Libertarian Champion Rand Paul Helped Kill NSA Reform Bill

[steve2470]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/11/18/rand-paul-nsa-reform-bill_n_6182204.html

WASHINGTON -- Rand Paul, a leader of the libertarian wing of the Republican Party, helped kill a bill meant to rein in the National Security Agency. Huh?

The USA Freedom Act, sponsored by Sen. Patrick Leahy (D-Vt.), received 58 votes on Tuesday night -- two short of cloture, the magic number in the Senate that allows a bill to proceed to an actual roll call.

The 40 Republicans and one Democrat who voted against cloture mostly did so because they thought the bill went too far. Paul also voted against NSA reform -- because, he said, it didn't go far enough.

Paul said he voted against the bill because it would have extended the Patriot Act provision that allows the NSA to search Americans’ phone records. He has consistently opposed the Patriot Act, passed in the wake of the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks.

[Cha]

1. Yeah, Rand Paul says a lot of things..

Bottom line he votes with the repubs..



Dianne Feinstein voted to reel in NSA.. Rand Paul voted No.. spin that GG.

Thank you, steve!

[steve2470]

3. my pleasure Cha, I really suspect his reason for voting no...

Didn't go far enough ? WTF. Even Diane Feinstein voted yes.

Next time he trumpets his "civil liberties creds", someone needs to ram this vote in his face.

[Cha]

4. He voted NO.. 'cause..

" I wanna be President "



Segami http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024501728

[steve2470]

6. yep you nailed it Cha ! nt

[billhicks76]

13. So Do You Know The Answer?

Sorry to interrupt the lovefest but I get nausea from people lauding Obama for the same things we hated Bush for. Being hypocrites is a HUGE reason we lost the midterms. People voted against the government in general which they should but unfortunately it wasn't directed at Republicans. But all the backslapping about how great the government under Obama is is simply naive, myopic and arrogant. Sorry but a few breaks doesn't make up for spying on citizens, imprisoning citizens(do people ignore the statistics in their ivory towers?), torture, wars, wall st giveaways, lack of transparency, more lobbyists in regulatory positions, secret trade agreements etc etc. But a loser always blames the other side. I know how wrong and vile Repubs are but when you go along with them and be subservient to them for favors, fame and status how can we complain and blame Rand Paul? My understanding is that this bill not only sucked but did the opposite of its intention. We were lucky Repubs opposed it out of their ironic sheer hatred of Obama. In this case they voted against their own special interests BECAUSE if no bill is passed the spying provisions EXPIRE which is more important than any fake reforms. It's our fault we handed them this issue. Obama rolled over for the intelligence community much like he joined these same Republicans stalling the release of the Torture Report until they got a Senate majority to squash it. If I am wrong about the spying provision sunsetting please tell me. If I'm wrong fine then...if I'm not then you are embarrassing yourselves and hence all of us.

[steve2470]

14. I don't know the reason for his no vote, no

The bill should have passed, easily.

Obama was nowhere in my text. Take out your frustration with the President in a constructive fashion, not on me where it does zero good. Go write a letter, lead a demonstration, etc etc etc.

Bye.

[billhicks76]

16. Bye

I need the President on this even if you don't. Bye.

[FSogol]

22. Fuck Rand Paul

Fuck his supporters too.

[billhicks76]

42. Who Cares

I like that the Republican establishment under Jeb Bush had a thorn. We need our own thorn. I'm tired of the Clintons and Bushes saying each other are honorary family members. They cover up for each other...I get it. Democrats afraid of a so called Libertarian is pathetic. The more you whine and cuss about him the more afraid you look. Time to not worry about the other side and get our own house in order. It's painful that of our only two decent candidates one was a Reaganite, Warren, and one has a party label that engenders bias, Sanders. I hope they nominate Paul instead of Bush. That would force our candidate to talk about spying at least and believe me the Bush Crime Syndicate would be perturbed.

[FSogol]

44. Thinking Paul would address anything of substance is called gullibility.

Paul would sell out faster than any other sell out in politics. It is in his genetic code passed down from his grifting father. Believing that he could get the GOP nomination is like thinking Trump, Santorum, or Cain could get it. It'll never happen.

