Ralph Nader: Hillary Clinton is a 'menace to the United States'

[Rhinodawg]

She may be leading all of the polls looking ahead to the 2016 presidential election, but Ralph Nader, the former Green Party and Independent Party presidential candidate, doesn't want anything to do with Hillary Clinton.

In an interview with WeAreChange earlier this week, Nader sounded off on Clinton, saying she's "a menace to the United States."

He starts off by saying she's too big of a "corporatist and a militarist."
But then he kicks it up a notch.

“She thinks Obama is too weak, he doesn’t kill enough people overseas," Nader said. "So she’s a menace to the United States of America.”

http://politics.suntimes.com/article/washington/ralph-nader-hillary-clinton-menace-united-states/wed-10292014-208pm

[Rhinodawg]

1. I think he's running again.

see NADER2016.

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Vote-Ralph-Nader-For-President-In-2016/456014484458032

[brush]

96. Nah, he's getting injections to his Swiss bank account

You can always count on this guy to do or say things that help the repugs.

It's like clockwork — who can forget 2000.

[Politicalboi]

2. Ralph Nader

Unsafe at any age. STFU Ralphie.

[demigoddess]

13. + 1

please!!!!

[fredamae]

92. "STFU Ralphie"

I second!

[kysrsoze]

103. Good thing no one actually listens to this "Independent" Republican operative asshole anymore.

I notice he never gets around to criticizing and writing long, bloviated editorials about Republicans. Hmmm...

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

3. Still pissed off about your Cisco systems dividend Ralph?

http://blogs.wsj.com/deals/2011/06/27/ralph-nader-turns-rightest-on-cisco/

[Little Star]

4. Ralph has crawled out of the woodwork again? Ugh

STFU and go away Ralph.

[former9thward]

56. Yeah,let's put the warmonger into office.

[wyldwolf]

5. the man who gave us Junior has also praised Rand Paul

[Hubert Flottz]

28. Well Ralph helped W win so...

As soon as Jeb talks about running, up pops "Raaaaaaalpf. " Does Ralph work for Karl Rove and the Bush Whackers?

I award Ralph, this week's in re award, of the week.

[TreasonousBastard]

6. Well, at least Nader isn't such a menace, because...

he's completely irrelevant.

Some people just can't handle obscurity.

[Rhinodawg]

7. Like him or hate him, he still has a huge following.

just sayin.

[wyldwolf]

8. Hillary's following dwarfs his

just sayin.

[TreasonousBastard]

9. But his is shrinking...

or growing too senile to know the difference.

[Rowdyboy]

25. Its Hugh! He has dozens of loyal followers who'll proudly follow him into irrelevance....

Its really hugh!

[BootinUp]

26. rofl

[joshcryer]

55. Not really, he arguably killed the Green Party.

His following may be with the politically apathetic more than anything else. No grassroots backing.

[BootinUp]

10. Fuck YU NADIR!

[Ron Green]

11. Everything he says in this interview is absolutely true.

I don't understand the hate.

[JHB]

14. See #12 below.

Can't speak for other people's issues with him, but that's mine.

That and his myopia about "not a dime's worth of difference". There isn't nearly as much difference as there should be, but when one party has gone completely off the deep end there's a hell of a lot more than a dime.

[G_j]

15. It usually is

rarely, if ever, will you hear someone address the actual text of what he says.

[BootinUp]

20. There's more than 8 years of evidence he is a fraud, whats the point?

[Adrahil]

65. Well the thing is...

Little Ralphie usually expresses a broad opinion rather than making an argument from specific facts. Arguing against that typically turns into a "nuh-uh" contest. And Ralphie is an narcissist asshole to boot, so you have that.

[MH1]

107. Did he, or did he not, say "there's not a dime's worth of difference" between Dems and republicans?

I see that particular "actual text" addressed here all the time.

Some statements matter more than others.

[BootinUp]

17. Oh yes, fuck, maybe we should draft him as a 3rd party candidate!, LOL.

[Adrahil]

22. Nader's narcissism has been very bad for this country.

He let his ego come before even the most basic common sense. Had it not been for him, shrub would have never been President.

