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cali

(114,904 posts)
Sun Oct 6, 2013, 09:09 AM Oct 2013

You may not be concerned about the chained CPI. Progressive House Dems sure are

and if they are, I am. No, I'm not saying it will happen, but it's foolish not to see it as a possible component to some coming "Grand Bargain". And yeah, I think that's coming.

<snip>

“It worries me,” said Rep. Jerrold Nadler, D-N.Y., adding that a default on the nation’s debt would make the stock market crash of 1929 “look like a picnic.”

“We are organizing inside and out” to rally opposition against a chained CPI or social security benefit cuts in any “grand bargain,” added Rep. Jan Schakowsky, D-Ill.

The Congressional Progressive Caucus spearheaded the event, which concluded with lawmakers and several dozen participants forming a “human chain.” CPC Co-Chairman Keith Ellison, D-Minn., led a few versus of the old spiritual “This Little Light of Mine.”

“Part of what we’re doing here is we’re trying to set the terms of the debate,” Ellison said in an interview with CQ Roll Call. “What I want to make sure is that, as some people are having backdoor deals, and say, ‘Oh, we have a way to get out of this,’ they don’t say, ‘Oh, we’ll just toss them the seniors.’”

<snip>

http://blogs.rollcall.com/218/house-progressives-form-human-chain-against-chained-cpi/

46 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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You may not be concerned about the chained CPI. Progressive House Dems sure are (Original Post) cali Oct 2013 OP
oh they're just Progressive Poutraged Purity Ponies. Agony Oct 2013 #1
it hasn't happened yet, so it couldn't possibly happen. KG Oct 2013 #2
Obama says we all have to sacrifice n/t leftstreet Oct 2013 #3
This message hidden by a jacked clown jury decision L0oniX Oct 2013 #13
lol G_j Oct 2013 #15
As it says on the red graphic .... Scuba Oct 2013 #4
at one time, concerns like this would not be controversial here Enrique Oct 2013 #5
I don't care. cali Oct 2013 #6
If you had told me when I first signed up here, twelve years ago, QC Oct 2013 #7
+1 leftstreet Oct 2013 #8
This Needs To Be Strangled In The Cradle, Ma'am --- Again The Magistrate Oct 2013 #9
Indeed. There can be no 'grand bargain' cali Oct 2013 #10
Everyone sing "Rockaby baby..." L0oniX Oct 2013 #14
They'll just call it something else and hope no one notices. Buns_of_Fire Oct 2013 #11
If there's one thing that gives me hope BelgianMadCow Oct 2013 #45
My Rep is a member of the Progressive Caucus Bluenorthwest Oct 2013 #12
The Senate already passed a budget that rejected chained CPI ProSense Oct 2013 #16
Extra words don't make your message any more valid. Chained CPI has to be Bluenorthwest Oct 2013 #19
What the hell are you talking about? The Senate rejected it. ProSense Oct 2013 #20
bwahahahaha. and that means it's dead for all time cali Oct 2013 #21
Do you only see what you want to? ProSense Oct 2013 #22
Do you loudly and clearly reject any futher discussion of cuts like the Chained CPI? Bluenorthwest Oct 2013 #23
Read my comment, and stop pretending that you don't understand the point. n/t ProSense Oct 2013 #24
Answer a direct question. Stop accusing others of 'pretending' and speak your Bluenorthwest Oct 2013 #25
forget it. not a chance. cali Oct 2013 #26
It's not the evasion but the insults used to create that evasion that are not Bluenorthwest Oct 2013 #27
No, ProSense Oct 2013 #30
In another thread today, you called Paul Wellstone a bigot. Would you go back to that thread msanthrope Oct 2013 #36
LOL! ProSense Oct 2013 #29
Ah, the 'rofl' emoticon which always lets us know how seriously folks take Social Bluenorthwest Oct 2013 #32
LOL! ProSense Oct 2013 #34
Stop pretending. Your question shows you chose to ignore my point. ProSense Oct 2013 #28
So you just refuse to answer a direct question and hurl insults instead. Again. Bluenorthwest Oct 2013 #31
Apparently, ProSense Oct 2013 #33
Don't hold your breath waiting for an answer. nt Mojorabbit Oct 2013 #43
and I was correct. A non answer answer complete with a link! nt Mojorabbit Oct 2013 #44
Thank you, ProSense! Jeezus, the conspiracy theorists are out in force BlueCaliDem Oct 2013 #35
Obama's "superlative CPI"...remember that? madfloridian Oct 2013 #17
I remember it. Enthusiast Oct 2013 #39
If Obama takes this route I will oppose it at that time, but so far he is not taking that route Bjorn Against Oct 2013 #18
K&R! KoKo Oct 2013 #37
here they are Enrique Oct 2013 #38
Oh, they mean well. Enthusiast Oct 2013 #40
as someone who is 58 years old, I certainly hope my littlewolf Oct 2013 #41
As someone who is 74 years old and already on Social Security, RebelOne Oct 2013 #46
Chained CPI is nothing but death by a thousand cuts against both the people least able to withstand Uncle Joe Oct 2013 #42

