Why Hospitals Want Patients to Pay Upfront

[LiberalElite]

http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2014-09-25/why-hospitals-want-patients-to-pay-upfront#r=rss


I'm lucky. I have health insurance through my employer. my in-network deductible is only $500. But my specialist co-pay went from $40 to $60 this year, and I'm putting off seeing a couple of doctors. Single payer where are you!?!?!?!?!

[baldguy]

1. Cue the anti-Democrat "Democrats" to chime in & blame Obama.

Of course, single-payer was a non-starter in 2009, and they know it.

[Cali_Democrat]

9. ...

[rhett o rick]

18. So you don't want single payer and like to disparage those that aren't ok with settling

for the ACA? Let them eat cake right? Is that what you mean? It's not Obama's fault. It seems that statement is more important than thinking how we can make our country better for the 99%. Do you care about the 99% or just defending Pres Obama? An answer isn't necessary, the question was rhetorical. The President could bomb Syria and some here would defend him.

"Of course, single-payer was a non-starter in 2009" That's the rationalization for not going for single payer. What does "non-starter" even mean? Sounds like the rationalization the conservatives use to justify settling for the ACA. "We have to give them something, how about Romney-care?" And tell us that it's a "first step". When will we see the second step? Again, that's rhetorcial because we won't see the second step as long as we continue to elect conservatives for president.

The conservatives here disparage the left for wanting more. I think they think we should be satisfied with eating the cake.

[baldguy]

19. No, no and no.

You can whine & stamp you feet & hold your breath like Baby Finster just because you haven't received the ice cream & ponies you've irrationally demanded, but I'm talking about the real world. That doesn't make me a conservative, that makes me an adult.

And every time you cry, it just makes it that much easier for the GOP to win & destroy everything.

[rhett o rick]

20. Yep, there it is. Wanting single payer apparently equates to wanting a pony. We should be thankful

that we got what we have and never want for more. How like a true American Aristocrat. That's exactly what is meant by "let them eat cake." "Let them have the ACA. That'll shut them up for a while."

"I'm talking about the real world." Really? How audacious. In the real world that I see, we have longer lines at the soup kitchens, demand up and donations down at the foodbanks, and millions losing their homes. But apparently you have a different view of "the real world", where we should sit down and shut up. And that will help us defeat the GOP.

I think your "real world" is in deep denial.

[baldguy]

21. Denial is behavng as if the GOP is not a political power & the Pres can do whatever he wants.

That is not the case. Obama can't just flip a switch in the Oval Office and end poverty, or simply order that the fed govt create a free, single payer healthcare system. And we have a vast array of extremist RW propaganda continually campaigning against him & any Democrat who stands up. To strive to cast anyone who recognizes this, and who supports the President and the Democratic party as some sort of RW stooge, isn't audacious - it's childish, and IT HELPS THE RW defeat the very policies you claim to support.

[rhett o rick]

23. I am disappointed. Asking for progressive policies does not help the GOP. We don't have single

payer because why again? And if it was a first step and he was determined, why isn't he pushing for the second step?

I get confused from the whiplash from threads that proclaim how good and great the President is and how helpless he is. Is he trying to end poverty? Seem to me like he is more interested in persecuting whistle-blowers and medical marijuana users. Why are they high priority. He seems to have no problem acting unilaterally in expanding The Great Middle East War, but helpless to fix our health care, infrastructure, and feed our children. Some want us to believe that the GOP is so very powerful that the President's hands are tied, the GOP doesn't force him to appoint conservatives that DON'T EVEN TRY to help the 99%.

And now we are looking at the possibility of H. Clinton-Sachs as president. The American Aristocrats are winning and even have rooters here in DU.

[baldguy]

27. Since you're acting like a child, here it is explained for children:

If you can stop pouting a couple minutes, maybe you'll learn something.

If a bill can't get through Congress, it can't become a law.

