Melissa Haris Perry's INTENTIONS may be good. Her delivery is like nails scraping down a blackboard.

[Amerigo Vespucci]

I've tried, but I find her Saturday and Sunday show too hyper, too SOMETHING, I don't know what. She just seems like she's jacked up on about 50 Red Bulls and the overall vibe of the show, for me, is really, really annoying. Also, at times, she seems to be excruciatingly self-satisfied.

I don't know if Karen Finney is ready for prime time...her fill-in stints for Martin Bashir were pretty good, although a little green in the area of carrying the whole show (like every other MSNBC personality who got their own show, especially Alex Wagner. It takes time.).

Nia Malika Henderson is also a consistently excellent guest, although that also doesn't necessarily mean she can carry her own show.

Just my opinion...I'm sure Melissa has a mix of fans and non-fans on DU, and I'm not trying to influence what people like. I just had to change the channel this morning after the first 20 minutes because I couldn't handle it.

[DURHAM D]

1. Is there a reason why you are limiting

your critiques to females?

oh never mind...

[Amerigo Vespucci]

2. No, I'm just looking at one female host and assuming she could be replaced with another.

Please, for Christ's sake, it's 7:30 on Sunday morning. It's a little early to be searching for hidden agendas in my posts. There aren't any. Look through any of my other motherfucking threads and you'll find countless discussions of MALES. I appreciate your need to second-guess what's posted here, but you've come to the wrong thread.

[PatSeg]

33. I'm a woman

and I've found her annoying for some time now. I'm just now starting to understand why. I like the "professor" side of Harris-Perry, but when she takes on the cutesy, girly, cheerleader role, I tune out. That doesn't quite sum it all up, but I mostly find her irritating and a bit full of herself.

After watching Chris Hayes, two hours that are just saturated with intelligent, thought provoking conversation, Harris-Perry is a big let down. To be honest, I never cared much for Hayes as a guest host during the week, but he is exceptional hosting his own show in a much different format. I guess I see Hayes as a very authentic person and Harris-Perry more as a performer.

[RetroLounge]

102. Are you fucking kidding me?

RL

[EFerrari]

3. I agree with you. Her television show needs a performance coach desparately.

And her political arguments are often sort of tortured and thoughtless at the same time.

I was a fan of her academic work.

[Surya Gayatri]

32. Yeah, Melissa uses professorial arguments--too lengthy,

too complex. She needs to adapt to the medium of TV. Shorter phrases, more succinct statements, without diluting or dumbing down her basic message.

And, she needs a voice/public speaking coach pronto.

[EFerrari]

45. Professorial arguments without the benefit of peer review. nt

[Shankapotomus]

81. Really?

I find the depth of her analysis refreshing.

[Surya Gayatri]

86. Love MHP's intellect, but she could learn a thing

or two from Rachel. As PatSeg said so well down-thread:

"She (Rachel) is one of those people who can say a whole lot very clearly, with very few words. It is a rare gift."

[Lionessa]

4. Even as a visiting commentarian, I find her annoying.

So I've never watched her show, and never will. I agree also it's hard to pin down exactly why she annoys me, but she surely does.

[EFerrari]

7. She's annoying because she's not more interested in her audience and in her topic

than she is in herself, i.e., tries to be interesting, and it's distracting. It's odd because Manning Marable was one of her mentors and he was great at speaking to cameras.

[bluedigger]

5. I like her show, but I can see your complaint.

I like the energetic delivery, and find her more self-assured than self-satisfied, myself, but she does occasionally clang one. She is also blessed/cursed by her choice of guests. I appreciate her reaching out to voices that don't get much exposure, but sometimes it's clear why. I was pleased when they gave her a show and I think she will get much better - it's only been a few months.

eta: Remember what came before... Prison!

[ellisonz]

10. And remember what comes after...

More Prison!

P.S. I agree, she's not telegenic right-out-the-bat, it's not her background. I find Ezra Klein to be bad too.

[MoonRiver]

6. I also find her abrasive and annoying.

Never watch her show.

[Mponti]

8. Just use the remote

I like her style and the indepth exploration of issues. Glad to see msnbc use this time slot [also Chris Hayes] for worthwhole public affairs reporting rather.than Lockup

[goclark]

36. I love her show

I am a big fan and always tape it.

She is one smart lady and I like her guests as well....
Harris-Perry is a professor of political science at Tulane University.

She is founding director of the Anna Julia Cooper Project on Gender, Race, and Politics in the South.

She previously served on the faculties of the University of Chicago and Princeton University.







http://melissaharrisperry.com/#

[BeyondGeography]

9. She's got that tenured mindset

Meet me 95% of the way, and maybe we can talk.

[Swede]

11. I like her show.

She will only get better with time.

[TuxedoKat]

96. I do too

I like all the different guests she and Chris have on too. Not all the usuals you see on the weekday shows.

[XanaDUer]

12. I really want to like her

She is a progressive, after all. But...watching her...I don't know. Is this her first show?

Ironically, my favorite? Big Al. LOVE that show. Something about him and his delivery.

PS- I'm female and it has nothing to do with gender. At least to me.

[hlthe2b]

17. My feelings too... I really want to like her show. But I find her show difficult to watch.

Maybe she'll get new producers or someone that can help.

[Amerigo Vespucci]

23. That's where I'm coming from

I really want to like her too, but I just don't. I don't care for her personality or delivery at all. Maybe it's the "hyper" thing, I don;t know. I didn't mind her when she was brought on for segments on other MSNBC shows, but since getting a show of her own, I don;t care for her at all.

