A warning if the GOP loses this. (a lesson from the last shutdown)

[edhopper]

I will cheer as loud as anyone if they end up with their tail between their legs.
BUT, remember the last shutdown, when all was said and done it seemed to be caused by Newt's feelings being bruised on a flight to Rabin's funeral. They ended up giving in at the end of that one. But the GOP are a bunch of mean spirited babies, and their response to that embarrassment was to impeach Clinton.
If, or hopefully when, they get their ass kicked at the end of this, don't expect them to be shamed into behaving like responsible adults.
They have probably gerrymandered their way into retaining the House, so we haven't seen the end of their petulance.

Sorry to be a downer, but forewarned is forearmed.

[sufrommich]

1. nt.

[edhopper]

3. got it

fixed.

[msanthrope]

2. Fast and loose with the headline, eh?

[edhopper]

5. My proofreading skills

art not my strong suit.

[MineralMan]

4. The GOP is loosing the dogs of war?

[edhopper]

6. yeah.

glad your all having fun with my typo

[MineralMan]

7. Sorry, it's irresistible.

All in good fun, though. Your point is well taken in the post.

[edhopper]

8. I know

just a little ribbing. Giggled myself when i saw what I wrote.

Least you can do is give me a Rec though.

[MineralMan]

9. Done.

[DCBob]

10. No doubt... in fact in losing they may become even more desperate.

The Republican party has turned into a gang of angry desperate psychos on a mission to "save" the country at any cost.

[edhopper]

13. Some bullies

get shamed into changing their ways and with a little introspection realize what is wrong with their behavior. Others just get madder after being taking to task and end up being more brutal. i think the current GOP is the latter.

[Generic Brad]

15. Until the whole country shuns them, nothing will change

They already hang out in an echo chamber, so they have no idea how ostracized they are. Their own base is going to have to reject them - which I do not see happening ever.

[edhopper]

18. If only their base votes for them,

they lose. If we can marginalize them, maybe there is a chance.

[dragonlady]

25. Good news

Take heart from this post: PPP: "GOP Could Lose the House in 2014"

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023794379

A recent survey shows that 17 of the House seats polled could be captured by Democrats, enough to change control. (The longer this goes on, the more seats would be in play, I should think.)

[Mnemosyne]

11. I am so glad that I don't have television anymore, that was one of the most ridiculously sickening

times in US history.

I hope to hell they do not pull that shit again! I agree with you, Ed.

[Andy823]

12. You are right

They won't act like "adults" no matter what happens. They will continue on down the road doing the same crap they have been doing since president Obama was elected. The ONLY way to stop them is vote them out of office!

The bright side of this is that they will keep on being jerks, and that will show voters just how insane they really are. If president Obama uses the 14th amendment to keep the country running, and to pay the bills, some of them will be demanding to "impeach" him also. If they ratchet up the "impeachment" war cry, it will make them look even worse than they are. I think not only does the president know this, but I also think the GOP leadership knows this. While the tea party clowns scream for impeachment, the party leaders will be pulling their hair out trying to figure out how to stop the continuing war within their party.

While the tea party base will back this kind of insanity, the more moderate republican voters will not, and neither will most independents. What the tea party nuts seem to forget is that many of those who have been hurt by the stupidity of the sequester, and now the shutdown, happen to be republicans. Some of these republicans have been sitting on the fence for some time trying to figure out why their party is doing this to them. Some used to be middle class, not anymore. Many of them have been republicans because of their parents, and while their parents may continue to voter republican no matter what, they are getting fed up with all the BS. All that they need to push them over the fence is to see more BS coming from the teapublicans in congress. If the republicans can not stop the tea party madness, a lot of them will either jump over and vote for another candidate in 2014. Others will simply not vote at all. If democrats can get voters out in 2014, and even convince some of these republicans sitting on the fence to vote for the democrat candidate come election time, things could be very bad for republicans, but good for the democrats.

The key is to get out the voters.