[rhett o rick]

30. Annnnd right back to "It's not Obama's fault". Or "the buck stops somewhere else."

The President doesn't have trouble getting things he wants done, just those things the 99% wants done. He is unilaterally expanding the Great Continuous ME War without any trouble from Congress but he can't seem to get his own DoJ to prosecute Wall Street corruption (he doesn't need a bill for that). Doesn't need a bill to get the TPP passed. Not even a hearing if it's fast tracked. Congress isn't holding him back from coming out against fracking. In fact he supports fracking, something about an "energy bridge."

I notice when you run out of things to say you resort to ridicule. I want to end poverty, at least child poverty and you call that childish. What you need is a special place where no one is allowed to say a discouraging word about the President. Where no liberal is allowed. I think it's called the BOG.

[baldguy]

31. You're so busy looking for things to blame Obama for, you've forgotten who the real enemy is.

Karl Rove loves your kind of "Democrat".

You "want to end poverty", but your shit gives the RW all the ammunition they need to make it worse.

You want single payer, but your shit would have made it impossible to get any health care reform done any time, any where.

You don't want war, but you won't tolerate Obama trying to clean up the mess from the last one.

Everything you do makes it MORE DIFFICULT to get progressive policies enacted and HELPS THE GOP defeat them.

[rhett o rick]

32. I am glad we are having this exchange. Let's get it in the open as to what kind of Democrats we

each are.

You claim: "You're so busy looking for things to blame Obama for, you've forgotten who the real enemy is." I am very curious who you think "the real enemy is" Maybe Herman Cain, or John McCain or Scott Perry, Sarah Palin, or even Mittens Romney. They are only tools of our enemy.
I think the enemy are those that protect Wall Street corruption, those that let banksters declare bankruptcy while many millions of Americans lose their homes. The enemy is those that support the NSA/CIA Security State. The enemy is those that support fracking and cross country pipelines. The enemy is those that support Free Trade agreements that throw millions of Americans out of work. The enemy is those that want to destroy SS and Medicare.

And you go on to claim that my desire for ending poverty, for achieving single payer health insurance, and ending the Great Continuous Middle East War, some how aids the GOP. Care to explain that? You, like your hero, want the left to sit down and shut up and accept the status quo. I hate to tell you but that's not likely.

"Karl Rove loves your kind of Democrat". Really? Karl Rove loves wild-assed left wing radicals? As an attempt to disparage me, it's not even a good try.

So tell us what kind of a Democrat are you? What do you stand for?

[laundry_queen]

38. +1 nt

[rhett o rick]

41. Out of curiosity, who do you think the real enemy is? nm

[laundry_queen]

42. sorry so late

I was at work, lol.

Corporatists. Anyone who puts corporate interests above the interests of the general population.

[rhett o rick]

43. Yes, I agree. You said it all. nm

[nationalize the fed]

33. It has to get TO congress first

Arrests on Capitol Hill over Single Payer Health Care Issue

Dr. Margaret Flowers, one of the eight arrested, added in the press release: "Health insurance administrators are practicing medicine without a license. The result is the suffering and death of thousands of patients for the sake of private profit. The private insurance industry has a solid grip on patients, providers and legislators. It is time to stand up and declare that health care is a human right." The activists are supporting HR 676 and S 703. For background and any updates, see: http://www.healthcare-now.org and
http://singlepayeraction.org and http://md.pnhp.org and
http://www.prosperityagenda.us/ and http://freshaircleanpolitics.net.

Max Baucus is now Ambassador to China

I wouldn't have supported a Heritage Foundation plan under a R and when I opposed this same plan under a D I was called a racist

[baldguy]

37. In 2009 you could've counted the people in Congress supporting single payer on one hand.

see post #27:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025593308#post27

[sabrina 1]

34. Do you care about the people who are sick and cannot afford HC or are you more concerned

about politicians, none of whom were even mentioned in the OP.