Enrique

(27,461 posts)
5. at one time, concerns like this would not be controversial here
Sun Oct 6, 2013, 09:47 AM
Oct 2013

not too long ago, progressive concerns were at the very least respected at DU. Not 100% shared here, but certainly not widely ridiculed. The "faction" of DUers who mocked progressive concerns consisted of just a handful, one of which was named jiacinto.

but now, a post which ridicules such concerns as "vomit slurping" gets 228 recs at DU. The size of the jiacinto faction has skyrocketed, and why is that? My answer: the power of the presidency.

QC

(26,371 posts)
7. If you had told me when I first signed up here, twelve years ago,
Sun Oct 6, 2013, 09:59 AM
Oct 2013

that the day would come when being concerned about things like Social Security and LGBT equality, or favoring single payer health insurance, would be dismissed as poutraged pony-demanding, or when progressives would be dismissed as emoprogs, or whatever is currently the favored insult among the wingnuts, I would not have believed you.

But that day has arrived.

The Magistrate

(95,248 posts)
9. This Needs To Be Strangled In The Cradle, Ma'am --- Again
Sun Oct 6, 2013, 10:12 AM
Oct 2013

Putting this 'grand bargain' swill through is about the only thing that could revive Republican prospects of victory in 2014.

Buns_of_Fire

(17,186 posts)
11. They'll just call it something else and hope no one notices.
Sun Oct 6, 2013, 10:51 AM
Oct 2013

Remember "Superlative CPI?" http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022417077

I rather liked "Doubleplusgood CPI" (mentioned in the thread), myself. It had a nice, contemporary ring to it.

BelgianMadCow

(5,379 posts)
45. If there's one thing that gives me hope
Sun Oct 6, 2013, 07:53 PM
Oct 2013

it's the ever-expanding knowlegeable use of Orwellian newspeak to puncture the media narratives that employ it.

I've seen it here, but also over at the Guardian, and on the conservative Frankfurter Allgemeine. The book is being sold in big volumes in the UK again as well.

Now, forget all that!

 

Bluenorthwest

(45,319 posts)
12. My Rep is a member of the Progressive Caucus
Sun Oct 6, 2013, 11:14 AM
Oct 2013

The guy who keeps posting 'not going to happen' on DU is not my representative. I stand with elected Democrats in strong opposition to this attack on Social Security and I have to wonder who those posters nattering against vocal rejection of Chained CPI are standing with. Not my elected Democrats, that's for sure.

ProSense

(116,464 posts)
16. The Senate already passed a budget that rejected chained CPI
Sun Oct 6, 2013, 11:26 AM
Oct 2013

This is not to say it should be ignored. The House has to act. Still, the Senate should be able to stand its ground.

Senate Opposes ‘Chained CPI’ Cuts to Social Security, Veterans’ Benefits

WASHINGTON, March 22 – The Senate tonight voted to block cuts in benefits for Social Security and disabled veterans.

The amendment by Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) put the Senate on record against changing how cost-of-living increases are calculated in a way that would result in significant cuts.

“The time has come for the Senate to send a very loud and clear message to the American people: We will not balance the budget on the backs of disabled veterans who have lost their arms, their legs and their eyesight defending our country. We will not balance the budget on the backs of the men and women who have already sacrificed for us in Iraq and Afghanistan, nor on the widows who have lost their husbands in Iraq and Afghanistan defending our country,” Sanders said.

The amendment opposed switching from the current method of measuring inflation to a so-called chained consumer price index. President Barack Obama favors a chained CPI as part of what the White House calls a “grand bargain” that Obama hopes to reach with congressional Republicans.

The proposed change would affect more than 3.2 million disabled veterans receiving disability compensation benefits from the Department of Veterans Affairs. Veterans who started receiving VA disability benefits at age 30 would have their benefits reduced by $1,425 at age 45, $2,341 at age 55 and $3,231 at age 65. Benefits for more than 350,000 surviving spouses and children who have lost a loved one in battle also would be cut. Dependency Indemnity Compensation benefits already average less than $17,000 a year.

More than 55 million retirees, widows, orphans and disabled Americans receiving Social Security also would be affected by the switch to a chained CPI. That figure includes 9 million veterans with an average yearly benefit of about $15,500. A veteran with average earnings retiring at age 65 would get nearly a $600 benefit cut at age 75 and a $1,000 cut at age 85. By age 95, when Social Security benefits are probably needed the most, that veteran would face a cut of $1,400 – a reduction of 9.2 percent.

