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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsPope Francis’ new clothes: Why his progressive image is white smoke and mirrors
(I find it fascinating that the carefully crafted image is the product of a former fox news person)
Pope Francis new clothes: Why his progressive image is white smoke and mirrors
THE IMAGE OF Pope Francis is that he is a breath of fresh air, more progressive on social issues than his predecessor and a kinder, gentler pope. But when the facts are examined, you see that he is none of these things. There is an enormous disconnect between who the pope really is in terms of his policies and his public relations image, as crafted by the Vaticans PR man, previously with Fox News. The current PR mission is all about reversing the incredible decline in fundraising under the last pope from the U.S. Catholic Church in particular. Pope Francis has made any number of statements that seem to indicate change and progress that are not reflected in policy. In fact, in the wake of such comments from Pope Francis, the Vatican often makes a point to explicitly state that no church policy has changed.
While the pope transmits a populist vibeparticularly about the economy he is an old-school conservative who, despite his great PR, maintains nearly all of the socialpolicies of his predecessors and keeps up a hardline Vatican cabinet. He has done virtually nothing to change the policies of the church to match his more compassionate rhetoric. People excuse the pope, claiming that he doesnt have much power to make changes, but this simply isnt true. Further, it is ludicrous to suggest that a man who denies comprehensive reproductive health care (including all forms of birth control including condoms and abortion) and comprehensive family planning is a man who cares about the poor of this world. The bigotry of homophobia and sexism cloaked in religion are still bigotry and sexism. By giving to the church, American Catholics arent supporting progress, they are supporting oppression and in this way are complicit in the bigotry, sexism, and oppression of the church.
.. . . .
The wheels were set in motion to change the perception of the church before Pope Francis was elected. In March of 2010, Pope Benedict XVI had only a 40 percent favorable rating in the United States. By June of that year, the U.S. Bishops were planning a PR campaign to soften their image and attract the younger generation. Shortly thereafter, the Vatican hired Greg Burke, a former Fox News correspondent, as a senior communications adviser reporting directly to the Vaticans third-ranking official, Archbishop Giovanni Angelo Becciu. The New York Times points out that Mr. Burke had previously met Cardinal Timothy Dolan, the archbishop of New York, and did not rule out that being known by the cardinal might have helped him get hired. Clearly, the American cardinals have a great deal of influence over Vatican PR, given how much Vatican funding comes from the U.S. Burke is a traditionalist, a celibate, a member of the conservative catholic alliance Opus-Dei, and his spiritual practices reportedly include self-flagellation, in keeping with Opus Dei traditionalists.
In addition to Burke, the Vatican has also hired the consulting firm of McKinsey & Company. The consulting firm was engaged to study the Holy Sees communications, with an eye to creating a more effective media operation. The goal was that this hire, along with that of Burke the year before, would reverse the declining view of the Church caused, in part, by public relations miscues.
. . .
Greg Burke told reporters when he was hired that he know[s] what journalists are looking for and what they need, and I know how things will play out in the media. Pope Francis has played the part nearly perfectly and Burkes strategies have certainly paid dividends for the Church. By going on the offensive and promoting positive stories instead of waiting to react to negative ones, Burke helped to turn around the Catholic Churchs image in the United States. And improving Americans image of the Catholic Church is of critical importance. According to The Economist, The American church may account for as much as 60 percent of the global institutions wealth. Little surprise, then, that it is the biggest contributor to head office (ahead of Germany, Italy and France). Everything from renovations to St. Peters Basilica in Rome to the Pontifical Gregorian University, the churchs version of West Point, is largely paid for with American money. The National Catholic Reporter points out that American Catholics put more than $150 million a week into the collection plate, totaling $8 billion annually. Even if, as they assert, ninety percent of those donations never leave their parish, that means that about $800 million a year donated by American Catholics is being used to fund the Catholic Church around the world.
. . . .
http://www.salon.com/2014/06/22/pope_franciss_liberal_reformer_image_is_all_smoke_and_mirrors_partner/
tea and oranges
(396 posts)n2doc
(47,953 posts)merrily
(45,251 posts)about "if a priest is homosexual, who am I to judge?"
Years ago, the Church stated that BEING homosexual was not the issue. Having sex with a person of your own gender is a sin, though. (This pronouncement occasioned--and deserved-- many bitter jokes.)
Also, priests (other than the few who are married) take a vow of chastity and are not supposed to have sex with anyone of any gender. (And none of us is supposed to masturbate.)
On top of that, the Bible says none of us should judge anyone.
