For the Record, I think they hacked Brexit too.

[LaydeeBug]

I think they're in the process of hacking Germany.

And to be clear, I think they have fucked with, are in the process of fucking with, and are continuing to plan to fuck with VOTING MACHINES, etc.

I think there has been a coordinated effort from them for quite some time. I don't *just* think they had some operatives here, but hosted some of us there (Manafort, et al) I think DU was just a part of it (the hack)

We will not overcome the way they cheat if we only ever talk about it in the past tense.

Do NOT let them frame the fucking narrative.

[nini]

1. That wouldn't surprise me one bit

They were a bit stunned that passed too.

[onenote]

2. Hacked Brexit in what way?

The vote there was done entirely with paper ballots.

[LaydeeBug]

3. and NEVER has there been ballot box stuffing...NEVER. It NEVER happens

and they had NOTHING to do with any malfeasance this time around.

Nothing whatsoever.

[onenote]

7. So the Russians snuck in and stuffed the ballot boxes in Britain?

Anything to back up that claim?

How paper ballots are counted in the UK:http://theconversation.com/explainer-how-britain-counts-its-votes-41265

[LaydeeBug]

8. Oh, HOLY FUCK, here we go again...

Last edited Sun Jan 15, 2017, 02:00 PM - Edit history (1)

This is a discussion board. This is not the "I have to prove something to you because you think I need to stifle my speech (or in this case, post) to suit YOUR spite. I don't. I'd love to see our machines examined...by now, the chain of command would muddy it though, wouldn't it? But I digress...

There is a dichotomy going on here at DU:

1) One one hand, we're an anonymous bunch of activists, too small to make an difference, and certainly not important enough for the Russians to hack on election day

2) On the other, we aren't supposed to say 'VOTING MACHINES WERE HACKED' because our influence is so vast that it might dissuade people from voting and adversely effect our credibility.

[hardluck]

11. Poor persecuted soul

Being asked to provide any facts to support your assertion. And on a discussion board! So do you have anything to support your assumption besides your feelings?

[LaydeeBug]

15. welcome to du

[Alekzander]

12. Excellent point you just made there LaydeeBug.

[LaydeeBug]

56. Thank you very much. nt

[onenote]

21. the best way to undermine our credibility is to make foolish claims

and claiming that the Russians hacked the Brexit vote is a foolish claim.

[LaydeeBug]

53. shit. wait till you find out that I think they did down ballot shit too

see post #45.

Because this really is getting crazy.

[onenote]

66. You're good at non-sequiturs. I'll give you that much.

[ProudProgressiveNow]

48. +1 nt

[Generic Brad]

24. It's about who counts the votes , not who makes the vote

The most vulnerable point in the election process is in the tabulation of the votes. Our machines are probably not hacked. But I would bet dollars to donuts that the vote counting/reporting process has been compromised in many key places.

[milestogo]

46. That's what Joseph Stalin said.

It is enough that the people know there was an election. The people who cast the votes decide nothing. The people who count the votes decide everything.

[BlueCaliDem]

4. Cheating and stealing is what KGB IS good at, and Putin was KGB. It's what he does.

It comes naturally to him.

He cheats and steals from his own people in order to amass his whopping $200 billion dollar fortune within 17 yrs, so why should any intelligent country believe he wouldn't do the same in elections in countries that defy his sense of entitlement to rule the world?

Of course he was involved in Brexit - just as he's involved in Calexit. He clearly schemes to divide and conquer the world who dared to unite against his god-given right to oppress it...and murdering his dissenters isn't above him, as we well know.

[LaydeeBug]

10. This!!! They made the shadows their business.

[BlueCaliDem]

16. You're so correct, MiLadeeBug. So correct! eom

[kimbutgar]

5. I fantasize that a video or memo will emerge this week showing they hacked the election for

The rethugs and thump. I know it is a dream but remember that 47% video that did in Romney. Someone out there has this video, email or memo detailing what they did.

[triron]

6. Breitbart already

producing fake news in Germany.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/jan/07/german-police-quash-breitbart-story-of-mob-setting-fire-to-dortmund-church

[deminks]

9. Nigel Farage, the smiling asshole.

Fanboy of Putin and the Orange Menace. Has been here on several occasions supporting the orange dumbass and basking in his Brexit lies.