A chained CPI would cut Social Security benefits for average senior citizens who are 65 by more than $650 a year by the time they are 75 years old, and by more than $1,000 once they reach 85.

Groups supporting Sanders include AARP, the AFL-CIO, National Organization for Women, the American Legion, Veterans of Foreign Wars, Disabled American Veterans, AMVETS and others.

Sanders is chairman of the Senate Committee on Veterans’ Affairs and the founder of the Defending Social Security Caucus.

http://www.sanders.senate.gov/newsroom/news/?id=41f5d32d-b4bf-4f0e-9ceb-7df622262cac

There was no doubt that this had no chance of passing the Senate.

White House Praises Senate Budget

White House Press Secretary Jay Carney lauded the Senate for passing a budget early Saturday, its first in four years, which he said "will create jobs and cut the deficit in a balanced way." He also criticized the House for passing a budget that eliminates the deficit over the next ten years entirely through cuts, saying that "We will continue to insist that any solution has balance."

The full statement below:

Today, the Senate passed a budget plan that will create jobs and cut the deficit in a balanced way. Like the President's plan, the Senate budget cuts wasteful spending, makes tough choices to strengthen entitlements, and eliminates special tax breaks and loopholes for the wealthiest Americans to reduce the deficit.

The President and Democrats in Congress are willing to make difficult choices so we can cut the deficit while laying the foundation for long term middle class job growth. And it is encouraging that both the Senate and House have made progress by passing budgets through regular order. We will continue to insist that any solution has balance. The House Republican budget refuses to ask for a single dime of deficit reduction from closing tax loopholes for the wealthy and the well-connected but instead makes deep cuts to education and manufacturing while asking seniors and the middle class to pay more. That's not an approach we support and it's not an approach the majority of the American people support.

Now it is time for our leaders to come together to find common ground. The President has put a plan on the table that reflects compromise, and he will continue to work with both sides to see if there is an opportunity to reach a solution to our budget challenges. We hope we will find this compromise because that is what the American people expect and what they deserve.

http://livewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/entry/white-house-praises-senate-budget

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022558947

The clean CR temporarily funds the Government. It's different from the Senate budget.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023794742

 

Bluenorthwest

(45,319 posts)
19. Extra words don't make your message any more valid. Chained CPI has to be
Sun Oct 6, 2013, 11:31 AM
Oct 2013

loudly opposed until such time as Obama clearly and decidedly takes it off the table as a possibility, which he could do with great ease. This use of America's most vulnerable as political hostages is simply not right and he needs to stop doing it.

ProSense

(116,464 posts)
20. What the hell are you talking about? The Senate rejected it.
Sun Oct 6, 2013, 11:33 AM
Oct 2013

"Extra words don't make your message any more valid. Chained CPI has to be
loudly opposed until such time as Obama clearly and decidedly takes it off the table as a possibility, which he could do with great ease. This use of America's most vulnerable as political hostages is simply not right and he needs to stop doing it."

That was my point. You may not want to hear it, but that's a fact. Your "extra words" are pure nonsense.



 

cali

(114,904 posts)
21. bwahahahaha. and that means it's dead for all time
Sun Oct 6, 2013, 11:36 AM
Oct 2013

and YOU fucking know more than the dems quoted

NOT A CHANCE, PRO.

NOT EVEN CLOSE.

Nope, no cigar for YOU.

ProSense

(116,464 posts)
22. Do you only see what you want to?
Sun Oct 6, 2013, 11:38 AM
Oct 2013
bwahahahaha. and that means it's dead for all time

and YOU fucking know more than the dems quoted

NOT A CHANCE, PRO.

NOT EVEN CLOSE.

Nope, no cigar for YOU.


From my initial comment: This is not to say it should be ignored. The House has to act. Still, the Senate should be able to stand its ground.

Now, it's apparent that your comment is more distasteful self-righteous bullshit.

 

Bluenorthwest

(45,319 posts)
23. Do you loudly and clearly reject any futher discussion of cuts like the Chained CPI?
Sun Oct 6, 2013, 11:38 AM
Oct 2013

Yes or no? Brevity is the soul of wit, mountains of verbiage are a sign of a muddled message.
You seem to wish to discourage others from speaking out against this. If that is not your position, answering a direct question would settle that confusion, just like Obama could put it all to rest by saying he refuses such cuts.

 

Bluenorthwest

(45,319 posts)
25. Answer a direct question. Stop accusing others of 'pretending' and speak your
Sun Oct 6, 2013, 11:46 AM
Oct 2013

damn mind. This is a discussion. You were asked a question and instead of answering you accuse ME of evasion. A simple yes or no.