So, when you put those three things together, the statement was nothing new. What was left unsaid by Francis and the Church--and left unasked by the near worthless media: While Pope Francis would not have a problem with a priest's being a celibate homosexual, would he would have a problem with a priest who broke his vow of celibacy? How about a lay homosexual (no pun intended) who was not content merely to BE a celibate homosexual, but actually engaged in sex without someone of his or her own gender?
Our near worthless media, however, hyped it as a huge departure. Not only was nothing new, it struck me as carefully disingenuous.
PeaceNikki
(27,985 posts)JustAnotherGen
(31,823 posts)merrily
(45,251 posts)Lord knows, I try. I don't always manage it, but I almost always try.
bullwinkle428
(20,629 posts)I've seen Mormons on other boards state this very specifically - that a person can have all of the thoughts and desires they can imagine about someone of the same gender. They're still totally fine in the eyes of the church if they never actually act on those impulses.
merrily
(45,251 posts)the positions "evolved." First, it was that homosexuals were an abomination to God. Which, of course, begged the question, "Then why does God create homosexuals?"
Rather than take the risk that the science might indeed prove that homosexuals are born, not made, the message switched to "Being a homosexual is not a sin, but having sex with members of the same gender is a sin." (The punchier, but equally awful, evangelical slogan being, "Love the sinner; hate the sin." And we recently heard a variant of this from Governor "Oops" Perry. Something alone the lines of "I can be born with a tendency to alcoholism, but I don't have to act on it. I don't have to drink."
Of course, all that was back before the right found it easier simply to deny scientific findings, no matter how definitive they were.
BTW, in various religious groups, especially those that were really turned inward by rejection, lying and otherwise being deceitful to protect the religion/sect/cult is considered a religious duty, not a sin. And that fact is never to be admitted to an outsider. I have encountered that first hand in a group smaller than Mormons or Catholics.
Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)nt
MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)Many folks are mystified how we could expect Obama to fix 8 years in 5, yet others demand a fix for 2,000 years in 1.
Pope Francis has said things and done things that no other Pope has for generations. Will he fix stuff? We'll see. But I don't think it's reasonable to expect much more from him in this short time span.
niyad
(113,306 posts)apparently no. come on, what part of his authority, as quoted in the article, do you not understand? are you okay with the rcc's continued assault on women, on lgbt? are you okay with the rcc's interference in women's (and not just catholic) health care? with the stroke of a pen, he could change this, but doesn't even bother with the rhetoric.
This stuck out:
She clearly has an agenda. There's very little new reporting in there. Links are cobbled together to attempt to create a whole to match that statement.
I did read some more of her writing.
Well, Im an atheist, but it was a spiritual experience, I tell you. New Orleans is like that. Everything is crazy and beautiful, even when its not.
http://www.drinkingdiaries.com/2012/03/21/an-interview-with-anna-march-author-of-the-forthcoming-novel-%E2%80%9Cthe-diary-of-suzanne-frank-%E2%80%9D/
I'm not impressed.
niyad
(113,306 posts)rug
(82,333 posts)cprise
(8,445 posts)Whereas your criticism of her writing amounts to "links cobbled together", which is another way of saying you didn't like the barrage of evidence.
If OTOH you can point out an unfair insinuation or misquote, then by all means share with us...
rug
(82,333 posts)"All about".
It would make her burden easier if it were true. But, of course, it's not.
These hyperbolic screeds bury in hyperbolic screeds the legitimate criticisms to be had.
BTW, who is this "us" you're speaking for?
cprise
(8,445 posts)Actually, I'd say it takes considerable work to even approach the kind of hyperbole and absolutism dripping from the pens of RCC clergy.
Judgment is a funny thing: It frames the discussion in ways that can be applied back at the framer.
rug
(82,333 posts)Say hello to "us".
cprise
(8,445 posts)niyad
(113,306 posts)from LEGITIMATE, non-biased sources (in other words, catholic register does not count) what, exactly, she got wrong.
theHandpuppet
(19,964 posts)An actual rebuttal of facts in the article rather than just a trashing of the author.
niyad
(113,306 posts)rug
(82,333 posts)It's cobbled because she takes certain information, which may or may not be true or complete, and uses them to support her preformed opinion.
For example:
That statement is just left out there, floating in the wind. She doesn't define "complicity" and as a result it is no more than a bigoted smear against any practicing Catholic.
Perhaps you want to take a crack at it.
niyad
(113,306 posts)validity than you give hers, without concrete proof?
rug
(82,333 posts)Tell me who the "we" is that you're speaking for and you may get an answer.
niyad
(113,306 posts)YOU are the one with the burden of proof to show that. but, as I said, keep trying, we need the laughs.
Beartracks
(12,814 posts)Wow, no bias THERE.
===============================
MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)There are many things that Obama could change with the stroke of a pen, yet chooses not to, either, such as federal prosecution of people for marijuana offenses, prosecuting war criminals, etc.