[Are_grits_groceries]

13. Chris Hayes acted like

he mainlined Red Bull when he started. He still goes too fast at times, but he has gotten a lot better.

Did you mind his lightning delivery?

MHP's delivery will morph over time. Rachel's did.

I find it exciting that she has her own show and has a variety of guests we would never see. Her pool of people to draw from is more varied than a lot of others. That's because of her background and experiences.

I can find her annoying too at times, but not so much that I can't listen to the views presented by her and her guests. It is worth the time and some irritation.

We bitch endlessly about Faux News, but when we get a truly progressive voice that annoys us because of the delivery, out goes the messages. Keep complaining and all of those leaning and moving forward will be gone.

Nobody is above constructive criticism, but we better be careful of the destructive way it is delivered.

[XanaDUer]

21. Yes, Chris is smart as a whip

but his talking-too-fast delivery made me nervous watching him.

[CTyankee]

35. Living in New Haven, I've noticed that Ivy Leaguers all seem to be rapid talkers.

So it was no surprise to me to find out that Hayes went to Brown. Perry taught at Princeton. Paul Krugman who teaches at Princeton and went to (and taught at) Yale, also speaks very quickly.

It's just something they learn to do in the Ivies. Kind of a tic.

[ashling]

55. Chris sometimes reminds me of the guy in this ad

I like him, though. He is extremely intelligent.

[Surya Gayatri]

88. Bwaahaaaa! Spot on!!

And I love Chris's intellect, too!

[Amerigo Vespucci]

24. And he was wired at 10 on a 10 scale this morning, too...

...maybe it's a matter of my not being able to handle the two of them back to back. I almost wanted to turn off Chris Hayes because he not only had that wired thing going on but the little nervous laugh that goes with it. Maybe at the end of his show I'm exhausted with that kind of personality and want something different. I don;t know. I almost mentioned him in my OP, but I do appreciate your bringing it up, because for me, he is not an "easy listen." Good intentions, great content, but Chris...try the decaf.

[Surya Gayatri]

27. You know, Amerigo, I think his brain gets ahead of his tongue...

he starts to hyperventilate a bit, fearing he won't get his idea out in time.

He starts running to catch up with himself--raising the pitch and upping the tempo.

When he's in that mode, it's exhausting for his audience--like cheering on a race to the finish line.

[Amerigo Vespucci]

28. You may be right

It does seem like the ideas are coming faster than his ability to express them. And maybe what I'm saying, now that I've given it some additional thought, is that it's not so much that I don't care for Harris or her delivery (even though I don't)...it's more of a matter of her following Chris Hayes is just too much. I need a host who dials it back a notch, and Harris Perry actually dials it UP a notch on most occasions.

[Surya Gayatri]

26. +1! Agree completely, grits...

"I find it exciting that she has her own show and has a variety of guests we would never see. Her pool of people to draw from is more varied than a lot of others. That's because of her background and experiences."
.../...
"We bitch endlessly about Faux News, but when we get a truly progressive voice that annoys us because of the delivery, out go the messages."

She does need some voice placement training, though.

[Amerigo Vespucci]

29. And just to confirm...

...I have no issue with her as a "progressive voice." My issue lies 100% in the presentation. If the presentation is repellant to me, the voice is lost on me. I just don't think she's worth the effort.

[Surya Gayatri]

39. I understand completely...I have a musician's ear

and am perhaps overly sensitive to any presenter's use of voice. It's almost as if "form" (the voice) is just as important as "content" (the progressive message).

I can't tell you how much the caterwauling by some commentators--both women and men--sets my teeth on edge. It's a kind of physical revulsion.

[CTyankee]

37. If you ever saw her on her earlier days in interviews on issue...particularly her debate with

Gloria Steinem during the 08 campaign, she was very sullen looking, like she was really mad (and I think she was at the time). She wore dark colors and her hair style was drab and straightened. Now she wears bright colors, has amazing makeup that brings out her beautiful coloring and has a cool cornrowed hairstyle (altho it looks painful to me). She has also taken on a festive air.

Image makeover...

[Surya Gayatri]

40. Know what you mean about the cornrows...

Yikes, gives me a headache at the temples just to see her!

[CTyankee]

70. Other than that, I think she looks amazing. Just gorgeous...

[Surya Gayatri]

90. Very pretty woman--beautiful eyes...

[PatSeg]

116. The image makeover

and the more outgoing personality seemed to have happened after she got married. Its not uncommon in both men and women to outwardly change with a new relationship. I know it has happened to me.

She is clearly a happier person.

[uponit7771]

34. +1!

[EFerrari]

60. I don't knew how truly a progressive voice she is

and disagree that a poorly presented progressive viewpoint should get a presentation pass.

[aint_no_life_nowhere]

14. No drama

Teevee is visual and people want to be entertained. They want to see a story unfold, even on a political show. They want to see at least some level of confrontation and adversity, whether towards a guest, towards an idea, or a political personality who isn't present. As they say in film school, drama is conflict. A story involves adversity and the overcoming of adversity. It's what all the entertaining shows on MSNBC have in common, from Bashir and Sharpton to Maddow and Matthews. Harris-Perry seems to dwell on little twists and turns of nuance but doesn't take it anywhere. She never seems to come to the political point. And she's too agreeable with her guests. It's not a question of being hostile or impolite. Rachel Maddow can smile sweetly like a baby assassin while hitting the Republicans with a sledge hammer when making a point. Harris-Perry seems satisfied if she's taught her audience a new factoid and then moves on. She's probably terrific in the classroom but not on television. This morning she had Margaret Cho on her show who would have made a more colorful and entertaining host.

[Surya Gayatri]

41. An academician, not an actor...

Rachel has a much better developed sense of drama and stage presence.

