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We need more of this kind of 'rhetoric' in Congress (Original Post) bigtree Mar 2015 OP
Oh noes! HappyMe Mar 2015 #1
Don't you mean "Warren will haz a sad"? Android3.14 Mar 2015 #5
Nope. HappyMe Mar 2015 #6
He meant Warren Buffett, who is also having a sad over Liz's rhetoric. nt Erich Bloodaxe BSN Mar 2015 #26
Why does this difficult angry woman want to soak the rich? Autumn Mar 2015 #2
I don't care for her tone. AtomicKitten Mar 2015 #3
I love her tone!! Delmette Mar 2015 #31
I think she thought it was obvious. nm rhett o rick Mar 2015 #35
I do, too. calimary Mar 2015 #51
K and R bigwillq Mar 2015 #4
Simple question: why? brooklynite Mar 2015 #7
Beause PADemD Mar 2015 #12
So, the clueless public hasn't been convinced by six years of Alan Grayson? brooklynite Mar 2015 #17
Half the public doesn't know who controls Congress. PADemD Mar 2015 #21
Outside of DU I've never met a single person who knew who Alan Grayson is think Mar 2015 #28
That's mainly because the Republicans control most of the news media. Cal33 Mar 2015 #30
Why do you guys insist on asking questions. If you have an opinion, spit it out. nm rhett o rick Mar 2015 #36
maybe not 'facetious' but definitely cynical bigtree Mar 2015 #15
It'll get non-Wall Street Democrats to the polls. Erich Bloodaxe BSN Mar 2015 #27
Your world really does revolve around the wealthy, doesn't it Brooklynite? Scootaloo Mar 2015 #34
Because it will create solidarity and express the frustrations among average JDPriestly Mar 2015 #40
Nice! Enthusiast Mar 2015 #43
It's a show of spine, and shifts the focus, if only momentarily, toward us. Orsino Mar 2015 #53
this is perfect for my facebook & twitter family hopemountain Mar 2015 #61
Maybe they need to get Rand Paul in there Mr.Bill Mar 2015 #8
Sanders and Warren GeoWilliam750 Mar 2015 #9
I would too... KansDem Mar 2015 #10
Now. Now. We should not speak of liberal ideas now that we don't control congress. pampango Mar 2015 #11
she's honoring her seat ellennelle Mar 2015 #13
Welcome to DU, ellennelle! calimary Mar 2015 #52
Is there a video? Because without a video the "Angry Warren" photo is just a photo with a logo. Fred Sanders Mar 2015 #14
it's only 'angry' if you're talking about a woman bigtree Mar 2015 #18
What? It has nothing to do with gender, it has to do with tone of voice, what was the tone of voice? Fred Sanders Mar 2015 #20
right, whatever you say bigtree Mar 2015 #22
Or hysterical, maybe? calimary Mar 2015 #50
Shrill and hysteria lark Mar 2015 #57
Obama keeps calm and carries on compromising away our liberties and freedoms. But he remains rhett o rick Mar 2015 #37
Obama does remain calm and carry on. That's his way. JDPriestly Mar 2015 #41
Liz was a Republican when they were not so crazy QuestionAlways Mar 2015 #46
They were always this crazy. 1992 GOP Convention keynote speaker was Pat Buchanan Bluenorthwest Mar 2015 #49
Goldwater's speech was in 1964, before Reagan QuestionAlways Mar 2015 #55
They were in pretty deep when they tried to assassinate FDR... freebrew Mar 2015 #60
She is from Oklahoma and there are a lot of conservatives in Oklahoma. JDPriestly Mar 2015 #59
Right. stage left Mar 2015 #29
The gop is gleefully destroying the middle class and working poor. Why would they want to fix it? Dont call me Shirley Mar 2015 #16
Here's a better question. Why is it so many dems don't seem to want to fix it? Autumn Mar 2015 #23
Those Dems would be 3rd wayers. Dont call me Shirley Mar 2015 #24
K&R! G_j Mar 2015 #19
I have to wonder why Dean would say that. langstonhues Mar 2015 #25
Game is the right word. WTF? Enthusiast Mar 2015 #44
It's about time! markmyword Mar 2015 #32
A third party will only assure a crazy Republican is in the WH QuestionAlways Mar 2015 #47
hell fucking yes! BlancheSplanchnik Mar 2015 #33
Seems the Third Way doesn't appreciate her tone. They are getting nervous that rhett o rick Mar 2015 #38
What populist movement? FSogol Mar 2015 #54
please link to the poll for these results hopemountain Mar 2015 #58
Go Warren! GO! burrowowl Mar 2015 #39
Yes we do! And the more they try to smear her, the more people like her. sabrina 1 Mar 2015 #42
K&R! This post should have hundreds of recommendations! Enthusiast Mar 2015 #45
I can only give it one but tularetom Mar 2015 #56
Exactly Liberalynn Mar 2015 #48