Afraid? No, I'm laughing at Paul's chump supporters.

Cruz will be the thorn in Jeb's side. Paul and the Paulites are a sad joke.

[billhicks76]

45. I Disagree

I disagree. Cruz is totally whack. I don't support Rand at all or trust him but he's better than Jeb or Cruz. And I'm sorry but I've read too many editorials on Antiwar.com by Ron Paul to agree with the drivel you just said about him. He may be a prejudiced old man but his pro civil liberties, Antiwar and Antidrugwar stances are real. Grifter or not. Remember some of our grifter Antiwar congressmen in 2006? They may be slimed politicians but being Antiwar/Antispying/Antiprisons is my #1 issue and supersedes all the other stuff. That's why Hillary and Jeb make me sick.

[FSogol]

47. Sorry to see admiration for grifting white supremacist, Ron Paul on DU.

[billhicks76]

71. I'm Sorry

That you see anything positive by letting people murder babies abroad with our tax dollars in our name while locking up poor people forever for possessing harmless flowers or harmful addictive drugs. Seriously...you expect sympathy? You definitively have the war profiteering contractors on your side. How precious.

[FSogol]

75. Yes, hating Rand Paul's phoney politics = tacit approval of killing babies.

[billhicks76]

72. What's More Pathetic

Is that you let a racist fight our battles for us. What's worse than that? Asking a racist to fight your fights? Don't you see the folly of someone who is more immoral than you on one front being more moral than you on another? You probably can't perceive that when you look at the world two dimensionally.

[FSogol]

76. LOL n/t

[Ikonoklast]

83. Bill Hicks wasn't easily fooled by bullshit.

You are no Bill Hicks.

Fuck Rand Paul and his gullible fanbois.

[1StrongBlackMan]

80. ...

He may be a prejudiced old man but his pro civil liberties, Antiwar and Antidrugwar stances are real. Grifter or not.

Correction: Pro-SOME civil liberties (see: paul's actual position on the CRA), Pro-SOME anti-war (see: his vacillation on ISIL/Iraq) and Pro-SOME antiwar on drugs (see: his actual position ... but, Yes, you will be able to smoke all the marijuana you want).

You really should listen to what this guy says, beyond the headline/sound-bytes.

[billhicks76]

98. Ron Not Rand

[snooper2]

85. your slip is showing

[SidDithers]

52. +1...

Especially his supporters.

Sid

[woo me with science]

24. ^^^Correct. This was brazen MANIPULATION to LEGALIZE spying^^^

from corporatists including corporate Dems.

Pelosi and corporate Dems, in collusion with corporate Republicans, have been trying for some time to pass supposed "reforms" of NSA spying that actually LEGALIZE huge swaths of the spying.

They are lying vipers, and Americans should be furious that political messaging has devolved to this level of rank dishonesty.

These aren't Democrats and Republicans. They are corporatists with a vile, lying propaganda machine, systematically dismantling our democracy.

[malokvale77]

60. I'm only surprised by how many on this site don't understand...

something so obvious.

[billhicks76]

73. Just Like I'm Surprised

That people on this site don't know how in bed together the Bushes and the Clintons are.

[malokvale77]

59. I think you are right on this.

I have seen nothing that suggests otherwise.

But there may be insiders here who know different.

[1StrongBlackMan]

79. This is the insanity that passes as political reason these days ...

Sorry to interrupt the lovefest but I get nausea from people lauding Obama for the same things we hated Bush for.

I gather You support paul's vote because (he says) the bill doesn't go far enough ... so you are left with more of the very thing you don't want; rather than, accept incremental change ... because, at your core, I appear to be anti-government:

People voted against the government in general which they should ...

No ... people shouldn't vote against government (which you are correct, they did) ... they/we should vote against representatives that we do not believe are effectively representing are political positions.

The teaparty, and the right, have effectively convinced the American people of what reagan started 40+ years ago ... that "the Government" is the problem, and too many supposed (deep thinking) liberals have bought into that crap (and progressives have always been there) ... so it's no wonder we get Traditional Democratic policies passing and counter-Democratic policy candidates elected!

