Bill Maher: Cornel West Clashes With Barney Frank Over Bernie Sanders

[betsuni]

Panel Debates How To Get Under Donald Trump's Skin

[Liberal In Red State]

1. It was heated . . . Frank was right on working within the system . . . If you saw overtime

they got West to admit that if it was between Hillary and Trump . . . He would cast a protest vote against Trump. I am so tired of the purists who are beginning to promote the 3rd party candidates with the . . . System is broke. We have a chance to vote to bury the right wing tea party Neanderthals. Hillary just barely winning is not enough . . . We need to swamp the ballot box! I don't care why people vote for Hillary . . . Just don't waste a vote on a 3rd party candidate. Did we learn nothing from 2000???????

[betsuni]

3. Yes, I just saw Overtime.

At least he finally had to admit to reality!

[Adenoid_Hynkel]

2. Cornell West is a grifter

Remember the "Poverty Tour" he and Tavis Smiley did against President Obama?

They only completed a handful of the dates, then simply checked the rest off on their map and went around saying they did them.

I've heard the two of them say repeatedly that they visited West Virginia when doing this imaginary tour.

They were never here, and I know people in media in the state who tried endlessly to contact them to find out when the date was supposed to happen, only to get stonewalled repeatedly by them.

[betsuni]

5. I'd forgotten about that!

Thanks for bringing that up.

[oberliner]

20. They lied about the poverty tour stops?

Do you have evidence of this?

[SunSeeker]

4. Barney has a very effective way of listing facts.

Loved how he ticked off the long list of ways the Clintons have helped poor people.

[betsuni]

6. I know, LOVED it!

[Liberal In Red State]

7. Loved it too! Barney has the advantage of having worked with Hillary in the trenches. Loved

how he said that the congressional wins came with a small majority. He knows from experience that progress is slow . . . But I really believe we have a chance to advance the ball on many issues for generations to come. Love . . . Love . . . Love Barney! Pragmatic Progressive!

[elleng]

8. Don't think I could stand watching this,

don't like (or respect) any of them. Hasn't always been this way.

[LittleGirl]

9. Thanks for posting

these clips. Really appreciate it.

[betsuni]

10. You're very welcome!

[lovemydog]

11. Alex Wagner, at about 9' on the first video

makes a great point. Liberals & activists, to get the change they desire, need to do much better at running candidates & winning elections at local and state levels.

[happydaze]

13. This kind of goes back to "party elite" system...

In many places, the establishment of the Dem party choose candidates that tend to be corporate, who will take money from wealthy donors, who will create PAC's, who will go out and "bring the money" into the party. It's incredibly hard to run an election if you are taking on an incumbent representative on the other side, it's even harder to do this when Dem Party leaders decide to push a candidate, and financially back and send out "big names" for "their" chosen candidate. That has been a reason why many older progressive, grassroots activists have left the party and left the party short handed when it comes to GOTV efforts.

The state I live in is a great example of Dem party refusing to listen to the grassroots who do the majority of the work, all for free, when they choose to back candidates that don't represent their values. What I'm incredibly happy about with Bernie's "political revolution" is that there are a slew of young people, 30 and under, who have now invested skin in the game, organized rallies, organized GOTV efforts, volunteered, worked their collective asses off, and truly made a candidate who started at 1% approval, into a "rock star" in the political arena. The ideas that started as "unicorn farts", are now main street ideals that people want out of the "richest nation" on the planet. Young people are now using their aps, time, and power to come into their own voices to be heard. AND the fact that the millennials want real change, focus on policy details, have the energy (that quite frankly many of us are losing trying to carry all the time), and they typically, incredibly inclusive with one another. They want to make a difference, they want a better world, they understand that they and their children will be handed an incredible threat from climate change. They will continue to push for bans on fracking. Fracking is worse than coal mines. We don't have the time to frack for the oil and gas industry, just because they buy politicians favors. It is environmentally bad for those who have to live in "fracked" areas, and it is incredibly bad for the planet in releasing methane gases (which is worse than CO2 as a greenhouse gas).

To me, I really believe, that the Dem party establishment needs to keep their hands off primary battles at local, county, and state levels (unless there is someone running who is incredibly dangerous - like a Trump of the left). It's incredibly hard to "fight the system" from the outside, its even harder in many places to get a true progressive candidate to win against the "party choice" and then again, against the Republican. Often times, if you do win, as a progressive, against an "establishment" candidate, the party will continue to turn its back on you, especially if your area is typically republican. If we could get money out of politics, our campaign seasons would probably be shorter, money wouldn't be the issue, ideas would be the issues, and grassroots efforts. Perhaps that Main Street Mom who wants to see gun laws enacted and mandatory maternity paid leave enacted or national daycare enacted or tuition free colleges enacted, would have a shot at running and winning. Perhaps we could get our congress and Senate to look more like America, instead of mostly white men from wealthy families, writing laws from country club perspectives. The party needs to be more inclusive to people and the establishment needs to stop choosing "play boys" disaffected from the Republican party, who really could care less about women's health care or tuition costs for college (their Daddy's sent them for free to an elite school).

