General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsLatest Obama rumor going around here.
I have heard this twice now. Obama is going to take our guns away. And to do this he is going for some kind of resolution thru the UN so that we will all have to comply even though guns are not against the law in this country. Somehow he manages to get everything done by going around all of the existing laws and he is going to do it again.
Oh, and there is going to be a huge riot.
This stuff makes me nuts. I did tell those who were panicked over this that if this were really true the NRA would be going absolutely nuts. The paper would be full of letters to the editor. And neither is happening - not a word anywhere.
Atman
(31,464 posts)This is all the rage among my crazy RW FB friends. The UN somehow has the power to override the United States Constitution and unilaterally ban and confiscate all 300,000,000 guns in the U.S. Hillary Clinton has voted for it, and will help make it happen.
No discussion about how our Constitution or international treaties work is tolerated...such talk is just met with "But Obama has already shredded our Constitution, all he has to do is sign an Executive Order." It is pretty surreal. America is full of lots and lots of very stupid, very paranoid (and very racist) people.
yardwork
(61,629 posts)We've been hearing that Obama will confiscate all our guns and Bibles since 2007 but nobody has shown up at the door to collect the firearms and religious tracts yet.
Before Obama we were told that (insert Democrat) was going to confiscate all the guns. Still hasn't happened. Black helicopters from the UN haven't landed yet. How do they explain this delay in implementation?
JHB
(37,160 posts)...and yet my Chinese vocabulary still consists of nihao and some menu items. No blue meanies force-educating me to learn more.
And now they're concerned about Executive Orders? How about the ones that put all that "shredding" into place while a certain Shrub was pretending to clear brush?
Atman
(31,464 posts)JHB
(37,160 posts)If you don't hear from me again, then the answer is "yes".
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)by glen beck, in an effort to ... wait for it ... wait for it ... drive his book sales.
JaneyVee
(19,877 posts)1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)I distinctly recall beck saying that "Simon & Shuster approached him, asking him to read, edit and 'distill' this 'unpolished, but way too long' novel into something they could sale!"
You mean beck LIED to his audience? Oh the shock! The horror of it all!
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)Glad you linked to it, as I had missed it.
But what I suspect the author/editor might not fully appreciate is that beck's audience will read this piece of fiction as containing "researched fact." After all, that's how beck is selling it. I suspect, if one were to do a search of freeperville (if it has that capacity) in a couple of months (because it'll take that long for most to "read" the novel), we will see specific excerpts from the book ... I the form of:
mzteaze
(448 posts)Thanks for posting
tyne
(1,248 posts)would make a cartoon(for Facebook) something to the effect of:
Before you start on yet another paranoid gun-grabbing tirade, would you please let me know so I can buy stock in ammunition/cabelas/remington? Thanks in advance.
I'm in Idaho and this would really help me out
yardwork
(61,629 posts)Christmas is coming. Time to stock up because Obama is going to steal our guns again11111
NewJeffCT
(56,828 posts)or thereabouts?
RKP5637
(67,109 posts)NewJeffCT
(56,828 posts)if I recall.
Aristus
(66,380 posts)It's your typical, tired, right-wing conspiracy boilerplate that's been around for decades. They don't even bother trying anymore...
It's as effective for selling guns to the idjits as "Buy this cologne, and you'll be as sexy as George Clooney!" is for barfly types...
oswaldactedalone
(3,491 posts)Damn, I want my money back.
Where do I sign up as a gun confiscator and re-education camp trainer? Is that how we lower the unemployment rate?
Aristus
(66,380 posts)LiberalFighter
(50,942 posts)leftyladyfrommo
(18,868 posts)I couldn't understand the UN part of this.
Xmas is coming. Buy your loved one a new assault rifle. You need it to protect yourself from the rise of the third Reich. (That's the one I read about last week) The medfia and Obama are in collusion to rasise Obama to dictator.
Man, this stuff is really getting nuts.
It is hard for me because I know these people and really like them. They are good people - just not educated. I tend to just nod my head and say nothing at all.
yardwork
(61,629 posts)They've been brainwashed. Literally. The Republicans are using sophisticated psychological techniques to play on people's fears and resentments. It's easy to rile people up when you push their buttons, day after day after day.