You can talk about him being "right" all you want, but the Iraq war would have never happened had he not run in 2000.

[pnwmom]

27. He deliberately tossed the 2000 election from Al Gore to George Bush

and now he has the nerve to disparage Hillary.

That's why.

[Tarheel_Dem]

48. Because this is a "partisan" Democratic forum? Could that be it? Ya think?

Vote for Democrats.

Winning elections is important — therefore, advocating in favor of Republican nominees or in favor of third-party spoiler candidates that could split the vote and throw an election to our conservative opponents is never permitted on Democratic Underground. But that does not mean that DU members are required to always be completely supportive of Democrats. During the ups-and-downs of politics and policy-making, it is perfectly normal to have mixed feelings about the Democratic officials we worked hard to help elect. When we are not in the heat of election season, members are permitted to post strong criticism or disappointment with our Democratic elected officials, or to express ambivalence about voting for them. In Democratic primaries, members may support whomever they choose. But when general election season begins, DU members must support Democratic nominees (EXCEPT in rare cases where were a non-Democrat is most likely to defeat the conservative alternative, or where there is no possibility of splitting the liberal vote and inadvertently throwing the election to the conservative alternative). For presidential contests, election season begins when both major-party nominees become clear. For non-presidential contests, election season begins on Labor Day. Everyone here on DU needs to work together to elect more Democrats and fewer Republicans to all levels of American government. If you are bashing, trashing, undermining, or depressing turnout for our candidates during election season, we'll assume you are rooting for the other side.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=termsofservice

AFAIK, Nader isn't a Democrat, so he's met here with the same disdain as any other non-Democrat. Hope that helps.

[RedCappedBandit]

72. Content doesn't matter

just march in unison!

[Tarheel_Dem]

101. An unflushed toilet also has "content". Just sayin'.....

[RedCappedBandit]

102. See what I mean?

It's not about *having* content. It's what the content *is*. Duh.

[Tarheel_Dem]

105. How's this for "content"?

[Enthusiast]

83. PLUS ONE!

[treestar]

86. Mark me down as disagreement being hate as getting real tiresome

I mean, really, really ineffective.

[hfojvt]

95. because he still has not apologized for 2000

And from the sound of it would like to run again so he can make Romney or Jeb President.

Making RALPH himself, the menace.

[Rhinodawg]

104. I dont think he will ever apologize.

[JHB]

12. Ralphie! Where ya been?

No, really, where? You've had 14 years since 2000 (18 if you include 1996) to build an effective independent party. How much time have you spent on it? Promoting it, finding candidates, promoting them, things that would actually be effective, not simply making the occasional speech and winging in as a "candidate" every few years. Local level, state level, federal level, how many candidates has your party run?

Gadfly.

[Ron Green]

16. There's a role for a gadfly as well.

He didn't build a movement, but neither did anyone else.

[BootinUp]

18. As just another loser, you forgot that part. nt

[Rhinodawg]

19. At one time, Nader was a legend.

[JHB]

24. What role is that, and how is it constructive if it's left to whither?

The other people at least don't pop up every few years to pretend to build a movement.

[loyalsister]

23. AND

Where was his outrage when it is obvious that republicans want to take healthcare away from people. When the SC ruled on hobby lobby, when republicans have enacted these abortion restrictions, when republicans blocked the disability treaty.....

I am not thrilled by the idea of Hillary Clinton being our nominee, but this is overkill. I am not going to discount the possibility that he could exert some influence again.

[Le Taz Hot]

21. Oh boy.

It's the Party Faithful's dog whistle. I haven't even read upthread but I already know the response. There may be drooling involved and perhaps a little bit of spittle.

[Jackpine Radical]

29. You have to be able to hold 3 things about Nader in mind all at the same time:

1) He has spoken a great deal of truth over the years, and is doing so again.
2) He has sometimes been a majorly destructive and divisive force on the left.
3) Observation # 2 doesn't invalidate observation # 1.

[JHB]

39. Observation 4) #1 doesn't exempt him from criticism...

...when another bout of #2 is looming.

