Obama rejects Republican warnings on immigration
Source: AP-Excite
WASHINGTON (AP) — President Barack Obama says he intends to issue an order easing the threat against deportation for immigrants in the country illegally.
He'd act despite warnings from Republican leaders that he would be poisoning the well with a newly elected GOP-controlled Congress.
Obama tells CBS' "Face the Nation" that even if he goes ahead, there still would be room for Congress to pass immigration legislation.
FULL story at link.
US citizens Esmeralda Tepetate, 10, with her brother Sebastian, 2, whose parents are originally from Mexico, holds a sign that says "stop separating families" during a rally for comprehensive immigration reform, Friday, Nov. 7, 2014, outside of the White House in Washington. After the midterm elections immigration groups are pushing for executive action. (AP Photo/Jacquelyn Martin)
Read more: http://apnews.excite.com/article/20141109/us--obama-immigration-bbf20aed99.html
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mcar
(42,331 posts)
kimbutgar
(21,148 posts)Then call out that bit of history when the Koch congress has its hissy fit.
freshwest
(53,661 posts)
Jefferson23
(30,099 posts)
SunSeeker
(51,557 posts)
Stellar
(5,644 posts)
NBachers
(17,110 posts)yup.
From day one they have been "poisoning" everything that the president has want to do, but now they "threaten" him and accuse "him" of poisoning the well! Total BS.
Plucketeer
(12,882 posts)The pot testing the kettle's mettle.
Martin Eden
(12,867 posts)And the president knows it.
Baitball Blogger
(46,709 posts) 
Blanks
(4,835 posts)I wish he'd show up on Sunday morning TV more often. Perhaps he will. One of the points that he made was: "building a better mouse trap isn't enough - you still have to sell it."
I'm paraphrasing, but that's the point he was making.
FailureToCommunicate
(14,014 posts)<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/M39l7rj80bM" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
ballyhoo
(2,060 posts)
mazzarro
(3,450 posts)That is my apprehension - being that the hyper-bi partisans controlling the DNC are still there
Veilex
(1,555 posts)
Iliyah
(25,111 posts)He has to go it alone.
Koch's congress is effed-up, let them destroy themselves but the meantime they are gonna do as much damage to America as possible. Voting is a democracy right, Koch's congress will along with USSC teabaggers will to their best to destroy the voting rights of millions of America as well as destroying health care.
workinclasszero
(28,270 posts)of ever working with the President to get things done....EVER!
Anyone with half a brain knows that! Do it Mr. President and F*** the damned republicans!
Build a unstoppable coalition for the future as the rethug/bagger old white male racist party dies off.
The democrats can rule if you will be BOLD and lead us into the future!
Welcome the fascists hate just like FDR!!!
Monk06
(7,675 posts)
bobGandolf
(871 posts)jonjensen
(168 posts)republiscum plead threaten don't do amnesty please wait until the latinos are as angry with you democrats as they are with republicans!
TomCADem
(17,387 posts)...but make inroads with immigrant communities by blaming the inaction on President Obama. If President Obama does something, they will have to shift and complain about abuse of power and blame their inaction on immigration on President Obama "poisoning the well." In the end, Republicans will still be obstructionist even though they have both the House and Senate.
lunamagica
(9,967 posts)"He says if Congress does act, it would take the place of whatever he puts into place by his own authority."
What? I don't get it, it just sounds bad to me
Abouttime
(675 posts)Obama knows history is on his side and at this stage in his Presidency he can make bold moves like this, what's to stop him?
With one executive action Obama can grant rights to millions of undocumented tax paying workers who now have none. This country was founded on the fundamental belief that if you are taxed you should have representation in government. Obama is placing them on the path to recognition, once 10 million or so are on that path no law, no court will take those rights away.
The upside for us will be huge, red states such as Texas would be blue within a decade, the political landscape of the United States would be forever changed. The Republican Party would become nothing more than a permanent but shrinking minority party on the wrong side of 21st century demographics.
lunamagica
(9,967 posts)but the quote "He says if Congress does act, it would take the place of whatever he puts into place by his own authority." makes it sound (at least to me) like whatever he does can be undone by congress. Why did he say that?
