Are property taxes stopping many from home ownership

[scarystuffyo]

If you own a home do you feel property taxes are too high in your area ?


Are seniors who worked their whole life to pay off a home having a hard time keeping it
now because of property taxes?

[Hekate]

1. Taxes are how govt pays for things. Figure out where else the money can come from before...

....following in Howard Jarvis's footsteps. Back when Prop 13 was passed in California, first thing my Mom noticed was the public library cut its hours drastically. Cutting taxes is a two-edged sword.

To answer your original question: property taxes are part of the ancillary costs of home ownership, ongoing and to be expected, like the electric bill. They can and should be researched before deciding how much you can afford to spend to buy and keep a house -- like HOA fees for a condo.

No, they did not stop us from buying our first and only house when we were young, but now that we are nearing retirement and thinking of buying a "dream home" to live in, the prospect of vastly increased property taxes on top of the purchase price has made us reconsider, because in retirement our income will be reduced a lot. Such is life.

[brush]

72. Property taxes help make the community livable . . .

by paying for the fire dept., police, sanitation in many communities, schools, etc.

It's part of owning a home and one should only buy in an area where you can afford the taxes.

The good thing about it is you get to write off the taxes and insurance you pay on the house, which usually helps you get more money back in your tax return every year.

In other words, the property taxes are themselves a tax shelter from the IRS.

[Hekate]

83. Agreed. I am not anti-tax, believe me. The other thing that suffered here was schools

I swear people are stupid -- taxes keep the community going, keep the state and country going. The state lottery was supposed to benefit schools, BUT the state legislature made it a zero-sum game (last I heard) so that all the lottery really is is a regressive tax on the poor. As always it's a matter of electing people who will represent the interests of the people, so that taxes get spread out fairly, and not just feed them a lie about how we can have everything we want and pay nothing.

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

81. Without Prop. 13 I would have lost my house

The real estate bubble convenienly enough coincided with some very lean years for me. Prop. 13 also protects industrial and commercial areas (aka employment) from redevelopment pressures that replaces commerce with condos.

[Retrograde]

97. Not quite that bad here

We can cope with the regular 2% increase - and even the additional parcel tax for the schools - but with the recent increases in our area (it was a marginal student/oldster/worker neighborhood when we bought, now that Facebook moved into the area it's gone out of sight) we couldn't afford it if we had to pay based on current prices.

A side effect of Prop. 13 is that is seems to have made neighborhoods more stable: there's not much turnover here.

[Bluenorthwest]

116. Prop 13 is actually the reason CA's real estate market is not stable, why you bubbled so hard

It is the law that most hinders CA, and also the law that is the most harmful to communities who are striving toward home ownership and helpful to those who already own one property or one thousand.
Among the people who opposed Prop 13 when it became law are my Dad, myself, Harvey Milk and Jerry Brown....

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

131. Prop. 13 was a result of municipalities aggressively reassessing properties at inflated values

California's biggest housing bubble to date was almost a century before Prop. 13.

You just can't use property taxes as a bottomless piggy bank, especially when a modest family or business can so easily become paper millionaires. It also isn't a great outcome if a commercial property, say a strip mall that were to support 40 or 50 full-time jobs is redeveloped into condos supporting one of two or zero jobs.

[The empressof all]

2. I live in a very high property tax area...Over 5000 per year for 1600 sq ft home on small lot.

It's still cheaper per month than renting if your home is paid off. You need to be disciplined to put that money aside every month because the bill comes twice a year for us and it would be a burden if I didn't budget for it out of the monthly income. Even with routine maintenance and upkeep its still far more cost effective for us to remain in our home.

My community is a trendy affluent area east of Seattle. It has great schools, public resources and community services. Our property values are continuing to grow because folks want to live here. I feel I get great value for what I contribute in taxes...so no complaints from me.

[NYC_SKP]

110. Me, too. Just got my statement. $7,288 for a 450 sf one bedroom condo!

Lots of extras added to the basic 1%, and I think they might have over valued it. By a lot. Or I got a great deal when I bought it at auction.

In any event, I'll still have to work til I die just to pay the taxes and HOA fees.

Or move to a trailer park!

[Logical]

3. We have great schools where I live. And most school levys always pass. nt

[bigwillq]

4. Mine are way too high.

They went down a little bit this past year after a new administration took over, but still way too high.

I live in a small town in CT.

[NutmegYankee]

95. Which small town?

I live in Montville.

[JustAnotherGen]

5. Not really

Property taxes have always been high in NJ. We bought last year. Because we bought the home far below what it was last assessed at - our taxes actually dropped by about $400. Still paying about 8500 though.