[99Forever]

14. It's the one lesson Dems seem never to ...

... "get" from righties. They don't EVER surrender, even when roundly defeated.

We can cannot EVER give one inch to these bastards. No capitulation, EVER. No compromise to terrorists, EVER.

[edhopper]

16. Obama tried to play nice

and work with them after 2008, instead of channeling the anger so many Americans had at Wall Street and the Bush GOP. Instead he allowed the Tea Party to subvert that anger and help gain control of the House. I truly hope he has learned his lesson.

[99Forever]

20. Agreed.

Obama has "played nice" for way too long in my opinion, he should have stood up to these assholes years ago and didn't. However, there is no going back and changing it now, so "better late than never" applies.

[edhopper]

21. Yes

one hopes the Dems do it right this time as they go forward.

[AnotherMcIntosh]

32. After the 2010 House losses, he said "We get it."

[BumRushDaShow]

17. Win back the House in 2014

and that reduces the chances of attempts at impeachment.

"Win" or "lose" this latest showdown, the repukes WILL proceed with impeachment if we don't take back the House (even if it is by 1 vote).

I do understand that "impeachment" is not "conviction" (which the Senate would never do). But every fiber in my body would fight this because there is still a STIGMA to "impeachment" and it would linger on forever to tarnish this President as it has tarnished Clinton. Such a chance should never be available to be brought to bear.

Family, friends, coworkers must be made angry enough to vote in 2014 because of the real threat that he WILL BE impeached if they don't.

[edhopper]

19. My fear is

that many voters don't seem to have the short term memory to remember this come November 2014.
After all they couldn't seem to remember that it was the GOP policies that almost lead to a complete worldwide collapse just 2 years after it happened.

[Squinch]

22. I don't think it will ever happen, but if Obama ever is impeached,

there is no chance he could ever be convicted of anything, and I think it will go down in the history books as an example of a disgusting act on the part of a branch of government that has been overrun by troglodites.

Like Plessey versus Ferguson or the Citizens United decision.

It wouldn't hurt Obama. It would hurt Congress.

[truebluegreen]

23. Who cares if they impeach?

It will be just one more spectacle of Whack Jobs on Parade. Since it will go exactly nowhere in the Senate, it will be a gigantic waste of time and taxpayer money. Sure, the base will love it, but they already love the shutdown and that is hurting them badly. At the same time it will motivate our side and even the squishy middle. If they want to continue to hurt themselves, let 'em. It is not as if they are going to do anything useful in the next year, and maybe this way we will be able to boot their asses out of the People's House.

[edhopper]

24. Impeachment is just a reference from the last one

an example of the damage they can continue to do. Stop anything good from taking place or dealing with our real problems.

It's a larger picture, not to be meant literally.

[truebluegreen]

38. Didn't mean to go off on you, sorry.

I just don't think anything good will take place anyway, nor will any real problems be dealt with. If they are willing to vote 42? times to repeal a law they don't like, and now shut down the government over it, nothing good can be expected of them.

We just have to hope that their asinine, destructive behavior is seen as such, to a great enough extent that the ill will they earn can overcome their gerrymandered advantage. If we can take back the House, and hold the Senate, we can accomplish good things, even during the last, lame-duck years of Obama. Might even be a good thing, given his penchant for grand bargaining, if a) legislators are looking beyond him and b) they have a few more years of pent-up frustration under their belts. That's the best case scenario, as I see it.

I hope they do impeach.

[edhopper]

39. I didn't think you did

I was just trying to clarify.

[truebluegreen]

41. Phew!

[gopiscrap]

26. tend to agree with you

I think if they try impeaching Obama, they're really gonna get their asses kick in the next general election

[lonestarnot]

27. They have skin in the "game," real pigliCON skin, even resembles pigskin.

Sportsters hmmmf.

[Agnosticsherbet]

28. As I recall, the push to impeach began in the December of 1992, befor Clinton was innaugerated.

It wasn't hard feelings by Newt, but its own separate strategy. They were investigating Clinton long before the cigar in the White House with an intern. (It became an entire industry on the right.)