BumRushDaShow
(128,979 posts)he could veto and they would be unable to override - i.e., the option is still there for THEM to make the change. But basically he is also telling them that rather than put if off and punt, they should act now if they think that no immigration reform is not necessary, "amnesty" is a dirty word, otherwise they better deal with it.
lunamagica
(9,967 posts)BumRushDaShow
(128,979 posts)
The President is daring Congress to do something if they feel that strongly about it, or stop whining about him deciding TO do it himself (within his authority)...
Darb
(2,807 posts)You just pretended that the whole thing is about voters, when the whole thing is about being human. Of course, the voter thing is exactly what the Repugnant Party is whining about. It has nothing to do with that and I'm sure you know that. Stop pretending, ok?
I see you.
That's why I referenced the emancipation proclamation, the executive action will grant rights to people who now have no rights. Once these rights are granted no court, no law making body will dare take these rights away from millions of people. It's all about the people.
Igel
(35,309 posts)He can't write laws. He tells the executive how to implement laws and intepret them within the limits of what the laws say. Or the EO simply says how the bureaucracy is going to be run.
Yes, executive orders rely on the Constitutional language that all executive power originates with the President. The executive (branch) is unitary, without multiple heads.
But the President is constrained to follow the laws as passed by Congress (and signed by him, or passed over his veto).
If the Congress passes a law--with his signature or over his veto--he's stuck with it. The best he can do is create possibly a bit of wiggle room by virtue of ambiguous or conflicting language in statutes. For example, in one * signing statement he pointed out how he'd interpret legislation: an agency head had to certify some report, which according to statute either meant that his agency had produced it or entailed that he certified that the agency head had personally verified each fact and statistic cited. Bush II went with the first (Congress wanted the latter, but it was an insane want--having the agency chair vouch for each number in a 500-page statistical compendium). The president can also, in some cases, allege a constitutional conflict--legislation that might conflict with some authority Constitutionally granted the Presidency.
Personally, in his statements I see PR and not a willingness to collaborate. It's based on ill-will and assumes that the press will play along. It's more of the "I want to cooperate--let's cooperate by doing what I want, and, oh, if you don't, here's an ultimatum" way of doing things that goes with "let's pull together--everybody get in line behind me--and by the way, you ran the economy into a ditch and you're not getting the keys back" and "let's cooperate on what I think is important for Americans, here are your peas, open wide."
In this case, the cooperation with the "new Republican Congress" has an expiration date--end of the year. Of course, the transfer of majority status happens in January of next year. So the cooperation has to occur with a (D) majority in which the (R) will still have minority status. This is what one writer a number of years ago dubbed "ambush politics." While partisans like it, it's how DC's been run for the last 10-15 years, if not before--a firm start date is impossible since it's just become more and more frequent since the '70s, probably, or perhaps the '60s, and the "start date" is more of a tipping point.
cheapdate
(3,811 posts)The Tennessean newspaper did a story that focused on the tradition of cock-fighting in East Tennessee. The story was great, but it interviewed the Sevier County Sheriff and asked him about efforts to break up illegal cock-fights. The sheriff said he'd be glad to break up cock-fights, but his resources were finite and limited, and meth labs and prostitution were are bigger priority at the moment.
Darb
(2,807 posts)He just has to state it. They can claim a mandate, but so can he. He was elected with a strong majority with a relatively large turnout. The Republicans blocked every voter they could on the way to garnering 18 or so percent of the electorate. No mandate. Just say so and it goes away. Perception is reality. The Republican talking points about some "message" is nothing more than a meme. The vast majority of voters either stayed home or were blocked. They have no mandate. And even more so they never respected the outcomes of the last three elections, they belligerently blocked everything.
Obama should act boldly and let them whine and carp all they want. He owes them nothing. They can pass a law any time they want. It just has to be balanced and not idiotic. But they don't want to pass one because immigration is one of the spokes in their wheel for getting elected. They don't want to fix it. Do it Barack, and go as big as you think is constitutional.
Poison the well? Piss off. It is already poison.
candelista
(1,986 posts)I hope the US can provide jobs for all these people without destroying the US wage base and all the gains achieved by the US working class in the past 100 years.
SunSeeker
(51,557 posts)There have not been 100 years of gains. Workers have not made any gains in terms of wages since the 1970s. Why? Outsourcing.
The undocumented immigrants in this country already have jobs. They're jobs most Americans don't want.
If the undocumented are driving wages down at all, it is because they have no papers and can be exploited, sometimes working for a few dollars an hour. They can't complain or demand a minimum wage for fear of being deported. Give them temporary or permanent legal worker status, and then they can't be exploited by unscrupulous employers.