I was thinking that it's too bad we are not French when I read the OP. S/he would not have any co-pay, or hospital bills at all. And Hospitals wouldn't have to worry about being 'paid up front' by sick people. Sick people wouldn't be expected to pay at all.

Their life span is longer than ours also.

Single payer had the best chance it will ever have in 2008 had it been 'on the table'. The bargaining would have had to start from that HIGH POINT. Instead it and the PO were thrown away. Since you brought it up.

I care about people who are sick. I know politicians are going to do just fine and don't need me to worry about them.

[baldguy]

36. Do you care about the MILLIONS of people who can now afford health insurance?

Do you care about the tens of thousands of Americans who surly would have died without Obamacare? Because that's the alternative: Obamacare or nothing. Single payer never had a change. There was too much entrenched opposition to it & too little support for it in Congress. It was never an option. To persist in saying it was defies reality.

Is it perfect? No, of course not. When Social Security began, it wasn't perfect either. (And it's still not.) But over the years, it's been modified & expanded to what it is today. We made it better.

Why don't you work to make ACA better rather than attacking Obama & Democrats for making better health insurance for all? Why do you ally yourself with the people who are trying to repeal it?

[kcr]

2. I had two thoughts reading your post.

First was, "OMG your insurance is fabulous" Then, it was, "How sad is it that that is now considered fabulous insurance?" Yes. Single payer, where are you?

[LiberalElite]

5. Exactly -

I've been insulated all these years because I had affordable copays. Now I can't afford doctors either AND I HAVE F******G INSURANCE.

I saw a podiatrist recently due to a burning sensation in a toe on one foot. It was bad enough to make me wince. He prescribed orthotics. I was cautiously optimistic that the orthotics were covered - I called customer service - Turns out my insurance only covers orthotics for diabetic neuropathy and some other diabetic condition. I said to the customer service person - "So searing, nearly disabling pain by itself isn't enough?" She started to chuckle before I hung up. It's bizarre that my reaction to learning this was to be envious of diabetics. The orthotics cost $450.00 and it's all on me.

[kcr]

6. I can remember 10 dollar copays for specialists. And no deductible.

It was a dream. I remember being told that the new system with deductibles would mean more choice. This way is better! But I still have a list of in network providers to choose from and it doesn't seem any larger. What a scam.

[LiberalElite]

7. Believe me -

i'm only staying in-network - and now I can't afford it anyway.

[kcr]

10. I'm sorry

I know, the whole thing about reducing choice to save costs was such a sham. We're all still underinsured and it's only getting worse. Having insurance doesn't mean affording healthcare.

[madokie]

13. you have to remember who was in charge of the negotiations for ACA on the dems side

Max Baucus who was in the pockets of the insurance companies

[strawberries]

39. I can one up you

I remember 3 dollar Co-pays for DR. visits when my children were babies. God I am old

[noiretextatique]

16. i had to got to the county hospital when i broke my fifth metatarsal

because i could not find a podiatrist who would accept my insurance. after four months of walking in a boot, the county hospital podiatrist ordered a bone stimulator for me...it was free. this thing probably costs about $450.00 and there is no way i could have paid for it. i was very impressed with the care i received at the county hospital.

[Thav]

22. I haven't been to a doctor for a LONG time

basically due to the fact that I'm pretty health and I have NO IDEA how much I'll pay if I do. My wife goes in, pays the co-pay and later we get a crazy bill for crazy stuff.

No one really pays attention to "how much will this actually cost me" because we're so fixated on insurance. So you have insurance, big whoop, you'll still pay through the nose no matter what. I pay like $300/month for medical bills, on top of paying for health insurance. I pay almost 3x as much as my MORTGAGE for health care costs.

There's a law (at least in my state) requiring car dealerships to present an estimate of the cost of work, and they have to get re-authorization if the actual amount exceeds like 10% of that. There should be one of those for health care too. I'm sure people would flip out if they knew the full costs of some procedures. I, for one, just want to know how much I'm going to have to pay. The whole "ok, your copay today is $25 and we'll send you ANOTHER bill for some more later." is just bullshit.

