"No civilization in the history of the world . . .

[Brigid]

"has declined because it spent too much on education." -- Marc Morial, president of the National Urban League and former mayor of New Orleans

For your ponderation and consideration.

[Jackpine Radical]

1. Doesn't apply to the US.

He said "civilization."

[Scuba]

2. Feeling cynical today?

[Jackpine Radical]

5. Moi?

[cheapdate]

13. "Civilization" is seriously overrated.

[NobodyHere]

17. Nah

It's a great game

[cheapdate]

22. "Civilization" has colonized the living world to its farthest reaches.

Its appetite has no limit and it kills everything that stands in its way without remorse.

[LawDeeDah]

15. America Is the Only Country That Went from Barbarism to Decadence Without Civilization In Between

I thought it was Oscar Wilde that said this, but it might have been Henry James?
Anyway, clever.

[former9thward]

16. It was but neither of them originally said it.

In 1926:

The theatre reviewer, James Agate, saw a production of the work “Katerina” by Andreyev, and he was deeply unsympathetic to the behaviors displayed by the characters. Boldface has been added below: 3 4

Everything that happens to Andreyev’s characters is repugnant to the English sense of what would, should, or could happen to people laying claim to ordinary, i.e. English sanity. This being so, the temptation is to cast about for excuses, to pity Russia for having been left out of the Roman march, and so passing from barbarism to decadence without knowing civilisation, or to talk about “retrogressive metamorphism” and the way this country has been steadily breaking Europe down ever since, in the time of Peter the Great, she first began to absorb European culture.

Then in 1947 Churchill:

In April 1947 the popular syndicated columnist Leonard Lyons printed an anecdote about Churchill in the Washington Post:

From the man who brought him the offer, Winston Churchill exacted a promise that this story would not be printed until he no longer was Prime Minister: At the height of Churchill’s popularity he received an offer of $5000 a lecture for a Nation-wide tour of America. “That’s an unbelievable figure,” said Churchill … “In that case,” said Churchill, “it would prove that America is the first country which went from Barbarism to Decadence, without a certain intervening period of civilization.”


http://quoteinvestigator.com/2011/12/07/barbarism-decadence/

From the link is an interesting history of the quote.

[LawDeeDah]

19. Interesting indeed. Thanks.

[Bigmack]

3. And we're getting our money's worth...

19% of Americans believe the sun revolves around the earth... 24% don't know our independence was won from Britain...46% of Americans believe in creationism...

[Igel]

9. The article about how many believed in geocentrism and some other errant -isms had a riposte.

A rather devasting one. Or two.

One pointed out that the numbers of those believing in error had consistently fallen over the last 30 years. What many consider the "good old days" were merely "old days." The current system is better than the previous system.

Another pointed out that how we compare with other countries naturally depends upon what the set of "other countries" is.

[malaise]

4. Profound

Rec

[branford]

6. The more appropriate question is whether increased spending improves outcomes.

Among developed nations, America spends some of the most money, but still trails on numerous indicators.

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/us-education-spending-tops-global-list-study-shows/

The issue transcends simply spending more money.

[Spider Jerusalem]

7. Same thing with healthcare, the question is, where is it spent?

Averaging it per-pupil tells you nothing at all when there are tremendous disparities in spending that make the average kind of meaningless.

[DavidDvorkin]

8. Given that large-scale publicly funded education is a relatively recent institution,

we don't really have the data to support or reject that claim.

[Igel]

10. So what, you're saying that a very small sample size

doesn't allow for sweeping conclusions with 99% confidence?

Damned statisticians, always trying to bring facts in to trump beliefs and (nearly) foundationless opinions.

[Brigid]

11. Good point about large-scale public education.

But I think the substance of the quote holds true. Education is a sound investment. Now excessive military spending, OTOH, has destroyed many a civilization.

Using hyperbole to make a valid point -- I really don't have a problem with that.

[jtuck004]

12. With a few hundred years of educational research out there, perhaps one just doesn't want to look?

The fact that there is no nation for which that has ever happened is irrelevant, of course, but here is ours, founded on genocide and equality for white folk. Sure seems like there is a fairly clear path through education to where we are today, and that is leaving aside Germany, the Swiss, the Folk Schools of Denmark, others with histories of public education and training.

Maybe the problem has to do with method? Perhaps quantitative data isn't the best, (the kind that find our medicines, and also that used by thieving banksters to steal from us) but there is a rich history of qualitative research in education and training. Maybe this just won't fit the limited world of the quants?

Not really disagreeing, just thinking about it.

[eppur_se_muova]

14. Well, I wish one would *try*. ;) nt

[Major Hogwash]

18. "Rarely is the question asked: Is our children learning?"

Brought to by the stupidest, most knuckle-headed, weasel-faced, aberration of a knuckle-dragging, cross-bred moron to ever be selected to be the President of these United States!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[hifiguy]

24. Bravo!

Just look at the asshole:

[LWolf]

20. Any time the nation wants to put their money where their big mouths are

when it comes to "the children," let me know.

I'd be happy to have the resources to better serve my students.

[bemildred]

21. We don't care about civilization, all we care about is money and power. nt

[NM_Birder]

23. every civilization in the history of the world has declined,

when the governing body decides the population needs to be raised by, and at the will of, the governing body.