For my taxes I get - I borough police department, really good schools, FD, EMT, a recent project to re-direct the drains (lots of folks had flooding problems in some parts of towns), the sidewalks are under way, purchase of two historical buildings - one will become an arts center/theater.

This is a very affluent town - and most of our seniors are doing pretty well. It's the folks in the shadows (undocumented aliens, Pennsyltuckians moving here for opportunity, 2008 job loss folks) that are hurting. Most live in apartments/rental units.

But there are some moves for tax breaks for businesses that can provide walkable (many of the folks listed above don't have private transportation) jobs that pay $15 an hour or more in our town.

That's good for everyone! More than willing to offset the cost of something that will allow more folks to prosper.

[meaculpa2011]

6. My property taxes this year are $14,750.

We're in a very nice, very modest home in a middle/working class suburb just outside of NYC.

One of my neighbors is a lawyer, but most are teachers, police, small business owners, retirees and one free-lance writer.

I don't know how any community can expect to have a future if young families can't afford to live there.

We have a tax reduction program for seniors, but the income threshold is so low that few can really benefit.

[scarystuffyo]

8. Wow that's nuts

[The empressof all]

11. NY, CT Or NJ?

I have family in NJ and their taxes are crazy high. NY can be even worse. Plus these states have Sales and Income taxes. You folks do carry more burden than most.

[bigwillq]

14. Not sure where that poster lives but I live in CT and, yes, taxes are outrageous.

[scarystuffyo]

18. CT

[bigwillq]

21. You live in CT or the poster you asked does?

I'm confused.

[scarystuffyo]

22. I'm sorry , I live in CT

[bigwillq]

23. Great. Me too!

I love it, but it's such an expensive state.

[scarystuffyo]

25. I love everything about this state

Even the winters I don't mind

It's just the taxes are crazy high for everything it seems

[NutmegYankee]

88. The winter is part of the high tax though.

All that snow removal and road treatment plus the repaving.

[scarystuffyo]

102. Oh I know snow removal costs but there's a lot of waste in this state

Also 180 or so million we get from each casino a year was suppose to ease our tax burden.

Yet we are one of the highest taxed states in the country

go figure

[NutmegYankee]

104. The Casinos aren't doing that well.

I live near Mohegan Sun. Our town get paid $500,000 a year and supplies the water/sewer to them.

[scarystuffyo]

105. They still pay the state 25% of all slot revenue even now

combined it's close to 380 million a year give or take 10 or 20 million

[NutmegYankee]

106. $279 million and falling.

http://www.ctpost.com/local/article/Revenue-falls-at-state-casinos-as-regional-5708629.php

[scarystuffyo]

107. Holy cow that's a big drop

I hope that doesn't mean even higher taxes

[meaculpa2011]

17. NY. South shore of Nassau County, Long Island four miles from the Queens line.

The proximity to Manhattan is huge plus (we're transplanted city kids) and we've done fairly well.

I'm concerned for young people who would like to make a future here.

I guess we'll just die and leave everything to kids so that they can go someplace they can afford, but my intention is to spite them and live to be 110.

[The empressof all]

27. Young folks buying in that area has always been a problem

It was the reason we left in 1986 when we wanted to root and start a family. Even back then with two salaries we couldn't afford to buy anywhere in NYC area that we would live in. Since I am Jersey by birth I never considered living there again after I escaped. We looked all over Brooklyn which would have been our first choice but we wanted home not co-op or condo. It worked out just fine for us but even almost 30 years later I miss "home"

[meaculpa2011]

32. We were very lucky.

We moved from a small (tiny) apartment in Manhattan in 1977 and bought a two-family attached home in Queens. It was, at the time, a less-than-desirable neighborhood. We lived there very cheaply and the area experienced an upswing.

We sold the house seven years later for nearly four times what we paid for it and bought our current home in Oceanside. It was a fixer upper and 28 years later I was still fixing when Sandy came through and washed away our first floor. Thankfully I carried full replacement flood insurance and the major renovation we were planning is now being paid for by the insurance company.

There's a little known program here that allows homeowners 62 or over to convert up to 800 square feet into a rental apartment. We're thinking very seriously of doing it since our kids are now in their early 20s, the young one out on her own, and we don't need all that space anymore.

[tabbycat31]

15. Are you from my hometown

Because your property taxes sound like the town that I grew up in. It's become so out of reach that the only under 40 people I know (who grew up there) are only still there because they're living with their parents.

It's become a Wall Street bedroom community.

[meaculpa2011]

19. I'm in Oceanside. And you? n/t

[tabbycat31]

53. Grew up in the White Plains area

So different county but same metro area.

