Cafe owner shames mom for her messy children.

[Just Saying]

A coffee shop owner who had had enough of one mother's messy toddlers, asking them to leave before sharing a picture of the mess online, has come under fire for publicly shaming the family.
Lorraine MacDuff, who owns and runs Rainy Days Caffé in Washington's Lake Stevens, snapped a photo of the children's crumbs and posted it on Facebook.
Now, angry mothers, who believe Rainy Days Caffé should be more tolerant towards children, have attacked Mrs MacDuff and her shop.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-2385517/Rainy-Days-Caff-owner-shames-mom-messy-children-posting-picture-floor-Facebook.html#ixzz2bFYshSkL
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Honestly it looks like a few crumbs to me. What do you think? Was the owner justified or is she making a mountain out of a pile of scone crumbs?

[Nevernose]

1. If the cafe owner didn't want to pick up people's messes

Then they shouldn't have opened a cafe.

[Daemonaquila]

153. If the mom wanted to take the kids out into a restaurant

then she should've watched the kids more closely and cleaned up the mess that SHE ALLOWED herself.

[Nevernose]

156. If she wanted to clean up her own mess

She would have stayed home. Instead, she paid other people to clean up her mess. That's how restaurants work. Rather than cook and clean for yourself, you pay other people do it for you.

There were crumbs on the floor after dining. At a restaurant. It's not like they smeared feces on the wall.

[Autumn]

2. I'm going to say, I have seen adults in a restaurant with no kids

leave a bigger mess. That's rather petty of the owner.

[Liberal_in_LA]

151. exactly! she should pull up that carpet. get laminate

[MADem]

3. The owner shamed herself. She should get a Hokie carpet sweeper and chill out.

Jeez. Someone was having a bad day, and it wasn't the customers!

[niyad]

4. that woman has GOT to be kidding!! I have seen more crumbs than that from a croissant eaten

by an adult. seriously, several kids and the few crumbs I could see from that lousy pic?

well, I know one place NOT to visit if I happen to be in that neighborhood.

[prefunk]

8. Really? An adult eating a croissant?

I would say that the adult who makes a bigger mess than that while eating needs help. Serious help.

[niyad]

102. perhaps, before making a statement like that, you should visit the french cafe where they make

these really flaky croissants.

[kentauros]

106. Pastries can be tricky things to bake properly.

Bake it too long and it'll dry out. Plus, as is often the case, pastries at coffee shops have been there for at least a day, if not longer. Staling will dry out the pastry even more, such that when you bite into it, it literally explodes. And then there are all the variations on the simple croissant that bakeries like to use (almond, chocolate, dusted in nut crumbs or powdered sugar.) Those add to the mess.

I haven't looked at the image because I don't care about the issue all that much. But, I do have a background in pastry, so I like to see people know and understand the facts about baked goods

[NV Whino]

5. Don't ask me

I don't even like non messy children.

[Control-Z]

201. +1000 (nt)

[hughee99]

6. While I don't necessarily have an issue with the concept of shaming someone for behaving poorly,

this doesn't seem to be nearly enough of a mess to warrant such treatment. 10 seconds to clean up with one of those roller jobs isn't worth the negative image you have for complaining about something like this. If you ARE going to do that, though, complain on your private page to your friends and not on your business page.

[MotherPetrie]

7. I don't see where the cafe owner identified the crumb droppers in her FB post.

[Just Saying]

9. The shaming happened to the mother's face

While she was still in the cafe.

'The woman came up and she basically told us there was going to be a worker coming over and she was going to vacuum up the mess and that they had just spent $50 cleaning the carpets and she didn't appreciate us making such a mess, and that next time if we decided to come in, not to bring our kids.

The owner then posted the picture on her cafe's Facebook page and the mother saw it.

[MotherPetrie]

11. How did it make the news then?

[Just Saying]

13. Your guess is as good as mine.

Someone saw it on Facebook and called the media? A local reporter follows that FBI page? The mother called because she was pissed off?

[MotherPetrie]

16. I read the article. The mother saw the picture on the cafe's FB page -- and put it on her own wall.

Guess she wasn't so humiliated privately that she wasn't above using it to get public sympathy for herself. Talk about blowing something out of proportion.

[avebury]

86. So at that point, the Mother outed herself.

There is always two sides to a story. What we don't know is what the cafe has experienced from families with children in the past. This incident might have been the straw that broke the proverbial camel's back. It would be interesting to know if the cafe had any highchairs. If so, if the 1 year old was in a highchair, maybe the mess might have been so bad.

[marshall]

94. That is where shaming belongs, if anywhere

People should speak up if they believe inappropriate behavior is affecting them. And it does not appear that the owner sought to shame her in front of other customers. She spoke to her in private, and then posted a photo without identifying the woman. It was the young mother's own sense of shame that lead her indignation, and she dragged this into the public arena in an attempt to publicly shame the restaurant.

I have a young child and I always cleaned up after him as best I could, apologized for any mess, however small, and left a larger than normal tip.

[HiPointDem]

157. "She spoke to her in private" = where do you get that? there's no 'private' in that cafe, as

you can see from pictures of it. tables small & closely spaced, one room.

"I said exactly what she said that I said. I was like, 'You guys are going to need to leave. You're welcome to come back, but you can't bring your kids. Somebody is going to come over and clean this up now,'" MacDuff tells KIRO Radio's Dori Monson Show.

The mother and children that MacDuff chose to approach were so disruptive, she says, that she had to cut short a meeting she was holding with her insurance agent.

"We couldn't hear over the noise - crying, screaming - it's the stuff that honestly most moms are just used to it and they don't think anything about it," says MacDuff. "The kid was having a meltdown."

To all the people that say she should have let them stay and vacuumed up the mess after, MacDuff says no.

"That's not how you get to act in my shop," says MacDuff. "We are basically, I would say kid-oriented, but we are not oriented to people who are going to let their children act out."

For those that don't think their kids can behave appropriately, MacDuff says there is a fantastic bakery just down the street.

"There's this darling little bakery, the Oven Monkey, just right around the corner and she's a school teacher, they cater to children, they've got the tile floors and kudos to them for that."

http://mynorthwest.com/?nid=11&sid=2329505

[marshall]

172. The mother says the owner "came up to me"

I took that to mean she was in close proximity to her, and also no mention is made of other peoplw's reaction as a cause for the embarrassment. The mother felt offended by the fact that the owner dared to ask her to leave rather than her saying it in front of people.

[HiPointDem]

180. as you can see from the photo, 'coming up to her' doesn't mean it was 'in private'. if there

were any other customers in the shop at the time, she said it in front of others.

[marshall]

192. But there is no allegation of her being embarrassed in front of others

Or that the owner shouted at her. I would think the mother would have pointed that out were it the case. Perhaps as you point out others overheard, if any were present, but that doesn't seem to be a concern to either woman. If other people were involved the owner should have mentioned that other customers were being bothered, or the mother should have mentioned that she was embarrassed by others watching. Neither woman even mentions anyone else present.

