The NRA is a Right Wing organization

[obamanut2012]

They are not what they were decades ago, an organization to teach gun safety and instruction.

I do think that support of the NRA as an organization should be a TOS violation and the poster should be PRRed.

You can be a gun owner and not support the NRA. I am one of those. You can be a liberal and own guns. I am also one of those. You cannot be a liberal, or even a Conservadem, and support the NRA. It's impossible.

[onehandle]

1. Exactly right. The NRA is a domestic terrorism instigator and a wing of the GOP. nt

[RKP5637]

2. Decades ago when young the NRA and National Guard taught me how to do target shooting on our

boy scout rifle range. It was far different then. It was just something we did and was a lot of fun. Back then, there was not all of the crap the NRA represents today. IMO the NRA has morphed into a quite evil organization filled with hostilities and hatred.

[obamanut2012]

4. Exactly -- our Girl Scout troop had a class with them

About gun safety.

[Indydem]

10. They still do all of those things.

"All of the crap the NRA represents today" is inside of you. The NRA still does youth shoots. They still teach gun safety classes to people of all ages. They still advocate for responsible gun ownership.

You have changed. Not the NRA.

[ananda]

13. NO.

The NRA is pure evil these days.

[Indydem]

15. Because the majority of their support goes to Repukes?

Does that mean that the Military is pure evil?

How about union households that supported Scott Walker - they "Evil" too?

Or is it just their policies of opposing additional restraints on gun ownership that offend you?

Because calling them "pure evil" is a pretty blanket statement.

Perhaps you could point out some specific issues that you find evil.

[RoccoR5955]

16. Gee.

You sure came up with some specifics of pure evil.
I, for one would classify all of your examples as pure evil!

[davidthegnome]

26. Maybe you forgot the sarcasm tag?

If not... really? You're calling the military pure evil?

[RoccoR5955]

52. Yes I am

And I did not forget the sarcasm tag.
I have not, nor ever will be an advocate for the military.

[MightyMopar]

79. NRA board member calling for Obama to be killed just for starters

[heaven05]

19. afraid

of losing our gun(s) are we? Put that fire out in your hair. you're running too fast, might injure your brain.

[PoliticalBiker]

36. Don't try to pull that

I was one of those that took the gun safety classes at the villiage rotary club.
We didn't have the kind of violence then we have today.
Constant 24x7 news cycles were not there.
The need for a paid pro-firearm at all costs lobby group was not needed... it still isn't
The fear of self-protection was no part of the equation.
The NRA made it part of the equation when right-wing nutbags began asserting their political agendas
The NRA promotes no restrictions on gun availability or ownership
The NRA actively works to repeal any and all gun legislation
The NRA opposes all additional regulation
The NRA coerces legislators by openly *grading* responses to bills
The NRA puts false information in their ads for candidates

Tell me again the reason for the NRA?

[thucythucy]

47. So does "well regulated militia"

you know?

[PoliticalBiker]

50. Patently False

There was a different mindset then than there is today.
Blood and gore wasn't mainstream in society as it is today.

The NRA tactics are nothing short of terrorism. Probably because they have a combined IQ of yer shoe. They are a bull in the china shop while hiding like a coward behind the Constitution.
Virtually every part of the Constitution has reasonable restrictions while still maintaining the spirit and intent of it. It MUST be no different for the second amendment. I am a gun owner and I support the second amendment, but just not unrestrained like the neandertals in the NRA

[BainsBane]

69. No right is absolute

All have limitations. Gun rights long ago passed point where they interfere with our right to life. The difference now is that people have finally had enough. The NRA is in hiding. They know their position is indefensible.

[DisgustipatedinCA]

56. You're posting in support of the NRA, and I believe your post should be removed

We don't support terrorists here, and we don't support Republicans. And NO, the 1st Amendment doesn't have any application at Democratic Underground.

[Indydem]

57. You may believe whatever you wish.

Until the DU administrators (not you) decide that the NRA, which supports dozens of Democrats, including Harry Reid, is an organization who's support is inappropriate, then I will continue to tell the truth about an organization that I know to do good works.