[billhicks76]

99. I Don't Know

I only know what results I want. I predict Rand will try to steal this issue from Democrats and I have no sympathy if we let him do it. Time to grow a pair and push back against the corporate apologists defending Orwellian spying in our party. Rand is a red herring. I would never vote for him ever but the idiots who hide behind hating him to distract from their own unethical appeasement regarding civil liberties is sickening.

[UglyGreed]

2. A fraud just like his Dad N/T

[steve2470]

5. votes on the USA Freedom Act, S.2865

https://www.govtrack.us/congress/votes/113-2014/s282?utm_campaign=govtrack_feed&utm_source=govtrack/feed&utm_medium=rss

My Democratic Senator Nelson voted no (sigh), Rubio (ugh) voted no.

[Cha]

7. Thanks for the link.. yeah, it was amazing that Nelson voted NO on Keystone!

[steve2470]

8. it was , indeed, your people voted the right way on both bills ! nt

[steve2470]

9. Democrats who voted no: Nelson

ugh. At least he voted down Keystone.

4 Republicans voted FOR the act: Murkowski, Heller, Cruz and Lee.

[Cha]

10. Wow, what was he thinking? Nelson? Oh yeah, let's have the NSA have free reign! Cruz is a

Last edited Wed Nov 19, 2014, 07:38 AM - Edit history (1)

surprise breaking from the block of repubs.

[steve2470]

11. this is my guess about Nelson's votes

Florida, overall, is still too reddish for my taste, and Nelson has to listen to a lot of conservatives here. He might have done a favor to Harry Reid (with Keystone XL) in exchange for being able to say he "protected America" (vomit) with his no vote on the NSA reform bill. Rubio was beating that drum during floor debate.

I'm sure Nelson will take some heat for his Keystone vote, but somehow he manages to do the blue dog two step in this state. Maybe Nelson is more of a conservationist than I know. I know he has voted against oil drilling too close to the Florida coast (protect our tourism).

[Cha]

12. Thank you for that, Steve~

[billhicks76]

15. So Cruz=Democrats?

It's complicated. I want real reform. Not cosmetic BS that allows business as usual but neuters opposition when people stop fighting because they "think" they won. The spying provisions expire. If they vote for this now they are renewed right? I'm sure they can he a separate vote in renewal and the sad fact is we are screwed because now they have control. My bet is actually quite out there...I think CIA/NSA and all the conservative think tanks used everything in their arsenal including spying and blackmailed leverage to manipulate the public psyche and it's racist elements to effect the change they wanted. These corporate aholes have endless cash to do this. Can Obama veto renewal? Anyone know the details? I do not.

[Iliyah]

20. Welcome to the ugly monster Koch's Congress

who will make sure NSA becomes stronger. Rand Paul is a wolf in sheep clothing.

[billhicks76]

40. On NSA So Was Obama

He flip flopped on Telecom Immunity and spying. No one knows why. He also flip flopped on making public the 28 redacted pages of the 911 report implicating the Saudis. No one knows why. He's totally silent on it. I believe it's because it would destroy the Bush name forever which he has gone out of his way already to not do much like Clinton did for Bush Sr. Think the Bushes hold things over their head or offer something in return? Carrot or stick? The Bush Crime Family Syndicate has always been running things behind the scenes I believe. And here comes Jeb. Naysayers here said it wasn't possible when I warned about it in 2009. Now it's just accepted wisdom he will run.

[Arkana]

27. Cruz and Lee both?

Did they accidentally press the wrong buttons?

[TM99]

17. In this case, Rand & the GOP got it right.

Why you ask?

Because the original USA Freedom Act bill got watered down before going to the Senate.

I normally agree with the EFF and ACLU but in this case, I am not in agreement on one big thing.

Here is an excellent article on why this bill is flawed -
https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2014/08/understanding-new-usa-freedom-act-questions-concerns-and-effs-decision-support

So why I am against it when they are not? Because I am sick of the Democratic Party's new meme that flawed bills will somehow, someday lead to better bills.