I don't care for Hillary for even more reasons that Ralphie has, but 'menace to the United States'? In an era where the Republicans are pining to eliminate the 20th Century? For whom any restraint on business owners, any public investment, and -- in particular -- Ralph's signature accomplishments are equated with the Warsaw Pact? Whose public officials have such a blinkered fantasy-view of the world they wouldn't notice if a dragon flew by?

in that situation I have very little patience for Ralphie's myopia.

[Jackpine Radical]

44. Menaces come in different sizes and concentrations.

As far as I'm concerned, issues like climate change, overpopulation and environmental degradation are rushing at us at blinding speed. (Sorta literally--most of us are blind to the rate and devastating potential of the onrush.)

The Democrats pay at least lip service in acknowledgement of the impending Perfect Storm, and will likely do some minor things to ameliorate the impact, while the Republicans and their corporate sponsors are willfully blind to the coming catastrophe.

It's a choice between a rapid drop into perdition under Republican control and a somewhat slower slide to the same destination under the conventional Democratic policies I anticipate.

Given only those choices, I choose the latter, if only in hopes of buying us time to wake up. Or, on a more cynical and self-centered level, I'm old and would as soon live out the remainder of my years without fully experiencing the misery I know to be coming.

[DonCoquixote]

53. sadly,none of those three

contradict each other.

Just like

1) Bill Clinton slowed down the progress of the GOP (true)
2) Bill Clinton proved that taxing the rich doesNOT sink the eocnomy, but helps it (true)
3) Bill Clinton gave away the damned store with letting Glass_Steagall and the fairness Doctrine be axed (Damned true)

Sadly, even our heroes have villain sides to them.

[Ykcutnek]

30. Radical organization elicits radical monologue from washed-up old fart.

More at 11.

[WhiteTara]

31. Drop Dead Ralph Nadir

You have no relevant place in our country or history.

[MannyGoldstein]

32. Honest question

I forget... is Nader the most dangerous man alive today, or Greenwald?

Regards,

TWM

[Rex]

34. Nader reminds people of how much they hate democratic elections.

Or it lets others know just how much some hate democratic elections.

[BootinUp]

35. He reminds me of how much I hate some of the jackasses that run in them. lol.

[former9thward]

57. Sure,we don't want to spoil the MIC party.

[SidDithers]

33. Fuck Ralph Nader...

and his groupies.

Sid

[jeff47]

36. So Ralphie....what exactly did you do to improve the situation?

Say, between 2001 and 2009?

Didn't exactly work very hard to make people talk about corporatism and militarism during that time frame.

Where's that third party to challenge the "not a dime's worth of difference"? Why haven't you been working on it?

Golly, it's almost like you're seeking attention instead of seeking change.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

37. He' right.

[zappaman]

38. He' wrong.

[JHB]

40. He' a dessert topping.

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

41. And a floor wax.

[Sheldon Cooper]

68. Hahaha!

#37, #38, #40, and #41 - bravo on a great sequence of posts!

[Major Hogwash]

42. Who unlocked the door to the crypt before Halloween?

Christ, it isn't like Hillary drives a Corvair or something really spooky like that!!!

[liberalhistorian]

43. Fuck him

he's the real danger. If it weren't for him and his "no difference between the parties" horseshit, there never would have been a President Dubya, with all the bullshit wr've had since. Fuck him and his continued efforts to fuck over and smear Dems.

[Jackpine Radical]

45. Multiple factors contributed synergistically to produce the debacle of 2000.

He's certainly one of them.

[otohara]

46. How Bout George Bush, Was He A Menace?

go away old man

[Hekate]

60. Oh no, Ralphie told us there was no difference between Bush and Gore. Right?

[Jamaal510]

47. Let me get this straight:

so just a while ago, he proposed an alliance with Libertarians (the same crowd that opposes expanded health care and wants to ultimately eliminate the safety net) while attacking Obama, and now he's calling HC a "menace"?
He's obviously diagnosed with the "Doesn't-Know-WTF-He's-Talking-About Syndrome".

[Tarheel_Dem]

49. Nader is pissed that Democrats haven't lined up to follow him over the cliff. We elected a black...

guy, and that was just too far for him. If he hadn't already lost it in 2000, the election of BHO sent him right over the edge, despite Nader's best efforts to peel off support.

