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DonViejo

(60,536 posts)
Sun Mar 12, 2017, 12:16 PM Mar 2017

Ryan: Number Who Will Lose Health Coverage Under Repeal Is 'Up To People'

Source: Talking Points Memo



By ESME CRIBB Published MARCH 12, 2017, 11:57 AM EDT

House Speaker Paul Ryan (R-WI) said on Sunday that he can't say how many people will lose health coverage under the Republican bill to repeal the Affordable Care Act, as it's "up to people" to acquire coverage "if they want it."

"The one thing I'm certain will happen is CBO will say, well, gosh, not as many people will get coverage. You know why? Because this isn't a government mandate," Ryan told ABC's John Dickerson. "You get it if you want it. That's freedom."

"How many people are going to lose coverage?" Dickerson asked.

"I can't answer that question. It's up to people," Ryan said. "People are going to do what they want to do with their lives."

Read more: http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/paul-ryan-number-who-will-lose-coverage-up-to-people

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Ryan: Number Who Will Lose Health Coverage Under Repeal Is 'Up To People' (Original Post) DonViejo Mar 2017 OP
God how I hate that smarmy little jerk! Chasstev365 Mar 2017 #1
and his horrible janterry Mar 2017 #6
He is under the misapprehension that he is "cute." WinkyDink Mar 2017 #46
+1 narnian60 Mar 2017 #31
Typical Republican sociopathy. dalton99a Mar 2017 #2
"You get it if you want it"? The Velveteen Ocelot Mar 2017 #3
"Freedom's just another word for nothin' left to lose....." WinkyDink Mar 2017 #47
+1 Phoenix61 Mar 2017 #67
I wish people would kick Ryan's sorry ass out of office in 2018 n2doc Mar 2017 #4
Gerrymandered districts in Wi. Scarsdale Mar 2017 #15
Congress should get no better insurance than they offer all. Alice11111 Mar 2017 #53
"it's up to the people" LakeArenal Mar 2017 #5
Coward Scarsdale Mar 2017 #17
The truth is Desert grandma Mar 2017 #7
Ryan isn't stupid; he full well knows this. He simply doesn't care. Ryan is all about the Uber- WinkyDink Mar 2017 #48
he's a revolting excuse Faux pas Mar 2017 #8
Lyin' Ryan the Social Security moocher: I got mine...F*CK the rest y'all Submariner Mar 2017 #9
I agree with Paul Krugman NastyRiffraff Mar 2017 #10
So the millions who had Medicaid coverage or heavily subsidized insurance subterranean Mar 2017 #11
Here we go again with the undeserving poor bullshit. Blue Idaho Mar 2017 #12
Exactly Scarsdale Mar 2017 #20
This is a little dated, but the situation has not fundamentally changed since it was published... Moostache Mar 2017 #63
Those at the bottom being single mom's.... LakeArenal Mar 2017 #22
Those children they were so insistent be born. BarbaRosa Mar 2017 #59
+1 Yes but they are children now and none a fetus anymore so they no longer care about them lunasun Mar 2017 #62
Republican "freedom" at its finest ProfessorPlum Mar 2017 #13
More importantly, they are free to not give a damn. LakeArenal Mar 2017 #23
Yes, this! What a contortion of the freedom concept. JudyM Mar 2017 #39