Terrorists? Really? Causing a lot of terror are they?

Hyperbole much?

[DisgustipatedinCA]

62. If you continue to vocally support this organization, you should be prevented from posting here

I already had a pretty good handle on that thing about me not actually running this website. But I'll continue to advocate for people like you being sent elsewhere when you feel like praising this piece of shit rightwing terrorist group.

[Indydem]

64. Luckily for me, you don't run this place.

So I will continue what I'm doing. Thanks.

[BainsBane]

70. Argue until you're blue in the face.

We don't care any more. We are taking action, and gun owners who care about the nation's children are joining with us.

[ThatPoetGuy]

83. Luckily for us, decent people ARE allowed a say in how this community runs --

and a jury of decent people (four of them, anyway) decided that no, you WON'T continue filling this thread with lies on behalf of a murdering organization.

Oh right -- you can't reply to this. Because decent people told you to take your ugliness and stuff it.

[Lasher]

84. How can I recognize these decent people?

Lately I'm having a hard time telling the difference.

[ellisonz]

87. NRA =

[Erose999]

75. Their support of "gun safety" is a front. They are a lobby and propaganda for the gun manufacturers.

If they gave a good GOD DAMN about gun safety they would support b/g checks, waiting periods, tracking of ammo purchases, and keeping the crazies from getting guns.

[elleng]

61. Same here, at summer camp,

and when I became a Jr. Counselor, I taught target shooting to other campers.

[spanone]

3. if there were about gun safety they would have already made a statement...right wing lobby group

nothing more

[axetogrind]

5. Right on.

They are no more than a wing of the GOP now, problem is that they have a lot of money to spread around to buy politicians.
They need to get rid of the crazy board of directors and get back to being what they were before.

[Tutonic]

6. I look forward to the butt kicking that the American public

is about to unload on the NRA. We are in the grief (sorrow) stage. In the coming days we move to ANNNGGGEERRRRR The NRA and their minions are going to fry y'all. refreshments are on me!

[_ed_]

7. NRA = Republican front group

The NRA does nothing other than enrich Republicans and support gun and ammo corporations. Support of the NRA should be a TOS violation.

[LisaLynne]

8. Excellent point!

Thank you for your insight.

[Indydem]

9. Is there any liberal or progressive organization that teaches gun safety?

Is there any left- leaning organizations that teaches youth shooting and respect for firearms?

Is there any liberal organization that stands for the 2nd Amendment and the RKBA?

If there is, I will join their ranks TODAY.

Until then, I will proudly remain a member of the NRA.

Not because of everything they do. Just the important things they do.

[obamanut2012]

11. They advocate RW stances on many issues

They help elect Teabaggers to Congress and State offices.

They do not stand for gun safety and Second Amendment Rights. Not for decades.

[Indydem]

12. They support pro-2A Democrats - including Harry Reid.

They help elect people that represent their causes - including dozens of Democrats.

And they DO continue to teach safety classes and hold youth shoots.

[SpartanDem]

22. Do you really support Wayne LaPierre?

And the crazy things he's said about Obama.

[obamanut2012]

23. +1

[Lone_Star_Dem]

27. They've spent tens of MILLIONS of dollars to defeat democrats.

The pittance of money compared to that they contribute to pro gun Democrats in Republican leaning districts does nothing to offset that damage. It's all a ruse to appear bipartisan. A thinly veiled ruse at that.

[Hugabear]

28. Their support of Democrats pales in comparison to their support of Rethugs

Especially the more rabid Teabagger types.

Without the NRA, I imagine that folks like Harry Reid would still manage just fine.

[JaneyVee]

34. Their bad FAR outweighs their "good".

[ieoeja]

58. So you support the single most sadistic, totalitarian laws in the United States: 3 Strikes.

The NRA invented these laws. When I was a member of the NRA, they touted this as one of their great achievements. They bragged of actually writing the first such laws. Then successfully sued the State of California for failing to apply the law to a 1st time offender.