Change can't always happen in an instant, even if it theoretically can. The Catholic Church has something like a billion members, and a ginormous hierarchy, it can't be turned on a dime without big problems. In the case of Pope Francis, he *seems* to be moving in a way that's consistent with change. Only time will tell.
zeemike
(18,998 posts)And ot seems to me that we are divided into two camps...the good guys and the bad guys, and if one of those who is on the other side says something to support our side we still have to trash them.
It is as if we care nothing for the principles, only the personalities...and like in the WWF the good guys are all good and the bad guys are all bad to the bone.
I think we have all watched to much TV.
tom_kelly
(959 posts)theHandpuppet
(19,964 posts)Scott Novak
06/20/2014
On Thursday, Archbishop Salvatore Cordileone of San Francisco participated in the homophobic March for Marriage across from the Supreme Court, leading thousands of protesters in prayer against same-sex marriages.
The rally, organized by National Organization for Marriage President Brian Brown, promoted the idea that LGBT relationships are somehow lesser than heterosexual relationships, and it had the full support of the Catholic Church. SF Gate reported that Cordileone told the crowd that he has "'the support of Pope Francis for what we are doing today,' citing approval by the Apostolic Nunciature of the Holy See to the United States, the Vatican's diplomatic mission in Washington."
Pope Francis has certainly brought some good PR to the Church when it comes to LGBT equality. In response to a question about gay priests in the Catholic Church, he replied, "If someone is gay and seeks the Lord with good will, who am I to judge?" He was later named The Advocate's Person of the Year for setting a new tone of compassion for LGBT people within the Church.
But as incidences like the Church's approval of the March for Marriage shows, Pope Francis is not the LGBT rights hero that some media groups have made him out to be. It's important to note that the "who am I to judge" comment was made in reference to celibate gay priests, not about loving, non-heterosexual relationships, therefore remaining consistent with Catholic doctrine. The pope was not saying that LGBT families are just as sacred as heterosexual families, although you wouldn't get that impression from some of the media reports about his remarks. Rather, homosexual relationships are still "intrinsically disordered," as the Catechism of the Catholic Church so eloquently states....
MORE at http://www.huffingtonpost.com/scott-novak/for-lgbt-people-the-pope-_b_5516144.html
rug
(82,333 posts)Here is The Advocate's evaluation.
http://www.advocate.com/year-review/2013/12/16/advocates-person-year-pope-francis
theHandpuppet
(19,964 posts)This pretty much summed it up:
rug
(82,333 posts)theHandpuppet
(19,964 posts)Perhaps with some reflection the editors of The Advocate will come to realize just how much cred they lost with that one.
rug
(82,333 posts)cprise
(8,445 posts)rug
(82,333 posts)BTW, Salon simply reprinted an article from The Weeklings. How's their track record?
http://www.theweeklings.com/about-the-weeklings/
MattSh
(3,714 posts)The question is: What are here credentials to write about religion?
Make fatherhood a mans choice!
The burden of pregnancy will never be fair. Child support can be -- but men need to have a chance to opt out
ANNA MARCH, THE WEEKLINGS
SATURDAY, NOV 2, 2013 08:00 PM EET 579
SOCIAL THE WEEKLINGS, PATERNITY
Hillary in the (White) House
We elected a black man. Are we ready to elect a woman?
ANNA MARCH, THE WEEKLINGS
SATURDAY, MAY 11, 2013 05:00 PM EEST
POLITICS THE WEEKLINGS, HILLARY CLINTON
My bad sex wasnt rape
The outcry over a recent "Girls" episode startled me. What happened to a woman's sexual agency?
ANNA MARCH
SATURDAY, MAR 23, 2013 01:00 AM EET
LIFE SEX, FEMINISM, RAPE, GIRLS
My shazam boobs
As a feminist, I believe breasts shouldn't matter. So why do I care so much how mine look, and whether I lose them?
ANNA MARCH
TUESDAY, DEC 11, 2012 03:00 AM EET
LIFE BODY WARS, BREASTS, BODY ISSUES
http://www.salon.com/writer/anna_march/
niyad
(113,306 posts)about other subjects disqualify one from writing about religion? and, as a matter of curiosity, what are your credentials, such that we should give weight to your opinions about who is, or is not, qualified to write about religion?
m-lekktor
(3,675 posts)i remember reading it all when i included mine.
PeaceNikki
(27,985 posts)It's equivalent to, "my black friend said racism is dead".
Chathamization
(1,638 posts)But the influence on the ground of Franciss words and deeds including a recent suggestion that the church may look more closely at the issue of civil unions has begun to create what gay Catholics here describe as a burgeoning spirit of acceptance in pockets of the churchs grass roots.