When Ronald Reagan gave undocumented workers amnesty, I don't recall us suddenly being deluged with unemployed undocumented immigrants.
paper boy
(52 posts)Immigration is also part of it. more people chasing fewer jobs equals a job market that favors the employers, not the emplyees. this is simple supply and demand economics.
azmom
(5,208 posts)They have been here 10 some 20 or more years. Do you think they have been sitting at home waiting to get amnesty. They have bills to pay and families to feed. They have jobs already.
SunSeeker
(51,557 posts)At least here in California, undocumented immigrants work bent over picking our strawberries, washing dishes in our restaurants, mowing our lawns and cleaning our toilets.
The fact that we have an "employer's market" is the result of right wing policy and the death of unions, not some immutable "free market" forces of supply and demand. There is no such thing as a free market. That is an Ayn Rand fantasy. The market is shaped by politics and policy.
paper boy
(52 posts)and ignoring the long term impact of immigration on the labor market. I am an RN. I have worked alongside countless immigrants who occupy positions in every department within the hospital from those who clean floors to those who write prescriptions. Before I was an RN I worked at an entry level job alongside immigrants. Between 2009 and 2012, 67% of all job growth went to immigrants, documented and undocumented.
SunSeeker
(51,557 posts)Or do you have a problem with legal immigrants?
paper boy
(52 posts)I simply pointed out that there was more to it than just that. It's a statement of fact, not an opinion regarding aliens documented or otherwise. You then indicated that immigrants (not otherwise specified) are not chasing the jobs that Americans want. Again, I was just pointing out that immigrants are, in fact, absolutely chasing jobs that Americans want. Again, this is a fact, not an opinion regarding aliens, documented or otherwise.
SunSeeker
(51,557 posts)Psephos
(8,032 posts)SunSeeker
(51,557 posts)In post #46, he finally admits his hospital did not hire undocumented immigrants. Yet, in post 41, in talking about the (legal immigrant) RNs he worked with, he said, "I was just pointing out that immigrants are, in fact, absolutely chasing jobs that Americans want."
It appears you agree with him. I wouldn't be proud of that if I were you.
Psephos
(8,032 posts)my observation was directed toward the conversation itself
SunSeeker
(51,557 posts)Psephos
(8,032 posts)If all you have is a hammer, everything begins to look like a nail.
Try a different tool.
SunSeeker
(51,557 posts)paper boy
(52 posts)I have no problem with legal immigrants. I do have a problem with intellectual dishonesty however.
SunSeeker
(51,557 posts)What is your point? That legal immigrants are taking American jobs? You do realize legal immigrants ARE Americans, right?
paper boy
(52 posts)I got along with those ladies just fine. I have simply pointed out how you were wrong. Now, for whatever reason, you're attempting to poison the well. weak. very weak.
SunSeeker
(51,557 posts)That must not have been easy considering you blame them for lowering wages.
paper boy
(52 posts)SunSeeker
(51,557 posts)We refuse to raise the minimum wage because of Koch brother Republicans in congress. Each year we don’t raise it means wages go down due to cost of living. The good paying factory jobs are rarer and rarer due to outsourcing. Again, thanks to Koch brother GOP assholes. God forbid we should tax outsourcing corporations to make them pay for the damage they're doing and to discourage that shit. No, let's blame "those ladies."
paper boy
(52 posts)Where it used to take 10 individuals to do a job, it now requires 5 and 2 of those men live in China and 1 of them was not born in the US. A smaller labor pool means employers must be more competitive. A larger labor pool means employees must be more competitive. This is the way it works. The Koch brothers are very much in favor of a large labor pool because they understand what you do not. They are, in fact, bankrolling amnesty.
SunSeeker
(51,557 posts)Undocumented immigrants living here in limbo makes them exploitable with low wages and no legal recourse for fear of deportation. The Kochs want to do away with the minimum wage.
Please give me a link for the Koch brothers saying they support "amnesty."
Again, you do realize just because someone "was not born in the US" does not mean they're not Americans, right?
Guaguacoa
(271 posts)I have a cousin that is working for federal express in san diego and has been for years. Working with purchased documents makes it easy and in no way are they all picking strawberries, washing dishes and cutting grass. It's very degrading to latinos to even think so.
Food processing plants are full of them and they are a lot. They have benefits, vacations, medical, etc.