To Sum Up :,,,,, Cryptoad Mar 2017 #14
... and Iphones Dorn Mar 2017 #21
I once heard a gop say "95% of poor have refrigerators" LakeArenal Mar 2017 #25
I can get an iPhone for $27 a month... Blue Idaho Mar 2017 #35
There was a documentary on a ship sinking Turbineguy Mar 2017 #16
More Blame The Victim DallasNE Mar 2017 #18
Ryan said. "People are going to do what they want to do with their lives." aka DIE Dorn Mar 2017 #19
Yes! That's what I want to do with my life as well. Defund all the LuckyLib Mar 2017 #26
Bullshit -- there is a mandate in the AHCA -- you pay a 30% premium surcharge for a year progree Mar 2017 #24
What complicated BS -- and of course the insurance companies come out on top. LuckyLib Mar 2017 #28
Great point: ACA: the fine goes to the U.S. Treasury. AHCA: the fine goes to the insurance company progree Mar 2017 #32
Why can't Dickerson then ask: JDC Mar 2017 #27
Blame the victim Blue Idaho Mar 2017 #36
+1000 harun Mar 2017 #69
LOL "freedom" - yeah Kimchijeon Mar 2017 #29
"Free market" economics is Ryan's religion. The Velveteen Ocelot Mar 2017 #30
+1 dalton99a Mar 2017 #43
+1 Beartracks Mar 2017 #57
Translation: "I don't care what happens to you." nt neeksgeek Mar 2017 #33
That statement is just inane. sinkingfeeling Mar 2017 #34
the old let them eat cake attitude conservatives have for America.... beachbum bob Mar 2017 #37
I want to smack him. Solly Mack Mar 2017 #38
Paul Ryan is a fucking scumbag. nt TeamPooka Mar 2017 #40
Once again, Republican Jesus proves money is the focus. sarcasmo Mar 2017 #41
Ryan, like Scrooge in the Christmas Carol, PatrickforO Mar 2017 #42
Disgusting jerk gademocrat7 Mar 2017 #44
So basically, to R's, health insurance is a commodity, even a luxury item. Buy it or don't! WinkyDink Mar 2017 #45
You can hear Ryan in the gym sayin" I f@@ked those sick people good. Hey bro can you spot me?" bronxiteforever Mar 2017 #49
Randian a-hole. nt Cognitive_Resonance Mar 2017 #50
It's up to you, Jim Bob. You can spend your $12,000 on a house for the family to live in or you Vinca Mar 2017 #51
"It's up to people" Kimchijeon Mar 2017 #52
"The people have no bread." --- "Let them eat cake!" tblue37 Mar 2017 #54
Let's do away with police and fire departments, too. Leave it up to people... Beartracks Mar 2017 #55
SoylentCare: It's Up to People. Beartracks Mar 2017 #56
I wonder who Pope Francis had in mind when he said "better to be an atheist than a hypocritical still_one Mar 2017 #58
Wow. Just wow. Very compassionate to the people who can't pay for it. nt Honeycombe8 Mar 2017 #60
aka "fuck you if you don't like our plan". nt Javaman Mar 2017 #61
What an insufferable little prick he is. emmadoggy Mar 2017 #64
Ryan: Number Who Will Lose Health Coverage Under Repeal Is 'Up To People' mdbl Mar 2017 #65
This Idea RobinA Mar 2017 #66
"You get it if you want it. That's freedom...People are going to do what they want to do with their WinkyDink Mar 2017 #68
Might as well go full Monty...do away with speed limits and age of consent and SticksnStones Mar 2017 #70
 