[HiPointDem]

195. mother says she was 'humiliated' in the cafe.

Mrs Poore... had purchased scones for her children at the cafe. 'There were scone crumbs. . . What would she have done if I had accidentally spilled my coffee?' She recalled to King 5 news: 'I had my one-year-old in my lap and my three-year-old sitting in the chair next to me.

'The woman came up and she basically told us there was going to be a worker coming over and she was going to vacuum up the mess and that they had just spent $50 cleaning the carpets and she didn't appreciate us making such a mess, and that next time if we decided to come in, not to bring our kids.'

Mrs Poore said she was humiliated by the comment, and left quickly with her children.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-2385517/Rainy-Days-Caff-owner-shames-mom-messy-children-posting-picture-floor-Facebook.html#ixzz2bFYshSkL


no, it doesn't say there were other patrons, but there was at least one other person there besides the family, because the owner said she was talking to her insurance agent & supposedly couldn't continue the meeting because the family was making such an uproar.

i'm inclined to believe there were other patrons because the cafe is supposedly popular for its wifi, for business meetings, etc.

[marshall]

197. Probably there were others there, I agree

The mother says she was humiliated by the comment itself, making no mention of any reactions from possible onlookers. It is also interesting that the owner makes no mention of other patrons in her own defense, as she might justify her admonishment by saying the disruption was bothering anonymous crowds of people.

The fact that neither women mention others, in spite of the fact that to do so would bolster each woman's argument, makes me deduce that if anybody was there they either couldn't hear specifics of what was happening or didnt care enough to take notice.

[Daemonaquila]

152. That's completely normal.

Any time someone acts out, throws food on the floor, makes an unnecessary mess at a public establishment, etc., the owner or staff have every right to say something about it, and should. Or is the argument really that they shouldn't say anything because *sniffle* this was a moooooooooooommmy, but it would've been fine to say something to a bunch of workers coming in after a hard day and tracking in mud and cracking peanuts all over the floor?

[prefunk]

10. MORE tolerant? How about the parents offer to clean it up before leaving?

Remember, these are likely minimum wage earners who have to clean up after these folks. A little more consideration by the parents is what is needed here.

[Skittles]

12. I agree

when I leave a giant mess I also leave a giant tip

[prefunk]

14. Bingo!

[pnwmom]

26. Have you ever seen a customer with a broom and a dustpan, cleaning the floor?

Or running a vacuum?

I don't believe it.

[prefunk]

28. Yes, I have.

It was me, running a carpet sweeper to clean up the several packs of crackers my then-1 year old destroyed all over the place.

It's called being considerate. Perhaps if more people tried it...

[pnwmom]

31. Do you bring a carpet sweeper along with you wherever you go?

[prefunk]

32. Yes, everywhere I go.

Your sarcasm aside, most restaurants have them. Maybe the next time you leave a mess like that shown in the picture you ask if you can borrow theirs. I'm sure they will be happy to let you borrow it.

[pnwmom]

39. I have never in my life seen a customer using a carpet sweeper, vacuum, or broom in a restaurant.

Maybe it's a small town thing.

[prefunk]

46. Maybe.

I'll agree that it is unusual, but not unheard of.

[niyad]

104. I have eaten in restaurants of all sizes, in towns of all sizes, all around the country, and have

never seen a customer cleaning.

you must be one of their favourites.

[Orrex]

121. Until now, I have never witnessed nor heard of such a thing

I worked in food service for many years and have known countless waitstaff and buspeople.

I have seen all manner of customer oddities including a customer who tried to re-sell prepackaged cold cuts right at his table. My food service friends have likewise shared many tales of colorful customer quirks.

I've never seen a customer bring his or her own broom/carpet sweeper into a restaurant, much less use it to clean the site, and such an occurrence strikes me as so singularly unusual that I'm certain that one of my friends would have mentioned it if they'd encountered it.


I don't doubt your story, but in this regard you are approximately as rare as a unicorn riding a unicycle.

[snooper2]

113. We had a catastrophic failure with bringing lunch to the table at Disneyland

I saw a broom and dustpan up against a pillar by the trashcans and went to work

[whathehell]

185. Me either...It's a restaurant, for God's sake. If Ms. MacDuff can't handle crumbs in a bakery,

she really shouldn't be working in one.

[Just Saying]

18. It doesn't look like the owner gave them the chance

To leave a giant tip or to clean up.

[prefunk]

19. It is unclear exactly how this event took place.

In my experience, I find it quite plausible that the people responsible for the mess would have left it that way, no matter what else happened. Sure, there are exceptions.

[Just Saying]

17. I think most parents do try to clean up after their kids.

I do. But I don't bring cleaning supplies and a vacuum with me.

I've worked in food service so I know if you serve food, you will clean up food. The picture looks like a few crumbs and I think the owner overreacted.

[pnwmom]

27. As someone who has worked in food service, have you ever seen a restaurant manager

hand a vacuum or broom over to a customer so the customer can clean up a mess herself?

[Just Saying]

40. No, and I don't believe we would have given a customer our supplies to do it either.

It was part of our job to go out to the dinning area every so often to clean and wipe off tables and do a quick sweep if we could.

Children or not, some people are messier than others. Some would empty their leftovers and packaging into the garbage and the table relatively clean. Others might leave everything on the table and spill condiments and food on the table, seat and/or floor. And don't even get me started on the restrooms!

I can't imagine the owner or managers back then yelling at customers about food on the floor. It was expected.

[pnwmom]

47. Thanks for the reality check.

I think some of the people here never waste an opportunity to complain about young children and the tired parents who care for them. I'm long past that stage but still remember the challenge.

[Just Saying]

54. Yeah I figured this would go this way.

Mine are school age but can be messy at times.

I think this owner was out of line. She can post a sign if she doesn't want children in her establishment. I can respect that. But if she's going to serve food and drinks, there will be crumbs on her rug occasionally- even if she only serves adults. It's not that big of a deal.

[pnwmom]

55. I bet a lot of restaurants have bigger problems with drunk customers

than they do with children.

One young bride I knew, who had worked in food service, was ready not to have any alcohol at her wedding because she didn't want any drunks. She finally relented and allowed a champagne toast.

[Fumesucker]

58. I was at a wedding reception a few years ago where alcohol flowed freely

It did not end well and I told the tale here on DU.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=6098750&mesg_id=6098750

[Just Saying]

115. Absolutely

I shouldn't be surprised at how many people on here seem to hate kids! (And even parents!). But the amount of anger is surprising. And it always seems like the most judgemental don't have kids. I get that some people don't watch their kids and let them make a horrible mess, but that's hardly the case here.

[Daemonaquila]

158. Not at all.

I worked as a waitress in a restaurant on a college campus between low-income apartment towers and a slew of bars. We had drunks, and we had families with kids. I'll take the drunks any day.