Health Insurance is supposed to help you not go into bankruptcy because of a major health crisis. It does no good if you go into bankruptcy because you went in to have a cough checked out and got a monsterous bill.

[MerryBlooms]

3. Rehab is also a gold mine

My rehab bill was $10,000 up front before they would even admit me. So it was the $10,000 up front and then $2,000 per week. I was there for 6 weeks. Luckily I had the funds to cover. Health care on EVERY level in this country is like wading into a pond of 6 inches muck, all the while being attacked by hungry leaches.

[bigwillq]

4. My specialist co-pays also went up

insured through my employer as well.

Everything is so expensive, and the system is still a mess, imo. Not sure if that will ever change.

[Brigid]

8. There is a solution.

But I am convinced it will never happen in this country.

[awoke_in_2003]

15. It won't...

the insurance companies own enough politicians on both sides of the aisle.

[customerserviceguy]

11. Y'know what would be nice?

Knowing upfront what something is going to cost you before you have it done.

Today, we make appointments with medical providers who do not disclose fees, who use equipment and drugs that even they don't know what the cost is, then we play the insurance gamble to see what's covered, what's not, what's partially covered, and what did or didn't make the deductible. Then we get an indecipherable "explanation" of benefits that more likely than not is simply incorrect.

I have high-deductible insurance, and a Health Savings Account, and unless it's an emergency, I'm not going to obligate myself to pay for so-called medical care unless I know for sure what's going to come out of my pocket.

[JEB]

12. I avoid doctors like the plague.

Something will eventually kill me, but I'm almost 64 so I will likely make it to Medicare.

[TransitJohn]

29. And then you'll find out that no physiciancs or hospitals take Medicare. eom

n/t

[yeoman6987]

14. I don't understand the desire for single payer

Medicare is single payer and costs 105 dollars a month.........but you need a supplement which can cost a couple hundred and still have co-pays and other charges. I don't get it at all.

[dflprincess]

17. A true single payer system (like Canada's)

might have some copays but there is no need for supplements (unless, like in France, you want to buy one that would cover things like a private room).

In other countries they do not have private insurance companies spending millions trying to undermine the public programs by bribing politicians making large campaign contributions.

[rhett o rick]

24. What type of national health insurance do you recommend? And do any countries now use it? nm

[yeoman6987]

25. Well my experience with national health care is The Bahamas

They have national health care. But also private hospitals. The government run hospitals are for the middle class and poor. The private hospitals are for the wealthy. I believe if we end up with national health care. It will be similar to that. Most of us will end up using the government run hospitals and the rich will use the Johns Hopkins type. Of course government run hospitals will start with all the hope for best care, but eventually will become inferior to the private hospitals.

[rhett o rick]

26. What you are describing is a single payer system. Citizens pay the government either like we do

with Medicare or via taxes. In some countries it's like you described while others have all private hospitals with the bill paid by the government insurance, like Medicare.

[davidpdx]

40. We have universal coverage in South Korea

It took 12 years to fully implement it here. That was long before I arrive. I pay $105 a month (or about $1,260 a year) for my wife with my employer picking up the other half. I can go to any clinic and the fees are regulated. Three years ago I broke my ankle and had to go to the doctors for several months to have it checked. An x-ray and doctor's visit runs less than $15.

[freshwest]

28. Single payer is where you vote it in. The ACA allows for it. VT did it. CA may do it. Up to us.

[MillennialDem]

35. It's ridiculous - my insurance denies the claim at the doctor

The doctor's office sends me a bill.

Then I try to submit a claim to my insurance company to cover the damn bill (they are in my network) but they require the TIN (tax id number) of the doctor's office.

The doctor's office refuses to give their TIN to me. They don't GAF and just want me to pay - easier than dealing with insurance.

Single payer - NOW.