Autumn

(45,042 posts)
2. Why does this difficult angry woman want to soak the rich?
Mon Mar 2, 2015, 04:46 PM
Mar 2015

She's gonna make some democrats sad.

Please cross post this in the Elizabeth Warren group. http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=forum&id=1265

brooklynite

(94,489 posts)
7. Simple question: why?
Mon Mar 2, 2015, 05:08 PM
Mar 2015

And I'm not being facetious. We're not talking policy here, we're talking rhetoric.

Why do we need more of this type of rhetoric?
- because it will cause republicans to change their minds?
- because it will get voters to pay attention to an issue they're not otherwise interested in?
- because it'll make progressives feel good?

What is the beneficial outcome?

PADemD

(4,482 posts)
12. Beause
Mon Mar 2, 2015, 05:29 PM
Mar 2015

It will make the clueless public realize that the Republicans are not doing anything for them.

PADemD

(4,482 posts)
21. Half the public doesn't know who controls Congress.
Mon Mar 2, 2015, 05:43 PM
Mar 2015

Or even the name of their Senators or Representative.

 

think

(11,641 posts)
28. Outside of DU I've never met a single person who knew who Alan Grayson is
Mon Mar 2, 2015, 06:14 PM
Mar 2015

including well informed Dems in another part of Florida.

It's unfortunate...

bigtree

(85,986 posts)
15. maybe not 'facetious' but definitely cynical
Mon Mar 2, 2015, 05:34 PM
Mar 2015

...why say anything, in that case, if you're not intent on changing the conversation and surrounding the economic debate in Congress?

Would you have Democrats remaining silent on republican inaction, neglect, and obstruction? Is there any value you can see in calling them out in the public forum for their intransigence in enacting policies and making budget choices which benefit the working-class?

You do realize that debates in Congress and public appeals from our elected officials involve 'rhetoric?' What would you have Democrats say to republicans?

JDPriestly

(57,936 posts)
40. Because it will create solidarity and express the frustrations among average
Tue Mar 3, 2015, 04:14 AM
Mar 2015

Americans whose voices are not heard in D.C. and whose needs are ignored by a Congress too busy raising big money to think about the majority of their constituents.

It will get voters to pay attention.

It will reassure voters that their concerns are recognized by Elizabeth Warren and that she is on their side.

Because it will make not just progressives but a lot of people feel good, people who lost their pensions when their companies were sold, people who lost good paying jobs when someone like Romney bought their company and set up the equipment overseas and then imported the products that were at one time made her, etc.

The beneficial outcome is uniting people behind REAL change, not just Third Way chump change. And chump change is what too many Americans are left with today.

I know a guy in his 50s, worked as long as he could at a steady, decent-paying industrial job. When he got into his 50s, the work petered out. The company "reorganized." He was "laid off." He became very depressed and kind of withdrew into himself. Went into retraining for, of course, some sort of computer industry job but never got a job. Continued taking courses. His marriage began to fall apart. Eventually, someone made an offer on his house and he and his wife who no longer lived in their house sold. He is still depressed. He still has no job. He is still in his 50s. He is close to divorced.