I've never had a drunk cover a wall with ketchup. I've watched a mom let her 3-year-old do it without batting an eyelash. I've never had a drunk intentionally pick up a glass of water and pour it out on the floor. I've watched a laughing toddler do that with nobody lifting a finger. I've never had a drunk throw their food in every direction. I've had lots of babies in the restaurant do exactly that while their parents thought nothing of it, whether they were given a pile of cheerios or part of an adult entree when they where clearly too young to handle that kind of food. Given that this restaurant served Cincinnati-style chili, that got out of hand really quickly.

I've had to pour drunks out of their seats and into a cab. Mostly, no problem. Kids also, as long as they had responsible parents, no problem. But the rare nightmares were almost always kids whose parents just couldn't be bothered.

[Fumesucker]

21. If all the customers cleaned up after themselves there would be no job for the workers

No one is going to pay workers to watch the customers do their jobs for them.

[prefunk]

22. You would have a great point had anyone suggeston such action.

[Fumesucker]

24. If one group cleans up after themselves then why not all groups do so?

[prefunk]

30. It's called being considerate.

Maybe if more people tried it....

[Fumesucker]

34. Exactly, all those workers don't really need those jobs

It's not "considerate" to do someone's work for them in front of them and in front of their boss. If you want to show consideration leave a bigger tip if you make an inordinate mess.

Businesses hire the minimum number of workers for the minimum number of hours to get the job done, the less work to be done then the less hours the employees will see.

[prefunk]

43. Uhm, yeah, ok.

You have it all figured out.
Good luck with that.

Me, I'll go with being considerate.

[Fumesucker]

57. So what would your boss think if a customer were to do your job in front of both of you?

[prefunk]

60. I would hope the boss would think "hey, look how considerate these folks are."

The boss may also think "I wish more people were this considerate. Maybe I'll try to be more considerate myself."

Imagine how much better a place the world would be.

Or, we can continue to be pessimistic jerks and keep things the awesome way they are.

Me, I'll take Ghandi's advice and BE the change I want to see.

[Fumesucker]

61. You and I might wish that but that's not the likely thought pattern

No it's probably going to be more along the lines of "Why am I paying prefunk to stand here and watch the customer do her/his job?".

I know it would make me quite uncomfortable to have a customer doing my job in front of my boss, I would figure I was going to be criticized later for letting it get to the point the customer felt they had to do it. (thinking like wait staff here, a customer wouldn't dream of doing my job in the first place, that's why they call me)

The employer pays workman's comp insurance to cover any injuries their employees might sustain on the job, that insurance won't cover you if you happen to become hurt doing their job for them. It's unlikely that you would hurt yourself cleaning up in a restaurant but there's no doubt at all in my mind that people have been killed doing just that, unlikely-but-not-impossible stuff happens if you wait long enough.

Just leave a bigger tip, be nice and let the pros do what they do, in my opinion it will make everyone happier in the long run although the difference probably isn't all that huge.

[joshcryer]

68. Man, we could never dine together.

I'm all cleaning my table, making sure I haven't left crumbs anywhere, sweeping salt away (I am a big salt consumer, so if I see any grains I sweep them into my hand), replacing the salt shaker and condiments, stacking my plate neatly and if my nephews are around, attending to their stupid messes.

My booth is very close to being the way it was when I arrived. I'd hate to think that the employees got in trouble for that or felt bad because of that.

[Fumesucker]

71. You're making unwarranted assumptions

I don't make a big mess in the first place although I'm not crawling under a table to pick up crumbs (which is what this seems to be about).

It only took raising one child to learn to keep liquids well away from small children unless in a spill proof container, I watch that like a hawk, hate getting a lap full of chocolate milk or grape Nehi.

Make them put that drink in the middle of the table, not near the edge. It's well away and if it does get knocked over you have time to move before it Niagaras over the edge.

[joshcryer]

75. Oh I know that feeling.

It's important to give kids stuff that crumbles though because they realize quickly that if they squeeze it hard it's going to vanish. I took my nephew to McDonalds for his first time and cut up a kids hamburger for him. At first he was flailing all about and just being filthy (he's only 9.5 months). But by the end of the meal he was grasping the little squares I'd cut up lightly and bringing them to his mouth (I know this sounds young for his age but I assure you, I almost got this kid walking unassisted...).

There were a couple of grandparents across from me with their two young nieces (5-6?) and they left their booth with a masterful mess. Just a cluttered mess of crumbs and chaos. The worker quickly attended to the mess once they were out of the store (I'm sure trained to politely let them leave before rushing over there to clean it). Had it cleaned in about 45 seconds.

I realize, efficiency wise, I could've let her do the same to my area, hell, she seemed bored enough behind the cash register that it would've been a welcome change (this was just after the lunch rush and she just stood there with her hand to her chin looking around). But for me, nah, I just gotta clean that crap up. I did leave crumbs though and I like to think she got another break to go clean it, maybe it even left her with a challenge since I picked up all the big bits and the smaller bits are harder to see. I dunno.

[pipi_k]

99. That's what

I do too.

Number one, because it's what I'm used to doing at home.

Number two, so the waitperson doesn't think I'm a disgusting pig. Which means next time I go in the restaurant, I get good service because I also leave a 20% tip along with the non-slob table.

[woodsprite]

128. When I go out with the kids and hubby, we consolidate and stack the plates

for the server and wipe the table down before dessert. Actually, we wipe the table down because we play with electronics while we wait for the food and we don't want to get crud or drinks on the electronics. BUT, we will do the same after we're done the whole meal and get up from the table.

When the kids were little, I did carry a large sticky lint roller in the diaper bag to pic up their mess from the seats, etc. If something was on the floor, I'd pick up large pieces or something that might be slippery or get "ground in" (like a french fry, tomato, etc), but wouldn't have gone to town on that batch of crumbs.

We must be a little different than most customers because even the wait staff has thanked us for doing the table or stacking the dishes. It just makes it easier for them to carry back to the kitchen.

[joshcryer]

66. Looks like the customer was berated before finishing.

For all we know she would've cleaned up the mess.

But the owner had to make a big fuss about it.

[pnwmom]

190. More likely he'd wonder:

Does our liability insurance cover us if this non-employee slips or or trips someone else while she's using our equipment in an effort to "help"?

[whathehell]

186. I worked as a waitress for years and cleaned up WAY bigger messes...It's part of the job.

Ms. Anal Retentive needs to get a job that doesn't involve eating food, for fuck's sake.

[whathehell]

183. That would be the case if she was a guest in someone's HOME...This is a commercial establishment.

If the anal retentive freaks out over crumbs in a bakery, she shouldn't be working in one.

[pnwmom]

29. More than one person in this thread suggested that. n/t

[HangOnKids]

36. Your point is lost as suggeston is not a word

[Union Scribe]

35. So people should make more work for them?

Would I be helping employ stockers at the grocery store by throwing shelved items on the floor?

