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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsVirginia county board says no followers of ‘pre-Christian deities’ allowed to deliver prayers
Yeah, Town of Greece v. Galloway opened up a can of worms...
Virginia county board says no followers of pre-Christian deities allowed to deliver prayers
County officials in Virginia have apparently violated the constitution by designating which religious leaders can deliver prayers before public meetings, according to the states American Civil Liberties Union.
The ACLU sent a letter Thursday to the Chesterfield County Board of Supervisors, which had limited opening prayers to ordained leaders of monotheistic religions.
The First Amendment requires governing bodies to allow everyone the chance to deliver prayers before official meetings, said the Rev. Barry W. Lynn, executive director of Americans United for Separation of Church and State. If they dont, then what theyre doing is unconstitutional.
...
Officials defended that decision, saying the neo-pagan faith does not fall within the Judeo-Christian tradition and invokes polytheistic, pre-Christian deities.
...
Raw Story link
Fucking morons have established Christianity as the official religion of Chesterfield County, and I bet the Roberts court let's them get away with it.
eShirl
(18,502 posts)Drale
(7,932 posts)since Christianity did not appear to well after Jesus's supposed execution.
BrotherIvan
(9,126 posts)Their God is the god of the Hebrews. Are they really that fucking stupid?
TNNurse
(6,929 posts)Yes.
sulphurdunn
(6,891 posts)IllinoisBirdWatcher
(2,315 posts)tblue37
(65,477 posts)gwheezie
(3,580 posts)Even though the state is turning purple, we still have loons out here in the woods that just won't stfu and mind their own business, they're part of the smaller government crowd that supports shredding the constitution. They've somehow conflated the bible, constitution and atlas shrugged into their founding document "the biblitution shrugged" in which Jesus Galt said at the sermon on the mount of money "you're on your own"
MohRokTah
(15,429 posts)gwheezie
(3,580 posts)I don't live in Cfield cty, I live out in where the hell am i, virginia but within 40 miles of Richmond.
deafskeptic
(463 posts)I should know. I grew up in Richmond VA.
However, I agree with what you've said though. Christians - especially the fringe types - should mind their own business.
no_hypocrisy
(46,158 posts)Isn't he "pre-Christian"?
deafskeptic
(463 posts)underpants
(182,866 posts)Will continue to say the prayer.
Hell, they might "spice it up" a bit and let a Methodist have a turn.
pangaia
(24,324 posts)underpants
(182,866 posts)They tend to get to the buffet first too. I am told
pangaia
(24,324 posts)Brigid
(17,621 posts)"Dost thou love and serve God? It is enough! I give thee the right hand of fellowship." I think most Southern Baptists would be a little more particular than that.
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Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)Jebus be on the way any time now. Gonna strike down some lazy, poor moochers!
grasswire
(50,130 posts)I recall driving through there years ago.
gwheezie
(3,580 posts)Bumpass is in Loiusa also
grasswire
(50,130 posts)jmowreader
(50,562 posts)shenmue
(38,506 posts)Didn't we get rid of all that bullshit in 1776?
The Velveteen Ocelot
(115,809 posts)in Town of Greece v. Galloway that the First Amendment's Establishment Clause applies only to Congress and that there was no clear intent to apply it to states. In other words, he thinks that although the federal government can't establish a national religion, it is theoretically constitutional for states or municipalities to choose a "local" religion. Fortunately, that's not the holding of Galloway, although the idjits referenced in the OP seem to think so.
shenmue
(38,506 posts)Eeeeew.
Xyzse
(8,217 posts)And all the stuff in the Force that Lucas tells us.
Praise to the Pontiff Skywalker, and the new Jedis coming out of the order.
I am going to have to make some prayers up, and come up with new gods.
I live close enough to VA, that I could probably make a nuisance of myself.
rhett o rick
(55,981 posts)The Velveteen Ocelot
(115,809 posts)At one time "God," then known as Yahweh (YWHW), was merely the particular god of the Israelites, not the only god anywhere. The Commandment that says "Thou shalt have no other god before me" simply means that you shouldn't be worshiping, say, Baal or Ahura-Mazda instead of Me, Yahweh. It didn't mean they didn't exist at all.