That's the story of a generation that got hit hard by history.

In fact, there is a pretty good-sized segment of every generation in America today that has it tough, really tough. The economy is improving a bit, but not nearly fast enough. And the recovery is only slowly bringing higher wages In fact, a lot of the wage hikes are do to new laws and not to any drastic growth in demand for labor.

The rich were bailed out. The poor and middle class lost out. That need to change. Many Americans are still waiting for prosperity to trickle down. Elizabeth Warren speaks for them. When Elizabeth Warren says the game is rigged, she is talking for millions and millions of Americans.

Why should a student pay a higher interest rate on a student loan than a bank pays on a loan from the Fed? That is the kind of question that Elizabeth Warren asks?

Why should a guy who helps his clients avoid paying taxes in the US be employed by the government whose tax revenues he helps deplete?

Why should a bank be allowed to sell a stock to a middle-class client who has no inside information and is relatively unsophisticated about investments and then buy some sort of financial instrument that constitutes a bet against the stock purchase of the client? The bank's purchase of a stock that is essentially a bet against a client should be considered a conflict of interest and a breach of fiduciary duty. It isn't. It seems to be legal. But it's morally wrong. Elizabeth Warren understands that it is wrong and can tell you why in language that you will understand.

Elizabeth Warren 2016.
And if she doesn't want to run, Bernie Sanders 2016.

Let's get some fair rules in our capitalist game. Capitalism had to either be pretty good for everyone or it will be rejected and fail. I think we can make capitalism into a good, fair system with everyone playing by the same, fair rules. And I think Elizabeth Warren is the person who would be able to change our nation so that our system is fair. I would like to see her appointing the cabinet. That is why I would like to see her in the White House.

I also like Bernie Sanders.

Orsino

(37,428 posts)
53. It's a show of spine, and shifts the focus, if only momentarily, toward us.
Tue Mar 3, 2015, 01:53 PM
Mar 2015

Our needs ought to become a priority, despite the party that controls Congress.

More rhetoric like this, sustained, will translate into more action. Shutting up guarantees more of the same.

hopemountain

(3,919 posts)
61. this is perfect for my facebook & twitter family
Tue Mar 3, 2015, 04:22 PM
Mar 2015

who are too busy surviving and don't have much time to read except for soundbites. soundbites - the republicans have this down - along with the rest of their pr machine. notice how they get a distortion or message out there for a day or so throughout their msm and then it's off the headlines - except for the soundbites being handed across facebook, twitter, teabag and republican forums, etc. they don't even bother to print corrections.

your assessment of the power of this poster may apply for the 1% and centrist 1% wannabes. but this soundbite for warren is truth and it should be heard by the working class and others who are being exploited by the 1%.

pampango

(24,692 posts)
11. Now. Now. We should not speak of liberal ideas now that we don't control congress.
Mon Mar 2, 2015, 05:28 PM
Mar 2015

If we did not do what needed to be done in the last 6 years we should be quite now. I read that somewhere.

calimary

(81,195 posts)
52. Welcome to DU, ellennelle!
Tue Mar 3, 2015, 01:45 PM
Mar 2015

Glad you're here! You're a palindrome! I agree with you. She's doing great honor to the seat once held by Teddy Kennedy. The people of Massachusetts are well-served. Not so much by their governor (who's a CON) - what the hell? Oh yeah. I forgot.

Because Martha Coakley.

Fred Sanders

(23,946 posts)
14. Is there a video? Because without a video the "Angry Warren" photo is just a photo with a logo.
Mon Mar 2, 2015, 05:31 PM
Mar 2015

Logos of statement clips strung together of one persons sayings.