Yes, the law was written to imprison 1st time offenders, not recidivists, for the rest of their lives. No chance at rehabilitation even though the vast majority of 1st time offenders never recidify. Tens of millions of people who would have gone on to decent lives now rot in our jails because of the NRA.

And you support this monstrous organization.


When the 3 Strikes insanity started some within law enforcement spoke out against it. They pointed out that studies showed that most career criminals stop shortly after turning 30. So putting these people into jail for another 30+ years after that didn't make any sense.

But then, we had less recidivism when we tried rehabilitation in the '70s, but still reject rehabilitiation.
The few remaining prisons we have that *do* try rehabilitiation have less recidivism. We still reject it.
Countries that do extensive rehabilitiation have much less recidivism than us. We still reject it.
The War on Drugs has been an inexpensive failure. But we still continue it.

When intelligence and revenge collide, far too many of chose revenge. Since they make their revenge legal, don't break the law, go to church and take care of their children, they believe themselves good and decent human beings. They're not. Warping "justice" to destroy "criminals" makes them evil pieces of shit.

[2ndAmForComputers]

63. I predict much flailing and no meaningful answer to this post.

[Indydem]

65. Yes. I support three strikes legislation.

Apparently, so do the Democrats in California, who now have a super majority in the house and senate and control the governorship.

[ieoeja]

71. And that makes you a sadistic, monstrous evil.

You support this tyranny. You support destroying lives in your bloodlust for revenge. To support 3-Strikes legislation you must believe that criminals are simply evil and incapable of change. Ever.

This is not The Lord of the Rings. These are not fucking Orcs. They are real people with real lives. And you want them utterly destroyed.

You are evil. A lot of Democrats are evil too. Lots of people have perpetuated evil in the name of good. That list is without number.

And you have proudly staked claim to a place on that list.

[Starry Messenger]

72. Three Strikes got repealed in the last election by Prop 36 in CA

In the same election where we got the super majority of Democrats. Just FYI.

http://www.sfgate.com/politics/article/Prop-36-Three-strikes-changes-approved-4014677.php

[renie408]

74. So, HOW exactly do you know you are a progressive?

Seriously. Not being icky here. You are passionately pro-gun and you are for 3 strikes. Those are some fairly anti-liberal things. You are a member here, so that means you must either self-identify as progressive/liberal or you are here under the radar. And since that 'under the radar' things is REALLY not working out for you, I am guess you genuinely think you lean progressive/liberal. I am just wondering what liberal/progressive beliefs you hold. Cause now we all know which ones you don't hold.

I am really thinking you can be a non-NRA supporting gun owner. The 4-H has several shooting programs for youth and, hell, even our Rec center holds gun safety classes (we are in SC, though, so that might account for that). You don't need the NRA for that stuff and the NRA actively works to elect people who will defeat any progressive/liberal ideals you hold.

It's just a strange combination of beliefs to me.

[renie408]

73. You get that they spend YOUR money to defeat every other thing you supposedly believe in

right?

The NRA might have that single redeeming quality, but Ted Bundy was generally held to be a charming guy. And cute, too.

Let's try this from a different perspective...forget guns. What LIBERAL tenets do you ascribe to?




Ok. So, how does supporting the NRA further THOSE things? Realistically, no liberal is going to get rid of the 2nd Amendment. It is probably safe. We might want to curtail the ownership of certain guns which support large magazines and are typically used in mass shootings and we might want gun owners to be more regulated, but a total gun ban just ain't gonna happen. You are supporting an organization based on this one issue which works tirelessly to get people elected to office who will defeat every OTHER thing you are supposed to believe in.

Does that make sense?

[hogwyld]

14. The are not just a RW organization

They are a terrorist organization. They openly advocate for everyone to have a CCW and no bans whatsoever on guns, be they assault style weapons, or handguns. They are owned by the firearms manufacturers, and take no responsibility for any of the crimes commited by guns. I used to be a member many years ago, but fortunately, I have evolved, unlike the gun crazy NRA apologists.

[RoccoR5955]

17. I think what is REALLY needed

Is to make people aware of the first phrase of the Second Amendment.
"A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."