[HuckleB]

51. Well, then, people in Portland, Oregon can stop complaining.

Dang.

[REP]

58. Makes me feel a lot better about the $9,049 tax bill I just got!

[Historic NY]

7. My school taxes are more than double my municipal...

its what drive folks out of their homes, the foreclosure for unpaid school taxes is fairly large county wide. They continue to rise with a dwindling student rate in the district.

[scarystuffyo]

12. My town told me 78% of my taxes are for school taxes , do you get two bills or is it lumped together

Mine are all lumped together so unless you go to the town hall and ask for a break down like I did
you wouldn't know what goes where

[Historic NY]

108. We have two seperate bills...

apparently there is a smoke and mirrors tax rebate scheme...

Years ago everyone got one especially around election time..

http://www.democratandchronicle.com/story/news/2014/10/22/second-round-rebate-checks-hit-mailboxes/17743991/

[TexasMommaWithAHat]

9. I think the elderly should get significant property tax exemptions

under a certain income threshold.

How do you live on a fixed income if your property taxes keep going up? Your house didn't suddenly get bigger or fancier. Imo, property taxes are one reason why granny - who certainly doesn't seem "poor" - can't afford her medication copays and keeps the thermostat set at fifty degrees in the winter. Sadly, most elderly will do anything to remain independent and living in their own home for as long as possible.

[scarystuffyo]

13. you can't

"How do you live on a fixed income if your property taxes keep going up"

[Lars39]

20. Many states and cities have tax relief programs for the elderly , disabled, and disabled veterans.

[RockaFowler]

28. I know in Florida they get a discount

They get a Senior's discount, Homestead Exemption and a 2nd Homestead Exemption (not on School Taxes, though).

We get the Senior's discount when my husband turns 62, so that will help us in a couple of years.

We got our bill and ours was $1300. That includes my trash pickup, too!! Not bad

[One_Life_To_Give]

10. Borderline and Yes

What percentage of a mortgage payment is too much? Before I make 30 yrs on the Mortgage the Property Tax will exceed the Loan payment. Are we prepared to collect a large chunk of SS payments to cover local taxes?

[Wellstone ruled]

16. So many Red Herrings out there.

Notice in areas with outrageous Property taxes,little to no Business or really low rates on high wage earners. While many were not paying attention,the Rethugs f---ed you over. States have transferred the real expense of Government Operations away from those who can afford it to the ones whom excepted it and made do. Bottom line,a progressive tax system states,most folks are doing Okay. Notice also,progressive states get less Federal Dollars than the taker Red States. That is why this Election is so important. And they wonder why home sales in Florida are stuck on dead,check their taxes. Outrageous.

[TexasMommaWithAHat]

24. Damn right!

Texas has no income tax at all, so we have outrageous property taxes. ugh

[catrose]

31. ^this^

My property taxes are almost half of my mortgage (p+i) payment.

[scarystuffyo]

33. New Hampshire ?

[catrose]

45. TX eom

[Silent3]

76. I'm in NH

My mortgage is paid off as of this year, but I still have to pay almost $10K/year to keep my house.

[scarystuffyo]

77. You guys are like us when it comes to property tax

and we also have a sales and income tax

[Silent3]

79. Yes, at least we're spared sales tax and income tax. OTOH, since my wife and I don't cook much...

...NH gets quite a bit of 9% "rooms and meals tax" out of us too.

[malokvale77]

49. I don't know how long you've been in Texas...

but, services that used to be part of our property taxes, are now billed separately.

Such as: Ambulance service, sewage, sanitation, etc.

To answer the OP, I paid off my mortgage many years ago and my tax bill equals what used to cover mortgage, interest, taxes, and insurance combined. All the while the evaluation on my home has plummeted.

I no longer can afford home owners insurance because the rates have become so high.

The only "miracle in Texas" is that it's citizens are so oblivious as to how bad they are being screwed.

[Trekologer]

115. Well...

In New Jersey, we have pretty high (shall I say outrageous) property taxes--statewide average last year was $7,988 with some counties close to or over $10,000. We also have personal income tax (brackets of 1.4% through 8.97%) AND sales tax (7%). The NJ Constitution mandates that personal income tax is used to reduce property tax burdens though aid to municipalities and homestead rebates (which the current administration has cut back considerably). That means that the state government mostly runs on the sales tax and business tax.

Why are property taxes so high and why do municipalities need the additional aid? NJ has 565 municipalities, 21 counties, and 603 school districts. Most municipalities have their own police departments. Some counties have both sheriff's and county police agencies. New Jersey desperately needs consolidation of local agencies. The duplication at the top (management) is bleeding the citizens dry.