I saw another post here at DU today about "Tea Party radicalism and the New Right." The obstruction, the investigations by Issa, the shut down of the government as a strategy to paralyze the government are all part of a well conceived plan to keep a group of small town white well to do aristocrats in power. It worked under Bill Clinton, and it has worked so far. And when this is over, they will regroup and try something else.

[Gothmog]

35. The GOP will try to impeach President Obama

These idiots are convinced that the rest of the country agrees with their views and that a majority of the county hates President Obama just because they hate President Obama. These idiots will try to impeach President Obama if they do not get what they want

[MrScorpio]

29. They really don't have an impeachment leg to stand on

The more extreme they get, the bigger their failures will be

Bring that shit, the Prez will knock it out the park.

[jeff47]

30. You forgot to list an actual problem in your post.

So...if this insanity fails, the GOP will behave more insane, like in the 90s.....when they lost seats in 1998 over impeachment.

So what's the problem? Please proceed, Republicans.

[edhopper]

33. And then Al Gore won the presidency right?

so what could be the problem, huh?

[jeff47]

40. Al followed the route you're proposing.

Al ran away from Clinton. Stupidly. W couldn't have stolen it if Gore had been smart enough to realize the country and the DC bubble are usually not aligned.

[edhopper]

43. Where do you get that?

When did i ever say Gore should've distanced himself from Clinton?

[jeff47]

44. The thrust of your snark was Gore lost.

And Gore lost* because he stupidly ran away from Clinton.

* (For certain definitions of "lost&quot

[edhopper]

45. No I meant that after the impeachment

The GOP still controlled the WH and Congress after 2000.

So impeaching Obama doesn't mean a Dem House in 2014 or 2016.

Your assumption is completely out of left field.

[Thinkingabout]

31. Instead of Cruz getting prepared to run for president I am thinking he has his sites

on becoming America's first dictator. We have existed under majority rule for many years but I don't think Cruz thinks it should continue and he deserves to be the dictator.

[kestrel91316]

34. Doesn't scare me. I give it a 90% chance that they will impeach Obama

sometime before Jan 2017.

[Gothmog]

36. I think that you are correct

The chance that the GOP will resort to impeachment is really high.

[kestrel91316]

37. I have believed that since Nov 2008.

I also believe that they will impeach every future Dem president any time they control the House. They are exacting revenge for Nixon.

[freshwest]

42. Nope, not even close to what's happening, although I hope I'm wrong:

Any loss that can be attributed to the 'battle' in the 'shutdown' will forgotten if they win the 'war' with the debt ceiling. They and their supporters have planned for this for a long time, salivated over it, love it.

This was their intention all along, and the ACA and shutdown is just a skirmish on the road. And they hold all the cards.

Such notions as the invocation of the 14th, the minting of a trillion dollar coin and charging them with treason are mental masturbation. The world's belief in the full faith and credit clause of the US Treasury will not be restored by such means.

Great fortunes were made in the Great Depression. Much more will be made with this one and means will be just as brutal, if not more so.

This is what banana republicans wanted for years. I'd say we are pretty well screwed. But as I said above, I hope I am wrong, but that is my opinion. Here is their vision:

What does this remind you of?

Without commentary:

You can overthrow government and auction everything off to the Koch brothers by several ways.

First, by denying others a voice in voting by oppressive regulations and misinformation.

Second, by impoverishing people through defunding government's ability to stand between predatory capitalists and their prey.

Third. by non-stop propaganda against that government to make people give in to the fascism they promote by default, allowing the church and business interests to run wild in the public and private lives of people.

Fourth, is just shooting people or intimidation, doing that banana republican routine so obvious in the videos. These displays of armed force across the nation are designed to shut people up and let these who presume to act as our 'betters' or as they call themselves, 'patriots' who would run our lives into the ground.

I'm sick about this.