Pentagon warns airstrikes are not enough to roll back ISIL
Source: Yahoo
President Obama sent a clear message to Iraqi Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki on Monday to step aside quietly after Iraq’s president moves to replace him, as the Pentagon warned that targeted American airstrikes won’t be enough to roll back the bloody advance of the Islamic State of Iraqi and the Levant (ISIL).
American strikes have only “temporarily disrupted” the extremist group’s shockingly effective onslaught, the Pentagon’s Lieutenant General William Mayville told reporters. “I in no way want to suggest that we have effectively contained, or that we are somehow breaking the momentum of, the threat posed by ISIL,” he said.
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On Martha’s Vineyard, Obama assured Iraq of American support as the war-torn country grapples with “difficult days ahead.”
“But just as the United States will remain vigilant against the threat posed to our people by ISIL, we stand ready to partner with Iraq in its fight against these terrorist forces,” he said. “Without question, that effort will be advanced if Iraqis continue to build on today’s process and come together to support a new and inclusive government.”
Read more: http://news.yahoo.com/pentagon-warns-airstrikes-not-enough-to-roll-back-isil-215720755.html
Are airstrikes only the beginning?
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ballyhoo
(2,060 posts)thousand of Americans will get killed again, more than with al qeada because ISIS is badder and better funded and using weapons the US supplied in Syria.
cstanleytech
(26,283 posts)past when the US has tried isolationism such as when the US turned a blind eye to what Hitler was doing.
Dont get me wrong though as I am not saying I like the idea of the US having to send in troops yet again but seeing our country was the one destabilized it we do have an obligation to try and mend it as its the honorable thing to do.
ballyhoo
(2,060 posts)another_liberal
(8,821 posts)If so, that is amazing.
Frankly, I can't imagine why one would want that?
cstanleytech
(26,283 posts)the problem we created but we can try your idea and ignore the problem in the hopes it will go away but I kinda doubt it will.
another_liberal
(8,821 posts)Let me remind you of an inescapable fact:
"The cause of a problem can never be its solution."
bemildred
(90,061 posts)We have a much more extensive record of making messes than of cleaning them up, and the notion that our military is good for making peace or nation-building does not correspond with the facts, What the military can generally be seen to do is to create a mess or to make the existing mess bigger, and then to leave it to fester. As we can see in Iraq, and so many other places in the Middle East.
We have been meddling in the Middle East for over a century now, and the one thing that has never happened is creation of a stable political order.
zonkers
(5,865 posts)to make things right, we'd start by prosecuting the sacks of shit that rushed us to war on based on lies. Never gonna happen. Because the truth is, we don't want to fix it. We are not acting out of a sincere morale imperative. We are still under the spell of hawkish, corporatist neocons. Bin Laden is going to get his wish... an Islamic state. I mean, what else is going to happen? This goose is cooked.
bemildred
(90,061 posts)IS will fragment continuously as it spreads, in a Hobbesian war of all against all. It's already happening.
"Free Companies", little enterpreneurs:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_company
zonkers
(5,865 posts)We sure did a number on them.
FrodosPet
(5,169 posts)Oh yeah, they are!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Crusade
FrodosPet
(5,169 posts)But it is hopeless.
Entire cultures are going to be wiped out in front of us. Historic artifacts and shrines, historic birth and death records - all of that is going to be obliterated as these madmen murder, trash and loot their way from Iran to Tel Aviv.
It hurts to feel helpless against barbarians who never take prisoners, only decapitated heads.
But this is the price we must pay for not being strong enough to prevent the western actions of the last 900+ years. If only someone could have gotten to the crusaders and warned them of the catastrophe that was arising from their conquest - perhaps our cultures could have coexisted.
But Richard III effed up. Harry Truman, by supporting the creation of the State of Israel, effed up. And every President since has continued the support of Israel over the indigenous Arabs.