[frazzled]

26. I don't think so

While property taxes are quite high where I live (a major city), and have been in previous places I've lived, there are many reasons why I--and all who claim to be liberal--should support them. This is how we pay for "police, parks, streets, schools, community colleges, public hospitals, elections, courts, jails, mosquito abatement, sewage treatment," etc. Here's a typical (though somewhat outdated) graph of how my property taxes are allocated:



Lowering property taxes means cutting services--services that affect all of us but mainly the poor. I would prefer if my state would generate more revenue (and give some back to the cities) through a progressive income tax (ours is a flat rate tax). But short of that passing, I don't want to see programs cut. And believe me, what will get cut first is always things like mental health programs, homeless shelters, after-school enrichment programs, etc.


Mortgage interest rates are very low right now, and rents are very high. If you are a renter and think you aren't paying your landlord's property taxes through your rent, you are probably naive. Frankly, I think that a mortgage + property taxes is equivalent to rents right now. Property taxes can take less of a bite if you arrange to have your taxes paid monthly into escrow to your mortgage payment. It can be tough coming up with thousands and thousands at once, but less problematic to allocate for them into your monthly payments.

In most places, seniors get a significant discount--though sometimes not enough to allow them to stay in their homes--on their property taxes. I'm not sure what the answer is. When I'm older and on a fixed income, I feel I should be moving to a smaller, more efficient place anyway. But we'll see.

[CK_John]

29. No, The student loan problem is the biggest mortgage problem and the new social norms

is to be flexible, be able to move for a job cross country overnight. We are a now a land of renters.

[spinbaby]

30. We've been wanting to downsize

In that we're looking for a retirement home without the many stairs of our present home, so we've been shopping real estate. Property taxes in our western PA area are nuts in that they're totally inconsistent. Two seemingly identical houses will have wildly different property taxes. There's been talk of reassessment but no action as of yet.

[maced666]

34. They are attempting to raise everyone where I live 17% - in one year!

Out of control.

[scarystuffyo]

65. I knowa couple of people if that happened here it could mean losing their homes

They just barely make it now

[Trajan]

35. I would rather tax the rich, who can afford to be taxed

REDUCE taxes for seniors, the poor and the middle class ....

Though, reading through your previous, right-leaning postings, I presume you seek a reduction of taxation for the rich and increased taxation on the 'Takers', as so many right-leaning persons tend to say ...

[Le Taz Hot]

36. I pay some of the lowest property taxes

in California at $1300.00/yr.

[cherokeeprogressive]

82. Mine are a shade under 14k.

I think I'm pretty much maxed out.

[Travis_0004]

37. Im ok with my property taxes

I live in a modest, but nice house on 3/4 of an acre.

What I pay for mortgage plus insurance plus propery taxes would get a 1 bedroom apartment.

Plus my payment is just about fixed (tax and insurance will go up).

It makes buying an easy decesion.

In Ohio seniors also get a tax break. I would pay about 1000 a year in property taxes if I was 65.

That may be a lot for a senior, but you couldnt rent a place for anywhere close to only 100 a month.

[karynnj]

38. You don't avoid the impact of property taxes if you rent

They are a cost to the owner and they impact your rent.

In terms of seniors, some states give seniors a break. Others, including Vermont, have a system where your property tax is based on your income if you are below a threshold. This should mean that people - of any age - who fall on hard times will pay less property taxes. (I also have heard proposals that there should be non profits that look at whether a small amount of assistance could keep someone in their home - which often is the lowest cost long term solution.

[SheilaT]

39. I'm in NM, and my property taxes are rather low.

I am paying them within the context of a mortgage, so I'd have to look at a recent statement to see just what they are. At the moment I'm out of town so can't do that.

But along with those low taxes we have really crappy schools across the state, other than in Los Alamos, where all those scientists live. I did not move here when I did six years ago just for low taxes, and I don't think I'll live here forever, although where I wind up I don't know.

But there is no way I could ever afford over a thousand dollars a month for property taxes, as my entire mortgage payment is less than that.

[mnhtnbb]

40. Here in Orange County, NC, realtors advertise houses with Chapel Hill schools but no CH taxes.

Residents of Chapel Hill and Carrboro have voted to tax themselves to support the
city schools. At one time--not long before we moved here--the school system
was recognized as one of the 10 best in the country.

In the last 2 years, since the Repubs took control of NC State Legislature, we are now
seeing teachers leaving the state, even being recruited to leave by other states.
Why? Because teacher pay is ridiculously low.