[Shankapotomus]

82. I think we are already over entertained

and under educated in this country. You are describing Right Wing radio which has turned political discussion into a WWF sewer. No way do I want that infecting Left Wing political round tables. Mellissa Harris Perry's show is awesome. Don't change a thing.

[Tarheel_Dem]

130. +1. My only complaint is that I was hoping that MHP would cover world affairs more.

The endless string of political shows can be overload. They're basically discussing the same topics, over & over, with different guests. That being said, I love MHP's regular guests, most of whom I'd never seen or heard of before.

[Shankapotomus]

134. You're right

Msnbc should have a show that focuses on foreign affairs. I wish it would go for a 24 hour news network instead of effectively going off air on weekends except for the mornings.

[Tarheel_Dem]

139. Ditto! I'm a huge Fareed Zakaria fan, and I wish he'd make the switch to MSNBC, but I....

understand they may not have the global infrastructure of CNN. While Fareed does some of the politics stuff, he also covers the rest of the world, and how what happens "over there" impacts us here at home. I get tired of the "politics" of he said/she said.

[Peregrine Took]

15. I can't get past the braids.

They look like they pinch and I have to turn the channel as soon as she comes on.

Ouch!!

[Tennessee Gal]

16. I can't get interested in her show and I think it is her delivery.

I do find her annoying for reasons I can't explain.

I do not like it when she subs for Rachel either.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

18. Rachel is even more animated. Gosh, I wonder what you think of her...

[Amerigo Vespucci]

25. Gosh, could you BE more condescending?

I like Rachel, tough guy.

Welcome to my ignore list. You do not get to address me in this manner. Learn some respect. It might serve you well when you grow up.

[tallahasseedem]

74. It's very confusing why some members...

are taking your criticism of MHP as sexism. I certainly didn't see it that way. I can only take her in doses.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

79. You came here to flamebait and now you act like a victim?

No respect for that at all.

And besides...

I'm very much a GIRL and proud of it.

Meet IGNORE and have a nice holiday weekend!

[EFerrari]

87. There is nothing remotely flaming baiting in the OP and neither is the poster obligated

to simply take the reflexive rudeness in your post "like a victim".

[goclark]

101. yes!!! Let's be happy they support Democrats in every way

I am disappointed that we are picking apart our own msm people that work hard every day!!!


Thugs don't care how Rush looks or sounds!

I happen to be African American and a woman . It disappoints me that " liberals" would
be so concerned about " in fashion" corn rows in 2012
We are proud of Harris-Perry!!
We are also proud of Rev. Al, Eugene Robinson (hope his voice is not too raspy)
and others that are adding their perspectives to the political discussion.

Thanks to msnbc for including an AA woman in their line up.
Thanks to msnbc for understanding that the African American votes are critical to this election.
We need to stay informed more than ever....we are the voters they must suppress .

Thanks Liberal _Stalwart71 for giving me the courage to respond

[Surya Gayatri]

118. We just hope Melissa ups her game

so she can stay on the air, goclark.

I don't think anybody wishes her ill. Most of the criticisms here are positive, with constructive ideas for improvement.

She definitely has a problem with breath control and voice placement, and needs some coaching.

Compare her delivery to that of AA female media personality Joy-Ann Reid, for example.

Reid has much better voice modulation and pitch control. Really pleasant to hear.

As for the Rev. Al and Gene Robinson, enjoy them both, but especially the Rev. Al.

The amusing, but hard-hitting content of his shows largely compensates for his eccentric delivery style and scratchy voice.

"We got'cha!" Love it!

edit: crazy spelling

[goclark]

127. Thanks for your positive thoughts

I do appreciate them.

Question ~ why is it that many of the female News Reporters in the msm talk with a Nasal tone? It's as if they had a nose job to make their nose more appealing and they talk in a different manner.

Are they getting beatup for their voice that sounds like bad chalk on a chalkboard?

To be perfectly honest, it drives me up a wall but I don't think anyone has commented on what many friends ( of all races) have discussed.

[Surya Gayatri]

133. It drives me up the wall, too, goclark...

Maybe I'm overly sensitive, but even if the contents are informative and topical, if the form (delivery style and voice) rips my ear drums, I have to switch.

Here's another post where I discuss the phenomenon:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002732795#post39

Don't these media personalities ever watch and analyze videos of their own shows?

Are they satisfied with the nasal screeching that passes for speech?

Some of the FOX presenters, male and female, are the worst. But, then there's Alex Witt and Chris Jansing on MSNBC, too.

Quick, hit the mute button!

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

137. You're welcome! I am a black woman too, and was taken aback by some

of the comments regarding MHP's appearance. So glad that you're speaking out!!

[WolverineDG]

19. I like her

In fact, I like the whole weekend morning line up MSNBC has put together, even though that means I don't get to sleep past 7.

[Cali_Democrat]

20. I wouldn't know

I'm sound asleep when her show comes on. But I do know Rachel is pretty hyper and I love that about her

[Surya Gayatri]

22. Same reaction here, Amerigo. I think it's

partly a question of voice pitch, timber and tone. She needs a voice coach (like Margaret Thatcher at the beginning of her career)!

If you go back and look at some of Rachel's early appearances, her pitch was much higher when she became passionate. I think she must have gotten some voice placement training. Her voice has a "darker", richer tone now.

Chris Hayes's voice was too highly pitched when he started, too (besides the problem of a machine-gun style delivery). He's lowered the pitch and "darkened" the tone a notch, too.

Melissa sounds too much like a peppy cheerleader--not enough gravitas in her tone. She needs to lower the pitch and enrich the tone.