LBJ did not pass the Civil Rights Act as a stop gap measure to get to civil rights. It was a balls to the wall progressive piece of legislation from the get go.

The ACA is not a step towards single payer. The USA Freedom Act in its current form is not a step towards ending the NSA surveillance state. Why in the hell can't Democrats put forth and fight for a bill that will actually do what it is meant to do from the actual start?

Why are Democrats so damned scared of Republican obstructionism? It obviously isn't going to stop whether they are in the lead positions of power or in the opposition. They don't water down bills. They agree to put forth a bill to end the ACA. Period. End of discussion, and they vote on it.

I will support a new USA Freedom Act that actually does what it is intended to do. Until then at least some damned Libertarians and Republicans stopped this for now. If they are in agreement with us all on this, a new and better bill will have no problems passing with both GOP & Democrat support.

[Iliyah]

18. I don't care how you try to color this rosy for Rand Paul and the GOP

but NSA - USA Freedom Act is their baby and no matter how you frame it won't change but will be intensified. The whole lot of them including, but not limited to corporations and the super rich are effing paranoid and are in constant fear of losing their greedy control of everything. Ya'think Isil is their concern, nope, their concern is total power, they only use Isil, Ebola and anything else to strike constant fear in the masses.

Of course the Civil Rights Act was Liberal/Progressive legislation, duh. Back then at least congress was a tad more bipartisan. Moderate GOPers worked with Dems in order for it to pass. It was the right thing to do.

I'm effing getting tired of people trashing Obamacare. And yes, if hold's steady without gutting and cutting, but fixing where it needs it for the betterment of the insured, single payer will be the future, but alas, your GOP and Rand Paul will fight tooth and nail for the destruction of the health care law with no alternative.

NSA is to stay, I don't like it, but the reality is real.

[woo me with science]

30. Bullshit. The spying is a bipartisan goal of our corporate oligarchy,

and the Obama administration and corporate Democrats have fought to defend it at every turn.

Moreover, this Trojan horse bill would have LEGALIZED and made permanent major aspects of the spying instead of allowing them to expire.

The Third Way propaganda trying to rewrite history in front of our faces and try to pretend that corporate Democrats have not been complicit in spying all along has reached the point of embarrassment for the propaganda machine.

No, spying does not have to be here to stay. A mass surveillance infrastructure of totalitarianism has no place in a country that claims to be a representative democracy with a Constitution, notwithstanding all despicable attempts by the corporate propaganda machine to normalize it and pretend it is something Americans should roll over and accept.

[woo me with science]

26. Yes. It was a Trojan horse bill to legalize spying

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=5838035

Sorry to interrupt the lovefest but I get nausea from people lauding Obama for the same things we hated Bush for. Being hypocrites is a HUGE reason we lost the midterms. People voted against the government in general which they should but unfortunately it wasn't directed at Republicans. But all the backslapping about how great the government under Obama is is simply naive, myopic and arrogant. Sorry but a few breaks doesn't make up for spying on citizens, imprisoning citizens(do people ignore the statistics in their ivory towers?), torture, wars, wall st giveaways, lack of transparency, more lobbyists in regulatory positions, secret trade agreements etc etc. But a loser always blames the other side. I know how wrong and vile Repubs are but when you go along with them and be subservient to them for favors, fame and status how can we complain and blame Rand Paul? My understanding is that this bill not only sucked but did the opposite of its (stated) intention. We were lucky Repubs opposed it out of their ironic sheer hatred of Obama. In this case they voted against their own special interests BECAUSE if no bill is passed the spying provisions EXPIRE which is more important than any fake reforms. It's our fault we handed them this issue. Obama rolled over for the intelligence community much like he joined these same Republicans stalling the release of the Torture Report until they got a Senate majority to squash it. If I am wrong about the spying provision sunsetting please tell me. If I'm wrong fine then...if I'm not then you are embarrassing yourselves and hence all of us.

Typical, slimy MO of corporatists, to use propaganda to try to present as "reform" legislation that would actually legalize and make permanent. broad swaths of the spying.

[TM99]

37. Thank you Woo, exactly!

I have zero love for Rand Paul.