If I listened to a steady diet of that psy-ops I would probably believe it too.
proud2BlibKansan
(96,793 posts)condemning Agenda 21.
I would imagine other state GOPs have done so as well.
So this is relatively mainstream thinking on the right.
Enrique
(27,461 posts)because the NRA is quite capable of pushing any conspiracy theory, no matter how bogus. Remember what they did with Fast and Furious. So tomorrow the NRA comes out and denounces Agneda 21 (I think that's the UN thing you are referring to) and then there goes your argument. Maybe they already have. Same with the letter writers, I'm sure there are plenty of LTTEs about this that your friends can produce, and so there goes your argument.
fightthegoodfightnow
(7,042 posts)leftyladyfrommo, some gun advocate is going to try to get this thread locked as off topic (which it regrettably probably is).
Any discussion of guns, even if as a side note to UN action or Obama in general, almost always gets moved to the RKBA group (no forum available) where there is a strong abundance of pro-gun advocates to help make sure that never happens.
yardwork
(61,629 posts)Scuba
(53,475 posts)... in fact, it'll be illegal to utter the name of Gawd, Jeebus or Ronald Raygun.
You'll be required to marry someone of the same sex and anyone who complains will be sent to a "re-education camp".
Whites will be made into slaves for the blacks.
You'll have to buy an electric car or a bicycle. Maybe both!!!
And he was waiting until his second term to do all this, because, well you know.
Tsiyu
(18,186 posts)for abortions in Hawaii.
I think I'm gonna fake being pregnant and go next week.
patrice
(47,992 posts)leftyladyfrommo
(18,868 posts)Man, I am so far behind the times here. And I read the paper every day but I still seem to miss so much. The Kansas City Star is a left leaning paper - or so the writers to the editors say all the time. However, it seems to me that they really try to give equal time to both sides - in letters and editorials. But what do I know.
patrice
(47,992 posts)what you describe.
I saw the website for it a few months ago, can't find it right now, but the same or similar provisions could be buried anywhere in here http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery
The website described a pledge that the Senate should take to prevent any UN treaties that limit or control the flow of US weapons, including small weapons, into other countries.
I am concerned about this, because it is fertilizes foreign soil around the world for situations that will result in the deaths of US armed forces & their UN counterparts. IOW, it's Project for a New American Century promoting and EXPANDING the our, now nationless, Military Industrial Complex.
The "Libertarians" I know who were pushing a petition supporting this sign-or-we'll-see-to-it-that-you-lose-office extortion of the US Senate have since left here and moved to South Dakota.
Auntie Bush
(17,528 posts)The crazy's have enough idiotic lying talking points already.
Fumesucker
(45,851 posts)Render unto Caesar that which is Caesar's.
leftyladyfrommo
(18,868 posts)Having doors slammed in your face as you go house to house gives you extra points toward going to heaven.
My, this is getting too funny.
Fumesucker
(45,851 posts)Blessed are they which are persecuted for righteousness' sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
It's not even extra points, you win the entire lottery when you are persecuted.
And you are supposed to walk the extra mile as well.
Matthew 5:41
And whosoever shall compel thee to go a mile, go with him twain.
bhikkhu
(10,718 posts)...basically, the second amendment was held to overrule local gun restrictions. There are no new gun restricting laws in the works because, basically, they would be invalid before they were written, without a constitutional amendment.
And nothing the UN says is "law" or binding on us here in any way, for better or worse. Needless to say, Glen Beck, his listeners and the NRA are clueless idiots - the give "conspiracy theory" a bad name!
leftyladyfrommo
(18,868 posts)Now I have something decent with which to answer these arguments.
Hosnon
(7,800 posts)The U.N. is one of the primary sources of international law, which is binding upon the U.S. with regard to international law (for whatever that's worth).