And what about post-Christian ones like Allah, who didn't turn up until centuries A.D. (although Allah is technically the same as the Judeao-Christian God)? And does this mean we can offer prayers to the Flying Spaghetti Monster, since the FSM is a very new deity?
sakabatou
(42,170 posts)God was believed in long before Jesus.
yellowcanine
(35,701 posts)This should be clear to everyone involved.
arcane1
(38,613 posts)Hippo_Tron
(25,453 posts)gwheezie
(3,580 posts)how stupid and clueless the right it, a majority of mid east and far east virginians who are hindu or muslim voted for McAullife in the last election. Didn't they learn a thing from the Allen campaign?
sakabatou
(42,170 posts)MohRokTah
(15,429 posts)Thank John Roberts.
yellowcanine
(35,701 posts)MohRokTah
(15,429 posts)Take it to the SCOTUS and make Roberts face the monster he created.
sakabatou
(42,170 posts)Though Jesus is only part of Christianity and Islam.
yellowcanine
(35,701 posts)Unless Linguini and Raveoli are considered Gods but that is just the heretical version of FSM (BHHT), so I think we are good. Anyway, it is no more polytheistic than the Catholics with Father, Son and Holy Ghosticus.
Xyzse
(8,217 posts)I think I will have to make one called Mojo, patron saint of getting it on.
underpants
(182,866 posts)????
yellowcanine
(35,701 posts)SheilaT
(23,156 posts)have a wonderful array of Saints. Someone needs to get up and pray to St. Anthony (patron of lost things although I swear I was raised being told he was the patron of lost causes) or St. Barbara (patron saint of artillery and mining). I wonder who the patron saint of stupid people would be.
underpants
(182,866 posts)Chester is in Chesterfield. That used to be an inside joke whenever we saw a hayseed in the city of Richmond.
Not surprising for Chesterfield - or any county around Richmond - it us a Repub bastion and farmland turned into the white flight homeland of 50+ years ago. Try as they might they can't get around still being seen as the dirt-kickin' scabby kneed redheaded stepchildren named "Rusty" of the area. This sort of thing doesn't help.
justiceischeap
(14,040 posts)it incites stupidity to abound.
I wish the right would make up their minds... either the Constitution is the end all be all or the Bible is... it shouldn't be both.
alphafemale
(18,497 posts)That one will LOSE big time in the Supreme court.
MohRokTah
(15,429 posts)If the SCOTUS throws out Hobby Lobby v. Sebilius, then maybe. IF that case goes the way I suspect it will, then I wouldn't even consider betting on the SCOTUS ruling against Chesterfield County.
alphafemale
(18,497 posts)Constitutionally it was over.
The same exact argument as in Loving vs Virginia stands.
A prayer before a government meeting being Christian, even if it is almost always Christian does not exclude others. Excluding other religions clearly does.
I see the justices 7-2 against something like this. Because they interrupt the Constitution at whim. It think Scalia is on record of loathing the Bill of Rights. The other nut job against would be Thomas because he votes the way Scalia tells him too.
NutmegYankee
(16,201 posts)Now watch the county officials heads explode.
KamaAina
(78,249 posts)RAMEN!
mindwalker_i
(4,407 posts)He's definitely not pre-christian. In fact, I'm not even sure whether pasta is pre-christian, though I think it is.
Maedhros
(10,007 posts)From the wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pasta
mindwalker_i
(4,407 posts)and the FSM is definitely post-Christianity.
I don't see no problem.
Marrah_G
(28,581 posts)EEO
(1,620 posts)freedom fighter jh
(1,782 posts)but it's "pre-Christian." What are they gonna do?
MohRokTah
(15,429 posts)Maedhros
(10,007 posts)Consider what Christianity could be without all that Old Testament baggage? No Leviticus, for example.
Sognefjord
(229 posts)Thor and his hammer await them!
Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)WTF?