So, even though our kids are grown and gone--and took advantage of the Chapel Hill schools--
and our property taxes are higher than I would have anticipated three years ago--no, property
taxes are not too high in our area. For sure, they are too damn low in many other areas of
the state.

[CBGLuthier]

41. My taxes are $400.00 on a $50,000 house

Of course, our schools suck, our roads suck, and the whole state, including the capitol building is falling apart but hey, at least we got low taxes.

[scarystuffyo]

42. A year?

[CBGLuthier]

62. Yes

[W_HAMILTON]

44. South Carolina?

[CBGLuthier]

63. Oklahoma

[Tikki]

43. No, but then we are still on the Prop 13 level...

We will stay here until we pass or go into a rest home. We have worked hard to make sure the
property will be profitable for our sons if need be.


Tikki

[Shankapotomus]

46. Ask that question when you don't have the burden

of a mortgage on your back. If you didn't have to pay a mortgage every month, would your property taxes be manageable?It's not taxes, it's housing prices.

I haven't heard of anyone taking out a loan to pay their property taxes yet. Yet most of us take out 30 year loans to pay for our houses and ask if property taxes are too high?

[REP]

57. My mortgage payment is less than I was paying for rent

My property tax is pretty high, but it's mostly going to education and libraries, and I can live with that. What I'm getting for my mortgage payment is a much larger living space, a good-size yard, and I'm not crammed up against my neighbors.

[whatthehey]

47. Renters pay them too

No not as a separate check but as a landlord I can assure you I'm not paying property taxes out of my own pocket (higher too when not homesteaded in this and I think most areas) but that rent needs to cover all my costs including them.

But they are a hugely variable cost. Here in WKY taxes are less than 1% of value homesteaded. When I lived in the NE they were 4-5%. Other places in the Midwest I've lived somewhat in between. While the public schools here do, frankly, suck, the ones when I lived in WI and IA did not, and had much lower tax rates than the NE corridor, so it's certainly not a linear scale of good schools to high taxes.

Certainly people on low fixed incomes in NYS for example could find property taxes on sizeable properties higher than rent on modest properties, but they would also certainly find themselves unable to rent a comparable property anything like as cheaply as even the highest property taxes, because any actual owner will need to pay them. In all but the most extreme cases of charity though, tenants will bear the costs somehow. Few individual people are saintly enough to take on the responsibilities and costs of property ownership and not pass them on to tenants. I don't make a huge amount renting houses, and frankly I'm only interested in beating CD level rates of return in the first place, but I am certainly not interested in paying for the privilege of letting other people live in them, and I really doubt I'm uncommon in this regard.

[blm]

48. No. Property taxes aren't bank-breaking. My energy bills are higher

for the year. So is my cable bill.

[HuckleB]

50. Property taxes have always been a part of one's home payment.

Once the home is paid off, that monthly payment goes down.

Look, I don't know what the fairest way to tax people is, but people need to pay taxes.

[randys1]

52. Raise top rax rate to 90% where it belongs fed, raise state income tax rate accordingly

and maybe you can give some homeowners a cut

[Warpy]

54. They did in Boston

because I knew paying them even on a poky condo would keep me house poor until I died. It's one reason I left.

Boston is the best illustration I know of why churches need to be taxed.

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

55. Mine keep dropping.

Because every time they re-evaluate my property's value, it seems to keep going down.

I bought it at 103k, then they evaluated it at 96k the next time, and I think the current valuation they just did came in at 86k or 87k. The house next door sold a few months back for 80k, I think. Same floorplan and size and so on. So my problem isn't the taxes as much as equity vanishing in the wind.

[KingCharlemagne]

87. Wow, that's rotten luck. Hope the economy where you are turns around soon and takes

housing prices back up.

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

90. I'm guessing it at a 20 year rebound if that.

I'm in a small-medium sized town in which the main employer that built the town moved a lot of work out to other places, and nobody really big ever moved back in to replace the lost jobs. I don't expect the town to 'come back' until it's finally absorbed into one of the two large cities creeping towards it from either direction on the highway that connects all three, and it becomes a 'bedroom community/suburb'.

I actually bought 'before' the housing bubble. There was a brief period where I think a house or two with the same floorplan sold on the street for 120-130k in the years after I bought mine, so really, it sucks far worse to be them, having bought at the absolute top of our local market.

But the crash took us down, and we still seem to be slowly sinking, not rebounding at all.

[KingCharlemagne]

98. My wife and I always said to each other that we were buying a place to live and not a

financial investment. That said, it's really depressing watching housing values that had already declined 50% when we bought in 2009 go down another 20% between 2009-11. They've now started to come back up and this year our property tax bill will actually be a tiny bit higher (about $72) than when we first bought.