In any case, we screwed the pooch badly for centuries. It feels like a kick in the head, and a punch to the gut, but I am beginning to accept that our species is not going to make it to the end of our century outside of a few scattered tribes. Time to pay the pipe for the sins of our forefathers and watch helplessly as a brutal regime takes control over the planet's life blood, leaving a trail of innocent's blood, and triggering the worst war possible.
another_liberal
(8,821 posts)And not by killing a few thousand either; in fact, we will not do so with a renewed military intervention at all, we will only succeed in making the Iraq disaster even worse.
Of course, no one has even tried talking to them as equals. As repulsive as that may sound in the face our current media frenzy to hurry and start another war, it is not as repulsive as watching, as you suggest, while our World just falls apart around us.
candelista
(1,986 posts)They were trying to turn back a Muslim invasion of Europe, which took over Spain and reached the gates of Vienna.
NickB79
(19,233 posts)
swilton
(5,069 posts)I didn't expect to see it appear so early in the discussion!
Mike Godwin (2010)
Godwin's law (or Godwin's Rule of Nazi Analogies) is an Internet adage asserting that "As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler approaches 1"?— that is, if an online discussion (regardless of topic or scope) goes on long enough, sooner or later someone will compare someone or something to Hitler or Nazism.
Promulgated by American attorney and author Mike Godwin in 1990,[2] Godwin's Law originally referred, specifically, to Usenet newsgroup discussions. It is now applied to any threaded online discussion, such as Internet forums, chat rooms and blog comment threads, as well as to speeches, articles and other rhetoric.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law
cstanleytech
(26,283 posts)"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it"
another_liberal
(8,821 posts)Are "condemned" to argue we should return, so we can screw it up some more?
cstanleytech
(26,283 posts)Heck I'll make it easy on you and provide the quote as well as underline the relevant portion.
"Its not what I want its what we need to do if we truly want to fix the problem we created"
BobbyBoring
(1,965 posts)But we can't fix what the real problem is. There's nothing we can do to end the sectarian situation that has existed for centuries.
If we had a way back machine and could reinstall Saddam, we could fix it. Sadly we don't.
The real irony is, it was Cheney that stopped us from taking him out in the first war. He knew exactly what would happen and lo and behold, it did.
cstanleytech
(26,283 posts)for example to maybe give the Iraqi people the time they need to turn things around.
FrodosPet
(5,169 posts)He may have made it for another few more years, but he and his sons being so debauched, he would have either fell to the extremists, or had to have joined them. There is nothing America could have done since the founding of the State of Israel 1948 that would have made any difference in the final outcome - just in the timetable and the exact identities of who is doing what.
another_liberal
(8,821 posts)"The cause of a problem can never be its solution."
It's past time we learned some humility regarding our military might. It is not the solution, or it would have already worked.
cstanleytech
(26,283 posts)the taliban came into power and that didnt turn out well for alot of people including ourselves.
I mean heck even Iran who we dont get along with doesnt think its a good idea to let these people seize power.
LanternWaste
(37,748 posts)Invoking internet memes as a rhetorical device is creative, yet fundamentally lacking in validity.
Joe Turner
(930 posts)Is Mr. Status Quo Forever. Obama's administration has been one big deception. He doesn't even bother hiding it anymore.
Lochloosa
(16,063 posts)Air Stricks would not be enough to contain ISIL ?
jonjensen
(168 posts)drop bush and cheney and the rest of vietnam war draft dodging chicken hawk cowards on isis they started it let them finish it!
msongs
(67,395 posts)
tom_kelly
(958 posts)of our efforts to reclaim the oil fields we stole from Iraq. Its gonna get a whole lot more messy.
another_liberal
(8,821 posts)You noticed where the first tanker load of Kurdish crude decided to dock and unload. It sure wasn't Shanghai.
cosmicone
(11,014 posts)lest my post be hidden as "Islamophobic" by some overly sensitive people.
candelista
(1,986 posts)Or was that a non-comment comment?
cosmicone
(11,014 posts)sadly.
candelista
(1,986 posts)spyker29
(89 posts)together and do the heavy lifting
Trillo
(9,154 posts)Who the pays for this? Taxes?
cosmicone
(11,014 posts)to the size of the bomb used.
Ask Hiroshima and Nagasaki.