In Florence, a local parish council this month permitted a group of gay Catholics to hold their first public prayer session inside a Roman Catholic church. In Rome, a parish run by Jesuit priests announced a special service scheduled for April that, also for the first time in recent memory, is openly reaching out to gay as well as divorced Catholics. A leaflet for the service depicts Francis on the cover and reads: The Church wants to be home. For everybody.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/europe/in-italy-gay-catholics-feel-the-francis-effect/2014/03/27/8182dd6a-9f9d-11e3-878c-65222df220eb_story.html
is not, and never has been a force for good
Android3.14
(5,402 posts)Or the corporate push back. Pope Francis is rattling some powerful cages.
theHandpuppet
(19,964 posts)... that she's either part of a pushback by the Mafia or a corporate tool. In addition to being an accomplished writer and feminist, she and her partner founded the following...
THE ANNA & ADAM CHARITABLE FUND supports non-profit organizations, especially those that benefit people living in Delawares beach communities. The fund strives to support a wide range of programs with an emphasis on, but not limited to, progressive minded organizations that serve women and girls, the LGBTQQI community, immigrant communities, disabled individuals, the economically disadvantaged and other traditionally underserved people. The Fund also seeks to assist programs that promote writing, reading, literature and literacy. The Fund supports local, regional and national organizations and has a special interest in fostering an increase in charitable giving by both residents and guests of the beach communities.
But of course she must be dismissed as simply a tool and a hater.
NYC Liberal
(20,136 posts)His policies are exactly the same as his predecessors were. That includes economic policy. Benedict wrote some scathing attacks on capitalism.
Godot51
(239 posts)... any shift in the policies of the RCC to the left are to be welcomed. And, no matter the sincerity of the messenger, it's difficult to put things back the way they were and difficult to lower expectations once change has been initiated.
Ask Gorbachov (though, sadly, changes can be pulled back and expectations lowered if you try hard and ruthlessly enough, as Pootie Putin does).
Frankie goes to Rome may be a charade but for millions it will change the way they look at and what they expect from the church and that's worth something.
Blessed are they who expect nothing for they shall not be disappointed.
F4lconF16
(3,747 posts)However, I think it is wrong to say that "any shift in the policies of the RCC to the left are to be welcomed", as this implies there has been a shift in policy. While the pope has said things that may on the surface be a slight shift to the left, as the article states there has been little if any significant change in policy. That is a big difference.
That said, you are absolutely correct that it is difficult to put things back the way they were once change has been initiated, and I would agree that for many it will change what they expect for the church.
Unfortunately, for many others (perhaps even more, though we will see) it will be something that they can point to and say, "Look, the RCC is liberal now. You don't need to continue trying to change more". It also gives ammunition to those defending the church, which is not a good thing, imho. You can see that here on DU; there are some that cite the current pope as a reason not to continue attacking the RCC over its bigoted and harmful policies, or at least as a reason to lessen the attacks. While I don't believe these people are bigots, they end up supporting (if indirectly) bigoted policies as they aren't aware of the lack of real change. Now, I'm giving the benefit of the doubt to DUers, but I know there are people using the new pope to do more harm on the right.
That's my take, anyways
saidsimplesimon
(7,888 posts)I've said this pope speaks for me on most, not all social, moral or political issues. That does not mean that I encourage donations to any religious organization, or support their religious dogma.
The pope seemed ill during his visit to the wall in Israel. Was he fasting or in ill health? He has many enemies. Excommunicating the Mafia was long overdue, as was firing those in charge on the bank. Francis is making a few moves in the direction I can all support. I don't throw away an imperfect gift for the impossible dream.
rickyhall
(4,889 posts)SidDithers
(44,228 posts)and somehow appropriate that Pope Photo-Op's PR man is a former Fox News correspondent.
Sid
dilby
(2,273 posts)they need money. And since there is not an organization out there that operates for free the Catholic Church is dependent on their donations. So the author doesn't like how the Catholic Church spends their money, I get it. She doesn't like that they raise money, I get it. In all honesty I highly doubt there is anything the Catholic Church could do that would appease the author.
theHandpuppet
(19,964 posts)... fighting gay marriage, sponsoring discriminatory legislation and filing lawsuit after lawsuit against contraception coverage. If the church wants to spend its money feeding the poor that's one thing. When it uses it funds to oppress people, that's quite another.
F4lconF16
(3,747 posts)Let's not pretend the RCC only uses it's money to help people.
Edit: spelling
UTUSN
(70,695 posts)It said he was building his popularity that would be drawn upon later when he would reinforce the same old policies.
niyad
(113,306 posts)that any such thing is going on.