T.P.P. is for less competition and higher drug prices. NYT

[Ichingcarpenter]

T.P.P. is for less competition and higher drug prices. The effects will go beyond the 12 T.P.P. countries. Barriers to generics in the Pacific will put pressure on producers of such drugs in other countries, like India, as well.



http://mobile.nytimes.com/2015/01/31/opinion/dont-trade-away-our-health.html?_r=1&referrer=



By a Nobel winning economist

[Warren Stupidity]

1. Look, you've been told to stop using "news" sources like huffpo.

oh wait...

[Ichingcarpenter]

2. I tried RT but the NYTs had it first I will

Try RT & Huff later ....... LOL

[djean111]

4. To be fair, if the HuffPo picks this up from the NYTimes, after you have read it there -

the information becomes either completely translated into French in your mind - and you do not speak French - or the letters start dancing around like GIFs so you cannot re-read them PLUS you immediately are transformed into a Recalcitrant Populist Librul Left Leaning Tower of Pizza (there is an easily identifiable tshirt), and the black van will be around very soon to scoop you up and turn you back into a True Belieber and you will love the corporations!!!!!

So far, the TPP sucks, and isn't it amazing that this is the one thing that the GOP is LONGING to cooperate with Obama to pass. And if the GOP and Obama get their way, when we do get to see it in its full corporate glory - no one can change a word of it. So those wait until we can read it directives are kinda moot.

[Warren Stupidity]

7. Plus the bonus is that the GOP gets to blame the Democrats for the mess!

And Obama gets to....

Actually I don't have a clue what Obama's motivation is.

[xocet]

22. Speak to CoC-/industry-related groups after his presidency for large amounts of USD, perchance? n/t

[Hoyt]

3. This is an area of real concern in the TPP. However, I bet it isn't in the final draft.

Don't know that for a fact, as others don't know that it will be in the final agreement. But, I doubt that will be presented to Congress. I don't think many countries considering the TPP will enact a law that dramatically increases drug prices since their governments pay for those drugs.

[djean111]

5. This is why India will not join. And if Obama gets his Fast Track, none of the TPP can

be changed. At all.

[Hoyt]

9. First, I doubt he will get fast-track. Second, I doubt it will be in the final agreement.

Do you think Japan, Canada, Mexico, Australia -- and European countries which will be in the next round of this -- are going to approve a trade agreement that dramatically increases the cost of drugs to their government? I don't.

Again, I don't know that for a fact. But no one else does either. In the unlikely event fast-track authority is given, Congress can still say no to the agreement after a lengthy debate. They just can't nit-pick it to death so that it takes 300 years to make any final decision.

[djean111]

12. It looks like hundreds of corporate representatives are the ones writing this stuff

in secret. And maybe the other countries are just as corporately run as ours is. We know for a fact that this stuff IS in there, now, thanks to leaks. If Obama wants everyone to STFU about this, then he needs to release it so we all can see it.
This is not like previous trade agreements, where tariffs were the main point. This slithers into everything.
So - your "doubt" doesn't do anything for my apprehension, sorry.

[Andy823]

18. So if it's all a big secret

How do we know this issue is even in it? I keep hearing all kinds of things that are "IN THE BILL", and at the same time I keep hearing, from the same people, that it's all a huge secret and "nobody" knows what is being put in the actually bill. How can it be both ways?

[djean111]

20. There are leaks.

In addition, Grayson and Warren have had a look at it, are not allowed to get specific, but say Americans would be very angry if they read it. Pelosi and Reid are against Fast Tracking it. Reich, Stiglitz - I will trust them on this, too.

If you are okay with it, then all you really have to do is - nothing. Don't call your representative. If your aim is to convince others to wait and see, and trust - then you won't accomplish that.

[Andy823]

29. He said, she said, they said

Can any of those "leaks be confirmed as being facts, or just so called rumors.?


Would you accept "links" that said the opposite of what is being leaked now?

I hate what NAFTA did, but I know nothing about this current agreement, and won't till it is actually finished. If it's another NAFTA I too will will be pissed off. But at least I am waiting for some facts, not just so called "leaks". I have seen way to many accusations on things here at DU that people swear were going to happen, but they never did.

[pampango]

28. There are three reasons that India will not join: intellectual property, labor and environment rules

However, the real question is not whether India must integrate more with the world economy, but how it can do this. Should India join the TPP? Or should it, for now, only participate in the process of negotiations?

In practice, U.S. negotiators have included in the TPP non-trade-related issues, including labour matters, environmental laws and intellectual property rights.

From India's perspective an acceptance of such demands should not be a precondition for joining the TPP.