But yeah, I get your point. One of our neighbors bought at the absolute peak (late 2007) and had to walk away because her condo's value had declined over 50% and there was no way she would ever reasonably expect to get back what she would be paying for it. She willingly took the hit to her credit to relocate to rental housing and I can't say I blame her one bit.

[ozone_man]

56. How about a graduated property tax?

We have a graduated income tax, not like it should be back in the day when it peaked out at 90%. Even Obama pays only half of what I do, and I make much less than he does. We live in Bizarro world.

Back to property taxes. What we really need is a fair wealth tax and property and income are aspects of wealth. Wealth is the integral of income, like property. So, we need both taxes in appropriate measures. The new part that I would propose is a graduated property tax. Is it a great idea or what?! Why should a home owner that owns a modest home pay the same rate as someone who owns Trump Towers? In the real world, it is far worse than that, as the rich have all sorts of loop holes, e.g., Obama pays half the taxes that I do. I can't understand why there hasn't been a revolution yet in this country, but .. I digress.

[scarystuffyo]

61. I don't know if that would be fair on peoples homes

Are you referring to having a different mill rate based on the property value?

You might have people that don't deserve to be forced out of their homes just because
one family will be taxed a 10 % mill rate but then another would have to pick up that slack
so that family would be taxed 50% mill rate if the town needs a 30% across the board to pay for services and schools.

[ozone_man]

66. For the 50% mill rate who can't afford that,

they can sell and move to a cheaper abode. Yes? We (the USA tax payers) should not have to keep up expensive properties for those who can't pay for them, and a graduated property tax will help them scale down. It is the same as having a graduated income tax. The lower end of the scale should pay nothing, and the upper end of the scale should pay 90%, the same as it used to be, before Reaganites took over. Are they much different from Obamanites, or Clintonites?

I'm not sure what you mean by deserve? Everyone deserves some equity. It can never be perfectly balanced, but proper measures can reduce the disparities in equity.

[scarystuffyo]

69. It just doesn't sound right to me

Tax income more , tax liquid assets but...
making someone pay more than twice the mill rate of some one else ? I just don't like it

The person with the more expensive home is already paying more on his property tax
but then on top of that telling him now his mill rate is 50% instead of 30% because other home owners now pay 10%


I would be that guy that got the break because I own a small home but I think what it would do is have
more people leaving our state

[ozone_man]

70. Oh, this will be a national policy.

Well, it is all out of my own somewhat socialist vision. With a small s.

I appreciate your reservations and agree that the rich will not like it, and the decaying rich will especially not like it, who can no longer afford to keep up their "Tara." It tugs at the heart strings to give up that mansion!! But, think of it; sell the mansion, buy the modest property with half the (property) tax rate, and life is good again! What's not to love!

[scarystuffyo]

71. hehe

If it's national then maybe it could work

[ozone_man]

73. Think of it like health care.

We all should have it. I'm only being a realist (and somewhat radical), while also trying to promote equity. I understand if you are on the side of having to pay property taxes that you can't afford. Frankly Scarlett, ...

Oh, and don't talk to me about California property taxes, we get water in Vermont with our taxes. 40" per year. We need water for life..

[scarystuffyo]

74. just a side note.. I love Vermont

The largest obstacle in passing something like this on a national level is the ones
who need to vote it in are usually the ones who live in the largest most expensive homes.

For it to work it would need a revamp of our tax system in general because
I could see this thing 1000's of pages with deductions , loop hole's etc...

Which the rich would lobby to have put in because it wouldn't work if they pay more up front
but some how get it back from a deduction or loop hole on page 2055

It would be quite the under taking to write it up. My biggest gripe is nothing can be simple
when it comes to bureaucrats undertaking some thing this massive.

I never liked lawyer speak , everything should be understandable ....

[ozone_man]

78. It was just pie in the sky thinking.

What was I thinking?!

In a perfect world, there is equity at many levels. Health care, taxes, working conditions, environment, ... and not just for us! The equity should include all species, endangered, about to be, and all else. Humans have a way of thinking of themselves, and not the rest of our biosphere, and the inanimate world too. In the present world, I will be helping (paying a tax) to keep global warming at +2 degrees or whatever the present benchmark is to save the planet. Taxes... well, there are only two things that are sure in life, death and taxes.

[NutmegYankee]

92. Property isn't valued equally across the nation.

I live in a 1500 sqft house, but pay a price twice that of some states to buy it.

[ozone_man]

100. Location is taxable!

The three L's of real estate.