[Fumesucker]

41. In a word, yes n/t

[Union Scribe]

45. Your logic is horrible, but at least it's consistent. nt

[Fumesucker]

53. Spend your career fixing other people's fuckups and you come to appreciate them

Without those fuckups you don't have a job, or that job anyway.

[KittyWampus]

188. So you're the guy who thinks it's okay to stack a cart full of groceries and leave

just for the heck of it? After all, it makes more work for the shelf stockers.

I really, really don't believe it.

[Fumesucker]

193. If the checkouts are six carts deep and only two of twelve are open

Yeah, I'll leave the damn cart.

[Quantess]

92. No! Not from my experience working retail!

A store that increases hours or hires new workers to keep after messy customers? None that I can think of.

All it means is that the employees run themselves ragged to clean up after customers, in addition to answering all their questions.

[pnwmom]

44. Babies leave crumbs. Dealing with them is a normal part of a family restaurant's business.

This isn't beyond the scope of an employee's regular duties.

[theHandpuppet]

38. When workers are busy trying to cook and serve food...

...they don't have the time to vacuum between slobs. You must have mistaken "workers" for "servants". I've been in busy restaurants where parents let kids throw entire plates of food on the floor and turn the table into something that resembled projectile vomiting. If you're going to let kids turn your table and surrounds into a pig sty and expect them to clean up after your royal brood, then by god you'd better leaver a damn good tip, which I doubt a lot of them do.

[Fumesucker]

49. I've cleaned and worked around/with far worse than spilled food

Zinc poisoning for instance feels very much like a bad case of the flu and welding arc burned eyes have little blisters on them that make your eyes feel full of sand that you can't get rid of.

Waiting and busing tables can be hard and unrewarding work but even grody stuff left behind by kids after a meal is not toxic waste that's going to cause you physical damage.

[Daemonaquila]

162. So freaking what?

Just because it's not toxic waste, people should just put up with asshats who trash the place? We shouldn't expect basic manners in public places?

[Fumesucker]

194. The amount of bile this subject is releasing makes me think there's more to the complaints

More than just a few crumbs on a floor.

[mercuryblues]

134. bingo

When I was a server there used to be a couple that would come in almost weekly. They let their 3 kids throw food everywhere. A pig sty is an understatement. All of the running to just to keep the mess contained to their area and then trying to get scrambled eggs, toast, syrup, a few times the kids picked up their cup and just threw them. Cleaning that up off the floor was so worth the $3.00 tip. Not to mention losing tables because no one wanted to sit near them. I wish my manager had said this to them. We would draw straws to see who was going to wait on them when we saw them coming.

I have a feeling this wasn't the 1st time this customer had done this and the owner had had it.

[joshcryer]

64. Pick up the biggest pieces, at least.

It's not like you're expected to vacuum the place up, but leaving chunks of waste everywhere is nonsense and rude.

[Fumesucker]

67. It wasn't that big a deal, it actually looks like bread crumbs to me

Also it appears to have been under the table, sweeper will get it without anyone crawling under there to grab it.

Honestly, it would have been more trouble and taken more time to post the picture than to sweep the floor

[joshcryer]

69. I would've picked up 4-5 of those chunks.

Nothing to be done about the crumbs but the bigger pieces should be able to be picked up.

However, I would've waited until I was done dining. From the way the article reads the owner didn't do that, she berated the customer, while the customer was still dining, about how messy she was being.

[pnwmom]

25. What difference would it make to the minimum wage worker? In a restaurant

there is always going to be work like that to be done.

Seriously. When have you EVER seen customers using a broom and a dustpan to pick up crumbs?

[HappyMe]

136. Once in awhile my sons would make a bit of

a mess. I never thought twice about cleaning up after them. I would have felt bad about leaving it for someone else.

[pnwmom]

137. Where would you have obtained the vacuum or sweeper? I've never seen them lying around.

And I doubt that most restaurants would hand them out to their customers.

[HappyMe]

138. I asked the server for a broom and dustpan.

She usually said no at first, but I insisted. She would hand it over then and thank me.

[pnwmom]

144. I have never in my entire life seen a customer in a restaurant wielding a broom and a dustpan.

And there are people here who worked in restaurants for years who say the same thing -- it doesn't happen.

It must be different in small towns.

[HappyMe]

145. I was living in Chicago at the time.

I have worked in restaurants, both in the front and the back of the house.

Sorry, but I have cleaned up the mess under the table after my sons. It isn't as if they left a mess every time. I taught them to be quiet and eat like humans, not animals. I also always had coloring books, crayons and a couple of matchbox cars with me.

You saying that it doesn't happen, does not mean that I haven't done it.

[pnwmom]

146. I believe you. But as another poster in the business said here, it would be rarer sight than a

unicorn riding a unicycle.

[HappyMe]

147. I figured, my kids make a mess

then I should deal with it. Servers and bussers make little enough without extra work being thrust on them.

[pnwmom]

148. Maybe so, but restaurants are insured for slips and falls of their employees

and people who slip as a result of their employees' actions.

Not for work they allow non-employees to do. So I doubt most restaurant managers want their employees handing out cleaning supplies to apologetic customers.

[Just Saying]

149. I also wondered if there's a liability issue with this.

And I know in my experience, my manager would have bit my head off if he saw a customer cleaning up a table.

[pnwmom]

163. Or cleaning up the floor! n/t

[morningfog]

177. The idiot owner kicked her out before giving her a chance.

[REP]

20. It's pretty gross - that's a lot if crap ground into the carpet

[Fumesucker]

23. There's a reason they call them rug rats n/t

[Union Scribe]

33. Overreaction all around.

First by the cafe owner, not for the photo but for the behavior alleged while the family was in there, but especially by the mother for making a martyr of herself online. And most certainly overreaction by the idiots threatening the cafe owner. I hope they go to jail.

[Fumesucker]

37. Overreaction all around?

Jail?

Weapons grade snark or not?

[Union Scribe]

42. People threatening to drag a person to death behind their vehicle?

Yes, someone like that should go to jail for such a threat.

[Fumesucker]

50. The owner threatened the customer or vice versa?

I didn't think this stupid story deserved clicking on a link.

[Just Saying]

51. The owner was threatened by randoms on FB. n/t

[Union Scribe]

119. Neither. A third party threatened the cafe owner. nt

[Just Saying]

48. Agree, it's never okay to threaten people.

Just plain stupid.

I actually think the mother was more pissed off than being a martyr.

Ultimately, it's the shop owner that will likely be hurt by the attention. Food service is tough and the last thing you want to do is alienate customers. Bad publicity for her cafe.

[Daemonaquila]

165. Also good publicity.

When I hear one of these stories about an entitled parent screaming that they were "mistreated" because a business insisted on basic manners, I make a point of giving them my business. I've known a lot of other people who do, too. All the entitled parents and their kids stay away, and adults and parents/kids who understand manners have a peaceful place to go for a while before the toxic crowd returns.