[Amerigo Vespucci]

30. Rachel has improved greatly

There are times when she, too, will be revved up past my ability to listen to her. But that's never her whole show. Knowing Rachel is overamped because of passion over a specific subject, and knowing she's going to modulate that over the course of her show, keeps me hanging in there. The same can't be said for Melissa Harris Perry. And as I said elsewhere in this thread, maybe she's a little too pleased with her own performance. I don't know. I just know that for three Sunday mornings in a row I've changed the channel when shes come on.

[PatSeg]

38. I think the "little too pleased with her own performance"

is definitely an issue. She landed a really good job and maybe her feet haven't touched ground yet, but I think she needs to be a tad more serious, given the nature of the discussions. Yesterday she did a corny prop gag with a cigar that looked more like something from a late night entertainment show. She often acts more like a teenager than the well educated professor that she is.

[Surya Gayatri]

44. As I said elsewhere in the thread--she's a bit like an

overly peppy cheerleader. You almost expect her to jump up and lead the round-table in some pre-show "pep raising".

[PatSeg]

46. Yes, I've referred to her as a cheerleader in the past

Even she has mentioned she had been a cheerleader and had some pom-pom props on the show that day. Somehow her cute little antics and props don't fit with the discussions.

There is always room for a little humor and irony in a serious program, but she doesn't seem to know how to get a good balance. It feels like a cross between Good Morning America and The View.

[EFerrari]

51. Cf with her participation on this tribute panel for Manning Marable.

Last edited Mon May 28, 2012, 01:56 PM - Edit history (1)

Relatively little jiggly bouncy cuteness. And she ate everyone else's lunch.

http://www.booktv.org/Watch/12456/A+Tribute+to+Historian+Manning+Marable.aspx

ETA: she comes in at about 18:00.

[PatSeg]

58. Exactly

Here she was acting like an intelligent critical thinker, which is what I thought we would get Saturday and Sunday mornings. There is no shortage of "jiggly bouncy cuteness" in television and if that was what MSNBC wanted, there are people who could do it better.

I don't know if this is the type of program Melissa wants or if she is being encouraged to do it, but its not how I want to spend four hours every weekend, which is probably a good thing. I really should be doing something else.

[CTyankee]

61. I find booknotes a bit reserved, which I like but which may not "sell" on msnbc.

I say let's let it play out and see what happens. Clearly, she's a real talent and has some great, up and coming guests on her show. It is a breath of fresh air from all the "talking heads"...

[EFerrari]

65. While she is clearly very talented, I don't find her morphing into a talking head

to be a relief from talking heads. Hopefully, she has friends that will do an intervention before her on air persona becomes fixed in this mode.

[CTyankee]

68. She just may be nervous because she might have gotten feedback that she was too

"angry" in her run-in with Steinem, for instance. This is too bad. It is the "angry black woman" all over again. I'm willing to cut her some slack. She's too good to throw under the bus this soon...

[EFerrari]

69. You're probably right. I can't watch her

but certainly don't wish her ill. She's a young person. There's plenty of time for tweaking what she does.

[Surya Gayatri]

85. Thanks for bringing this video to the discussion, Ferrari...

What a 180° transformation!
Before: measured tone, well-modulated voice, natural gravitas.

After: elevated piercing tone, breathy high-pitched voice, forced gaiety.

She's trying too hard to please on her weekend gig.

You get the impression that she thinks if she stops pumping it up for a second, the whole thing will fall back down to earth.

Love her politics, but she's got to dial it down a notch.

[EFerrari]

91. She needs to breathe. I'm out of practice and didn't notice.

It's so basic. Hard to believe no one is helping her with it. Not breathing well screws everything else up.

[Surya Gayatri]

93. Call in the "King's Speech" voice therapist, asap...

emergency invention required!

Melissa's breath is all up in her throat and upper bronchial tubes.

Lower and slower! Move it down, slow it down!

[CTyankee]

117. well, she IS an academic, not basically a performer.

When she was a panelist, she was comfortable in that role. NOw she must feel she has the weight of a TV show on her shoulders.

Like the saying goes, "be careful what you wish for..."

[EFerrari]

125. She's had to lecture, present and lead discussions. She has skills that cross over.

She needs a coach but, most people do.

I remember watching Keith on Current and thinking how much more relaxed he was than when he was on MSNBC. There must be something about that set that is screwed up because all their hosts seem to have to fight to breathe and to relax enough to impersonate a person talking to other people. lol

[Tarheel_Dem]

131. Is it possible that you're older than MHP's usual demo? She's a college professor. She is....

constantly surrounded by young people, and I think she truly takes an interest in the things that make them tick. I'm not bemoaning critiques of Melissa, because Lord knows I hated Cenk's guts, and couldn't reach the remote fast enough. But MHP is much newer to the game, and I think will improve over time.

In Melissa's case, I note an eagerness to do a good job, and as others have noted, she wasn't "groomed" for this, but took advantage of an opportunity mostly because those of us who admire her, wanted to see more people on the teevee who look like us. Rev. Al and MHP have brought a whole new demographic to MSNBC, and kudos to them for finally answering the call.

[PatSeg]

136. Yes, I am older

but I had no problem with her before when she sounded like the professor she is. The tone of her show does not always match the content or the guests.

I'm sure she will improve with time and a lot of the fault could lie with MSNBC. This may be the Melissa they wanted weekend mornings or they may not have coached her properly. Meanwhile, I will probably watch her once and a while in the hopes she will improve.