But had he and the GOP not voted against this, it would have done more harm in the end than good.

The GOP corporatists are not on our side and if they were not currently the opposition party against all things Obama, they would have easily passed this for their masters.

Libertarians are correct and consistent for the most part in their anti-war and anti-spying positions. If only the majority of the Democratic Party politicians were the same.

[Ampersand Unicode]

38. Dems are in the pockets of Hollywood and Big Media.

Which of course wants spying on people who download MP3 audio from YouTube videos. Because wah, poor widdle Taywor Swift didn't get to have a vintage DeLorean for her quarterlife birthday because of those mean pirates who leaked her POS album. Boo hoo hoo.



Don't look for Big Media Dems to oppose electronic surveillance any time soon. Not as long as we're still fighting the copyright wars and the MAFIAA can snoop on the IP addresses of people using MegaUpload and BitTorrent. (Honestly, I wouldn't waste bandwidth on a Trailer Not-So-Swift album. Eighties music or not.)

As an aside, however, I'm sure rethugs definitely want their flunkies to dox anyone viewing evil salacious porn. Maybe Anonymous should have a look-see at why there's a cluster of porn-related activity coming from IP addresses in the Bible Belt and on Capitol Hill...

[OnyxCollie]

70. "... BECAUSE if no bill is passed the spying provisions EXPIRE..."

The spying provisions would have sunset in 2008 if Harry Reid had not brought the FISA Amendments Act to the Senate floor...

[DeSwiss]

58. !

- Reading is fundamental. Understanding is even better.

[malokvale77]

61. I would love to quote your full post but this will do...

"Why in the hell can't Democrats put forth and fight for a bill that will actually do what it is meant to do from the actual start?"

What the hell has happened to my Party? FFS.

[geek tragedy]

62. don't forget to click your heels together three times while wearing the ruby slippers nt

[TM99]

84. Typical response from you -

all snark and no substance.

[geek tragedy]

86. Do you think you would win a debate on substance

wherein you argue that we would have been better off doing nothing rather than passing the ACA?

Which appears to be another area where you Stand With Rand.

[TM99]

88. On the actual topic of the OP which is NSA

spying, yes, I do.

You offer nothing but snark, team sports politics (which is so adolescent!), and red herrings.

But, hey carry on.

[geek tragedy]

89. Nice dodge. You explicitly stated that your position is that only

perfect bills should be supported, specifically citing the ACA as an example.

So why I am against it when they are not? Because I am sick of the Democratic Party's new meme that flawed bills will somehow, someday lead to better bills.

LBJ did not pass the Civil Rights Act as a stop gap measure to get to civil rights. It was a balls to the wall progressive piece of legislation from the get go.

The ACA is not a step towards single payer. The USA Freedom Act in its current form is not a step towards ending the NSA surveillance state. Why in the hell can't Democrats put forth and fight for a bill that will actually do what it is meant to do from the actual start?

Your approach will align you with Rand Paul on every piece of legislation sponsored by Democrats.

Not likely by accident.

[TM99]

90. You want to chit chat about the ACA

then let's do it in another thread.

Perfect bills my ass! Good bills that actually support the populace and not spying agencies, the MIC, insurance companies, etc. Funny how populist liberal Democratic ideals from the New Deal through the Civil Rights Era are somehow now synonymous with Rand Paul in your mind.

Are you in the wrong place? I am a socially progressive, anti-war Independent who is very conservative when it comes to preserving the New Deal from the ravages of the corporatists who dominate both the Democratic and Republican parties of today.

What the fuck are you?

[geek tragedy]

91. I am a Democrat who supports Democratic legislation

instead of Standing With Rand and acting as if that is the progressive thing to do.

New Deal legislation was very flawed.

[TM99]

92. Yes, we are definitely opposed to each other then.

This has zero to do with Rand.

This has all to do with individuals like yourself who have the erroneous belief that New Deal legislation was 'very flawed'.

[geek tragedy]

93. You think it was perfect? nt

[TM99]

94. A great piece of legislation that was neither

'perfect' nor 'very flawed.'