(I am not advocating use of nukes ... just expressing physics)
joshcryer
(62,269 posts)Only useful when they're transitioning from one spot to the next. If they have heavy armor then it's easier to spot them but I don't think they do. It's just trucks and cars.
So there's really no way to get them without causing mass suffering.
atreides1
(16,072 posts)Not just trucks and cars...ISIL has taken all military equipment that was left behind by the fleeing Iraqi army...that includes armored personnel carriers, tanks and self propelled artillery, and towed artillery!
http://news.yahoo.com/video/isil-militants-show-off-tank-062744087.html;_ylt=A0LEVzGdO.pTmz4A1H9XNyoA;_ylu=X3oDMTE0MmRlYWZjBHNlYwNzcgRwb3MDMTAEY29sbwNiZjEEdnRpZANWSVAzNzZfMQ--
KoKo
(84,711 posts)and the Neocon Hawks want us to send them more....so they can continue their quest of "Remapping the Middle East."
We bomb ISIS and destroying our own equipment and who really benefits..?
PSPS
(13,591 posts)Let the lavishly-funded (by the US taxpayer) armies of the Gulf step up. They're the ones funding these people.
This reminds me of the first Gulf war, where the young men of Kuwait were busy going to big parties in their private jets while American G.I.'s were doing their work.
cosmicone
(11,014 posts)Remember the Army Corps of Engineers building the Kuwaiti Emir's new palace down to installing the gold plated faucets in the 53 bathrooms?
arcane1
(38,613 posts)KoKo
(84,711 posts)
The Dissidents we trained in Jordan to fight against Assad in Syria and the others we trained in Libya and Iraq. We armed them and trained them. We didn't do it alone...but were the major player. arcane1
(38,613 posts)It seems too easy
KoKo
(84,711 posts)
ladjf
(17,320 posts)candelista
(1,986 posts)KoKo
(84,711 posts)because it was too expensive to ship back to USA...so much of the "too big to transport" would be scrapped. They spoke too soon...
Maybe there is a Warthog or two that could be salvaged. It really does resemble a "warthog" from you photo. 
Thanks for posting that never heard of it before. Interesting.
ladjf
(17,320 posts)However, they are the lowest tech fighter we have and would be deadly on a column of pickup trucks armed with light machine gun.
It would be a duck shoot type situation. And, they fly so low that shoulder launched missiles might not be able to hit them.
Sunlei
(22,651 posts)Would really help if other countries, neighbors like Saudi Arabia, Dubai Leadership stop acting so afraid to make a simple statement of what THEY support!.
Orsino
(37,428 posts)It's probably been tough trying to persuade ISIS to fight in the air.
freshwest
(53,661 posts)He'd said consistently if the Iraqi government was more inclusive, had not excluded Sunnis, the uprising would not have support from those who were discriminated against there.
While his latest rebuttal of the American RW does not mention ISIS, he explains the roots of the conflict and how to resolve this without doing what Bush did:
Obama and the State Department have taken into account that there are ultrawealthy citizens of other nations in the region funding ISIS, to redraw the map of the Middle East, although the governments of the surrounding nations do not want this.
But they have no power over their traditional banking system to stop the flow of the money. Their banking system is not the same as ours and money can not be traced to find who is financing ISIS.
So the SoS is working trying to stem the flow of financial aid but this doesn't mean a ground war is on the way. It's just not Obama's way, he wants those nations to take care of their own problems and apply pressure without troops.
I don't see any boots on the ground in the future, and don't want to see that again. We have the technology to assist the Kurds and Iraqis resist ISIS and stem the growth of their Caliphate. Even the Russians are arming those who oppose ISIS and I'll bet there have been talks behind the scenes on that, and the USA and Russia will never go to war with each other, despitethe media sensationalism.
The huge division when it gets down to threats like ISIS is just hype and it's MSM's job to boost fear and hate for their owners' arms sales. All the major media are owned by corporations with their hands in that lucrative pie. MSM is a corporate sales job wrapped up with other things to pass on the message subconsciously that we have to be at war all the time.
JMHO.