[Just Saying]

169. I don't necessarily agree with your point of view on this situation.

But do agree that some places are good for kids and some are not. It's up to the parents to make good choices and teach their children how to behave in public. The best way is to lead by example.

I probably would avoid this place even on my own as the owner seems a bit anal.

[Tien1985]

84. I agree!

The business owner already hurt her business, but the threats are WAY out of line.

I don't think the mother is here nor there in this, unless she is the one making threats.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

143. yup. much ado about nothing. nt

[Sotf]

52. Overreaction...

[Warren DeMontague]

56. Can we put this thread on intrade?

I'm willing to bet it's going places.

[Violet_Crumble]

83. It's getting there, Warren...

Put the popcorn away for now. Unfortunately, until someone can manage to work out how to get Hiroshima, and possibly even Edward Snowden into the discussion, it's not gonna go...

[Violet_Crumble]

59. Why does it matter if her husband's in the US military?

From the article: 'Mrs Poore, whose husband is currently serving in the military abroad, had purchased scones for her children at the cafe.'

What difference does that make to anything?

[jmowreader]

79. It's the new Get Out of Jail Free Card

In the Cold War, we called it wearing your husband's rank.

[Violet_Crumble]

82. I'd never heard that 'wearing your husband's rank' one before...

I kind of guessed it was dropped in there to gain some sympathy value or something, but all I thought was I bet she wouldn't be mentioning what her husband did if he was a truck driver or construction worker or something

[bettyellen]

110. And it's what makes me think she is exaggerating the "dressing down" to max out sympathy.

If she was spoken to before they finished eating, I am guessing it was getting messier by the moment and she was trying to get them to contain it. Nothing else makes sense. And obviously Mom didn't take the criticism too well at all. Someone should start a martyrs of facebook Tumblr, LOL.

[HappyMe]

107. I don't know why they mention that.

Hmm... maybe I do. It's supposed to drum up sympathy for this latest FB martyr/saint. Honestly, if this is the worse thing that has happened to this mommy, she should thank her lucky stars.

[Just Saying]

109. She said it's why she brought her children with her. n/t

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

124. Usually it's "whose son is autistic"....(n/m)

[Jenoch]

131. I think it's a reference

to her struggles as a single mom.

[Vashta Nerada]

62. Parents should clean up after their little brats out in public.

Good for the owner.

[laundry_queen]

74. Little brats?

I suppose you were once a little brat also.

[Daemonaquila]

166. Oooh! I get to mark my bingo card!

"I suppose you were once a little brat also." That's a classic! Yes, all of us were kids. But most of us also had parents that had the class to spank us and take us out of the restaurant if we acted like poo-flinging monkeys.

[laundry_queen]

203. Yes, because when I see a raging parent hit their screaming child, the first word

that comes to mind is class.

[morningfog]

178. Owner's should give parents a chance to clean up before kicking them out

or publicly ridiculing them.

[joshcryer]

63. My nephew made a way bigger mess at McDonalds.

I did clean it up the best I could without a boom or a mop.

[kiva]

65. Since the mom outed herself on Facebook,

my sympathy factor is zero. If she hadn't identified herself, only a handful of people who actually say the interaction would know, and most wouldn't care. Gotta love Facebook victimhood.

[HiPointDem]

70. if what she says is true, she was publicly dressed down by the manager of the shop where she had

paid to eat because her toddlers got food on the floor.

my sympathy factor is not zero. she got publicly humiliated for a minor issue, something anyone who works in food service ought to be able to take in stride.

turnabout is fair play. she publicly humiliated the cafe owner for poor customer service. i'd say they're even now, but it will probably wind up hurting the cafe owner more.

[Violet_Crumble]

76. You start with *if*, then go on to treat one account as fact...

What I do know for a fact is that the owner apologised to that women, who refused to accept the apology, so I know which one I've got zero sympathy for.

I dunno about hurting the cafe's business. When I took a look at FB, there was a few hysterical mothers of little preciouses who acted as though it was their right to treat waiters and staff like their own personal servants, but there were quite a lot of people who clearly have no patience with that self-entitled crap...

[HiPointDem]

77. "if" makes what follows conditional, thus your claim that i treated one account as fact is just

flat out bullshit.

obviously the cafe owner thought some crumbs on her floor were a big enough deal to blog about, so i am inclined to believe she may have thought they were a big enough deal to dress down a customer over.

if so, she's stupid & deserves the loss of business. she'd better put up a sign that says 'you can only eat here if you don't make any mess, even accidentally. children not allowed.'

all the self-righteous kid-haters can go to that cafe.

[Violet_Crumble]

78. Not bullshit at all. Just an ability to read you treating her account as fact...

Actually, as others have pointed out in this thread, that was a bit more than a few stray crumbs. As a mother of a toddler who used to get a bit messy, that's a mess I would have offered to clean up, not demand that my perceived servants do it for me...


And as I said in the post you just replied to, the owner apologised and the attention-seeking woman she apologised to refused to accept the apology. Also, it's clear to anyone who's read the story and isn't just knee-jerking with nonsense like 'self-righteous kid-haters' that at no point has the owner said that children aren't allowed. If you can't take yr children somewhere without creating a mess and then getting outraged because not everyone shares yr belief that someone else is paid minimum wage to clean up after you, then running to the media whining about it isn't the best strategic move if yr looking for the sympathy vote, which is why I'm guessing she dropped the pointless snippet about her husband being in the military and overseas into it...

btw, I wouldn't have any problem going to that café if it was in my part of the world. I'd just have a bit of a snicker at the types who'd label me a self-righteous kid hater..

[HiPointDem]

80. not sure what language you speak, so no use talking to you. If is a conditional in English.

[Violet_Crumble]

81. I speak English with an Australian accent. That conditional ended...

...right at the end of the first sentence where you started the next one with 'my sympathy factor is not zero.' and went on to say 'she got publicly humiliated for a minor issue, something anyone who works in food service ought to be able to take in stride.'

Have a lovely day!

[HiPointDem]

85. The conditional does not end at the start of the first sentence.

If you're not busy friday, we can go to the movies. We'll have fun!

Am I claiming we definitely & surely will have fun?

No, I'm claiming we'll have fun -- IF you're not busy and thus are able to go.

The paragraph that follows "if she's telling the truth" is conditioned on the premise that she was telling the truth.

so wrongo.

[avebury]

87. I think that, before it even became an issues, the

mother should have offered to help clean up the mess. The 1 year old might be a little young but what kind of lesson did she teach the 3 year old about making a mess and not cleaning it up? Parents should teach by example.

While I do not have children, I can tell you that if I did have some and they made a mess in public, I 100% would have been apologizing for the mess and offering to help clean it up. It is the right thing to do. A crumb here or there is one thin, a lot of crumbs is a whole other thing.