SunSeeker
(51,557 posts)If it was so "easy" everyone would do it and no one would get deported; we would not need Dreamer legislation.
I did not bring up Latinos. You did. You're the one who is assuming all undocumented immigrants are Latinos (as opposed to Asian, European, Caribbean, etc.). I'm not the one degrading Latinos. You are.
"Union places," eh? Cool story, bro.
Guaguacoa
(271 posts)I am degrading latinos? You must be white as white people are the first to spew stuff like that out if they have no answer. That has also got to be the most idiotic comment I have ever seen. I refer to latinos because I am one, people tend to refer to what they know except in cases like yours where you try to act knowledgeable about something you are ignorant of. I lived in latino areas and worked with latinos, by far most undocumented. I have no idea about the other groups as I have not lived with them so won't comment on them, unlike people like you who think they know it all and are really clueless. Most latinos are from mexico, second is el salvador and the rest mixed in.
*******
First how about the Social Security Administration Office of Chief Actuary?
chrome-extension://ecnphlgnajanjnkcmbpancdjoidceilk/http://www.socialsecurity.gov/oact/NOTES/pdf_notes/note151.pdf
OCACT estimates 1.8 million other immigrants worked and used an SSN that did not match their name in 2010.Their earnings may be credited to someone else’s record(when the SSN and name submitted to the employermatch Social Security records) or may be credited to the Earnings Suspense File (when submitted with non-matching SSN and name). Finally, OCACT estimates3.9 million other immigrants worked in the under ground economy in 2010.
My comment:
Like I said, different name at home than at work. I guess this is one of those " Wow, I really don't know what I am talking about" moments for you. They are using these numbers to get good jobs, not cut grass and wash dishes.
*****
I have lived in the us in several states and have worked, myself and my wife, at the food processing places in a couple of states. Arkansas is a huge one. Oklahoma has some. I have also lived in southern california.
These places like in arkansas, butterball, cargill, tyson, allen canning, ok foods, etc. all have e-verify in place. E-verify only catches those who work with bad ssn's. It does not catch those working with "legal" ssn's purchased.
How do you think they are working at these places? These places DO NOT hire illegals without any documentation at all. It's not possible, if you think that then you are clueless. Most of the ssn's are of children from puerto rico, arizona, texas, etc. Everyone working there has a different name there and at work. I have relatives and fiends still there, I have a cousin working for fedex in san diego under a different name and ssn.
The system is not set up to catch someone with another person's ssn. I knew 3 people working at 3 plants for ok foods at the same time using the same ssn. It doesn't matter as long as the ssn checks out ok. I also knew of a guy that worked 2 tours at the same plant with different ssn's. Everyone knew it but catching this is not required, just bad numbers that e-verify catches.
I've been there and done that, I know what I am talking about. They do this for long periods of time and it's because of your system. Do you really think they are being deported? You are wrong, I knew of nobody that got deported that was working this way. It is those working ar menial jobs without papers like washing dishes and cutting grass, I do know of a couple that got deported for selling ssn's. Not jail time, just deported. She also was a dj at "la maquinita" radio station in fort smith arkansas.
Just how do you think Dreamers continue to stay here and work without being deported? Do you really think they are cutting grass and washing dishes? They are using other names with ssn's at work.
A quick search will bring up info, there is also a maximum number of dependents you can claim without raising flags. I forget what it is now, but It's typical to claim this on the form at work as taxes cannot be filed and they will not hold out doing this. This is the first thing people tell you when you go there. I don't know most of these websites, but the info is true:
**
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/09/04/world/americas/04iht-id.2688618.html?pagewanted=all
While no one knows how many of these mismatches are illegal immigrants, a Government Accountability Office study found that employers with the most mismatches were concentrated in industries that hire a lot of illegal immigrants, including agriculture, construction and food services.
"Right now, employers are not motivated to care if their workers give them false Social Security numbers," said Barbara Bovbjerg, the office's director of education, workforce and income security issues.
**
http://cis.org/IdentityTheft
Illegal immigration and high levels of identity theft go hand-in-hand. States with the most illegal immigration also have high levels of job-related identity theft. In Arizona, 33 percent or all identity theft is job-related (as opposed to identity theft motivated simply by profit). In Texas it is 27 percent; in New Mexico, 23 percent; in Colorado, 22 percent; California, 20 percent; and in Nevada, 16 percent. Eight of the 10 states with the highest percentage of illegal aliens in their total population are among the top 10 states in identity theft (Arizona, California, Florida, Texas, Nevada, New York, Georgia, and Colorado).
