religion is a wonderful thing for those who want to have it, atheists who are practically apologetic about being atheists.

We don't do that.

Our very existence seems to disturb the fundamentalists, which is why they make up lies about us.

[hlthe2b]

69. Yes. It would seem the poster needs to define the term in the OP

[betsuni]

4. The point of being an atheist is not caring about religion, not having to think about it

or talk about it because you don't care.

Like trying to have a group for shy people and of course they're not going to come.

[old as dirt]

5. I've been shy all my life.

Like trying to have a group for shy people

I'm pretty sure that I'm not the only shy atheist in the world.

[betsuni]

6. You don't get the joke?

Shy people wouldn't flock to gatherings to talk about their shyness with other people and atheists have little interest in talking about religion because they have no interest in the subject.

[old as dirt]

7. No, I don't understand the joke. (nt)

[old as dirt]

10. Let me ask you this.

Can a shy person have an interest in History?

Can a shy person have an interest in Anthropology?

Can a shy person have an interest in Music?

Can a shy person have an interest in Dance?

Is there something about shyness that precludes any of these?

[betsuni]

11. I have no idea what you're talking about.

[old as dirt]

14. Hey, I'm a mathematical logician by profession.

I'm going to have a huge problem trying to explain those sciences to anybody.

Especially considering how shy I am.

I just don't think that we should let our own shyness limit our own studies as amatuers, that's all.

[betsuni]

17. Here, it's humor:

http://www.motherearthnews.com/sustainable-living/nature-and-environment/shy-people-zmaz85mjzraw

[ItsjustMe]

19. I'm a mathematical logician by profession.

[old as dirt]

28. Happily retired.

The Logical Song

[betsuni]

25. So again, why would a shy atheist have any interest in forming a group to

talk about things they have no interest in -- groups (other people) and religion?

[old as dirt]

27. I'm guessing you wouldn't. (nt)

[Sky Jewels]

12. "fundamentalist atheists"

Your agenda and framing are pretty transparent.

[old as dirt]

15. The group wouldn't be for fundamentalists, anyway.

So don't worry about it.

[Mike Niendorff]

13. "Fundamentalist athiest"?

Extreme false equivalence, attempting to cast atheism as somehow being just a flavor of religious fundamentalism.

Notably, this *is* an argumentative tactic frequently employed by religious zealots -- attempting to portray their opponents as really being just as non-rational and authoritarian as they and their religious cohorts are (thereby attempting to render the distinction moot).

So yeah, put me down as a "no" here, because the premise is false and the intent is highly suspect.


MDN

[old as dirt]

16. Cool. Got you down as a "no".

[multigraincracker]

18. I'm a Secular Humanist...

For what it is worth.

[multigraincracker]

20. Secular humanism

Wikipedia

Secular humanism is a philosophy, belief system or life stance that embraces human reason, secular ethics, and philosophical naturalism while specifically rejecting religious dogma, supernaturalism, and superstition as the basis of morality and decision making.[1][2][3][4]
Secular humanism posits that human beings are capable of being ethical and moral without religion or belief in a deity. It does not, however, assume that humans are either inherently good or evil, nor does it present humans as being superior to nature. Rather, the humanist life stance emphasizes the unique responsibility facing humanity and the ethical consequences of human decisions. Fundamental to the concept of secular humanism is the strongly held viewpoint that ideology—be it religious or political—must be thoroughly examined by each individual and not simply accepted or rejected on faith. Along with this, an essential part of secular humanism is a continually adapting search for truth, primarily through science and philosophy. Many secular humanists derive their moral codes from a philosophy of utilitarianism, ethical naturalism, or evolutionary ethics, and some advocate a science of morality.

[old as dirt]

29. Sounds good. (nt)

[Duppers]

21. We atheists come in one flavor.

We do not believe in the existence of a deity.
Period.

We are not agnostic.

"Non-fundamentalist atheists"

[MayReasonRule]

23. God-damned Right!! The Real Good News - No One Is A God-damned Thing

Non-fundamentalist atheist...

Sounds like a turd in a taco to me.

Doubt is my "savior".
Reason is my "god".

May reason rule.

[ParishPolitique]

42. Hey fellow Louisiana atheist Dem! I tried to send you a PM but said I don't have enough posts yet :P

[MayReasonRule]

47. Hey Y'all!! I'll Check My Settings To See If I'm Able to Adjust That...

It may be that's a part of the site's algorithm.

I'm in Caddo. What part do you reside within?

[ParishPolitique]

65. Can you send me a DU mail message? :)

[claudette]

22. As a

Student of Buddhism, I'm more agnostic than atheist. But, I see your point. 🙂

[old as dirt]

31. What was it that Bertrand Russell said?

Something to the effect that where he draws the line depends on his audience.

I think he called himself an atheist when speaking to the lay public, but an agnostic when speaking to Philosophers.

Or something like that.

[Croney]

24. I don't know what a non-fundamentalist atheist is, but

the label is too clunky. Atheist is sufficient.

[NeoGreen]

26. DU already has one, it is called...

... The DU Lounge.

[MayReasonRule]

49. LOL

[ParishPolitique]

30. I shall use my first post here at the DU to say - as an atheist - This thread sucks!!!

I promise my second post will be more substantive.