I think he and le Pen carry Putin's 'greetings' when they are here.

Yes, they hacked the Brexit vote to weaken NATO/EU. Yes, they did it here, but got an absolute criminally insane zombie installed. Yes, they are working in France, Germany, and Sweden to do the same thing.

[onenote]

22. You seem certain that the Russians hacked the Brexit vote

care to share your ideas about how they did it?

[LaydeeBug]

25. You seem certain everything was hunky dory...

care to share your ideas on that?

[onenote]

27. I already posted a link to how votes are counted in Britain

So I think the ball is in your court.

[Baitball Blogger]

13. So, the USA turned out to be the weakest link?

[LaydeeBug]

39. Why frame the narrative like that?

[Alekzander]

14. You are correct which is why Germany is doing all they can or

everything in their power to prevent it from happening.

They at least are ahead of where we were before our election.

[deaniac21]

17. Sigh....

[NobodyHere]

18. Infowars is that way

[MFM008]

19. All this is done

Imo.
Through swaying public opinion through fake news. Lies. Etc.
Getting public fearful especially of immigrants/foreigners, BUT they will mess with votes if possible.
And I mean republicans.

[KamaAina]

20. You don't say!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10028447082

[LaydeeBug]

26. Damn!!!

[Blue_Warrior]

23. How do you 'hack' paper ballots?

What is your theory ?

[LaydeeBug]

28. Oh, *I'M* sorry...is there a semantics problem for you?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/12512672454

[Blue_Warrior]

29. Oh dear...

Okay, sorry for asking.

[melman]

30. That's not semantics

It's a legitimate question. Why not try answering it?

[Dr Hobbitstein]

31. That poster doesn't deal in facts or truths.

Baseless bullshit, yeah. But actual facts? None.

[LaydeeBug]

67. and yet, here you are

Hey. Thank for the kick!

[LaydeeBug]

38. No, it's semantics indeed. Ballot boxes can be stuffed

but I am SURE you knew that. Remember the South Carolina field office vandalized? It had completed ballots in it.

I've worked campaigns in earnest since 1986. EACH. one. You're not going to tell me that shit can't be done.

Thanks.

[melman]

50. Okay

So let's hear the theory then. How'd they do it?

[muriel_volestrangler]

44. Yes, there is a semantics problem

Because ballot box stuffing is not normally called 'hacking'.

The Brexit vote was at the Leave end of what the pre-referendum polls expected, pretty much all over the country. To change 50% to 52%, they'd have had to get extra votes in hundreds of locations. If Russia could organise that without a trace, they'd have such control over the whole country that they'd already be the government.

[LaydeeBug]

49. again..shenanigans...something afoot...not *just* hacking emails and disinfo...

This is getting to be like hair splitting.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/12512672454

[muriel_volestrangler]

70. The thing is, it's really just a complete guess on your part

In the US election, we have an actual action by Russia - a literal hacking of emails, and sending them to Wikileaks, who published them (and their publishing of the Podesta emails, day by day, was designed to make it look as though they were a problem, even though there was nothing significant in them).

There is no equivalent action in the Brexit vote - no 'unknown player' doing something for the Leave campaign. There was plenty of bullshit, by it was said openly by British politicians.

If the only way you can describe it is as 'shenanigans' or 'something afoot', it's useless, frankly.

[Denzil_DC]

62. Well, yeah.

And the opinion polling since has been pretty much in line with what you'd expect if the actual vote was accurate - right down to Scotland, Northern Ireland and a few other regions being for some unfathomable reason immune from this "hacking".

I think we've had far more productive post mortem discussions on the UK forum about what actually happened to bring about the result.

Which may mean, down the line, we have a quarter of a chance of addressing those issues.

[Dr Hobbitstein]

32. More bullshit.

Do you ever tire of being wrong.

Hacked a paper ballot. Laughable.

[LaydeeBug]

41. More bullshit indeed.

Do you ever tire of it?

***And yet you said you'd leave me alone***

[Dr Hobbitstein]

55. I said no such thing.

And anytime I see someone spouting bullshit with no basis in reality, I call them out.

You keep spouting off baseless conspiracy theories and when you're presented with facts, you cover your ears like a child who doesn't want to listen.

You post bullshit, I WILL call you out.

So, Russia hacked Brexit? Fucking prove it.