Children are prime targets. In Arizona, it is estimated that over one million children are victims of identity theft. In Utah, 1,626 companies were found to be paying wages to the SSNs of children on public assistance under the age of 13. These individuals suffer very real and very serious consequences in their lives.
**
http://seniorsleague.org/2012/how-undocumented-workers-are-becoming-entitled-to-social-security/
How “Undocumented” Workers Are Becoming Entitled To Social Security
Posted on Wednesday, April 25th, 2012 at 4:25 pm.
Q: How can illegal immigrants get Social Security? They don’t pay taxes!
A: That’s a common misconception. According to estimates from the Social Security Administration’s Chief Actuary, three-quarters of “other-than-legal” immigrants have payroll taxes withheld.
Q: How can payroll taxes be withheld if illegals don’t have a Social Security number?
A: Immigration law forbids working in this country without legal authorization and a Social Security Number (SSN). Yet millions of “undocumented” immigrant workers are earning income. Illegals often get jobs by using illegally obtained, forged, or invalid Social Security numbers. Employers in turn withhold payroll taxes and report the earnings to the Social Security Administration (SSA) using those numbers. When the numbers don’t match up with the numbers issued by SSA, they go into a special file called the “Earnings Suspense File.” Valid numbers issued from the U.S. government are also misused.
**
http://cnsnews.com/news/article/ig-irs-hindered-efforts-stop-illegals-misusing-social-security-numbers
(CNSNews.com) - An audit report published this month by the inspector general for the Social Security Administration says that the Internal Revenue Service's reluctance to penalize employers who consistently file W-2s on which the Social Security Number and name do not match has "hindered" the SSA’s efforts to stop “unauthorized noncitizens” from using Social Security Numbers that are fake or belong to someone else.
The audit report looked at “inaccurate wage reporting”—or the filing of W-2 forms on which the name and the Social Security Number do not match. The SSA has long said these no-match W-2s are frequently filed on behalf of illegal aliens. According to the IG audit report released earlier this month, a senior IRS official admitted to the IG that the service knows this is the case.
“Furthermore,” said the report, “a senior employment tax official at the IRS acknowledged that unauthorized noncitizens accounted for a high percentage of inaccurate wage reporting.”
**
http://thehill.com/blogs/congress-blog/homeland-security/223971-fraud-by-illegal-immigrants-destroying-childrens-lives
Fraud by illegal immigrants destroying children’s lives
“The use of fraudulent documents for employment authorization and child identity theft go hand-in-hand because adults can use children’s Social Security numbers for years without being detected,” Ronald Mortensen, a fellow at the Center for Immigration Studies, testified at a congressional hearing I chaired this month. “Document fraud, therefore, is not a victimless crime and the children whose Social Security numbers are used for employment purposes suffer very real and serious harm.”
Jennifer Andrushko’s 3-year-old son is one of those victims. His identity was taken by an illegal immigrant, who then used it to fraudulently obtain work and run up unpaid medical bills.
“I cannot express how ridiculous it is that my son’s Social Security number has been used for care at an OB/GYN’s office or how frightening it is to know that my son’s medical history has been blatantly corrupted, which could have serious, life-threatening impacts on my son’s life and medical care,” Andrushko said in her testimony.
When Andrushko’s son was born, the Social Security Administration issued him a Social Security number that had already been used for years by an illegal immigrant. His credit, his medical history, his work history and his potential for being denied future benefits were immediately corrupted.
The illegal immigrant who created the fake Social Security number was arrested and placed on an immigration hold and yet released – twice. She runs free while the Andrushko boy’s Social Security number is tied to a criminal record.
Andrushko is not an isolated case. The SSA Actuary estimates that 75 percent of illegal immigrants obtain and use a fraudulent Social Security number.
**
Lastly. If the company does find out the person has a stolen ssn they are just fired, not reported, so they are not deported. There was a plant in fort smith that was not as good and hired everyone. This person would work there until they bought another number and went back to work at the plant. Most of the office people were working the same way or didn't care and would take them back as long as the ssn passed e-verify. It made no difference they had worked there before with a different number, they were not required to catch that just bad numbers that e-verify would catch.