Keep hammering them on the part that the right is for those who are part of a well regulated militia, as part of national security. This has NOTHING to do with personal security.

Read it again, then tell me that it gives the right to keep and bear arms to ANYONE. READ THE WHOLE THING.

The NRA may provide rudimentary firearm education regarding use and safety, but they have become a fully fledged lobbyist for gun and ammo manufacturers.

[Lightbulb_on]

25. I'll tell you...

The right shall not be infringed so that the civilian populace could be drawn into a force if needed.

[thucythucy]

48. Yeah, right.

Who precisely are you expecting to invade us? Canada?

Perfect example of the sort of paranoa fostered by the NRA.

[Lightbulb_on]

55. Yes yes...

I'm sure the world will stay happy and civilized and sunshiney for as long as you or anyone you care about lives.

[thucythucy]

67. You didn't answer the question.

Who precisely is it we're all supposed to be arming ourselves against?

Which power is likely to sieze our nation, requiring the righteous wrath of well-armed citizen volunteers to protect us? This presupposes, doesn't it, that the entire military might of the United States will somehow be neutralized? Who do you suppose has the power to do that?

Or is paranioa just your general state of mind?

[RoccoR5955]

53. by a WELL REGULATED MILITIA

Why do you folks keep ignoring that phrase?!?!?!

[Lightbulb_on]

54. Who makes up the militia?

The people...

[RoccoR5955]

59. but the people

who are in the militia are the ones who should have the guns.
NOT just anyone.

I think someone's lightbulb is out.

[Lone_Star_Dem]

18. In response to the invitation by Obama to talk about gun control LaPierre said:

"Why should I or the N.R.A. go sit down with a group of people that have spent a lifetime trying to destroy the Second Amendment in the United States?"

Yes, they are a Right Wing organization. To pretend otherwise is foolish.

[Skidmore]

20. It is the lobbying arm of the gun industry.

Those who have a vested interest in making money on mayhem.

[DisgustipatedinCA]

21. They are right wing, and terroristic in their approach. Advocacy shouldn't be permitted here.

.

[DissidentVoice]

24. To Hades with the NRA!

Years ago, in the '70s, I was a Boy Scout and earned NRA medals for being a good shot with a .22 rifle.

If I could, I would return those medals.

The NRA has become the John Birch Society with 7.62 MM ammunition and crazies like Ted Nugent speaking for them.

Does anyone remember when President George H.W. Bush cancelled his lifetime NRA membership because of comments that NRA honch Wayne LaPierre made about Federal agents being "jackbooted thugs?" That was in the early '90s. They've only gotten worse.

Maybe they do still hold youth shoots, etc., but there's no way I'd feel safe letting a kid attend, because of the political indoctrination.

The Second Amendment has become an object of idolatry instead of what it is - a flawed document written by flawed human beings at a time when the worst firearms society had were flintlock muzzle-loading pistols and muskets with very questionable accuracy. There is no way the Founders could have foreseen AK-47's or AR-15's.

The "militia" clause has been stood on its head by crackpots who buy BDU's at their local Army/Navy, blast hell out of their back 40, listen to Limbaugh, watch Fux, and call themselves a "militia." We've had enough of that here in Michigan.

The "militia" IS:

The Army and Air National Guard
The Army, Navy, Air Force, Marine Corps and Coast Guard Reserve
Legally-constituted State Guards controlled by State Governors and Adjutants-General, most of which are unarmed anyway

I was in the Air National Guard. I swore a dual oath - to uphold and defend the Constitution of the United States and of my State, to obey the orders of the President, my Governor and the officers appointed over me.

Buying an AR-15 and joining the NRA does not make you part of "a well-regulated Militia."

[Puzzledtraveller]

29. They took our GUNS?!

[Harry Monroe]

30. And is this a sudden revelation you had?

The NRA has been a right wing organization for a LONG time. In other news, water is wet.

[obamanut2012]

37. Thanks for the unnecessary snark

To a thoughtful OP.

[Skittles]

77. there are people on DU who think NRA supporters are just A-OK

we want them to know the NRA is UNACCEPTABLE. END OF STORY!!!