[LaydeeBug]

68. Oh. Ok. You said no such thing. I *invented* it, like a conspiracy theory

Baseless.

Never happened.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10028458577#post136

[Dr Hobbitstein]

69. I was talking about in THAT thread where you were spouting off baseless

bullshit conspiracy theories as well. The same thread where you were presented with facts that disproved your theory and you plugged your ears like a child. Same with this thread, too. I'm seeing a pattern.

You say you want discussion? That's not true at all. You post bullshit, someone says "hey, that's bullshit" and then you start attacking them and crying victim. Your shtick is obvious and you're detracting from the real issues being discussed on this message board. If you want to post your nutter theories, then use the Creative Speculation forum.

[pintobean]

57. You mean, like, with an ax?

[Dr Hobbitstein]

59. Ha!

Russians, armed with axes, rushed in and hacked the paper vote in the UK while no one was looking because tinfoil.

[roamer65]

33. I think Farage and UKIP are Kremlin funded.

MI6 should be investigating it. If they are, then the referendum is invalid.

[dalton99a]

64. Nigel Farage brands EU 'MORE DANGEROUS' than Russia

http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/753200/Nigel-Farage-LBC-EU-dangerous-Britain-Russia

[KittyWampus]

34. Your constant posting of conspiracy theories make DU look like a fake news site.

The Far Right in all western Democracies are getting help from Russia. But there was no need for ballot stuffing.

You seem to think that if a population does something stupid as a result of propaganda, it's got to be vote flipping or ballot box stuffing.

The pre-vote showed it was almost an even split on Brexit.

[JI7]

43. yup. And it takes away from issues we have actual info on and need

To be explained.

[LaydeeBug]

52. see post #45

[LaydeeBug]

45. Your constant insisting that we are a news site when we are a discussion board is weird, frankly

And I want to be clear here: There was a coordinated effort that included all of those things...not any one specific for the enchilada.

Lest you forget the South Carolina office that was vandalized had completed ballots in it.

Pretending this bizarre dichotomy exists wherein we are some news site, and we are a completely irrelevant and too little to be hacked ourselves on that day.

I have worked elections since 1986.

It'd be nice not to face a double standard when I DISCUSS them

[ProudProgressiveNow]

51. +1 nt

[etherealtruth]

36. i have no idea if they hacked the vote ... but, they sure engaged in the same ....

... disinformation they utilized here.

Apparently the British fall for the same garbage the folk in the US did

[Denzil_DC]

37. I'm a Brit. I'd like to see some evidence of this hacking if you have it.

Because without it, this is just not a plausible assertion. And if it were, I'd be all ears, believe me.

Now exercising covert (or not so covert) influence is another matter. We know a whole lot about the moneyed interests that swayed a number of people to vote for Brexit. They're largely in plain sight, and have run some powerful UK media outlets for years. There's no need for conspiracy theories to account for that.

[LaydeeBug]

47. Do I need to PROVE something to you for me to have a thought?

Funny that.

[Denzil_DC]

54. Well, it's a discussion board.

People post news and opinions, and others quite often ask them where that news or that opinion came from if they haven't made it clear. Seems an innocuous invitation to provide evidence to me.

And since last I looked, 21 people had reced your assertion, maybe one of them could chip in and explain why they agree with your assertion.

Because, I'm afraid, unless you're holding out for some reason, you appear to have no basis for it.

[LaydeeBug]

60. Please see post #8

[Denzil_DC]

65. I already saw it on my way down.

I apologize for mistakenly assuming you wanted a discussion about it on a discussion board.

[brooklynite]

40. Unsupported conspiracy theories belong in CREATIVE SPECULATION

[BooScout]

42. As someone living in the UK...you could not be more wrong...

There was no way in hell the vote on Brexit was hacked. Not with paper ballots and the number of checks in place to assure that something like that just can't happen.

Brexit happened because theirs a helluva lot of ignorant, scared, racist, xenophobes that live here in the UK, just like in the States.

[AnotherMother4Peace]

58. our voting machines have been proven to be vulnerable. probably child's play to the Russians.

[ananda]

61. I guess they're biking ..

.. to protect women from the rapists on stage.

[tammywammy]

63. This belongs in creative speculation not GD. n/t

[cwydro]

71. Um what?

Oh, never mind.