It was most importantly effective, and for decades after its passage, Republicans and Democrats alike were in agreement to its merits and value.

[geek tragedy]

95. The New Deal was not 'a piece of legislation'

It was many pieces of legislation.

And it was not administered in a non-discriminatory way.

[TM99]

96. Oh come on.

You know what I mean.

So let's get rid of it because it wasn't implemented in the way you believe it should have been? Perhaps, we should instead focus on not getting rid of it and expanding it such that it makes up for any defects?

But you apparently follow the team model of politics. There is no reasoning with a person like that.

[geek tragedy]

97. No, I believe that flawed legislation that improves

people's lives is worth passing, e.g., the ACA.

You obviously disagree.

[Blue_Tires]

19. Watch out; all the Paulites are going to label you as an authoritarian sheep for exposing their idol

[DesMoinesDem]

21. Since when are Democrats infavor of extending the Patriot Act?

Oh yea. Since Obama was elected.

[Spazito]

23. Rand Paul is such a fraud...

he talks out of both sides of his mouth and far too many people believe him.

[woo me with science]

34. Ditto for corporate Democrats, who have fought to defend spying all along,

and whose sham "reform" bill here would have legalized phone spying permanently instead of allowing it to expire.

As usual, the entire sham partisan battle is a propagandist's wet dream: Set up a pseudo battle to divide people into their Red and Blue teams and get them to take sides in a false choice in which the spying agenda is advanced either way. Anything to keep us from uniting to demand ACTUAL cessation of the spying.

We have united oligarchy, not gridlocked democracy.

[Spazito]

39. LOL...just LOL...

posting this kind of nonsense is very entertaining!

[Number23]

64. Well, "entertaining" is one word for it.

[Spazito]

65. I thought I was reading the script from a 1930's movie...

I really did laugh out loud!

[Number23]

67. HA!!

I thought I was reading the script from a 1930's movie...

Oh my goodness!

And a really, REALLY bad 30s movie to boot. I'm envisioning a misty castle in Transylvania where the battle takes place, horrendous acting, absolutely baffling and gratuitous nudity at the most ridiculous times, and a script so poorly crafted that the audience laughs the hardest the more dire and earnest the film's "messages" are.

A cult classic, I'm sure! (Emphasis on CULT, here)

[Cali_Democrat]

68. Bwhahahaha

Reminds me of my absurdly easy film class in college. The professor would get an absolute kick out of showing us cheesy movies from the 1920s and 1930s.

[Spazito]

69. Yep, one of those really bad movies with cliche after cliche after cliche...

A surefire CULT classic!

[Johonny]

25. he “felt bad” that the bill failed, because it “probably needed my vote,"

Well as long as he felt bad then that's okay. I'm sure another reform bill is due as soon as the Republicans sweep into office. His excuse that it didn't go far enough is hilariously Rand. I did nothing to improve the situation when I had the chance, but trust me I don't like it. Yeah and Rand has a pipe line to sell you too.

[Rex]

28. Yeah people need to wise up, Rand is just another con man trying to rip us all off.

Fuck him.

[woo me with science]

31. Yes, he's a con man, but so was this bill.

It was a manipulative Trojan horse bill that would have legalized large swaths of the spying instead of allowing it to expire.

The bipartisan oligarchs are doing what they always do...setting up a false choice that leads us to tyranny in either direction.

[Rex]

32. I don't expect things to change, the GOP mutilated the U.S. Consitution under Reagan

then put it on the chopping block with Dubya. Congress won't do shit to the CIA or NSA, no matter how much spying on Congress they get caught doing or lying under oath. Those with power will never give it up, they will continue to spy on us and it will only get more intrusive.

We met tyranny under the BFEE and it seems some people just shrugged their shoulders and went with it.

[Iliyah]

36. GOPer senators voted for Keystone including Rand Paul

Eff the environment, destroy one of the beauties of America for profit for a few. Screw the people who live in those areas that will be affected, i.e. health issues but at least they will (maybe) be able to smoke plenty weed, oh wait, drug testing for people what some type of assistance, oh well.