The message is clear and logical, tax and income fairness is needed on an emergency basis - why this need to inject personality into the policy?

bigtree

(85,986 posts)
18. it's only 'angry' if you're talking about a woman
Mon Mar 2, 2015, 05:38 PM
Mar 2015

...if it's a man, you use words like 'forceful,' 'aggressive,' 'resolute,' and 'decisive.'

Right?

Fred Sanders

(23,946 posts)
20. What? It has nothing to do with gender, it has to do with tone of voice, what was the tone of voice?
Mon Mar 2, 2015, 05:40 PM
Mar 2015

Obama remains calm and carries on, some of the same is my position.

Let the policy do the talking. Stop looking for heroes and heroines.

lark

(23,083 posts)
57. Shrill and hysteria
Tue Mar 3, 2015, 02:13 PM
Mar 2015

are both man-speak put downs for a woman speaking her mind. They want us quiet and compliant. Tough!!

 

rhett o rick

(55,981 posts)
37. Obama keeps calm and carries on compromising away our liberties and freedoms. But he remains
Tue Mar 3, 2015, 01:44 AM
Mar 2015

calm. Maybe you meant that Sen Warren should sit down and shut up. Is that what you mean.

Keeping calm and carrying on is what got us where we are today. I am guessing you accept the status quo.

JDPriestly

(57,936 posts)
41. Obama does remain calm and carry on. That's his way.
Tue Mar 3, 2015, 04:17 AM
Mar 2015

It isn't the only way to be.

Elizabeth Warren does let the policy do the talking.

She puts energy behind it, emotion behind it. I like that. Nothing wrong with expressing anger at justice.

Even Jesus threw the moneychangers out of the Temple. Nothing wrong with righteous anger at wrongdoing. Elizabeth Warren does not advocate violence. She advocates righteous change.

 

QuestionAlways

(259 posts)
46. Liz was a Republican when they were not so crazy
Tue Mar 3, 2015, 11:11 AM
Mar 2015

Extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice. And moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue.

Barry Goldwater

 

Bluenorthwest

(45,319 posts)
49. They were always this crazy. 1992 GOP Convention keynote speaker was Pat Buchanan
Tue Mar 3, 2015, 01:04 PM
Mar 2015

who served as Ronald Reagan's Director of Communications. Pat was a candidate that year along with Ron Paul and David Duke for the nomination won by incumbent George HW Bush. Warren was a Republican at that time, I most certainly was not.
Let's take a look at the Keynote Speech in Warren's Party in 1992, several years before she left the Party:
"George Bush is a defender of right-to-life, and lifelong champion of the Judeo-Christian values and beliefs upon which this nation was built.
Mr Clinton, however, has a different agenda.
At its top is unrestricted abortion on demand. When the Irish-Catholic governor of Pennsylvania, Robert Casey, asked to say a few words on behalf of the 25 million unborn children destroyed since Roe v Wade, he was told there was no place for him at the podium of Bill Clinton’s convention, no room at the inn.

Yet a militant leader of the homosexual rights movement could rise at that convention and exult: “Bill Clinton and Al Gore represent the most pro-lesbian and pro-gay ticket in history.” And so they do.....
The agenda Clinton & Clinton would impose on America–abortion on demand, a litmus test for the Supreme Court, homosexual rights, discrimination against religious schools, women in combat–that’s change, all right. But it is not the kind of change America wants. It is not the kind of change America needs. And it is not the kind of change we can tolerate in a nation that we still call God’s country."
http://buchanan.org/blog/1992-republican-national-convention-speech-148

So where's the not so crazy part?

 

QuestionAlways

(259 posts)
55. Goldwater's speech was in 1964, before Reagan
Tue Mar 3, 2015, 02:01 PM
Mar 2015

Later in his life, Goldwater himself, thought the Republican party went off the deep end.

JDPriestly

(57,936 posts)
59. She is from Oklahoma and there are a lot of conservatives in Oklahoma.
Tue Mar 3, 2015, 04:14 PM
Mar 2015

Read her books, and you will understand why she changed parties.