[ehrenfeucht games]

31. The NRA is a Domestic Terrorist Organization (nt)

[Jeff In Milwaukee]

32. It's an industry-sponsored lobbying group...

masquerading as a grassroots organization.

Why would a gun owner be opposed to ballistic fingerprinting? A process that would help a stolen gun be returned to its rightful owner? Because the gun manufacturers know that if they gun isn't returned, you'll probably go out an buy a new one.

Why would a gun owner be opposed to allowing people to purchase two dozen of the same gun in a single purchase? They wouldn't care, but it's clearly an issue of great importance to the Marketing Department at Glock.

The NRA is looking out for the bottom line of the gun manufacturers and using members' dues to do it.

[RobertSeattle]

33. Exactly

For obvious reason gun makers don't advertise so they leave it up to the NRA to create demand via fear and fostering gun fetishes.

[maindawg]

35. the NRA long ago sold itself to the gun manufacturers

They are all about selling arms to assholes. its all about the money. They should be considered hostile to our democracy. Fuckers called me twice a day in Oct. I wish I had Wayne Lapiers number I would like to call him about 100 times see how he likes it.

[UnrepentantLiberal]

38. Agree and kick.

[Cleita]

39. We used to have something called the draft that taught most an American males and

some females about firearms. I'm not saying we should bring back the draft to send the kids to war, but maybe some mandatory military service say for six months for eighteen year olds could be required. They could learn about defense and do some domestic type service like replant trees in forests, stuff like that. If we do go to war then any kind of that military service should be voluntary. Any young person who has done their "draft" obligation would be that much ahead in training for war time military service if they really want to do that.

Okay, flame away.

[catbyte]

42. No flames here, Cleita. National service is a great idea. Maybe we can begin to instill a sense of

obligation to others. It couldn't hurt.

[Cleita]

43. Thank you. I'm glad some people might see some merit in this. n/t

[catbyte]

40. Agreed. My dearly departed dad returned his Lifetime NRA membership back in the 1990's

when they came out so rabidly anti-assault weapons ban. He was a police officer for 30 years and a lifetime gun owner. He saw the direction the NRA was going in and wanted no part of it. He taught me to shoot when I was 7 years old and to always respect the lethal power of firearms. He would be absolutely horrified by the events of last Friday and equally horrified by NRA inaction. God, I miss my dad...

I wonder if Wayne LaPierre is organizing a pro-gun rally in Connecticut like he did in Colorado after Columbine. What an obscenity that was.

[Indydem]

44. Man, debunking that gun grabber propaganda is getting quite old.

The NRA convention was already scheduled before columbine.

The event was extremely respectful and low key.

Charlton Heston did not make his "cold dead hands" speech there, as depicted by BFC.

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/1999-05-02/news/9905020283_1_gun-debate-gun-control-nra-leader

[catbyte]

49. "Extremely respectful and low-key"

R.O.F.L.M.A.O.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

45. The NRA used to be like an extension of "Field And Stream".

[obamanut2012]

46. I think that's a good analogy

[Spitfire of ATJ]

91. There was a time the NRA was all about preserving wilderness areas....

They even advised farmers to set up their fence lines so migrating herds of deer would be able to pass.

They were about promoting healthy herds and promoted the idea of father and son spending quality time walking in the woods together. There were even articles on setting up a duck blind and training your dog to fetch the ducks without crushing them.

Now they are nothing but a catalogue of guns with articles about arming up against the government and the United Nations.

BTW: The ATF needs to be subdivided. Linking a bottle of JD, a stogie and an M16 has created a hell of a stereotype. Kinda like a drunken "Sarge" in Quake III Arena.

[Dawson Leery]

51. The NRA used to promote enviromental conservation

and responsible firearm ownership. The modern NRA is an advocacy organization for the political right.

[Sissyk]

60. I agree with you on all counts.

You know, it can't be that difficult to not support the NRA here.