[Peacetrain]

29. Libertarians will stab you in the back every time

I would rather deal with a declared far right tea partier than a Libertairan any day of the week..At least I know what I am up against with the declared far right.. Libertarians smile in your face and knee cap you at the same time.. and they always wrap it up in their ability to talk out of both sides of their faces at the same time

[woo me with science]

33. And so will corporate Democrats.

The corporate PTB are doing what they always do: setting up false choices in which tyranny or tyranny are the only possible outcomes.

In this case, slimy corporate Democrats offered a bill that would have legalized vast swaths of the spying instead of allowing it to expire.

As per usual, we are manipulated and driven into ludicrous sham partisan battles, when in reality both parties are working to ensure that mass spying continues.

[Bobbie Jo]

35. So true.

Libertarians smile in your face and knee cap you at the same time.. and they always wrap it up in their ability to talk out of both sides of their faces at the same time.

Perfect description.

[Skidmore]

41. Fetid smarmy little scammer.

I have no use for him and I would hope no other liberal would either.

[Cali_Democrat]

43. Looks like this thread caught some of DU's resident Paulites

Like fly paper...

[Dr Hobbitstein]

46. I was noticing that a few of those who keep

mindlessly yelling about "Third Way" and the defunct DLC are the very ones rushing to defend Rand Paul on this thread.

Thinks that make ya go

[Number23]

66. Indeed, Dr. Hobbitstein!

I was noticing that a few of those who keep mindlessly yelling about "Third Way" and the defunct DLC are the very ones rushing to defend Rand Paul on this thread.

A coincidence, surely! Yeah!

[elias49]

48. Disappointing that Bill Mahr is so enamored of Paul, isn't it?

Not much in love with Mahr for some many months, but I never thought he'd go Rand!

[SidDithers]

54. But their attempts to hijack the thread...

and change the subject to Obama and "corporate Democrats" are pretty hilarious.

Sid

[Cali_Democrat]

56. Can you say "corporate Democrats" five times fast?

It takes some practice!

[FSogol]

55. Yup, pretty funny.

[Bobbie Jo]

57. Without fail. nt

[Clint0n]

49. One step closer to no patriot act is a good thing.

or maybe theres something worse than the patriot act sitting on the shelf at NSA hq, just waiting for the right time to brush the dust off..
Anyone know when the text of the patriot act was actually written? I suspect it was years prior to 911.

[Cha]

50. Hey Steve.. Your OP is on the Home page in the Left Column!

[Cha]

51. ".. Paul said he “felt bad” that the bill failed, because it “probably needed my vote.." RP talkin'

outta both sides of his mouth.

"Leahy pleaded with those who had concerns about the bill to allow it to proceed past Tuesday’s cloture vote and try to fix it through amendments. But Paul ignored him, essentially cutting himself off from the chance to add an amendment. NSA reform’s next stop is May 2015 -- the Patriot Act provision’s original expiration date."

[SidDithers]

53. But #StandWithRand!!!...

Sid

[blkmusclmachine]

63. ,

,

[ucrdem]

74. say it ain't so randy . . .

[Thinkingabout]

77. On the same BS statements Congressional members put out when they are spineless to stand behind

their votes. Sure they get slammed by their votes but where is their courage? We expect our military to put their lives in the face of danger and they do a fine job. The clowns such as Cruz makes an idiot out of himself but does not govern.

[Prophet 451]

78. He's another Conservative "Libertarian"

i.e. Libertarian when it comes to letting Big Business do absolutely anything it wants whenevr it wants, including torturing you to death. But just another Conservative when it comes to everything else. Essentially, he's just following teh current fashion for fringe-right politicians to call themselves "Libertarian". And that's not even getting into the problems with libertarianism itself (a philosophy that comes down to "people should starve rather than me paying taxes&quot .

[1StrongBlackMan]

82. But we get to smoke all the dope we want! eom.

[Autumn]

81. Fuck Rand Paul. A Democratic president could have ended it but chose not to

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1014947842

A Democratic Champion.

[TheKentuckian]

87. Rand Paul is a regular ass TeaPubliKlan that plays a libertarian on and for TV