I prefer a person who switched to become a Democrat for well considered reasons than one who claims to be a Democrat but has Republican ideas and values. Lots of the latter in the DLC, Third-Way wings of the Democratic Party.

stage left

(2,961 posts)
29. Right.
Mon Mar 2, 2015, 06:22 PM
Mar 2015

Absolutely right! Their righteous anger on behalf of the part of the 99% is what I admire about both Warren and Sanders. Has anybody told him he needed to soften his tone? I myself have described him as fiery, but damn, I like fiery when your cause is just. Every time I see the words of FDR--They hate me. And I welcome their hatred.--a thrill goes down my spine. Rhetoric, however, is worthless without action.

Autumn

(45,042 posts)
23. Here's a better question. Why is it so many dems don't seem to want to fix it?
Mon Mar 2, 2015, 06:01 PM
Mar 2015

They fear being associated with the message Liz is speaking.

 

langstonhues

(49 posts)
25. I have to wonder why Dean would say that.
Mon Mar 2, 2015, 06:09 PM
Mar 2015

Was it an honest slip up, a poor choice of words using 'soak'.

Was it an attempt to discredit Warren (which it does because he basically called Warren a liar, because she always has said 'be rich, enjoy, but pay your fair share' which is not even in the solar system of the rich being soaked.

Still I don't get what the game is here with what he said - it's evident that Warren's populism is being heard far and wide so why would Dean magnify the difference between Warren's populist philosophy and Hillary's centrist and protective of the rich philosophy?

markmyword

(180 posts)
32. It's about time!
Mon Mar 2, 2015, 11:42 PM
Mar 2015

It's about time that a Progressive stood up to the Republicans! Warren is the ONLY Democrat, with a BACKBONE who's fighting for the middle class.

Now other Democrats want her to tone it down, WHY????
We need someone MAD at what's going on, to the people and to our country.
Dean, Buffet and I'm sure a host of others will try and shut Warren up.
They all want the status quo, they don't want to ruffle the bankers, Wall Street and the corporations because that's where the money comes from and who THEY REPRESENT!

They also want her to turn it down for Hilary. Hilary is just the same as any Republican who's going to run. Both parties are really the same, they've done nothing for our country and the people.

Today's Congress and our Presidents represent corporations.
Warren ABSOLUTLEY has to run for President. How can she sit back and have Hilary and company tell her to knock it off.
Hilary represents Wall Street not us.

We need NEW BLOOD in our government and WARREN is it!
Warren is the REAL DEAL, Obama let us all down, he's great with the rhetoric, won't fight, doesn't stand up for the people, didn't prosecute Bush administration, instead PROSECUTES WHISTLEBLOWERS!!!!!!
If Warren won't run, then we need to get a Third party started that REALLY represents the people!

 

QuestionAlways

(259 posts)
47. A third party will only assure a crazy Republican is in the WH
Tue Mar 3, 2015, 11:20 AM
Mar 2015

We all saw the benefits of Nader's third party run

 

rhett o rick

(55,981 posts)
38. Seems the Third Way doesn't appreciate her tone. They are getting nervous that
Tue Mar 3, 2015, 01:46 AM
Mar 2015

the Populist Movement might kick their asses.

FSogol

(45,471 posts)
54. What populist movement?
Tue Mar 3, 2015, 02:00 PM
Mar 2015

Joe Biden 16%

Hillary Clinton 54%

Martin O'Malley 1%

Bernie Sanders 5%

Jim Webb 2%

Elizabeth Warren 12%

Someone else/undecided 10%

sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
42. Yes we do! And the more they try to smear her, the more people like her.
Tue Mar 3, 2015, 04:41 AM
Mar 2015

When the two Third Way founders tried it a few ago in the WSJ, they were so slammed they have retreated into anonymity and sent out others to try to do what they failed to do.

It won't work, it will lose credibility for anyone who joins them.

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