The ONLY way to stop this would be to add pictures and fingerprints to ssn's. It will never happen though.
Just because you are ignorant of something and your media does not spoon feed you does not mean it is not happen. Working at union places, absolutely. The ones I saw there took a year of work at a food processing plant as experience and there are many working at these places. So you are clueless like most people there. Not an excuse, but cool story bro.
SunSeeker
(51,557 posts)Sure, undocumented immigrant use fake ssn's, but they can't collect Social Security benefits, nor can they get tax refunds on all the taxes they pay using those ssn's. And as your links confirm, they eventually get found out.
Again, if it was so easy, undocumented immigrants would not live in constant fear of deportation, employers would not be able to exploit them--like the meat packing plants notoriously do. Dreamers would not risk everything trying trying to fix the system if getting around the system was so easy.
Guaguacoa
(271 posts)pay taxes, of course they do not file. SOME get found out and as I clearly posted they just go buy a new ssn and go back to the same place to work.
It's very obvious you did not read any of it. Read the link from social security. That doesn't prove anything. They even state the percentage of people doing this.
They DO live in fear of deportation because they are using someone elses ssn. Would you? The meat packing plants exploit them because they will not file claims on injuries as they are using someone elses ssn Would you?. Would you risk going to court with someone elses ssn? I know a guy that lost 4 fingers and got nothing because he was afraid as he was using someone elses ssn.
Are you serious? Do you not see how dreamers would be better with their own ssn's? Seriously? Would you be just as well off living and working under someone elses ssn? They are risking it all because working under someone else's ssn is only good for working, but not good for a full life. Buying houses, etc. You really do not get that?
You have no clue. Go to the meat packing plants, get out of the trailer park, and see for yourself. The links confirm they eventually get found out? No they do not, you did not bother to read anything.
I knew people that had medical, the meat packing plants provide medical, but could not use it to birth babies as the babies would be born to a mother with someone elses ssn. Do you not see how that works? They have to use their work names to use the insurance, the baby would have someone elses name on their birth certificate. They have to go in as themselves to have papers with their real names. THATS one reason they cannot even use the medical they are provided. Sure, they can for other things, but someone else is winding up with your medical history and you don't have any.
Do you SERIOUSLY think this is living good, except to have a job, and not see where dreamers want to be leagle. Risking everything? What, do you live in a cocoon? When you get out and raise a family try and do it under someone elses ssn. This provides a way to work, but they DO NOT know if and when they will get fired and not have an imcome.
You seem to think this is how one gets deported, by work. It's not. Most get caught driving around without drivers licenses or under something, stopped for speeding, etc. Do you really think gettting papers to work are the only worry? THIS is how they get deported, not by getting fired with someone elses papers.
You really don't know do you? Yet you are arrogant enough to think you know more than someone that has been there and done that? Why, because I am not white and you have to be white to have it all figured out? I've been there. Even buying a serial number to work does not end the fear. That's just a small part, it's a horrible life. Try it sometime, get out of mommy's basement.
I lived in several states there and california is the worst. There is a segment that think they have it all figured out, we "brown people" are not enlightened like you are. What a laugh. It's even racist from the crowd that goes to great lengths to slap themselves on the back for not being racist. Don't kid yourself, this segment is even worse than nazi flag wavers and I could see it as soon as the first thing that slithered out of your mouth was insinuation that what I posted was somehow bigoted toward my own people. We don't need, you the problem needs to be understood to be fixed. Find some other dark skinned group to feel superior to and make yourself feel better. We can truly use those that wish to help, not condescending jerk's.
No point in arguing with someone that is closed minded and knows it all, hopefully there is a way to put you on ignore. Yes!!!! And you are.
SunSeeker
(51,557 posts)
mimi85
(1,805 posts)Some people just cannot be reasoned with - yep, another one to add to the ignore list.
pampango
(24,692 posts)While it is true that each immigrant and each young American joining the workforce represents an increase in the supply of labor, each also represents an increase in the demand for goods and services.
paper boy
(52 posts)
&w=1484
"We gather here knowing that there are millions of Americans whose hard work and dedication have not yet been rewarded,".... "Our economy is adding jobs – but too many people still can’t find full-time employment. Corporate profits have rocketed to all-time highs – but for more than a decade, wages and incomes have barely budged."