[NutmegYankee]

101. So what you actually are proposing is to screw the blue states.

How thoughtful! I don't see your plan as workable at all. A mill rate is as fair as it can get. Those with bigger homes pay more. I pay $4200 on a 1500 sqft house.

[ozone_man]

109. Not thinking red or blue.

Just fairness as in income tax fairness. Should wealth be treated any different than income as far as taxation? Wealth including any properties. Be thankful I don't go after your bank accounts, for that can be used to acquire property too. Hmmm, another problem to solve. You don't think the Rockefellers and the other robber barons got to be where they are with a fair taxation policy, do you?

I once asked my Dad about the large land holdings that the robber barons held in upper New York state and he said that eventually the land taxes would require them to sell to the state. And they did, the Whitneys, Webbs, Vanderbuilts, ... Taxes are a good thing, not bad, as long as they are progressive. And if you are Scarlett O'hara, well, I am not Rhett Butler here to save you. Sell Tara and scale down.

[NutmegYankee]

120. You don't seem to understand.

Housing prices are higher in blue states, but the people aren't wealthier overall.

[Marrah_G]

59. Stagnant and unstable wages are probably a bigger factor

Might have a good job today and get laid off tomorrow

[zappaman]

60. I guess I'm lucky to be in California?

We pay a little over 5,000 a year.
And we own our house outright.

[scarystuffyo]

64. You're the 2nd person who said CA isn't bad

I pay more than that in CT

$5,820 and my home is just a smallish ranch on 2 acres

[cherokeeprogressive]

84. CA here. Almost $14k n/t

[LeftyMom]

85. You posted pics of the place. Nobody's crying for you.

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

91. But aren't your housing costs outrageous?

I seem to recall a friend who lived out there telling me a house the same size as mine would cost 5-8 times as much to buy there.

[Le Taz Hot]

94. That's true in Southern California and the Bay Area

but not so much in the rest of California.

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

96. I think he's somewhere around Berkley

not in, but in some nearby town. I'd have to dig out an address from mail somewhere to be sure.

[Le Taz Hot]

103. Berkely is in the Bay Area.

The price of housing is outrageous. Go outside those areas and housing costs are about the same as in most of the rest of the country.

[LeftyMom]

99. It varies wildly by community.

Parts of CA are midwest cheap (ie the parts of the central valley that look suspiciously like the midwest until you see people) and parts make NYC look affordable (fashionable neighborhoods in San Francisco.)

[PasadenaTrudy]

123. Here's a house for sale

in my city in SoCal. I don't think I'll even be buying a shotgun shack here ever

https://www.redfin.com/CA/South-Pasadena/710-Grand-Ave-91030/home/7004371

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

125. Coughing a lung up...

More than 11 times my cost for roughly the same square footage. Eeek.

[PasadenaTrudy]

130. Insanity, isn't it?

All I can do is laugh...I am setting my sights on Oregon or NM someday. And I will rent.

[kelliekat44]

67. Talk to your state and local governments. But many will blame the Feds. nt

[PasadenaTrudy]

68. We have Prop. 13 to thank...

Otherwise I don't think we could have held on to our parent's property.

[krawhitham]

75. Property taxes played a big role in where we bought our home 5 years ago

[LeftyMom]

80. They work out to just over $100/mo and the assessed value is arguably too high.

edit: California again.

[lumberjack_jeff]

86. Yes.

At one point property taxes alone were 15% of our gross household income.

In Washington, high property taxes and no income taxes the reason that we have the most regressive tax system in the US.

[ibegurpard]

89. no

who can afford the median house price?

[KingCharlemagne]

93. In California (2 BR Condo). About $250/month for us. I feel it is too high, b/c

local (Los Angeles) and state government seem pretty unresponsive, serving primarily the interests of the very well heeled. It's part of our mortgage payment (goes into escrow, I believe, for bi-annual disbursements), so I don't really notice it much.

That said, I'm damned glad I don't pay rent to a slumlord any longer, as I did when younger. Well, the slumlord has been replaced by a mortgage servicer (Nationstar). But that's grist for a different thread

[flvegan]

111. 3 questions: Maybe, no and possibly.

I own a modest home, I pay modest taxes on it. I don't really mind, considering.

Yes, I'd rather I got to keep that money, but I'd rather pay my way.

[Pakhet]

112. taxes on my house here in AZ has dropped 75% in the last 3 years

I was very surprised when I got my statement this year.

[MadrasT]

113. Question makes no sense.

If you rent, you are also paying property taxes. The property owner/landlord passes them through to you as part of the rent.

