A "Compromise"? FUCK NO.

[cali]

Let's be crystal clear: the repukicans are holding the government hostage because they couldn't defeat the ACA through the legislative process.

That's right: The legislative process. You know, the way bills and laws are passed and meant to be passed per that quaint piece of paper the teathugicans are always touting: The Constitution. Under the U.S. Constitution a bill becomes law once it's passed by the Congress and signed by the President. That's how the ACA became law. the Repukicans didn't like that, so they tried mightily to repeal, damage or delay the law legislatively. They FAILED. Repeatedly.

These dishonest fucks are now holding us hostage by shutting down the government. they are solely responsible for the pain they're causing and they dare to call themselves strict constructionalists. Like hell they are. They're lying, hypocritical, heartless, petty assholes.

No way the democrats should "compromise" with them.

No. Fucking. Way.

Just my humble opinion.

[Historic NY]

1. Welcome to DAY Two - "America Held Hostage".

[jsr]

2. As Harry Reid said

"With a bully, you cannot let them slap you around because today they slap you five or six times. Tomorrow it’s seven or eight times. We are not going to be bullied.”

[KansDem]

13. I can't believe the Repubs have accused Reid...

...of causing the shutdown!



Talk about lying through one's teeth...

[hue]

20. I believe it. Repukes constantly lie about everything. They care not about the consequences.

[RC]

48. The Republicans are not lying. Really, they're not.

They really do believe that by not capitulating to their treasonous demands, the Democrats are the cause of the shutdown. Those 30 or 40 congress critters, are really that far out there. The President and the saner congress critters need to apply the Constitution to this shutdown.

Article XIV
4: The validity of the public debt of the United States, authorized by law, including debts incurred for payment of pensions and bounties for services in suppressing insurrection or rebellion, shall not be questioned. But neither the United States nor any State shall assume or pay any debt or obligation incurred in aid of insurrection or rebellion against the United States, or any claim for the loss or emancipation of any slave; but all such debts, obligations and claims shall be held illegal and void.

Stop their pay and shut off the tea-baggers operating funds.

And then there is this:

Section 8
15: To provide for calling forth the Militia to execute the Laws of the Union, suppress Insurrections and repel Invasions;

How is what the Tea-baggers are doing, not an insurrection? Holding the country for ransom?

[tblue37]

61. They remind me of abusers who, after beating the crap out of their

significant other complain, "Why do you always make me do that to you?"

[C_U_L8R]

3. What are they offering?

That they undo their own mess?
No thanks. The GOP can do that all by themselves.
Send the clean CR !

[Bobcat]

15. Ridiculous

They essentially want Pres. Obama to implement the 2012 Republican Party platform - you know, the one voters overwhelmingly rejected in Nov. 2012.

[Buddaman]

4. Let 'em burn........

[el_bryanto]

5. They don't want compromise - they want capitulation. nt

[durablend]

35. "Governance By Gunpoint"

That's effectively what they're doing

[n2doc]

6. The Senate has already compromised

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023760071

People don't seem to understand just how extreme things have gotten over there, including with the Democrats. And not in the "liberal vs. conservative" sense. More like "Conservative vs. Fascist" sense.

[cali]

7. thanks for that link. this is important.

[rhett o rick]

8. How much damage will we let them inflict before we decide that extraordinary

measures need to be taken?

[cali]

10. what extraordinary measures could be taken?

and hey, skinner said yes to an FTA group.

[KoKo]

11. What's the FTA Group?

Thought it was the TPP Group?

[cali]

12. it's the same thing. it's just that all FTAs

will be included- like the upcoming TTIP; the FTA with Eurrope.

FTA=Free Trade Agreement.

[rhett o rick]

16. Thanks for your work on this. Looking forward to it. nm

[KoKo]

29. Ahhh...Duh... Got It!

Thought you were talking about Federal Transportation Authority... That somehow this was another group being started.

[grahamhgreen]

41. Pleas call it the CTA group / the COSTLY Trade Agreement group, framing is everything, IMHO. nt

[cali]

42. I think we'll stick to FTAs so people recognize it

but your point is certainly not lost on me. I can think of several (ruder) things to call these Sellout Faux Trade Agreements.

[RC]

49. When I see FTA, I see "Federal Treasury Assets"

Just spell things out. DU is getting to be as bad as the federal government with the alphabet soup.

[cali]

52. Point taken. I suggested to Skinner that it be

'Trade Agreements and related issues'

[rhett o rick]

18. I dont know. There must be some remedies. The Repukes should not be allowed to

intentionally damage the government.