janterry

(4,429 posts)
6. and his horrible
Sun Mar 12, 2017, 12:31 PM
Mar 2017

little 'gotcha' smirk.
I don't know who he cares about - but it sure isn't his constituency.

dalton99a

(81,065 posts)
2. Typical Republican sociopathy.
Sun Mar 12, 2017, 12:23 PM
Mar 2017

Freedom? Republicans love to FORCE Americans to shift money to the rich.

The Velveteen Ocelot

(115,276 posts)
3. "You get it if you want it"?
Sun Mar 12, 2017, 12:27 PM
Mar 2017

So if you want health insurance you get it because that's "freedom"? In other words you're free to pay whatever the insurance company charges, and you're also free to pay your mortgage and buy food and utilities and gas for your car, which might be more than you earn, but then you're free to choose which of those things not to pay for in order to have insurance, or else you could freely choose not to have insurance so you can freely choose to heat your house or feed your kids? Is that how "freedom" works?

I wish I were religious so I could have some reasonable assurance that Ryan might fry in Hell someday.

n2doc

(47,953 posts)
4. I wish people would kick Ryan's sorry ass out of office in 2018
Sun Mar 12, 2017, 12:28 PM
Mar 2017

It would be almost as satisfying as seeing Trump impeached.

Scarsdale

(9,426 posts)
15. Gerrymandered districts in Wi.
Sun Mar 12, 2017, 01:20 PM
Mar 2017

How many in office will sign up for this great plan, and give up their Cadillac insurance?? Ryan is bought and paid for by insurance companies. He met with them, before hawking his power point shitshow. We should DEMAND that the politicians HAVE to be offered the same choices as citizens. Ryan should remember his side kick, Eric Cantor. He was as arrogant as Ryan, and he lost his election. Would LOVE for this to happen to slimy Ryan.

Alice11111

(5,730 posts)
53. Congress should get no better insurance than they offer all.
Sun Mar 12, 2017, 06:06 PM
Mar 2017

Actually, W Buffet said that would quickly fix the system.

I always look up Ryan's opponents to see if there is anyone worth giving my peanuts to, but he has drawn the weakest ever. Add gerrymandering to that.... I saw this morning that Texas just got in trouble for gerrymandering. It is gerrymandered so bad that Austin elects Republicans. It was west Texas that was in trouble. God, that is one of the most conservative spots on the planet. I don't live in Texas thankfully, in over 30 years.

Obama and Eric Holder are going to focus enegy on the gerrymandering problem. Given their prior experience, if anyone can do anything, they can.

I can't even look at or hear Ryan, DT, or Turtleman.

For awhile, when Obama was in, the Repubs were saying throw out Obamacare, and we want the same insurance as Congress. How short their memories.

LakeArenal

(28,728 posts)
5. "it's up to the people"
Sun Mar 12, 2017, 12:30 PM
Mar 2017

The corporate "people" of Citizens United.

Ryan just had a town hall in his hometown that he did not attend. The "people" there wanted to talk about this very subject.

Scarsdale

(9,426 posts)
17. Coward
Sun Mar 12, 2017, 01:22 PM
Mar 2017

Wisconsin is doing away with gerrymandering districts, so maybe he will be out next time. People are finally seeing him for what he really is -bought and paid for.

Desert grandma

(802 posts)
7. The truth is
Sun Mar 12, 2017, 12:32 PM
Mar 2017

many people will lose coverage because THEY CAN'T AFFORD IT! Not because they don't want it. The lack of compassion amazes me. Joy Reid said yesterday that the Republican ideology is that healthy people should not have to pay for sick people. What the heck do those Ayn Rand morons on the right think insurance is????

 

WinkyDink

(51,311 posts)
48. Ryan isn't stupid; he full well knows this. He simply doesn't care. Ryan is all about the Uber-
Sun Mar 12, 2017, 04:33 PM
Mar 2017

Last edited Wed Mar 15, 2017, 11:54 AM - Edit history (1)

mensch.

subterranean

(3,427 posts)
11. So the millions who had Medicaid coverage or heavily subsidized insurance
Sun Mar 12, 2017, 01:02 PM
Mar 2017

will just go out and buy a $5,000-a-year insurance plan that they can't afford to use because it has a $10,000 deductible, right? And if they don't, well, that's because they didn't "want" it. (Maybe they decided it was more important to pay the heating bill or buy food for their families.) Meanwhile, Paul Ryan and other members of Congress will get a gold-plated plan paid for by we the taxpayers.

Blue Idaho

(4,988 posts)
12. Here we go again with the undeserving poor bullshit.
Sun Mar 12, 2017, 01:17 PM
Mar 2017

This is so Victorian... carving up those in need into the deserving and undeserving poor. Making it palatable to not care about those at the bottom. Just like Chaffetz's iPhone garbage. Blame the poor for being poor - in the world of Ayn Rand disciples (and how sad is that) we have the opposite of charitable thought. Instead of "feed the poor" we have feed the rich and fuck the rest.

After all - in the minds of the GOP the poor have no one to blame but themselves.

Scarsdale

(9,426 posts)
20. Exactly
Sun Mar 12, 2017, 01:29 PM
Mar 2017

The poor should have run for office, then taken bribes from all the lobbyists who take them out to eat. I want an investigation in to how these sob's all end up millionaires, or multi-millionaires when they are ready to retire, and STILL take a pension and healthcare from the real workers. Blood suckers, who have the GALL to denigrate anyone who finds themselves in a position to need food stamps, or welfare. Entitled creeps, who forget where they came from.