[HiPointDem]

91. If what she says is true, she didn't get the chance, as the owner/manager came to her table

before she was ready to leave it and read her the riot act.

I would not offer to clean up crumbs unless I'd deliberately thrown my food on the floor. I don't carry a broom and vacuum cleaner to restaurants. I might apologize for my children's messiness & leave a bigger tip, but I wouldn't say "so terribly sorry, i'll vacuum for you."

not my job, and would be unwelcome in many places not run by assholes. meaning the type of person who would blog about toddlers dropping crumbs as if they'd changed their diapers on the table.

[Orrex]

116. We should drop an atom bomb on the cafe and drop another on the customer a week later

"Imminent surrender" my ass!

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

126. It's always funny when someone makes themselves a scene

While waiting for a client in a lobby of an office, I once witnessed a woman at her workplace let everyone know she was being served papers by yelling, very loud "YOU ARE EMBARRASSING ME IN FRONT OF MY CO-WORKERS BY SERVING ME PAPERS??? WHAT KIND OF MAN ARE YOU???" when nobody knew beforehand what the guy standing there talking to her was doing, nor cared.

[Egalitarian Thug]

72. Attention parents, attention parents, please:

You had them, please stop trying to dump raising them on the rest of us. If you can't control them, keep them at home. If you can't teach them to be considerate, clean up after them. They're your kids, they're your responsibility, the rest of us are not here to give you a break.

[avebury]

96. +1 nt

[Just Saying]

112. Seriously?

A kid dropping crumbs in a cafe is asking you to raise them?

Kids drop crumbs sometimes and guess what? So do adults! This is hardly the federal case you and this owner have made it out to be. She runs a cafe where food and beverages are served so she is, in fact, going to have to clean up after people and not just children either. But hey, maybe her piss poor attitude towards paying customers will make it so her cafe is spotless. And empty.

[Egalitarian Thug]

160. And I would have the same response, actually worse, if an inconsiderate adult did this shit.

That's not "dropping crumbs", that turning a table into a pig's sty. That's lost income for the server, the owner, and a longer wait for the next customers. In short, that just being fucking nasty and inconsiderate assholes with no regard for anyone else.

Where do these (you?) breeders get off believing that they are entitled to screw up other people's days, meals, shows, livelihoods, etc.?

[Just Saying]

164. Listen I could have that table wiped off and cleaned up in under 2 minutes.

You're exaggerating.

And as far as your "breeders" nonsense, perhaps you should simply avoid public places if the rest of us annoy you to such an extent. I can tell you most of my bad experiences out and about has been with self-absorbed ADULT assholes who think their shit doesn't stink.

I teach my kids to be respectful, courteous and tolerant. I wish that more adults had learned those lessons.

On edit: Perhaps I'm just returning your snark in kind, but I don't like conversations that go this way. I can respect your desire to be away from annoyances including children as I share it myself at times. In those instances, I avoid places I know will have people I don't care to be around and opt for places kids aren't likely to go. We all have to put up with each other I guess.

[Egalitarian Thug]

175. You've (typically) avoided the point entirely, and then try to turn it around to where I'm the one

that should avoid public spaces because it's not my job to suffer the consequences for others bad parenting.

My shit certainly does stink and that's a big part of why I don't take a dump on a table in a restaurant and expect that it's now the job of somebody else to clean it up.
So, I don't know if you're just being obtuse or you really don't see that you have no right to impose the burden of your choices on everybody around you.

Either way, if you do something like this IRL, and I'm around, you are going to have a great big spotlight of embarrassment focused entirely on you.

Your kids are not our problem and you have no right to make them so.

[Just Saying]

182. I addressed your point

Which was full of nasty snark, assumptions and judgement. Perhaps that's the only tune you know but I don't don't wish to "suffer the consequences of others bad parenting" any longer and so won't continue talking to you.

Have a nice day!

[Egalitarian Thug]

189. Thanks for the good wishes. Every day is a nice day for us, we live in a city where adults can

enjoy adult activities and neither obnoxious children, nor their self-entitled parents, are tolerated in adult places.

[Daemonaquila]

168. Yes, it is.

The difference is, adults drop a few crumbs. Kids under a certain age drop and throw things wholesale if they are not responsibly attended or taught not to do it. The mess in the photo was not just a few random dropped crumbs, but the work of a messy and unchecked toddler. It's a parent's JOB to not allow their kid to make a make a pigsty of anyone else's place.

The mom was the one with the piss poor attitude. A business owner is entirely in the right to put the brakes on when someone is either messing her place up on purpose, or "merely" allowing it to be done by a kid who is either very uncoordinated or trying to get attention.

[kcr]

132. Attention entrepreneurs, attention please:

If you don't want to clean up crumbs? Don't open up a cafe. Because if you serve food items that crumble? You're going to have to clean up crumbs. Might as well get used to it and not pitch a hissy fit every time it happens. Carpet may not be the best flooring choice. Oh, and berating your customers in public? Never a good idea.

[Egalitarian Thug]

135. Do you want to be the customer that follows this group during lunch rush?

I think this goes far beyond a disgusting mess in a restaurant, there is a growing attitude among too many parents that the whole world owes them simply because they popped out a little petri dish.

[Whiskeytide]

139. I have kids...

... and I take them to restaurants. They behave pretty well, but they're kids. The best way I can teach them to be considerate is to take them to such places and explain to them why they should be considerate in context. They're less likely to comprehend and appreciate my lecturing to them at home about a waitress or waiter having to clean up after them, than they might in a real world environment with me explaining that Joe or Susie will have to clean up after them after they just met Joe or Susie.

If I can straighten up after them when they do make a mess, I do so. If I can't, or if they won't let me, then I consider the mess in calculating the tip. I once left a 50% tip when I was with a group with 6 kids - kid friendly place - and they made a big mess.

We all have to share this planet. My philosophy is that I try not to be a dick, and I assume others will do so as well. It usually works out.

[Egalitarian Thug]

154. Thank you, thank you, a thousand times thank you.

My parents were much the same and my sister and I learned early that, if we want to go along, we had to conduct ourselves properly, and guess what? We still know how to act around other people and to consider and respect their right to have a good time or meal without being intruded upon.

[Sunlei]

73. always a big mistake for a business owner to complain about their customers

[Fumesucker]

93. "How dare you come and spend money in my establishment!"

Yep, really, really dumb move on the part of the proprietor.

[Dash87]

125. A suicidal move - especially a public shaming.

I wouldn't go to a place that would be willing to shame me on the Internet for minor mistakes.

The owner sounds nutty. Also, who the heck has nice carpets in a restaurant?

[etherealtruth]

173. Absolutely asinine! n/t

I can't imagine what she was thinking

[madaboutharry]

88. Mrs. Macduff is not a good business woman

Its just stupid to offend customers. When my kids were little and left a mess in a restaurant, I always left a huge tip. We were always welcomed back.