The TPP will establish advanced-country rules in intellectual property, generic pharmaceuticals, local content requirements, liberalisation of services, environmental protections and labour standards which will not necessarily serve Indian interests.

http://www.gatewayhouse.in/india-and-the-tpp-wait-and-watch/

It is true that India does not like the intellectual property rights being discussed but they are also concerned by what they perceive as unfavorable labor matters and environmental laws under discussion.

[ND-Dem]

6. "I bet," "I don't think" = oh i'm convinced, you v. stiglitz

Don't Trade Away Our Health


By JOSEPH E. STIGLITZ

January 30, 2015


A secretive group met behind closed doors in New York this week. What they decided may lead to higher drug prices for you and hundreds of millions around the world.

Representatives from the United States and 11 other Pacific Rim countries convened to decide the future of their trade relations in the so-called Trans-Pacific Partnership (T.P.P.). Powerful companies appear to have been given influence over the proceedings, even as full access is withheld from many government officials from the partnership countries.

[Hoyt]

10. You will notice Stiglitz uses the word COULD a lot. Still don't think it will be in final draft.

A good final agreement COULD improve the world's lot too.

[ND-Dem]

13. The secrecy of the T.P.P. negotiations makes them maddeningly opaque and hard to discuss.

But we can get a pretty good idea of what’s happening, based on documents obtained by WikiLeaks from past meetings (they began in 2010), what we know of American influence in other trade agreements, and what others and myself have gleaned from talking to negotiators.

Trade agreements are negotiated by the office of the United States Trade Representative, supposedly on behalf of the American people. Historically, though, the trade representative’s office has aligned itself with corporate interests. If big pharmaceutical companies hold sway — as the leaked documents indicate they do — the T.P.P. could block cheaper generic drugs from the market. Big Pharma’s profits would rise, at the expense of the health of patients and the budgets of consumers and governments.


Stiglitz cites history, discussion with negotiators, and wikileaks documents for his "coulds". Yours are based on....the audacity of hope, or what?

[Hoyt]

17. If the preliminary negotiations were open to public, it would take 300 years to decide what font

to print things in. I'm sorry, I'll wait for the final draft.

I do not believe all countries party to the TPP -- and those that will be party to the next round, like European countries -- will approve any agreement that increases drug prices paid by the government.

Again, I realize that is at odds with those that believe Obama is going to sell us down the river.

[Warren Stupidity]

8. Yes secret trade deals are so lovely.

What could possibly go wrong with a secret trade deal fast tracked through congress?

Why, seriously, why would any peasant outside the rings of power support this sort of elitist anti-democratic bullshit?

[Hoyt]

11. The draft is far from final, and it still has to pass in every country. It won't be a secret when

it is presented to Congress. We'll see it and have time to debate. I suspect it will be a big part of the 2016 Presidential debate too.

But hey, why get in the way of a good "we're being sold down the river by Obama" story.

[Warren Stupidity]

14. It will be "fast tracked" guaranteeing that it will pass as there are enough

corporate asshats in both parties to ensure passage.

[Hoyt]

15. I doubt it. But who knows for sure.

[Andy823]

19. Yep,

The same old "hair on fire" gang strikes again. "It's all secret", but look at all the "leaks" that are coming out. It certainly is just another way to go after president Obama, buy the same crowd that does it day after day after day…!

[Ichingcarpenter]

24. Damn you Nobel prize winners!!!!!!

Oh wait....

[tridim]

27. And if it is, the President will veto in a split second.

Sausage-making is ugly. Always has been, always will be.

[Faryn Balyncd]

16. This will add to the already skyrocketing cost of generics caused by market manipulation.

[KG]

21. all i know is, higher drug prices are a good thing

because obama!

[90-percent]

23. What Elizabeth has said

She spoke to somebody that knows what's in it and she was told; "It has to be kept secret because if the public knew what was in it, they wouldn't like it."

I'm OK with secrecy at this stage, but DEFINITELY NOT FOR OUR ELECTED REPS. As our representatives, they should be allowed as full access as possible. And that brings up the strong possibility of leaks. But that's also OK, as any current day whistle blowers are usually prosecuted to the full extent of the seldom used obsolete secrecy laws anyway. I doubt any Congressional staffers want to suffer the same fate as Snowden, Manning, or that other new guy journalist that our government wants to put in prison for the rest of his life, for daring to practice................journalism. (he revealed some CIA secrets or won't reveal his source or something?)

-90% Jimmy

[ReRe]

25. TPP...

... is the first step on the road to Corporate governance of the effing world. Check out http://www.tradewatch.org

[abelenkpe]

26. Why would we want less competition?

Isn' that bad for consumers? Leads to monopolies, etc ?