[old as dirt]

32. Hey!

Welcome to DU!

[ParishPolitique]

40. Thank you. And I'll add that while there is no such thing as a fundamentalist atheist ..

.. there are plenty of atheists who are assholes, just as there are plenty of religious people who are. Atheists who are pushy, elitist, and insulting -- I think this is what you mean by "fundamentalist atheists." But this is an asshole problem, not an atheist one. I would recommend spending less time around assholes, theist and nontheist alike.

[JHB]

33. No

You'd need to explain what you mean by "fundamentalist atheist" and then explain why the present Atheist group is apparently reserved for them, and it's not just a case of assholes being loud in a particular space, which can be counteracted by ignoring them.

[old as dirt]

34. The hatred that they push can have real world effects.

And can be hard to ignore.

Angry White American Man

[yardwork]

45. So the purpose of your group will be to urge other Atheists to be quiet about their beliefs?

It sounds like you're trying to create a new group on DU whose stated purpose is to pester another group.

[old as dirt]

56. Nah, it's about respect. (nt)

[yardwork]

60. Respect begins at home.

Is it respectful to demean the DU Atheists group?

[Generic Brad]

35. What could there possibly be to discuss?

Atheists don’t recruit. They don’t feel a compulsion to gather. We certainly don’t need a forum to hash out degrees of no belief.

Ain’t nobody got time for that.

[LostOne4Ever]

36. Calling any atheist a "fundamentalist" is bigotry

You should be ashamed

[old as dirt]

38. I've had atheists tell me that I should be kicked out of the country.

Just because of who I married.

[LostOne4Ever]

41. That had nothing to do with calling any atheist a fundamentalist

Calling atheists fundamentalists is bigotry and has no place on DU.

[old as dirt]

43. My first experience with atheists at DU...

...was to be told by fundamentalists that my wife is a liar, just because of her identity.

And then one of them started coming at me with the N-Word.

[LostOne4Ever]

46. Anyone who would do that would be INSTANTLY nuked

So they would no longer be on DU.

If they still are on DU that probably means you are either a) misrepresenting what happened b) not giving full context or c) both a & b

[yardwork]

50. Those sound like personal attacks. Did you alert on the posts?

DU juries let a lot of things go, but it's hard to imagine a post calling somebody the n word not being hidden. Did you communicate this to EarlG? That post sounds like a violation of multiple DU rules.

What it's not is a definition of atheism. Atheists don't have any religious beliefs. They reject the whole paradigm. As far as I know, no other sets of beliefs are required to consider oneself an atheist. Their opinions will run the gamut.

[old as dirt]

53. Oh, it was alerted on, but not hidden.

Same thing when they called my wife a liar.

[yardwork]

54. Well, I'd forward those posts to EarlG if they concern you.

A couple of personal attacks are not a good reason to attempt to create a whole new group on DU whose stated purpose is to pester another group.

There are occasional trolls on DU, despite DUers' dedicated volunteer efforts. There are rude posts, despite DUers' volunteer efforts. Deal with it.

[old as dirt]

62. The stated purpose would be a safe space for respectful atheism.

A place where atheists are allowed to speak freely.

[yardwork]

64. That's the definition of the existing group.

If you think it's violating DU terms of service, take it up with the hosts.

[old as dirt]

68. Atheists are not allowed there. (nt)

[EarlG]

70. A post calling you the N-word was not hidden?

Please send me a link.

[old as dirt]

71. Ok, but it may take me a while to find it. (nt)

[obamanut2012]

51. Oh, I sooooo doubt this happened -- link?

Of course not.

Calling atheists fundies is rank bigotry.

You really are not a great person, are you?

[MarineCombatEngineer]

61. How about a link to your claim?

I find it hard to believe that anyone on DU called you the N word, that would be an instant hide and ban.

[old as dirt]

63. no stalking, please (nt)

[MarineCombatEngineer]

66. So, no link?

BTW, asking for a link isn't stalking, it's a request.

[yardwork]

67. Lol! You're stalking a whole group with this thread!

[if..fish..had..wings]

37. God knows...

I'm fundamentally opposed

[GoneOffShore]

39. You should move this to the Lounge

[old as dirt]

44. I find the theology of cattle rustling humorous. (nt)

[obamanut2012]

48. OP is calling atheists hateful in this thread

And also loves spamming the Atheist group on DU with Catholic dogma.

This OP is disgraceful, and yes, hateful.

Good grief.

[yardwork]

52. That's my take, as well.

I'm not an atheist but I'm close to several.

[dsp3000]

55. good lord, there are athiest denominations for real now? I think South Park did an episode on this

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Go_God_Go

[obamanut2012]

58. No, there are not -- the OP is attacking DU atheists

[old as dirt]

59. I think I may have seen a clip from that a while back. (nt)

[Jokerman]

57. "Seekers on Unique Paths"

Link to the forum:

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=forum&id=1226

IIRC, this forum was created exactly for others who, like you, claimed that they didn't quite fit into any other categories.

As a long time member and follower of the Atheists & Agnostics forum I can say that your continued use of the "fundamental atheist" slur is likely to be poorly received.