[northoftheborder]

31. MHP, Chris, & Rachael all talk way too hyper fast. I'm more Charlie Rose speed.

But it is so satisfying to have more than four minutes to devote to a discussion of issues, so that is why I record Chris and Melissa and listen to them later, fast forward through the commercials and less interesting segments. Their hyper speech pattern may be influenced by their producers. Melissa never talked that way when she was guest or guest host. All three are super smart; it does annoy me that Melissa gets a Repub. fillibusterer nearly every time, that she cannot control.

[PatSeg]

48. That is what I like about the weekend morning shows

They have much more time to cover issues than during the week. The discussions are more in depth and very informative. I'm glad I record Chris Hayes. I rewind often, as there is SO much "smart" to absorb in two hours. I definitely feel more informed afterwards. I only watch bits and pieces of Harris-Perry for the most part though.

I often rewind on Rachel's show too, but not as often. She is one of those people who can say a whole lot very clearly, with very few words. It is a rare gift.

[Surya Gayatri]

50. +1 So true about Rachel, PatSeg...

"She is one of those people who can say a whole lot very clearly, with very few words. It is a rare gift."

[PatSeg]

54. Chris Matthews

once paid Rachel a similar compliment and it was one of the few times that he praised someone where it sounded truly sincere and coherent.

[tallahasseedem]

75. It drives me crazy how Chris...

practically crawls up people's asses at the end of a segment. He always tells Chuck Todd that he is a genius, etc. Yuck!

[PatSeg]

78. I know

Everyone is GREAT, regardless of who they are or what they've done. He's certainly run that adjective into the ground. I wonder what his colleagues say about him when he's not around.

[Surya Gayatri]

83. His verbal fellating of Halperin is even more cringe-making...

"You're one of the best, Mark. Nobody can do it like you", and Halperin sits there with that self-satisfied smirk.

[PatSeg]

107. In Matthew's book,

everyone is the "greatest" or the "best", so I'm sure most of these people take his praise with a grain of salt. Doesn't the man have any producers? He obviously can't control himself or his mouth. Surely there must be someone who can advise him. Of course, maybe he tells them they are the "greatest" too and they shut up.

[Surya Gayatri]

119. Word! "Greatest"...he's certainly devalued that currency!

He's such a fixture on MSNBC that he's probably a sort of law unto himself.

I don't see him taking even "constructive"
criticism gracefully.

[PatSeg]

122. On a rare occasion

I've seen someone talk back to him and he shrivels up and becomes all apologetic. A few years ago, a woman guest snapped at him for not letting her answer his question, and he backed up and apologized profusely. Of course, I don't remember her name, as I doubt she was ever on his show again!

So Matthews keeps talking over people, asking questions he doesn't want answers to, and "great" now means mediocre OR "I'm sorry I'm such a dick, so I'll call you great on public television to make amends".

[Surya Gayatri]

129. And that's exactly why you see the same old

sycophantic "contributors" show after show.

Matthews knows he's not going to be broadsided by the likes of a Todd or a Halperin.

OTOH, Chris does have moments when his liberal bona fides show through--like in his rants during the Trayvon Martin scandal and his disgust with Rmoney's tactics, etc.

Gotta take the bad with the occasional better, I guess.

[PatSeg]

132. Yes, he does have his moments

He has no tolerance for all the birther crap and he will shut politicians down for answering in talking points now and then. I still find it hard to believe a person can be on television that many years and still have so little self-control though.

Also I'll never forget how many right-wing asses he kissed during the Bush years.

[Surya Gayatri]

135. He's out of control like a loud-mouth,

smart-ass teenager, sometimes. Amazing really...

And I feel the same way about his RW obsequiousness during the Bush years--not to mention his man-crush on "W".

He can never be totally trusted because his loyalties vacillate with the weather vane.

[PatSeg]

138. There a few people

who are on my "do not trust" list because of things they wrote and said during the Bush years. All of a sudden, that is all forgotten and they are moderates or liberals. People have such short memories.

I used to read Tom Friedman during his pro Iraq War phase and can't quite reconcile THAT Friedman with today's more reasonable, moderate Friedman.

I have a low tolerance for people who change with the political winds. One thing you can say for Dick Cheney though - he's as big an ass as he ever was! No hypocrisy there.

[Surya Gayatri]

144. Once a dick, always a dick! LOL!

[PatSeg]

147. That's for sure!

[CTyankee]

140. I think it is the result of great intelligence and a trained mind.

Being a Rhodes Scholar, Rachel had to do that sort of presentation. She would have had to present her data and make her resulting assumptions clearly and succinctly. Ah, the rigors of academia...

[Surya Gayatri]

145. Her mind is like a mouse trap wrapped in velvet.

You still get "caught", but it doesn't hurt as much. LOL!

[CTyankee]

146. We have to remember she teaches at Princeton. The Ivies are a pretty

tough lift. They don't cut too much slack for people. I think she knows that...

[Surya Gayatri]

150. Has Rachel ever taught at Princeton?

I didn't realize that.

In fact I was answering your post #140 where you were talking about Rachel!

Anyway, Rachel seems to me to have laser-like concentration and focus and an awesome capacity to synthesize.

[CTyankee]

151. sorry, I was talking about Harris Perry. Rachel is at that level, having gone to

Stanford and being a Rhodes Scholar.

I see Rachel and Melissa in the same light, but with different styles...

[ellenfl]

42. the issue for me is the 'cute' factor.

i wish mhp, rachel AND alex would dump the giggling (mhp & rachel) and cute nicknames (alex) and just be more serious. all three women are extremely smart but the cuteness factor undermines them, imo.

on a style note, i wish mhp would get a more becoming hairstyle.

ellen fl

[EFerrari]

47. Yep. It's like an apology for being smart or something. n/t

[PatSeg]

62. I think it is

It is something that my generation is so familiar with. Being smart for a woman back in the 60's and 70's was often a liability unless you could soften it with a fair amount of cuteness.