[Locrian]

90. yep

Instead of being smart about it she chose to take it to the next 'level' - the only reason being to be vindictive. Stupid.

[mainer]

89. Ha. My husband leaves more crumbs than that.

Crusty bread and croissants are hard to eat without dropping crumbs.

[magical thyme]

95. I've seen worse messes left by adults...

Scones are scones. Certain foods make a mess. You don't want to have to clean up a mess, don't serve messy foods in your restaurant.

Her treatment of the customer to her face was stupid and bad business. I've had strangers yell at me for no good reason (in one case, an instructor bullied and slandered me to the entire class. she ended up losing her job, since I had a class full of horrified witnesses, lol), and in the case of business owners, I won't do business with them again, evah, and I'm happy to spread the word.

The facebook pic doesn't identify the customer and threatening her there is stupid and potentially illegal, as well.

[avebury]

98. Scones are hardly a messy food. What made them

messy were two young children turning them into crumbs.

I remember when a friend of mine had a birthday party for her first son's 1st Birthday. She bought him a very small cake that he could have at it and enjoy. It was hysterical. He had a great time digging his fingers into it and mashing it all over his face. It quickly became a crumb cake. Now we know that he did not eat the whole thing and we never were able to figure out what happened to it because the majority of it just vanished.

As to your comment that you have seen worse messes left by adults. Perhaps that is a result of the way they were raised. The 1 year old is really young but the 3 year old is certainly old enough to start to learn about table manners. A restaurant is not home and what is acceptable at home may not be acceptable out in the real world.

[Just Saying]

105. Have you actually had a scone?

They are, in fact, messy. They crumble a lot and when I do have them I usually do it with a fork and over a plate and guess what? Still crumbs! It's not just the kids-this is a messy food.

Anyone would get messy eating cake and frosting with their fingers. That's rather beside the point.

And yes some adults are messy. It may be they don't know any better, but that's really beside the point. If you open a public business you'll get all kinds. If you are going to berate your customers you soon won't have any. If they are being really inappropriate I can see saying something, but a few crumbs doesn't rise to that level.

[avebury]

120. Of course I have. There is nothing better

then raisin scones with clotted cream and strawberry jam! And I never left a mess afterwards.

I wish that some other patrons who were in the restaurant would speak up about what they observed. It is possible that there was more going on there then crumbs on the floor. The kids might not have been the little angels (beyond the crumbs on the floor). I am not a big fan of bringing young children into restaurants, particulary when their parents have not taught them to understand indoor vs outdoor voices and let them run wild.

[Just Saying]

122. There's nothing wrong with children in restaurants

But like adults, they should be considerate of others. This looks like a small cafe to me so there probably weren't many people there. (Another reason not to insult your customers!)

Parents need to control their kids and make good choices. For instance, I usually take my kids to places that cater to kids. We went to a really nice place last weekend and left the boys at home. I wouldn't take them there for a number of reasons having nothing to do with mess: it's expensive and they probably wouldn't like the food anyway.

When we were there, two young women sat in the next table and the four of us exchanged glances. One or both of them had on so much perfume it made our eyes water! Will people here berate their parents too? We got used to it, but they were more annoying than my kids dropping a few crumbs would have been.

You're a very neat eater-Congrats! But I know lots of adults who can't eat without getting some part of their meal on their shirt.

I just think this owner didn't handle this right and some people are just too willing to hate on parents and their kids.

[magical thyme]

117. I am no fan of kids in restaurants when they misbehave

but I have left messes almost as bad was what was left by those 2 kids, and I was raised well. I don't normally leave messes behind, but certain foods are messy, period. And the scones I've eaten, along with certain flaky biscuits, make a mess.

Scolding or attacking a parent in front of other customers is simply bad business. If the kids were being loud and disruptive to everybody around them, I could see asking them to leave. But her behavior toward those customers will lead to fewer customers for her. Did you even read what she said to the mother?

I still remember the instructor who started screaming a me in that class, and my shock and humiliation. Easily 1/3 of the students, if not half, who witnessed it never returned. They took "Fs" rather than officially withdraw, and lost their tuition on top of it.

You simply can't treat people that way in business. Businesses depend on repeat customers. Re-branding and starting over is far more costly than simply behaving better than some of your customers.

[HiPointDem]

155. yes they are. they crumble evrytime you take a bite.

[Just Saying]

159. I love them but it's true! N/T

[snooper2]

97. Why do they have to put she is a "military wife" and bring that in to the conversation?

Do they get special treatment or something?

Teach your kids lady, no need to be a slob

[Just Saying]

108. It looks like she said that's why she brings her kids everywhere.

She's alone and must.

Do you have kids? Ever drop crumbs at a restaurant? Spill a drink? I think it's way over the top to call someone a slob because her kids dropped a few crumbs. When you serve food, you will clean up food. Just a fact of life. And these pictures don't show anything out of the ordinary, IMO. If she doesn't like kids, she should post she doesn't want them in her shop.

[snooper2]

111. My daughter is three, and she knows not to make messes

Her favorite restaurant is Denny's, she gets cheesy soup and pancakes, crushes crackers, pours syrup...

Three year olds are smart enough to know not to throw food and swing it around all over. Eat over the plate. I have seen other kids eating there and their parents don't give a shit, I guess they figure the staff will clean the seats and floor and strawberries in the fake plants. (which of course they do)

That picture isn't a few crumbs....

[Just Saying]

114. Looks like a few crumbs to me.

You see it your way, I see it mine.

Sure, kids can be taught but that doesn't mean they won't drop a crumb or spill a drink. Goes for adults too! My younger son tries but always manages to get something he eats on his face and/or clothes.

I worked with food many years ago and we expected to have to clean up. You're correct that some people are huge slobs but I just don't see crumbs under the table rising to that level. This owner would have done better to wait until they left and run the vacuum. She can easily post she doesn't want kids in her cafe if that's how she feels. Being rude to your customers is never a good business decision.

[MineralMan]

100. How to Eat a Scone without Leaving a Mess

The trick is basic table etiquette for consuming any bread-like food served in portions too large to eat in one bite. The well-mannered person does not pick up the entire scone, bring it to his or her mouth and bite off pieces of the scone. Like all breads, scones should be broken into bite-sized pieces over the plate, one piece at a time. The individual pieces are then conveyed to the mouth and consumed. If butter or jelly or some other substance is eaten at the same time, it should be applied to the individual piece, again over the plate.

This lesson in basic table etiquette is brought to you by Uncommon Courtesies, soon to appear as an eBook on Amazon.

[Jackpine Radical]

101. Lead on, MacDuff.

(Face it. SOMEBODY had to say it.)

[Baitball Blogger]

103. I appreciate it.

[Jenoch]

118. If the owner of the

coffeeshop did not want crumbs in her shop, why is she selling scones?