 

Bluenorthwest

(45,319 posts)
27. It's not the evasion but the insults used to create that evasion that are not
Sun Oct 6, 2013, 11:51 AM
Oct 2013

really acceptable. 'Stop pretending you don't understand'? Who the hell talks to others like that?

ProSense

(116,464 posts)
30. No,
Sun Oct 6, 2013, 11:56 AM
Oct 2013

"It's not the evasion but the insults used to create that evasion that are not

really acceptable. 'Stop pretending you don't understand'? Who the hell talks to others like that?"

...it's hypocrisy: http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023794123#post19

Don't dish shit, and then expect a discussion.

 

msanthrope

(37,549 posts)
36. In another thread today, you called Paul Wellstone a bigot. Would you go back to that thread
Sun Oct 6, 2013, 12:25 PM
Oct 2013

and explain that?

 

Bluenorthwest

(45,319 posts)
32. Ah, the 'rofl' emoticon which always lets us know how seriously folks take Social
Sun Oct 6, 2013, 12:12 PM
Oct 2013

Security. This is important, people would suffer. And you find amusement in that.

ProSense

(116,464 posts)
28. Stop pretending. Your question shows you chose to ignore my point.
Sun Oct 6, 2013, 11:53 AM
Oct 2013

That's your problem, not mine.

I don't have to answer your silly question.

 

Bluenorthwest

(45,319 posts)
31. So you just refuse to answer a direct question and hurl insults instead. Again.
Sun Oct 6, 2013, 12:10 PM
Oct 2013

That says all that needs to be said. Glad others can take a look at what happens when you are asked to clarify your position with a simple yes or no.

ProSense

(116,464 posts)
33. Apparently,
Sun Oct 6, 2013, 12:14 PM
Oct 2013

"So you just refuse to answer a direct question and hurl insults instead. Again.

That says all that needs to be said. Glad others can take a look at what happens when you are asked to clarify your position with a simple yes or no."

...you're projecting: http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023794123#post19
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023794123#post30

I supposed that you think inviting others to "take a look" absolves you of your hypocrisy.

BlueCaliDem

(15,438 posts)
35. Thank you, ProSense! Jeezus, the conspiracy theorists are out in force
Sun Oct 6, 2013, 12:16 PM
Oct 2013

since it appears that President Obama isn't going to take the fall for the Republican Shutdown and they can't have too many days pass before attributing some underhanded nefarious scheme he's privately cooking up.

madfloridian

(88,117 posts)
17. Obama's "superlative CPI"...remember that?
Sun Oct 6, 2013, 11:26 AM
Oct 2013
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022417077

"The president has countered with his own inflation offer, a “superlative CPI” that the White House says would shield the neediest beneficiaries from the change. Liberals have cried foul about all of it.

...The best number to know is $130: That’s how much a typical 65 year-old would lose in yearly benefits, three years from now, under the GOP’s “chained CPI” proposal."

They will call it fancy names, but it's still a cut.

Enthusiast

(50,983 posts)
39. I remember it.
Sun Oct 6, 2013, 06:26 PM
Oct 2013

It was bullshit then and it's bullshit now. Expect them to come up with another "new and improved" Chained CPI with a new name they hope we won't recognize.

Bjorn Against

(12,041 posts)
18. If Obama takes this route I will oppose it at that time, but so far he is not taking that route
Sun Oct 6, 2013, 11:28 AM
Oct 2013

So far Obama has not even hinted at any sort of concessions to Republicans yet, not even any small concessions much less something as big as Social Security.

Right now I think we all need to be united around not compromising and as of right now Obama is with us and is consistently saying he will not compromise. If things change then by all means get angry, but let's not divide ourselves on the possibility that something might happen even though it hasn't even been suggested.

Enrique

(27,461 posts)
38. here they are
Sun Oct 6, 2013, 01:10 PM
Oct 2013

There are people here telling us that this is nothing to be concerned about.

If that is true, then these Progressive Democrats are engaging in this demonstration for ABSOLUTELY NO REASON.

Everyone can decide for themselves whom they believe.


littlewolf

(3,813 posts)
41. as someone who is 58 years old, I certainly hope my
Sun Oct 6, 2013, 06:33 PM
Oct 2013

Democratic congressman and my Democratic Senator oppose this.

RebelOne

(30,947 posts)
46. As someone who is 74 years old and already on Social Security,
Sun Oct 6, 2013, 07:58 PM
Oct 2013

I only wish my Republican Georgia congressman and senator would oppose it also, but I seriously doubt it.

Uncle Joe

(58,378 posts)
42. Chained CPI is nothing but death by a thousand cuts against both the people least able to withstand
Sun Oct 6, 2013, 07:34 PM
Oct 2013

financial wounds and against the social programs.

It also has the secondary effect of damaging the economy in general as year after year more people have less money to spend on products, so in turn businesses will be hurt as well.

Thanks for the thread, cali.

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