[rhett o rick]

9. The public is being misled by the corp-media that this shut down

will save the government money. Wrongly thinking that if things are shut down they are costing anything.

[AllyCat]

40. They are refusing to pay people for the work they do.

How this is legal is beyond me. I understand they have sent many people home and they aren't working, but these people have contracts. The Republicans are stealing from people.

[R. Daneel Olivaw]

14. No compromise!

The GOPiggies want compromise so they can claim a victory and use it next year in the midterms.


A Democratic compromise would be a Blue Dog kind of thing to do.

Oh, that's right. Some of the Blue Dogs voted with the Republicans to shut down the government.

Go figure.

[cali]

17. Demand a clean CR! 13 repubs voted against their party shutting down government.

[R. Daneel Olivaw]

19. Those 13 perhaps felt that shutting down the government was a bad idea, and it was irresponsible.

Why some Dems couldn't see that is beyond me.

[LostOne4Ever]

21. If the dems compromise in anyway

That will only make the repugs think that their strategy worked and they will do this again and again and again.

So long as they are holding the government hostage there can be no compromise or we will have to deal with this every fucking time this or the debt ceiling comes up. AGAIN AND AGAIN!!!

No compromise with republican terrorists.

[L0oniX]

22. I just hope this is not a good cop bad cop gong show to put something on the table...

that will hurt the poor and elderly ...more.

[cali]

25. No, it's really not.

This really is what it appears to be- we have ample evidence of that: The repuke party has been captured by a group of truly insane thugs.

[grahamhgreen]

43. Evidence of that will be if they bargain away the medical device tax (30 billion),

this to me would signal movement down the road towards what I was worried about all along; that the end goal of the ACA will be to dismantle all of the positive reforms in the act, and leave nothing but the mandate, IMHO.

That said, I am thus far happy with the rates I'm seeing in The exchange here in Cali!

[hue]

23. Situations like this may cause some folks to WAKE-UP!! Of course the media spins for the RW'ers!

There are many "main stream" Republicans that cling to RW beliefs.
I stand with our President in not backing down or capitulating to The RW sociopathic fantasies/demands.

[cali]

26. I don't watch TV, but the print media which of course means the internet

is overwhelmingly on the side of dems.

[surrealAmerican]

24. The ACA was a compromise!

Despite the Republicans ultimately voting against it, it was written with input from both parties as a compromise between the two parties positions.


Maybe our "compromise" needs to include a single-payer system, until such time as all ACA programs are fully implemented.

[SomethingFishy]

58. +1 My thoughts as well...

They need to learn the definition of the word "compromise". They seem to think it means "we get everything and the other side gets nothing".

[awoke_in_2003]

27. And that piece of legislation...

was deemed constitutional by the Supreme Court.

[cali]

28. good point.

[pipi_k]

30. Usually

I am all for compromise and trying to find common ground.

In this case...

NO.

Holding millions of Americans hostage because of something they don't like?

not just NO, but HELL NO.

[Sheepshank]

37. Two things that should strengthen the DEM resolve not to cave:

1. The Republicans were looking to be punitive and hurt every working class person since Obama was elected, and have been talking about a gov't shut down since 2008. They relish in punishing those that voted for Obama. They want to prove that gov't is the enemy and they think they finally have a reasonable explanation for why the shut down is a good thing. Why they attempt to run for govt office is the most extreme hypocricy in politics I have ever encountered. They don't want compromise, they want total capituation.

2. This may actually bring about some reforms. (a) gerry mandered districts have caused those who don't have majority of the constituient (statewide) votes to be placed into office. It's time to seriously start pursuing one man one vote. (b) reforms in shutting down a vocal extreme faction that are not representative of the majority think, and disallowing them from weilding this kind of destructive power over the nation.

NO CAVING....learning from this nasty experience and making the change!!!

[pipi_k]

57. Point #1...

is the reason I'm so pissed off about this, and I'm not often highly pissed about political things.

Like you said, they want total capitulation.

Playing games with the lives of Americans.

Disgust is too tame a word to use for that bunch.

[heaven05]

31. Let's be perfectly clear

the american voter and non-voters are ultimately responsible for these people getting a position to create fiscal chaos for us all. The american voter put these clowns into office. THEY get what THEY deserve, ideologically warped idiots voted in by the same. Clear enough?