[Puzzledtraveller]

123. lot of militants in this thread

What party is this?

[Butterbean]

127. Psssh, that's nothing. In my 6 years of waiting tables in high school and college,

I saw WAY worse. I saw dirty diapers left on the floor (several times....I have no idea why people thought this was okay), food ground into the carpets, and messes so huge and nasty that it looked like a garbage can had exploded at the table. Crumbs like that didn't even make me bat an eyelash. Meh. Grab the zoom broom, sweep 'em up in about 1 minute, clean the table, and move on.

[Daemonaquila]

170. Me too, but that doesn't make it ok.

Just because people behave like asshats in restaurants doesn't make it ok for them to keep doing so.

[Butterbean]

176. Yes, but that cafe owner is freaking out over something pretty minor

in the grand scheme of things, IMO. I don't allow my children to do that in restaurants, but the fact of the matter is that the general public is chock full of assholes. If you're going to run a business like a restaurant, you need a thick skin and a high tolerance for stupidity, because you're going to see a LOT of it. Waiting tables and working retail gave me the foundation I needed to have the patience to be a nurse, LOL.

[AndyA]

129. When my brother and I were young, we knew better than to act up in public

We knew we had to remain seated at restaurants, and that we couldn't scream or run around the restaurant because we wanted to. In stores or shopping malls, we knew not to touch merchandise without permission, and to stay close to our parents. We understood that other people were paying for meals, and shouldn't be disturbed by loud and obnoxious children. We also knew we would be removed from the premises by our parents, taken home, and grounded or couldn't watch TV or some other activity we valued as punishment.

I've seen children running around restaurants, chasing each other, playing and screaming while their parents do...nothing. I've seen children walking on the seats in booths, with dirty street shoes. Not only does this damage the seat, if it's not wiped down carefully, it can soil the clothes of the next person sitting there.

Small children sometimes make messes, this is why their parents should be tending to them instead of just ignoring them. It's easy to see which parents tend to their children's needs and nurture and education them about right and wrong, and which ones don't. Just look for the children disrupting everyone else in the area, and you'll be able to identify the neglectful parents.

Kids have to be taught respect, consideration, and right and wrong. If the parents don't do it, who will?

[Sheldon Cooper]

130. Wow - that cafe owner is sure a dumbass.

That "mess" is nothing, compared to the mess she created by publicly shaming customers. If the kids had broken up furniture, pulled plumbing fixtures from the wall, etc., I could see her point. But crumbs? A few crumbs? Jesus, what an overreaction. I'd never eat at her place - god forbid I spill a little salt or something - she'll put my picture up on her facebook. She is a stupid business owner, and will likely reap the harvest from this blunder.

And I don't even like those "mommy" types who think their little darlings can do no wrong...

[Shrike47]

133. I've been to more than one restaurant with food messes that looked like they'd been there for days.

Some places don't seem to have enough staff to clean. I would have cleaned it myself if there had been tools handy. Of course, I've been known to make my bed in hotels, too.

[ecstatic]

140. The only person who should be is embarrassed is the cafe owner

The cafe's staff should be sweeping the restaurant regularly regardless of what the guests do.

[yawnmaster]

141. People need to step away from the facebook. eom

[Javaman]

142. It's her cafe, she can do as she pleases. nt

[Daemonaquila]

150. The cafe owner was completely in the right.

I'm disgusted by all the people who have been shaming her for booting out some people who made a nasty mess. It wasn't just a "few crumbs." The photo shows what is probably most of one or both scones crumbled up and dropped/thrown under the seats and table by the kids.

There are a lot of folks who want to whine about how there are lots of diners who make bigger messes, etc., etc., etc. That's a load of nonsense. Most diners don't throw food all over the floor. If something is dropped, it's accidental. It's not due to a careless parent handing food that they know is going to be thrown around to a child, without adequate supervision. Kids don't make a mess if they're given small pieces and watched. If this mom is ok with the kids creating a pigsty and inviting in cockroaches and rats, she's welcome to do that in her own home. A restaurant owner doesn't need to put up with that kind of behavior, then have to go clean it all out of the carpeting while the mom and her kids go waltzing off.

[B Calm]

161. Some kids are messy because that's what they been taught. The

parent or parents should be ashamed!

Had a 17 year old boy at my house yesterday and asked to use the bathroom. When he was done, there were two bath towels on the floor and the toilet paper hanging down from it's wall holder to the floor.

[HiPointDem]

167. a 1 year old and a 3 year old.

[Auntie Bush]

171. Maybe the owner over reacted...but those kids eat like pigs.

I wonder if they eat like that at home? I'm sure a lot of the mess didn't show up on the picture.
Children need to be taught manners at home before they go out in public. Maybe the Mom could say they can go out to McD when they can eat at home without needing to vacuum the floor when finished. Give them a goal and a reward.

[AngryOldDem]

174. This is part and parcel of owning any kind of restaurant.

Some people will be neat and tidy; others, not so much. Goes double with kids.

Two words: Vacuum. Cleaner.

[Marrah_G]

179. How would anyone know who the customers were?

Shaming would be if she took pictures of the family, not just the table afterwards.

[whathehell]

181. Unless it's for something truly immoral, I think public shaming sucks.

Ms. MacDuff sounds like a very nasty anal retentive.

[Butterbean]

184. Also, my dad, who has Parkinson's and dementia, made such a huge mess

at my house when he ate that I had to get out the broom AND the mop after he ate. I know for a fact that he still goes out and eats at restaurants. I wonder what would have happened if my father had eaten at this restaurant? Would she have approached he and my mother and said/did the same thing?

[snagglepuss]

187. Don't go to that cafe...seems to me their scones are a little on the dry side.

That was a comment left on DM

[customerserviceguy]

191. Too bad I don't still live in that area

I'd dine there, and leave a big tip. This sounds like a fancy cafe, it's not Mickey D's. Why yupsters insist on taking their "accessories" to upscale places is a mystery to me, other than they haven't gotten a clue that their lives have changed.

[HiPointDem]

196. doesn't look fancy to me. looks like a typical coffeeshop.

[customerserviceguy]

198. Trust me

I lived 37 years in Washington, that is upscale. And the picture you show has college-age young people who can behave themselves, not a bunch of rugrats crawling through the plastic ball pit at McDonald's.

[HiPointDem]

199. I've lived all my life in washington (~60 years) & my parents before me. looks like an ordinary

coffee shop to me.

also i never heard of this strict separation between cafes for college students and cafes for families. i usually see a mix.

besides which, what college is in lake stevens? i don't think they even have a CC.

[customerserviceguy]

200. I did say "college-aged"

Beats me if the folks in that picture go to Everett Community College or not. In any case, they're probably not throwing tantrums and making messes.

[Laffy Kat]

202. My kids were always messy, not loud but messy.

They didn't try to be but they were. I always tried to clean up what I could and left an extra big tip.