[WinkyDink]

50. What has he said about Romney? Christie? Jeb?

[Drunken Irishman]

51. Ralph Nader is becoming another Lyndon LaRouche.

[brooklynite]

52. Maybe he has a future in the Democratic Presidential Primary...

Plenty of DUers would likely support him.....

[Major Hogwash]

54. Only if he takes the litmus test . . .

. . . and promises not to reproduce!
No cloning, either!!

[Jim Lane]

110. If Nader had run in the Democratic primaries in 2000, I would have voted for him.

He would have been in several televised debates with Gore and Bradley. He would have drawn more attention to his views. He would have mobilized a lot of people to become active in Democratic Party politics and help us oust the DINOs. He would have gotten more votes than he did running in the general election.

Not to mention the minor matter that Al Gore would have become President.

[woo me with science]

58. He's right. The corporate agenda is a menace to the country and to democracy itself,

being relentlessly pushed by both Republican and Democratic corporatists, including Hillary.

And until people get past the hyperpartisan wagon-circling and start rallying the nation to demand representation on issues rather than party, these criminals in both parties will continue to feed us a suicidal corporate agenda.

Hillary stands for more deluges of corporate money driving policy, the familiar agenda of perpetual war, TPP, austerity, mass surveillance, assaults on journalism and suppression of dissent, "Kill Lists," indefinite detention, all manner of corporate domestic policies, and dismantling of the Bill of Rights of our Constitution....and so will the ultimate Republican candidate.

Republicans have virtually no chance of running anyone in 2016 who can stand even for a while during the campaign against these things, to help educate the nation and grow the dissent we desperately need to save ourselves from the corporate coup well underway in this nation.

Democrats actually have a couple of possibilities who might be able to do some good, if we get behind them strongly now and push to keep menaces like Hillary out of the running.

We can respond to the hyperpartisan corporate dog whistles and mindlessly rally around Hillary because Nader is a poopy head and Hillary has a deceptive (D) after her name, or we can look honestly at the malignant agenda she represents and try our damnedest to avoid running another corporate Trojan horse in 2016.

I know which route I would rather take.

[Electric Monk]

63. I think I'll miss you when you're gone. nt

[djean111]

79. Agree wholeheartedly. Thank you.

[sendero]

82. +1000...

..... the facts of the matter, well said.

Hopefully, somehow, it will not be a choice between a horrid HRC and a more horrid Republican, hopefully we can nominate someone who is not exclusively on the side of the 1%.

[JEB]

100. You are exactly correct.

Thanks for posting.

[Hekate]

59. Ralphie, go home yer mother's calling you

[RandySF]

61. From the man who said George W Bush was harmless.

[Skittles]

62. says the egomaniacal asshole who helped install Dubya into the White House

[Rhinodawg]

64. Seeing Nader brings back memories....

some good and some not so good.

I'd like to see a debate between Nader and Clinton.

[Snotcicles]

98. I would like to have seen him in debates in 96 and 2000. But they locked him out. nt

[leftynyc]

66. Looks like Ralph

wants to help another Bush get elected.

[theHandpuppet]

67. Oh, shut up, Ralph

You're so tiresome.

[Sheldon Cooper]

69. Oh, go eat a bag of you-know-what, Ralph.

And I hope you choke on it, you irrelevant asshole.

[11 Bravo]

70. I looked up "narcissistic fuckwad" in the dictionary.

I found a picture of Ralphie.

[LWolf]

71. .

The truth hurts, as evidenced by the predictable, stereotypical responses in this thread.



And, of course, for the record, as I have reminded people ad nauseum every time a Nader hate thread pops up, I never voted for him, anywhere, for anything, and I voted for Al Gore in 2,000.

That doesn't mean that I'm not honest enough to acknowledge his legitimate points, even when they are a bit hyperbolic, as this one is.

Hillary Clinton, as a representative of the dlc/centrist/3rd way/new dem/neoliberal wing of the party, is not good for the party nor for the country. She represents a faction that IS a menace.