I don't think Rachel is exploiting the cuteness aspect though. Her laugh and sense of humor do not seem forced or staged at all. It just seems to be part of the whole package. Harris-Perry, however, appears to be trying too hard. When she first appeared on MSNBC, she came across as a well-informed, intelligent guest. The change appeared to happen after she did some successful fill-ins for Rachel.

[EFerrari]

63. My viewpoint is skewed

from graduate school where all kinds of smart women didn't tap dance for anyone.

[PatSeg]

66. And there was a time

when I thought Melissa Harris-Perry was that kind of smart woman.

[EFerrari]

67. Me, too. I wonder if she ever watches her own video.

Well, good luck to her. Busting through all those ceilings must change your priorities for better or worse.

[Surya Gayatri]

49. Yeah, they could all take some inspiration from

more experienced female journalists with more gravitas--e.g. Christiane Amanpour.

The trick is to keep their shows fast-paced and amusing, while still maintaining an intellectually credible content.

[Shankapotomus]

84. I don't think it undermines them

I think it is true to who they are...women. Asking them to repress that is, I think, unconsciously ceding ground to the patriarchal stereotype that there is something wrong with being a woman. As if it somehow lessens their political analysis because a male host wouldn't act that way.

[EFerrari]

89. Being a woman doesn't consign you to giggling and smirking and squeaking like a little girl

for eternity.

If I had a shot at helping Harris Perry out, I'd have her work on her breathing. Whatever pressure she's under, she's not breathing very well and that makes her uncomfortable to watch just as it pitches her voice 'way up, makes her expressions seem like grimaces and speeds up her speech because she doesn't have enough air to modulate.

[Amerigo Vespucci]

104. Alex Wagner: "An on our panel today, Steve ""The Kornackster" Kornacki"...

I did post a thread somewhere in the first week of Alex Wagner's show asking "Why does she have a show?"

Some of the responses were similar to this thread...she did solid segments, etc.

Since then, she's grown a lot, but the nicknames and the cuteness and such are still ever-present.

Ms. Harris Perry's style is a completely separate issue for me. It's not something I think works well for her, but that's completely removed from what I'm saying here. If she insisted on that Bo Derek look and toned down the "cute" / hyper garbage, her looks would continue to not matter to me.

She's just annoying. I'm running out of ways to say it. She just gets on my last good nerve and grinds until I change the channel.

[jillan]

43. I stopped watching her also - but for other reasons.

Her attitude gets on my nerves.

[PatSeg]

64. I guess that attitude

wasn't apparent when she was a guest on other shows. The person on Saturday and Sunday morning is a far cry from the Melissa Harris-Perry we've watched for years on MSNBC. It sometimes feels like her recent success has gone to her head and screwed up her priorities.

[Amerigo Vespucci]

99. That's what I'm saying

She was fine in her guest segments. Now that she has her own show, there are all of these hyper / "cute" bits that annoy the living hell out of me. On Saturday's show she opened with "And today I'm going to smoke a cigar, but you're going to have to watch the segment to find out why."

I didn't watch the segment to find out why.

[PatSeg]

103. Yes, that's the teaser I saw this weekend

and it certainly did not entice me to stay tuned. A while back she had an Easter egg gimmick that was like a game show. She has some really impressive guests on her show and I wonder how they feel about all the silliness. What's next, a cooking segment?

[PragmaticLiberal]

76. Elaborate please.

[kentuck]

52. I think MHP is trying to be what someone else thinks she should be...?

..instead of trying to be herself.

Instead of trying to be perky and fun, with pom-poms and cigars, perhaps she should be the intelligent and educated woman she truly is?

[tralala]

53. She has a lisp

It's really distracting. That lisp is all I can hear when I listen to her talk.

[CTyankee]

72. Tom Brokaw had and still has a distinct "baby talk 'r'" like Barbara Walters yet he is still

lionized, even after having comics make great fun of him.

It's different when you are a man, I guess...

[tralala]

77. Way to pull the gender card for no reason

[CTyankee]

112. but only if the shoe fits. If it doesn't, well and good!

[MineralMan]

56. I like watching her show.

I guess it's a personal preference.

[CTyankee]

57. I LOVE seeing all the smart, talented women, not the same old bloviating men...

sure, we're used to seeing a "man at the helm" but women have their own talents.

But I can understand that their youth and femininity can be a bit off putting...but after a while you might get to where you like the diversity and the refreshing, new outlook to things...

[EFerrari]

59. My problem with Harris Perry is not her gender, her youth or her femininity.

Nor is it in "diversity". It's in the annoying persona she has adopted for reasons best known to herself that is neither refreshing nor new.

ETA: Check out the video I put up in #51, where she was on a panel of heavyweights and stole the show w/o any forced cheeriness or any of the other shtick that smart women seem to feel compelled to put on when they go on venues like MSNBC. This is the same host before the Pod People got to her. lol

[Amerigo Vespucci]

98. Thank you, THANK you.

"My problem with Harris Perry is not her gender, her youth or her femininity. Nor is it in "diversity". It's in the annoying persona she has adopted for reasons best known to herself that is neither refreshing nor new."

That is basically the point I was making in my original post, and somehow...in classic DU General Discussion style...it's become fodder for accusing me of criticizing only women and trying to silence progressive voices. That's horseshit, utter HORSESHIT.

She's annoying. She has an annoying personality. It has nothing to do with...as you say...her "gender, her youth or her femininity." She's just frigging annoying.