Moostache

(9,895 posts)
63. This is a little dated, but the situation has not fundamentally changed since it was published...
Mon Mar 13, 2017, 01:15 PM
Mar 2017
The median net worth of a member of Congress was $1,029,505 in 2013 — a 2.5 percent increase from 2012 — compared with an average American household’s median net worth of $56,355. Once again, the majority of members of Congress are millionaires — 271 of the 533 members currently in office, or 50.8 percent.


https://www.opensecrets.org/news/2015/01/one-member-of-congress-18-american-households-lawmakers-personal-finances-far-from-average/

Cryptoad

(8,254 posts)
14. To Sum Up :,,,,,
Sun Mar 12, 2017, 01:18 PM
Mar 2017

"If those Lazy ass Poor People would quit buying food to eat they could buy some shitty Health Insurance!"

LakeArenal

(28,728 posts)
25. I once heard a gop say "95% of poor have refrigerators"
Sun Mar 12, 2017, 01:35 PM
Mar 2017

The absurdity. Poor with refrigerators, when they have nothing to put in it..

Blue Idaho

(4,988 posts)
35. I can get an iPhone for $27 a month...
Sun Mar 12, 2017, 02:14 PM
Mar 2017

Even cheaper if I "settle" for last year's model. Someone explain to these snobs that it's pretty damn difficult to get and keep a job without a phone, a car, and a roof over your head.

Turbineguy

(37,206 posts)
16. There was a documentary on a ship sinking
Sun Mar 12, 2017, 01:21 PM
Mar 2017

where the Captain said "Once I order 'abandon ship', I can leave. If people want to stay, they can stay!"

DallasNE

(7,392 posts)
18. More Blame The Victim
Sun Mar 12, 2017, 01:26 PM
Mar 2017

That seems to be all that the Republicans know. And it comes across like fingernails on a chalk board.

?oh=091245317f459d4f8b6aa55d61f6cbb4&oe=596081B7

Dorn

(520 posts)
19. Ryan said. "People are going to do what they want to do with their lives." aka DIE
Sun Mar 12, 2017, 01:28 PM
Mar 2017

Can I do what I want with my life and not pay for all the wars ?

LuckyLib

(6,814 posts)
26. Yes! That's what I want to do with my life as well. Defund all the
Sun Mar 12, 2017, 01:36 PM
Mar 2017

Republican agenda items.

Welcome to DU!

progree

(10,864 posts)
24. Bullshit -- there is a mandate in the AHCA -- you pay a 30% premium surcharge for a year
Sun Mar 12, 2017, 01:35 PM
Mar 2017

Last edited Sun Mar 12, 2017, 02:50 PM - Edit history (1)

Similary the ACA -- you pay a fine, but otherwise there is no other sanction. So either they both have mandates (because you are financially penalized for not having insurance), or they both don't. I just hate the double-talk:

"There's no mandate in our plan, you just pay a fine" (same as Obamacare actually but they call that a mandate, because, well, that's politics).

Obamacare vs. the Republican plan — for those thinking of skipping health insurance (confirms that under AHCA, insurance companies can charge 30% extra premium for 12 months) MarketWatch, 3/8/17

The current penalty for not having insurance — either through Obamacare or an employer — is $695 per adult and $347.50 per child, or 2.5% of total household adjusted gross income, whatever’s larger.

For the median-earning household, that 2.5% fine is about $1,375. It is prorated, however. That is, if you’re uncovered for half the year, the fine is half.

Under the House Republican plan, the insurer is allowed to charge a 30% surcharge, for 12 months, on those who signed up without demonstrating continuous coverage beforehand. The average premium of a so-called bronze plan under Obamacare runs to about $350 per month, or $4,200 a year. So that’s a $1,260 surcharge to join late in the year before, say, a heart procedure.

Here’s the apples-to-apples of skipping 10 months insurance (and for argument sake, we’re skipping the grace periods in both). Under Obamacare, it’s $1,845 (10 months of fine, two months of insurance) and under the Republican plan, it’s $1,960.

