Thom Hartmann: Everything U Know Is Wrong: Who Really Killed Kennedy?

[thomhartmann]

Lamar Waldron, The Hidden History of the JFK Assassination, joins Thom.

The Big Picture with Thom Hartmann on RT TV & FSTV "live" 9pm and 11pm check www.thomhartmann.com/tv for local listings

[mother earth]

1. Labeling as conspiracy and ridicule are useful tools...for those who seek to end

discussion.

Truly those who believe Oswald did the crime are in the minority...now someone will come out to trash TH & guest,
no doubt.

[villager]

2. It's amazing how many repeat verbatim party lines from the likes of Allen Dulles, the NSA, etc.

...on issue after issue, yet imagine themselves as part of a virtual "underground..."

[mother earth]

3. Yes, the Dulles brothers brought us quite a legacy of long term mayhem, the NSA is

an overgrown spy and even their own are calling them out on it (Wm. Binney).

What ever happened to question everything?

[villager]

4. It's almost hilarious -- if it wasn't so tragic: "I'm posting on the 'Underground' to tell you

...all the pronouncements from our most powerful cabals are correct!"

[mother earth]

6. You do know nothing is "underground" right? Care to be more specific? nt

[villager]

8. Well, the name of this website, to be more specific

No, I realize that "undergrounds" of all sort -- artistic, political, et al -- get co-opted eventually.

Just kind of breathtaking how pronounced that affect is here, over so many posts...

[classof56]

13. I think it went the way of "Don't Trust Anyone Over 30"

Which--funny thing--happened the day I turned 31.

Peace!

[longship]

14. Allen Dulles was out of the CIA two years before the Kennedy assassination.

What's all this gum flapping about Allen Dulles? He wasn't at CIA since November 29, 1961.

Geez! If one is going to have a conspiracy theory, at least people should bother to get their facts straight.

[villager]

16. Speaking of "facts straight," Dulles was on the Warren Commission

Better luck next time!

[longship]

17. So was Earl Warren, a progressive liberal.

And so were many others. If one is going to spin a JFK conspiracy around Dulles, one is going to have to do better than that.

Of course, it will have to compete the JFK assassination conspiracies centering around:

* The CIA: (Dulles being out at the time)
* The FBI
* The Mafia
* Castro
* Krushchev
* The KGB
* Allen Dulles
* Geo HW Bush
* Yosemite Sam (no doubt) Might as well be Scrooge McDuck.

Note that many of these are mutually exclusive, yet nearly all the JFK conspiracy theorists bring out the same list. In other words, they are called conspiracy theorists but they have no cogent single theory except to deny the so-called "official" explanation, which I suspect is their sole goal.

Well, if they want to be taken seriously and not soon to be relegated back to the DU Creative Speculation Forum, they're going to have to do come up with a single explanation based on positive evidence. Otherwise, they are wasting everybody's time here. Negative and often long ago debunked sniping at the Oswald case is not going to help.

I am done with this crazy thread and all similar ones.

[villager]

18. And so were at least three commissioners who doubted the official findings. But hey,

don't want your time "wasted" in repeated attempts to condescend to the rest of us!

Happy threading elsewhere!

[longship]

20. Anomalies are inevitable in historic events.

Those that see history as a series of facts see one thing. Those that see only the anomalies inevitably see something else. The latter is unfortunate and rarely finds anything but the facts.

Too bad that.

[villager]

21. Conformity seems somewhat inevitable too

Especially in response to those anomalies.

So your threat to leave this thread was just a hollow one, I see...

[tomp]

23. your absence is appreciated. nt

[whathehell]

5. A lot of the debunkers are younger DUers who don't remember and are basically just uninterested.

I just came from another thread full of them.

[avaistheone1]

7. Seriously I have noticed that as well.

It seems that because they know little about JFK, and know little about the assassination - they assume the dominant MSM that Oswald was the killer or sole killer is true. Their lack of knowledge and intellectual curiosity is stunning.

Of course these are the same young people who are only too willing to give all of their personal information to the government.

[whathehell]

9. Yes, I think that's the case..

One person really got into it on one thread, telling everyone it was "not important", what's the difference, etc.

I basically said "Look...You're probably younger and just don't give a shit, and that's okay, just don't go telling the

rest of us who DO remember and felt that trauma and pain how WE should feel or what we should be interested in".

I definitely get your point about younger people willing to spill it all...I don't even really like facebook. My niece,

on the other hand, can hardly take a piss without needing to tell everyone about it...I don't get that need to be in CONSTANT

communication.

[villager]

19. How come so many of the Lone Nut Theorists are so snotty about it?

What's with the particular personality matrix that takes Allen Dulles at his word?

[BlueStreak]

10. The reality about this world can be shocking. Some are slower than others to catch on.

I guess I am one of the slower ones, like our Warren Commission apologists here. I vividly remember hearing news of a big rally in the Pacific Northwest. The year (or even the era) escapes me, but I guess it must have been mid-90s. This was a large organized protest against the incessant creep if global corporatism -- a rally against the unchecked power of these multi-national corporations that are accountable to nobody.

At the time, I was just like these not-terribly-aware folks who say we-mustn't-ask-any-questions-because-Oswald-was-a-solitary-perp-just-a-disturbed-guy-and-that-is-all-there-is-to-it-you-crazy-conspiracy-theorist.

I clearly recall being taken aback by these "crazies" in Seattle or Portland, wherever it was. What are they so unhappy about? I buy my gas from Exxon. Exxon seems OK to me.

That was the beginning of my education about how the world actually is. In my defense, information wasn't as available back then. The propaganda covered virtually 100% of the available media. We speak harshly of the MSM today, but really, they have always been agents of the propaganda factory. On this anniversary of the JFK assassination, it was sad to see some of those old broadcasts with none less than Walter Cronkite hauling water for the Warren Commission.

Today, we have much greater access to information globally. But it is a polluted well. You have to use judgment in weighing all this information. And that, in a nutshell is what is so very wrong about this business that we should not question __________ (fill in the blank. The Warren commission. The NSA. The PTT. etc.)

I would simply tell our friends whose understanding of the world is less evolved, Stop criticizing those who are farther down the path than you are. Question and learn. The world is a much more complicated place than you may be comfortable with right now. But honestly, you will be in a better place once you have a better understanding how this place operates. It can be pretty ugly and depressing. But as I see it, ignorance is even more depressing.

[canoeist52]

22. +1 "The world is a much more complicated place than you may be ...

"The world is a much more complicated place than you may be comfortable with right now."

I think you hit on the reason for the angry out-of-proportion push-back; "Fear"

Because it's disorienting to have one's life-long beliefs challenged.

Great post -should be an OP.

[navarth]

11. kicking.

I always will kick for Thom Hartmann.

[eggplant]

12. I'm on the side of the conspiracy theorists, but this guy is just hawking a book.

This clip didn't actually say anything except that "all this is in the book!"

And because of this, I have to discount the value of the clip. Not the content of the book, which I haven't read, just the clip itself.

[cpwm17]

15. Thom Hartmann also wrote a conspiracy book with Lamar Waldron – allegedly

When someone on his show asked Thom Hartmann about the book that he supposedly help write, Thom Hartmann played dumb. I don't think Thom Hartmann really believes the B/S in the book that Lamar Waldron probably mostly wrote himself.