The "War on Women" ain't happening in this thread, folks, and if it is, it didn't come from me.

[PatSeg]

109. Well

The majority of people on this thread seem to agree with you. We could easily come up with names of both men and women on television who are annoying - hmmm four men from MSNBC just popped in my head as I wrote that.

[Amerigo Vespucci]

111. It's not about people agreeing with me

I'm just looking for people to agree or disagree with what I wrote in the OP. When they pull an agenda out of their ass that has nothing to do with what I wrote, that's what I'm commenting on. That's where I call "bullshit."

[PatSeg]

114. Oh, I see

I know exactly what you're talking about. If people look hard enough for something, they're bound to find it. Its like they are listening to their own minds, rather than what someone else is saying.

I'm glad you started this thread. I had been trying to pinpoint why Harris-Perry was irritating me and I was finally starting to understand. Many of the comments here clarified it for me. I really have an obsessive need to know why I react negatively to someone.

[EFerrari]

124. She has an annoying personality on that show.

If you check out the video I put up (in 51 or 53, don't remember) she comes in at about 18:00 and I bet you will find that the annoying stuff isn't there.

[BiggJawn]

71. Uh-Oh...

Dissed One of Our Own.

The DU Lemming Troop will be here any time now with their Tru-Blu DU litmus paper to rub in your face...

[CTyankee]

73. Seems to me other "troops" have come trooping in, too!

just sayin'....

[BiggJawn]

80. Sorry, I forgot the first rule of DU...

Never talk about DU.

Second rule: Never criticize our Champions, for verily, they EARN their millions from the Glass Tit....

[Surya Gayatri]

92. A lot of posters on this thread, most DUers

of long standing, have given some timely but positive criticism of their liberal "Champions" (no sacred cows here).

There's your Second Rule shot down.

As for your BS First Rule, I can only deduce that you have yet to discover the Meta Discussion Forum. LOL!

[BiggJawn]

108. I really need to start using the "sarcasm" smiley more...

I really do.

[CTyankee]

94. I have never heard of the "Glass Tit." Can you explain to all of us what that is?

[BiggJawn]

106. Never?

Glass Tit=Television Set. So named because it has a front window made of glass (at least they USED to) and The People suck their intellectual nourishment from it.

Now do I have to explain to you what a TV set is?



Wheeeeeee! it's Teeeeee-Veeeeeee!

[CTyankee]

110. Thank you and I hope you feel better...

[BiggJawn]

115. You're welcome, seriously...

It never occurred to me that people wouldn't know what a "Glass Tit" was. It was from the same era as Newton Minow's "Vast Wasteland" speech, which would put it back in the 60's. Ye Olde Ancient Tymes, I guess.

A while back I was on a thread where I referred to Cannabis as "Boo". Nobody knew what I was talking about. Somebody asked why I thought they should smoke their boyfriend. I found the reference I was using in the Urban Dictionary, but I had to go back about 20 pages to find it. Another relic of another time, I guess.

I don't hear the term "Television Set" much anymore, it's usually "Flat Screen" or something like that. I've gotten blank looks from people when I mention a TV antenna, too.

[Honeycombe8]

95. I don't care for her. I find her somewhat irritating or something, for some reason. nt

[proverbialwisdom]

97. Unique & important segment here: http://video.msnbc.msn.com/melissa-harris-perry/47049927/#47049927

http://video.msnbc.msn.com/melissa-harris-perry/47049927/#47049927


MSNBC VIDEO (29:39) - Saturday, April 14

Actress Mira Sorvino, a Goodwill Ambassador, and Rachel Lloyd, executive director of Girls Educational Mentoring Services, join Melissa Harris Perry as they shine light on child sex-trafficking and the policies that criminalize the victims of the vicious cycle. Rev. Dr. Katherine Henderson and Liz McDougall, General Counsel for Village Voice Media, later enter the conversation as it shifts to the outrage against The Village Voice for its website, Backpage.com, that critics allege facilitates child sex-trafficking.

I haven't heard anything like it anywhere else. (Link from google via: http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002563238 )

[Amerigo Vespucci]

100. I'm not saying she can't do powerful segments...

...I'm saying she can't carry four hours on weekends via her own show.

There's a difference. Rachel Maddow did segments and made the leap to her own show, successfully. Harris Perry did segments and made the leap to her own show and ever since has provided the most annoying four hours of TV on any given week with occasional good segments.

Occasional good segments means that maybe she needs to go back to segments. Maybe her greatest strength is in producing good segments, not a two hour show of her own twice a week. That's all I'm saying, but somehow, it's not being heard.

[PatSeg]

105. I think she's capable to doing four hours of good segments

Last edited Mon May 28, 2012, 12:37 PM - Edit history (1)

Either she misunderstood what people expect of her or she is being poorly advised. With the type of guests she has on, she should be able to conduct an interesting, thought provoking show every weekend.

In comparison, two hours a day isn't nearly enough for Chris Hayes. The time just flies by and at the end, you are left wanting more. I get frustrated because it feels like there are so many commercials! I almost always feel smarter afterwards. His show reminds me a bit of some of the late night talk shows we used to watch in the 70's, very stimulating and informative.

[HipChick]

113. race have anything to do with it?

notice all the hosts you mentioned are black..


msnbc needs all the new blood it can find

[Amerigo Vespucci]

120. Sweet FUCKING Jesus, NO...race has nothing to do with it.

Finney and Henderson were the first two "wild card" segment guests who came to mind who don't have their own shows. HEY! Let's give Toure a show of his own! Except he's twice as annoying as Melissa! OOOOOPS! I mentioned a man. And an African American man. Looks like another 50 people are going to pile on and ask "Did you mention Toure because he has a penis? Did you mention Toure because his penis is black? I noticed that you mentioned Toure, who is black. I'll bet you don't like Reverend Al either (even though I have about 200 DU threads high-fiving Reverend Al. SOME ONE is going to ask if I dislike him because he's black, and I don't like Toure, so that means I must hate all black men.