But skipping, say, 22 months of coverage, is where the Republican plan pays off — $3,220 in fines plus cost of coverage for Obamacare, vs. $1,960 under the GOP plan. (Depends on your definition of "pays off", but that's a whole 'nuther 3 paragraphs -Progree)

More: http://www.marketwatch.com/story/the-economics-of-skipping-health-care-insurance-under-both-obamacare-and-the-republican-plan-2017-03-07


It says "the House Republican plan would deter hopping on and off insurance, since each time, the insurer gets a big one-time payment".

Ummm. On the other hand, Trumpcare is an incentive to go several years without coverage, since there is no extra penalty for being uncovered for a long time. Whereas the ACA, the penalty is proportional to the amount of time you are uncovered, and you pay it each year. I think the ACA is a more effective incentive that way.


LuckyLib

(6,814 posts)
28. What complicated BS -- and of course the insurance companies come out on top.
Sun Mar 12, 2017, 01:39 PM
Mar 2017

Yet another reason for single payer.

progree

(10,864 posts)
32. Great point: ACA: the fine goes to the U.S. Treasury. AHCA: the fine goes to the insurance company
Sun Mar 12, 2017, 01:54 PM
Mar 2017
Since the money from the {AHCA} penalty would go to the insurance companies, the rule does not affect tax receipts for the federal government like the ACA's current individual mandate, in which the penalty is paid to the IRS.


(which in turn helps pay for the premium subsidies and the excess out-of-pocket cost subsidies, just to name two of the many benefits of the ACA -Progree)

Source: Trying to force a giraffe through a keyhole': An obscure Senate rule could kill the GOP's Obamacare replacement (The Byrd Rule), Business Insider, 3/10/17
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/trying-force-giraffe-keyhole-obscure-154016346.html

By the way that article is a great read -- pretty much no way will the 30% penalty meet the Senate's Byrd Rule and so the AHCA won't qualify for reconciliation (where only a 50% majority is needed to pass it)

JDC

(10,081 posts)
27. Why can't Dickerson then ask:
Sun Mar 12, 2017, 01:39 PM
Mar 2017

How many will lose coverage that do want it?

Ryan is trying to spin the loss of coverage to people choosing NOT to have coverage, and the media let's it go at face value.

Kimchijeon

(1,606 posts)
29. LOL "freedom" - yeah
Sun Mar 12, 2017, 01:46 PM
Mar 2017

"gee poor people. you are free to be rich! you just CHOOSE to be poor!"

I'm not really a mean person but such crass, uncaring cruelty makes me want to just smack him upside the head with a cricket bat.

The Velveteen Ocelot

(115,276 posts)
30. "Free market" economics is Ryan's religion.
Sun Mar 12, 2017, 01:51 PM
Mar 2017

GOPers, especially those of the Ryan ilk, believe in the "free market" to the point of fanaticism. It's like a religion to them. They believe that every aspect of society should be subject to the "free market," and they believe this as absolutely as Christians believe in the Resurrection. The Resurrection can't be proved scientifically, but Christians believe it anyhow, as an article of faith. In fact, the fact that it can't be explained and that it happened only that one time sort of proves its miraculous nature, which in a rather circular manner supports that faith.

Likewise, Ryanites believe in the unprovable miracle of the free market. But while the Resurrection can't be proved, it hasn't ever actually been disproved either (although its extreme unlikelihood, given the basic rules of biology and physics, is certainly demonstrable). The claimed absolute perfection of free-market economics, in contrast, has been regularly disproved. Reagan's "trickle-down" economics doesn't work. We've seen proof of that over and over. For one thing, there's no such thing as a free market; the marketplace has rules that even Ryanites accept, such as the court system. Most federal litigation involves businesses vs. businesses in which a party is seeking, for example, to enforce or avoid a contract or protect intellectual property. The free market has its own acknowledged rules, so it's not really "free."

And some things can't be managed by a free market at all. No sane insurance executive would go into the business of insuring sick old people because it would be too expensive to provide coverage, and therefore nobody could afford to pay the premiums. This is precisely why we have Medicare. The alternative of just letting people go broke and/or die was, at least for some, completely unacceptable, but because this group of people is effectively uninsurable in a free insurance market, the government stepped in. The ACA was an attempt to remain within a free-ish market system (because it was politically impossible to get a far-superior single-payer system past the GOP) but still make insurance affordable for most people, using government subsidies.