[m-lekktor]

73. yep. I agree more with Nader on the issues

than i do Hillary Kissinger Clinton. she and Dick Cheney have the same foreign policy beliefs.

and i voted for Gore in 2000. I will never blame Nader for 2000. it's fucking pompous to presume Gore/Lieberman was owed those Nader votes.

[G_j]

78. Fuck you Michael Moore!

I mean GG, I mean Dennis Kucinich... oops..where the hell am I?...

[LWolf]

81. That's right.

Fuck all those loony fringe lefties who just don't "get it."

[G_j]

90. after all, I don't believe any one of them gets to

pal around with Henry Kissinger.

[99Forever]

74. Seems Mr Nader struck a nerve.

The I'm not much of a Ralph fan, he does have a way of putting the truth out there. Whether Mr Nader runs or not, is irrelevant to me. Either way, I will not vote for a Clinton ever again in my life.

[djean111]

80. Oh, he struck a nerve BIG time. Attack the messenger is the order of the day. Or year. Or always.

[treestar]

89. Messengers do not render opinion

He's being attacked for his opinion, as anyone can be.

[djean111]

93. An awful lot of the posts here are just attacks on him and his (mis)deeds, not a refutation,

with reasons, of his opinion of Hillary Clinton.
He is being attacked for HAVING an opinion on Hillary.

[treestar]

94. His opinion of Hillary is a very generalized attack

If he had specifics, it might be possible to discuss them.

It sounds more like trolling for attention than anyone else. He knows Hillary is a front runner thus far, so he generally attacks her with OTT language about being a menace to the U.S. That's not constructive.

[djean111]

97. The things he does not like about Hillary are the things that I do not like about Hillary.

In the scheme of things DU, I guess that makes me a Naderite, which I am not, but so it goes.

[Youdontwantthetruth]

75. Hillary Clinton 'Menace to the United States'

Will make a great sig line!

Thanks Ralph for reminding people who she really is!

[liberal N proud]

76. And Ralph is not?

[chrisa]

77. I don't like Hillary at all, but Nader is a bullshit hypocrite.

You can tell his words are hollow like a termite-eaten stump. Just another politician pandering to his base to get elected.

[Reter]

84. To those who disagree with Nader, watch this video

How can anyone support her?

[whatchamacallit]

91. Don't mistake the Death Eaters inhabiting the party for democrats of yore

Many on this board love this shit.

[hrmjustin]

85. Ralph Nader is a menace!

Never will forgive him for 2000.

[whatchamacallit]

87. He's right, and no amount of shrieking, foaming, and spasmodic writhing will change it. n/t

[treestar]

88. Does he have any thing more specific on which to disagree?

"Menace to the U.S." if OTT. Can no one use moderation in their terminology any more? It's making me think they have no real argument they can use on which to debate, rending them ineffectual.

[DonCoquixote]

99. Like many, I do not want Hillary, but

Ralph is obviously doing his little "pay attention to me" dance, which will be followed by him and jane hamsher gladly taking right wing money.

To those who say "he Iz telling Duh Troof!" I offer you this, the best con jhobs are based on truths perverted to the con artist's game, and Raplihe has a goood oen going, one that will keep him in Champagne and Big cars long after whatever fantasy you have about a third party beign elected fades out.

[Rhinodawg]

106. How DOES he support himself ?

[Jim Lane]

108. Anyone still paying attention to Ralph Nader was already down on Hillary Clinton.

This statement of his serves no purpose except to get his name in the paper again.

There might even be a backlash. Before I opened this thread, I considered Clinton a corporatist and a militarist. I still think that. Nevertheless, I'll admit to being slightly uncomfortable at finding myself on the same side as Nader. Stopped clock, I remind myself.

[True Blue Door]

109. She is a menace.

But she was merely a Bush toady. She isn't the one who helped the fucker get into power.

It's a mathematical fact: No Nader in 2000 = President Al Gore in 2001. No amount of disenfranchisement or hanging chads would have overcome the 30,000 or so votes Nader took from Gore in Florida.

[Algernon Moncrieff]

111. Ralph Nader can go to Hell (nfm)