FOR THE LAST MOTHERFUCKING TIME:

1). This thread is NOT about the fact that Melissa Harris Perry is black.

2). This thread is NOT about the fact that Melissa Harris Perry is a woman.

3). This thread is NOT about my desire to "silence a much needed progressive voice."

If you need for me to bring out the fucking sock puppets to drive the point home, just let me know. Somehow stating the explicit purpose and intention of this thread has resulted in an exercise similar to pissing in the wind and I'm afraid I'm all out of piss.

ON EDIT: Have a nice day.

[Surya Gayatri]

123. See my post just below, Amerigo. Don't let

the hit and run posters push your blood pressure up.

Obviously, they didn't bother to read the thread--just stopped in for a little quick, ill-informed sniping.

[Surya Gayatri]

121. No, race is not an issue and neither is gender. Chris Hayes's

and even Rachel's respective delivery styles are critiqued as well. And other black hosts are praised. Cf:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002732795#post24

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002732795#post12

[ProgressiveEconomist]

143. IMO, yes AND no. MSNBC IMO is like an eclectic music radio station

It has had for some time now Rock (Rachel Maddow), Oldies (Chris Mathews), and Country (Ed Shultz). But in recent years it has added Classical (Chris Hayes), R&B (Al Sharpton), and Hip-Hop (Alex Wagner).

Now MSNBC has added MHP, a show quite different from all the others.

For some who resist change and want everything homogenized to their particular taste, MHP may sound discordant. But IMO MHP just has a style different from what many MSNBC viewers have become accustomed to. Intellectual Black Feminism is something millions of Caucasians NEVER have encountered before. IMO if they are truly eclectic, they'll eventually come to accept it. Or they can just turn it off.

Who was it who said, "whenever people say RACE has nothing to do with it, race ALWAYS has something to do with it?" IMO, not liking MHP's style doesn't necessarily make you a racist. But it SHOULD make you ask yourself WHY you don't like MHP.

[CTyankee]

148. Ya know, I'm not black, but I ask myself the same question...

Give the woman a chance, fer chrissakes! I LOVE her guests. Fresh voices, new minds. C'mon folks, we need her and the forces she can marshal on behalf of our progressive agenda!

[limpyhobbler]

126. I think MHP is awesome. Love that show. Hope they keep it just the same.

Wouldn't change a thing.

[AtomicKitten]

128. I think MHP is lovely and her delivery charming.

She's a great addition to the MSNBC lineup IMO.

[retread]

141. I find her intelligent and worth spending some effort to listen to what she has to say. I've

never noticed a problem with her "delivery".

I can watch polished, slick, professional deliveries filled with lies and crap every time I turn on the TV.

Her writings and her tv show have shown her to be a woman of substance. Many times her point-of-view
is something I had not considered before. On more than one occasion she has caused me to rethink an
initial reaction.

[ProgressiveEconomist]

142. I think it's GREAT so many white DUers dislike MHP. This shows she's doing her job--

Unlike Fox "News", which has way less than 2 percent Black viewership, MSNBC's audience is more than 20 percent African-American, and climbing.

IMO, MHP's and Al Sharpton's shows appeal disproportionately to this segment of MSNBC's audience, although they draw hundreds of thousands of truly progressive Caucasians too.

MHP's and Sharpton's shows are quite different from the rest of MSNBC's lineup. They draw disproportionately on Black journalists, and especially feature lengthy discussions with journalists from NBC's Black arm, TheGriot.

IMO, unlike most of the posters in this GD thread, the vast majority of MHP's intended audience LOVES her cornrows and her outspoken intellectual Black feminist slant on the news, even though they may be disconcerting to many other MSNBC viewers.

IMO this GD thread demonstrates that many white DUers notice the difference between MHP and the rest of the MSNBC lineup and feel disturbed by it. They don't see themselves reflected in MHP and most of her guests.

IMO this explains why so many more have posted here against MHP than ever posted against Pat Buchanan. MHP has been put on MSNBC for the same reason Pay Buchanan was put out to pasture, and IMO MHP is doing an EXCELLENT job.

If you don't like her show, maybe it's because MHP and Sharpton are not meant for you, unlike the other 95 percent of of MSNBC's programming.

[Tarheel_Dem]

153. Funny you should mention her cornrows. I thought her show this weekend was phenomenal,

where she discussed black women's hair with Ari Nicole Parker. I think she even mentioned that her own hairstyle (cornrows) had been a source of discussion, and not all of it was good. I love MHP, and the many guests that I'd never heard of before. I think a host can listen to, and internalize so many criticisms that they wind up pleasing no one.

[boppers]

149. Who, what, and who cares?

I just scanned the thread, and I guess she's "talent" for some morning news show, has braids, and is a black female?

Seriously, is DU so freaking sexist and vapid that they care about a woman's "appearance", or "delivery", when reading the news?

WTF?

"Oh, that Walter Cronkite, his delivery style is sooo grating, and what's with his hair?"

If you have no idea what I mean, the US was different before the 80's.

[nofurylike]

152. Professor Harris-Perry is brilliant, and i am able to handle that

she has reasons for doing her show her way. i look forward to understanding those more as i see more of her show.

i am surprised by the cornrow comments. do you not find those offensive?

definitely ...