I imagine this particular Fascist US Supreme Court would allow it.
Throd
(7,208 posts)The whole idea of a prayer is silly enough, but when they act as the gatekeepers of which religions are acceptable or not, they have breached the line of separation between church and state.
BTW...you should see my atheist hat. It is quite the dandy affair.
Scootaloo
(25,699 posts)MisterP
(23,730 posts)Swede Atlanta
(3,596 posts)The Supreme Court just held that government meetings can be started with a prayer. All they said was this is in keeping with our traditions. While I vehemently disagree with this and think they got this dead wrong, ok...... But I knew that what Alito, Scalia, Thomas and the rest of the majority really meant by that was Christian prayer.
But this will never stand. The 1st Amendment prohibits the government from the establishment of religion. The only way the recent court decision can be reconciled with the 1st Amendment is if this means citizens of any "religion" (keep in mind our jurisprudence is very liberal in defining what a religion is) may open the meeting with their prayer. Government cannot define "which religions" because that would be endorsing or establishing a religion.
I think the ACLU will quickly get this quashed. I knew that all the religio-nuts applauded the recent court ruling but in their minds that meant they would be invoking Jesus at every meeting. What they didn't understand was no this means that Jews, Muslims, Mormons, Buddhists, Taoists, Satanists, etc. all can come with their prayers.
It was the same in LA where they passed a school voucher program. When some parents wanted to use their vouchers for a Muslim school the representative that sponsored the bill said no the intention was this was only for Christian schools.
I will laugh when this county board are slapped down.
PumpkinAle
(1,210 posts)Islam is about 600 years younger than Christianity.
These people are so ignorant of world history and culture and are just a freaking embarrassment to America.
And I just don't understand how these people have managed to get a toe hold in politics and are trying to turn the country - faux-Christian (real Christianity is nothing like what they have made it to be.)
PumpkinAle
(1,210 posts)SheilaT
(23,156 posts)people like this honestly have no idea that their own particular religion is actually quite narrow. "Non-denominational" prayer is invariably a Protestant prayer, and as someone who was raised Catholic it makes me crazy that even very nice and totally non-bigoted Protestants just don't get it. I want to pull out a rosary and start reciting Hail Marys until they get it that NO prayer is non-denominational.
These days, while I have my own peculiar spiritual beliefs, I generally refer to myself as a non believer. I feel absolutely no compulsion to explain to anyone what I believe or why, nor do I think there is anything wrong with someone who believes differently. So long as they really, really get it that they do NOT have a monopoly on Truth. All they have is a grasp on one way of thinking about such things, and absolutely no way of knowing if what they believe is valid or true.
ladjf
(17,320 posts)arcane1
(38,613 posts)One day I hope we can all Have Nice Things.
Spitfire of ATJ
(32,723 posts)LOL!!!
These IDIOTS actually BELIEVE a prayer is an invocation spell!!!
Like THIS is going to happen!
niyad
(113,522 posts)Spitfire of ATJ
(32,723 posts)niyad
(113,522 posts)Spitfire of ATJ
(32,723 posts)niyad
(113,522 posts)Spitfire of ATJ
(32,723 posts)Iggo
(47,563 posts)I disrespect them.
blkmusclmachine
(16,149 posts)wickerwoman
(5,662 posts)jmowreader
(50,562 posts)blm
(113,083 posts); )
sofa king
(10,857 posts)freshwest
(53,661 posts)Will the word 'God' as in GodTheFather© no longer be welcome?
And the Holy Spirit, said to have worked as part of the Trinity to create the world long before Jesus' birth, is going to be persona non grata?
And since Jesus is the Son of that God, he was before the gospels were writ and Christianity, etc., where does that leave the religion claiming to follow the Son of God, Jesus?
I think they have destroyed their religion and shot Jesus in the foot or something.
Just sayin'
MineralMan
(146,324 posts)Thinking is good. Being non-thinking dumbasses is not good. Being knee-jerk morons is also not good.
MohRokTah
(15,429 posts)They will now proceed to waste the county's money over this in courts.