Also, the U.N. Charter is a part of the supreme law of the land pursuant to the Constitution. While the supremacy probably only relates to the organic statute (the existence of the U.N. itself and our participation in it), it's possible that clear directives from the U.N. could be considered binding legislation here in the U.S. (at least to the extent that they do not conflict with the Constitution, a treaty, or any subsequently passed legislation).
bhikkhu
(10,718 posts)Its been pretty well conspiracy-theoried to death, so there is no shortage of speculation and argument online, but what it comes down to (here as well as regarding the OP) is settled law, as decided by the Supreme Court interpreting the US Constitution.
Nothing in the US charter, even considered as a treaty we are signatory on, has legal standing or establishes law here, unless a specific federal implementing law is written, passed and signed for each case. Which puts the UN in the same boat as anyone else - if you have a law you want implemented, you have to get a majority in our elected congress to support it, then you have to have the president sign it.
"Could be considered binding legislation here" was, perhaps, at one time valid speculation, but the Supreme Court decided very broadly against that possibility in Medellin vs. Texas. They left little room for ifs and maybes in that decision, and its unlikely to come up again.
Hosnon
(7,800 posts)And not all treaties are non-self-executing.
WinkyDink
(51,311 posts)leftyladyfrommo
(18,868 posts)and I knew that people here would know more about it and where it actually came from. And see, they do.
thelordofhell
(4,569 posts)George W. Bush allowed the military to confiscate civilian guns after Katrina
Honeycombe8
(37,648 posts)Obama hasn't made one move toward passing gun laws or anything. He has quite a lot on his plate without that. He might have that as a goal in the far future, but there are more pressing items on his agenda right now.
still_one
(92,215 posts)Freddie
(9,267 posts)My husband sold an old deer rifle for a lot more than he thought he'd get because "you won't be able to buy guns anymore." He did not dissuade the buyer.
Hosnon
(7,800 posts)The Second Amendment protects the right of Americans to own firearms. In order to change that, the Constitution must be amended (a conflicting law would simply be unconstitutional). The Constitution has a very explicit amendment process; it is an exclusive process, that is, any attempt to amend the Constitution must be made via that process.
The agreement establishing the U.N. is an Article II Treaty - a treaty signed by the President and ratified by at least 2/3 of the Senate. And while obtaining the signatures of the President and at least 67 Senators is impressive, it is not sufficient to amend the Constitution.
Therefore, nothing the U.N. does can alter our rights under the Constitution, including our Second Amendment rights.
former-republican
(2,163 posts)By use of BATF
It wouldn't take them away but firearms could be made much harder to obtain.
Hosnon
(7,800 posts)former-republican
(2,163 posts)Hosnon
(7,800 posts)former-republican
(2,163 posts)The UN rumor is just silly
Hosnon
(7,800 posts)DevonRex
(22,541 posts)If Congress decides firearms should be more difficult to obtain then ATF will enforce the laws they pass. That is all.
Some people should learn a thing or two about the constitution and Congress and federal agencies.
former-republican
(2,163 posts)safeinOhio
(32,687 posts)with a teabag nut at work. I think he bought it too.
If you have cable, Obama and the FBI/CIA have records of who watches FOX news and how much. They are now building internment camps for them. You can avoid this by switching to MSNBC or look out......
yellowcanine
(35,699 posts)They aren't stupid. The rumor varies between guns and ammo. So they manage to keep sales high for both.
graham4anything
(11,464 posts)Maybe he can name Michael Bloomberg as get rid of the gun czar.
Please please please be true.
Guns are WMD and kill.
No true liberal would want one.
And I am Jewish and NO, having more guns would not have turned the Jewish people in WW2 into Nazi killers.
Rider3
(919 posts)The nutwings have been spewing this lie since Obama took office. Did you know that gun sales are at their highest since this administration came in? People are incredibly paranoid, not to mention gullible.
DCBob
(24,689 posts)Its just boggles the mind the crap these morons come up with.
coalition_unwilling
(14,180 posts)SomethingFishy
(4,876 posts)They going to go door to door? There are more than 300 million guns in this country. Good fucking luck collecting them. I have a friend who believes this crap and he says, "they'll never get past Tennessee.."
It's just stupid. They don't have enough to complain about so they just make shit up.