Barack Obama
pampango
(24,692 posts)regulation of corporations and stagnating minimum wages, etc. Our 1% and corporations will be glad to hear the blame for our stagnating wages shifted away from them and toward immigrants.
Go ahead and slash immigration (like the republicans did in the 1920's) and see if that increases wages (income inequality reached record levels by the end of the 1920's). The reduction in the supply of labor when immigration is reduced is more than offset by the reduction in demand for products and services when those consumers are deported or never arrive. Studies done by non-right wing organizations show that immigration is good for the economy. Spreading that new wealth evenly is a function of progressive tax policy, the safety net and the strength of unions.
An increasing population (workers and consumers) - whether due to a natural increase of citizens, like during the Baby Boom, or due to immigration - does not necessarily lead to a reduction in wages. From WWII to Reagan, wages were much higher than they were 100 years earlier even though the population was much greater.
From the graph you posted labor's share peaked early in the Reagan administration and increased again in the mid- to late-90's. To me that says that government policy has more to do with wage levels than population does.
paper boy
(52 posts)when wages have been falling for decades while immigration has been increasing. The rich have gotten richer and the poor have gotten poorer. You can not claim that immigration has lead to an net increase in wages for the average American worker because the complete opposite has happened. The top 1% are the ones most in favor of flooding our labor market with more laborers as they are the only ones who will profit from this. I think the facts speak for themselves but you will do whatever acts of logical acrobatics that you need to do to come up with the conclusion that you want. More power to you. I'm done here.
SunSeeker
(51,557 posts)cheapdate
(3,811 posts)Wages are falling across all sectors because of a concurrence of long, deep, and systemic changes that have been underway for many decades. Leading factors include, globalization, technology and capital intensive production, the growth of finance driven economies, etc.
These changes aren't going away soon. Who sits in the White House won't affect it hardly one way or the other.
Immigration depresses wages in some labor-intensive jobs, such as certain construction trades, but the overall economic effect of immigration is neutral to slightly positive.
Darb
(2,807 posts)Where did you get it?
candelista
(1,986 posts)Got something against that?
SunSeeker
(51,557 posts)Bring on the impeachment proceedings, suckers.
Old Nick
(468 posts)And when the GOPers complain, remind their stupid asses about Dubya's "signing statements"! (Remember those end runs?)
azmom
(5,208 posts)We’re seeing record high levels of frustration with both parties from Latinos, and we know a lot of that has to do with the lack of progress on immigration,” Latino Decision co-founder Matt Barreto said on a press call discussing the results. “For Latinos, this issue is even more important than it is to the general electorate—a clear majority of Latinos know an undocumented immigrant. For them, immigration is deeply personal and symbolic. Both parties stand to lose serious support if they continue to take the Latino vote for granted. There’s clear signals of that happening in 2014 and even stronger signals for that in 2016.”
Sunlei
(22,651 posts)even a close island will do. 10k Cubans a year make fast track to permanent residency. Cuba should sell travel packages to mexico.
The law is called, "wet foot, dry foot" google it.
azmom
(5,208 posts)Republicans and against immigration reform. They got theirs so fuck everyone else.
Fucking Cuban republicans.
Cha
(297,240 posts)
yurbud
(39,405 posts)He's lost all his pieces, his king's in a corner, and now he comes out swinging.
Response to Omaha Steve (Original post)
Name removed Message auto-removed
uppityperson
(115,677 posts)cheapdate
(3,811 posts)Fuck the GOP. Amnesty for all peaceful immigrants. Immigrants are people. Living wages for all workers. Tax the rich.
If that's what a "troll" says, then count me in.
uppityperson
(115,677 posts)cheapdate
(3,811 posts)uppityperson
(115,677 posts)cheapdate
(3,811 posts)But that's exactly what was said. They said (paraphrasing) Fuck the GOP! Amnesty for all the southerners. And jobs with living wages for them as well. Tax the rich.
That's what they said.
I don't know what you thought you read, but that was the message.
uppityperson
(115,677 posts)It was the over done mocking tone of the other post that made me say not too subtle.
As you said, we can't get the exact post back, you can't say exactly what they wrote. But I am in agreement with your message of fuck the gop, amnesty, jobs with living wages, tax the rich.
TshaiRedhair
(56 posts)Cheap, low wage, exploited labor will make it harder for those on the bottom to get ahead. It will enoucrage even more illegal immigration.
Darb
(2,807 posts)Where did you find it?
candelista
(1,986 posts)