[madokie]

114. Our property taxes doubled last year

We tore down an old chicken house and added a portable storage building and this is what we got for it.

[melm00se]

117. Property taxes

can be a barrier to home ownership.

Upon buying a house, you, generally, have to pay your 1st year's taxes upfront and if you live in a high tax area, that can be a significant amount of your down payment.

I remember buying my 1st house with $5000/year property taxes. that moved a lot of money from the down payment to the tax column. that lowered the amount of house I could afford and created a situation where my interest rate was higher and had to pay PMI monthly.

[treestar]

118. Seniors get breaks in my state

There is a separate tax for them. Also on transfer taxes if they sell.

[ecstatic]

119. I challenged mine and partially won

A lot of the info they base valuations on is wrong or misleading, particularly when "new sales" are really just the banks changing records for their own benefit. I pointed that out and gave specific examples on my challenge. They didn't give me exactly what I wanted, but they met me half way.

Also, lock in your current rate for 10 years. If taxes go down, mine will go down too, they just won't go up.

[Adrahil]

121. Well....

I admit I am not a fan of property taxes. But no, they are not too high, IMO, I just wish we found that funding another way. It can be a burden to people on a fixed income.

[alcibiades_mystery]

122. Welcome to DU

[TBF]

124. No. Lack of money and student debt

are keeping folks from buying homes.

But nice try. Typical right wing argument ...

[redstatebluegirl]

126. It isn't the property taxes

I don't mind paying those, they pay for our fire, police and other public services we need and most of us could not do without. What is killing us here in Oklahoma is what we pay for our home owners insurance. Last year ours went up again, this time almost 40 percent. We changed companies, again and just got our renewal, it is going up 25 percent with this company.

Our homeowners insurance for our small 40 year old home will make it impossible for us to stay in it during retirement. I'm sure we will have to rent something.

[customerserviceguy]

127. Depends on where you're talking about

In the immediate NYC metro area, they're scandalously high compared to even what I saw in the urbanized areas around Seattle and Portland in the Pacific Northwest. And they are on top of high income and sales taxes, each of the cities previously mentioned does not have one or the other tax. I think a LOT of the tax money collected in this area is simply wasted, infrastructure was way better maintained when I lived in the Pacific NW.

However, there are other factors to consider when you're talking about affordability of homes. First, down payment requirements are more stringent, some folks have trouble saving up enough. It's also a LOT harder to get a mortgage than it used to be, although that's not necessarily a bad thing in some cases. And when owning your own home, you have a lot more maintenance costs to think about setting aside for.

Add to that the fact that buying a house is never again going to be the 'investment' that it was in most of the post-WWII era. The baby boom drove the prices of housing up, and now that that generation needs less housing, the market has suffered from a drop in demand. The main reason to buy a house is to have the autonomy in what to do with your living space, but at the cost of mobility. If your job dries up, and you have a house worth less than you owe on it to have to sell to move to another part of the country where job prospects are better, you have a hard time just picking up and moving.

[MineralMan]

128. Property taxes are always an issue in home ownership.

As far as I know the amount is always revealed as part of any real estate transaction. Homebuyers need to consider that cost as part of their decision to purchase a property.

When my wife and I sold our home in California to move to Minnesota, a young couple bought it from us. We didn't use a real estate agent in selling the house. To me, it looked as though this young couple might be stretched financially by the purchase, and I made sure they understood that the property taxes we paid each year would be very different from what they'd be paying. We were still paying taxes based on Prop. 13 rates, since I had purchased the home in 1974. They would be paying taxes on a different basis after purchasing the house.

I gave them an accurate estimate of what the taxes would be at the selling price of the house and broke it down to a monthly figure. I advised them to look at the mortgage payment, then add that monthly cost before deciding whether or not to buy the house. I also brought up the cost of homeowner's insurance. Before I agreed to the purchase agreement, I made certain that they knew the actual costs they'd incur on a monthly basis if they decided to purchase the house.

I had three other offers at asking price, so it wasn't a matter of losing the sale. I just wanted to make sure that this young couple understood what they were getting into with the purchase. They ended up buying the house, and now, 10 years later, they're still living there. Apparently, they were able to handle the cost. In 2004, when they purchased it, the value was at its peak. Afterward, the home's value plummeted, but has now recovered to about the level it had in 2004. They're apparently OK with their purchase, and have done some work of their own to make it uniquely theirs.

It's important to understand everything about the cost of home ownership before buying a home. I couldn't have dealt with selling that house to anyone who didn't understand what it would truly cost.

[WinkyDink]

129. I can't speak for others, but it is my one fear, as a relatively new widow age 64.