I will say this though. They are one of the very very few organizations that give training classes, certifications, etc. in my area. I have a few friends that have had to take those classes. But, you don't have to come here and talk about it. Or brag about it, whatever.

No NRA support on DU!

[obamanut2012]

80. Exactly

[Little Star]

66. I agree. But I also think you can't be a liberal and be for no gun control...

Gun control doesn't mean NO GUNS.

[Jack Rabbit]

68. I would like to see NRA members rise against Wayne LaPierre

Wayne LaPierre is the man who has made the NRA a partisan right wing lobby, no more respectable than George Zimmerman.

The NRA has always been interested in 2nd Amendment rights, even if throughout my lifetime they've had a different idea of what that is than I've had.

The NRA has increasingly become a partisan, pro-Republican lobby over the years, but under Mr. LaPierre it gone full throttle in the direction of the far right. Why did the NRA, under Mr. LaPierre's leadership, even take a stand on the House motion to hold the Attorney General in contempt? That was part of the GOP's ginned up discussion of Benghazi and had nothing to do with anybody's idea of rights under the 2nd Amendment. It's bad enough for the NRA to allow it's public face to be Ted Nugent, but Darrell Issa? Nugent is just a has been pop star with a big mouth. Issa is crooked politician and a dangerous demagogue.

Mr. LaPierre has also not been one to shy away from promoting conspiracy theories to oppose politicians seen as favoring gun control. He once charged that President Clinton tolerated gun violence in order to strengthen his case for gun control.

These are not the acts of a responsible conservative. Supporting a right wing demagogue on a matter not germane to the NRA's mission and spreading conspiracy theories about political opponents is neither temperate nor responsible. I'm not saying the NRA has to promote gun control or take any position that meets with my approval, but they would do well to shun the leadership of such an extremist as Wayne LaPierre.

In the end, it is up to NRA members what kind of organization they want to have. As long as their leadership contains a man who makes alliances with reprobates like Nugent and Issa, it will not be a respectable organization.

[Skittles]

76. CORRECT

and it SICKENS me the number of people who think their CRAP belongs on DU in the interest of "fairness". FUCK NO!

[jsr]

78. Wayne LaPierre: "We help Republicans that help us out. That's what our members expect us to do.”

More quotes:

“The Democratic National Committee is virtually 100 percent anti-firearms ownership, and the Republican National Committee stands on the side of the freedom.”

“I've come to believe he (Clinton) needs a certain level of violence in this country. He is willing to accept a certain level of killing to further his political agenda. The vice president, too. How else can you explain this dishonesty we get out of the administration?”

“We must never, never, never forget New Orleans, ... The equation is always the same -- where there are good people and bad people -- the good people only win if they are armed.”

[Logical]

81. I agree! And Ted Nugent on their Board Of Directors is all you need to know!!

[obamanut2012]

82. Seriously -- he is a horrible human being

A pedophile, draft dodger...

[Thinkingabout]

85. I see nothing reasonable coming from NRA on assault and rapid fire weapons.

It is not to deny hunters weapons for their sport for the real hunters wants game which is useable and as low as possible damage. NRA has played this game they are going to take our guns and gets sales for the gun shops and themselves. The repubs has instilled the idea of wars starting and one of the recent reasons was Romney was going to win and they would have to fight in order for him to take the oath of office, that was wrong so they have to think of another reason.

I will respect the NRA when they declare enough has happened and it is time to regulate the industry. Our nation has to face the mental health problems and just as we have speed limits there needs to be limits on how fast weapons will fire. Until I hear this from the AaNRA they will prove they are unable to figure reasonabiy and do not deserve respect.

[Cha]

86. Ted Nugent is a board member..

If Barack Obama becomes the president in November, again, I will be either be dead or in jail by this time next year.

http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2012/04/quote-of-the-day-ted-nugent-threatens-barack-obama/256025/

Does the Secret Service have their eye on the big mouthed threatening asshole?

http://meetthenra.org/nra-member/ted%20nugent

[ellisonz]

88. Kick

[Bobbie Jo]

89. It most certainly is.

[Care Acutely]

90. K & R. Fuck the NRA and their supporters.