There is simply no way for Ryan's free market to make affordable health insurance available to everyone who needs it. Insurance, by its very nature, is pure socialism: Everybody pays into a pool for the future possible needs of everyone, but some people will never need the benefits while others will. It is this very un-free-market nature of universal coverage that the Ryanites hate because it contradicts their deeply-held religious belief in the free market, which doesn't really exist. The cruel results of this rigid belief as applied to health insurance is unimportant because, like so many religions, adherence to the core belief is more important than anything else.

PatrickforO

(14,516 posts)
42. Ryan, like Scrooge in the Christmas Carol,
Sun Mar 12, 2017, 03:15 PM
Mar 2017

completely misses the point that some people cannot afford things he himself takes for granted.

He's an appalling little lout who should not be Speaker.

Vinca

(50,170 posts)
51. It's up to you, Jim Bob. You can spend your $12,000 on a house for the family to live in or you
Sun Mar 12, 2017, 05:38 PM
Mar 2017

can buy Trumpcare for yourself. If you give up food for the family the wife can be covered. Sorry about the kids.

Kimchijeon

(1,606 posts)
52. "It's up to people"
Sun Mar 12, 2017, 06:04 PM
Mar 2017

Poor/Elderly/Disabled people have the "freedom" to just up and move to a state or another country with healthcare! Cool, nice to know. We all have the "freedom" to magically just afford rapacious garbage insurance and medical debt. Awesome!
Or I guess the "freedom" to suffer and die. 'Cuz that's all "up to people", we are full o' "freedoms!"

tblue37

(64,979 posts)
54. "The people have no bread." --- "Let them eat cake!"
Sun Mar 12, 2017, 07:04 PM
Mar 2017

A billionaire and a pauper have an equal right to choose to live under a bridge.

Now, that's "freedom"!

Beartracks

(12,761 posts)
55. Let's do away with police and fire departments, too. Leave it up to people...
Sun Mar 12, 2017, 08:44 PM
Mar 2017

... if they want it. Cuz that's freedumb.

=============================

still_one

(91,947 posts)
58. I wonder who Pope Francis had in mind when he said "better to be an atheist than a hypocritical
Sun Mar 12, 2017, 10:58 PM
Mar 2017

Catholic"

mdbl

(4,972 posts)
65. Ryan: Number Who Will Lose Health Coverage Under Repeal Is 'Up To People'
Wed Mar 15, 2017, 07:05 AM
Mar 2017

That's right, if they are all millionaires. He's either very evil and greedy or very stupid and greedy.

RobinA

(9,878 posts)
66. This Idea
Wed Mar 15, 2017, 08:06 AM
Mar 2017

of equating the mandate with the lost coverage problem is either a sleight of hand on their part or they're just plain dumb. Sure, if you bought insurance only because of the mandate and there's no mandate you won't buy coverage, but those aren't the people being discussed when anybody non-Republican talks about people losing coverage. I think the Repubs are blowing the whole "mandate" issue waaaay out of proportion because it allows them to chant about "freedom" and ignore the "can't afford coverage" millions. Mandate = strawman the way they are using it.

 

WinkyDink

(51,311 posts)
68. "You get it if you want it. That's freedom...People are going to do what they want to do with their
Wed Mar 15, 2017, 11:54 AM
Mar 2017

lives."

My hatred for this evil man knows no bounds. Nothing in "Game of Thrones" approaches what I'd like to see done to him.

(And that includes flaying, immolation, and death-by-canine.)

SticksnStones

(2,108 posts)
70. Might as well go full Monty...do away with speed limits and age of consent and
Wed Mar 15, 2017, 12:08 PM
Mar 2017

Vaccination requirements and school boards because 'freedom'


Am I free to not have to pick up a portion of the cost the next time an uninsured patriot breaks a leg or has a baby or needs an appendectomy and goes to a hospital in my home town?

Where's the freedom based remedy for that?

Up to some people, not THE people...

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