[Andy823]

33. Yes I agree

However it's something like 30 or so members of the house that are causing the problem. These people were not voted in by the entire country, but by their crazy ass brain dead base. They are in districts that have been "made" safe for them, so getting rid of them is not going to be easy. Yes those people in those districts do deserve what they will get, but the rest of the country does noe.

The best way to defeat these morons is to make sure that in races that are not "safe" we get people to run against the republican that can actually win. Getting people registered to vote will help, and making sure they get out on election day and "vote" will also help.

[heaven05]

38. maybe not voted in by entire country

yet are able to hold entire country hostage. That crazy base IS holding all of us hostage. What exactly does that say to me. 'Safe" gerrymandered districts allowed these brain dead voters to elect fools and clowns. I agree with everything you say about overcoming gerrymandering by voter numbers and viable candidates. We'll see if this strategy can overcome voter restrictions and gerrymandering in 2014. I'm with you, been voting since '72', haven't missed one election. What to do about lazy, cynical voters? Let's hope the RW teahadists do it for us.

[grahamhgreen]

44. Disagree. It was big citizen united money, gerrymandering, corrupt voter machines and

RW big money media, as well as other gaming aspects that put the nut bags into power, in my view.

[heaven05]

45. you're entitled to your view

VOTERS still cast their votes or didn't.

[grahamhgreen]

50. True, but were they counted or gerrymandered, I made this pie chart

that shows how the R's can win with a minority:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022275888

[heaven05]

60. thanks, enlightening

more work to be done with the pukes and their nefarious ways.

[TiberiusB]

32. Wake up, the Dems folded a long time ago...

http://digbysblog.blogspot.com/2013/10/crazy-like-foxes-even-paul-ryans.html

and as was pointed out previously:

http://www.americanprogress.org/issues/budget/news/2013/09/30/76026/the-senate-continuing-resolution-is-already-a-compromise/

What the GOP is doing is clearly treason, but the Dems appear to be practically eager to go for more austerity while laying it on the backs of an eager GOP to mask their complicity. Two days in and we are looking at getting something worse than the original Ryan budget, which, ironically, despite being a supposed moral affront to any decent American, is HIGHER than the CR offered by the Senate Dems. The sequester cuts are now permanent, nice work there. Watch for Medicare and Social Security to suddenly be back on the table, too. Grand bargain, here we come.

Seriously, when will people snap out of it and realize that the lesser of two cancers is still cancer. Both parties are off the rails. This will not end well. The question is more when than if.

[Andy823]

34. So what is your plan to fix things?

Yes, the lesser or two evils is not always the best choice, but there is a third choice that would be even worse. That would be allowing some moron tea party clown to get elected because people decide to sit home on their ass and complain instead of voting. While some democrats that get elected may not be the best choice, they sure as hell are better than the third choice of letting more tea party idiots get into office!

[TiberiusB]

56. Even if I had a plan, there is no time to act on it.

There is no answer, really, other than sweat it out and hope the Dems do the right thing. There are no elections coming up in time to sweep the tea party out, and even if there were, it should be abundantly clear that approximately 1/3 of this country WANTS them there (so forget breaking the hold on gerrymandered districts). Time is simply not on our side. If there was ever a time to cross your fingers and hope the GOP somehow caves, this would be it. Someone needs to suffer, catastrophically so, to break this cycle. Unfortunately, that will likely be the 99%, and not the criminals running the show. Hopefully someone remembers that there is a disaster of biblical proportions brewing in Japan that could change the conversation in terrifying ways as soon as next month.

[hamsterjill]

36. Hold the line, Dems!

(I totally stole that comment from a post yesterday and I cannot remember the postor - so credit goes to that person whomever he/she is).

But I think this needs to be our motto right now! Hold the line, Dems!

[Enthusiast]

39. cali, I agree with your humble opinion.

[grahamhgreen]

46. Agreed. RW authoritarians lack the ability for real compromise, they seek submission.

[heaven05]

47. +1000

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

51. Very terse and to the point

[Kablooie]

53. But when we get to the debt limit and we are dealing with suicide bombers? What then?

I fear that the Republicans have the upper hand since they may be willing to destroy themselves if they can take the rest of the world with them.

Obama, I'm sure, won't allow this to happen so he will have to be the pillar that gives out if they won't.

The big question is what will he give in on?

[arthritisR_US]

54. Well said! Not a thing you said can I find

fault with

[cali]

55. why thanks.

[walkerbait41]

59. You are so right

Thank you for saying what s in my head