So, let's just see how receptive the party is to the influx of young people who have had their energy grabbed up and inspired by Obama when they were teens, and harnessed by Bernie now that they are old enough to vote. I'm so glad that he ran and that we are seeing the next generation feel like they can make a difference and that their voices are important. Did you know, that even though many millennials are broke as jokes, that they are the MOST generous generation to give money and time to causes? They volunteer quite a lot. I wouldn't be surprised to see that they wouldn't endorse an idea or mandatory national service for a year, be it military or humanitarian or environmental... Bring young people out into the world, engage them in different experiences and culture... And bring those ideas and those experiences back into America to make this country better. Anyone who has been lucky enough to travel to Europe can tell you, there are better ways of doing things that could definitely help Americans out as citizens.

AND a really big deal would be to make voting and registering to vote incredibly easy, peasy... It should be an automatic when one becomes 18, and at that point, the parties probably should allow independents/ non- party affiliates to vote at that point or allow the first time one votes, after being registered, to assign their party at the polls. Being more inclusive to the democratic process may just get us a better system of addressing the very serious issues this country is facing.

[lovemydog]

19. Thanks for your thoughtful reply!

Welcome here happydaze.

Have a great weekend!

[randr]

14. One of the rare good points made by either other guest

As usual West overwhelmed the show with blather. One of the worst Real Times ever.
Reminded me of the old CrossFire before John Stewart ripped them a new asshole for just this sort of nonsense.

[Gothmog]

12. I got to shake Barney Franks hand at the convention

[ptownbro]

15. Barney Frank demonstrated what is often exactly wrong with Clinton supporters: they don't listen

Not always, but often.

While some may applaud him here for how great he was. I see it differently. While I like Mr. Frank and can appreciate all he has done in his career and even his passion in his support for Secretary Clinton.... All he did was talk over Mr West, interrupt him, and condescend. He did not listen once to what Mr. West had to say. Mr Frank in his mind already had it all figured out.

It's easy to think you're right when you close your ears and never listen to the other side.

Well Mr. Frank. You're wrong. And if you'd take the time to actually listen to the other side, you'd probably see where and why.

Debating a Clinton supporter these days has almost become like debating a Republican or conservative supporter... pointless.

[maddiemom]

16. Huh?

Poor Cornell West, he just doesn't know how to hold the floor. Mean Barney walked all over him and seemed to think he actually had the inside experience in government to prove his point. I'm afraid he may have caused Mr. West to be afraid to speak up in future.

[Fla Dem]

17. And as soon as the Democratic party platform included almost 100% of what Bernie wanted,

Cornel West endorsed Jill Stein. He was a wolf in sheep's clothing. They gave him a seat on the Democratic Platform Committee, and then he kicked sand in their faces,

Cornel West endorses Jill Stein

http://www.latimes.com/nation/politics/trailguide/la-na-trailguide-updates-1468606689-htmlstory.html

Not all of Bernie Sanders' high-profile supporters are backing Hillary Clinton.

In a sharply worded op-ed article in the Guardian, Cornel West, an influential scholar and civil rights activist who was a staunch supporter of Sanders in the Democratic presidential primaries, endorsed Green Party candidate Jill Stein, calling her the "only progressive woman in the race."

I'm not for TPP, and that was about the only major issue Bernie Sanders was pushing that wasn't included in the platform. The major reason is because President Obama is still working on negotiations that will do the least harm. To have an opposing position in the platform would have undermined his negotiations. But I tend to think given how much time is left in his administration TPP is done for this administration.

Here's a good read on HRC and the TPP as well as other positions.

Will Hillary Clinton Flip-Flop Again on TPP After Election Day? We Ask Her Adviser Joseph Stiglitz
JULY 28, 2016
Amy Goodman

http://www.democracynow.org/2016/7/28/will_hillary_clinton_flip_flop_again

I agree with most of what you said in your comments. Bernie has performed a great service if he has truly energized a generation of young Americans who will continue his progressive message and become involved in politics. I hope they do. He also has to continue to mentor them and provide direction. He's the adult in the room. It will be interesting to see if he continues his revolution or just goes back to the senate and fades away.

I agree with you on this as well. While many focus on the national elections; Pres, Congress, & Senate, it's really at the local levels where we Dems, Liberals, Progressives, whatever label you want to use, have fallen short. So much of what has negatively changed America in the last 20 years, started at the local and state levels. The RW has dominated many Red State elections and their govenors and legislators have passed ridiculously terrible laws. The Democratic Party will welcome with open arms serious, committed, qualified candidates. However, if all they want to do is rail against the party, then it will be hard for the party to put their full support behind them.

Registering to vote should be as easy as getting a library card. You apply, your citizenship is verified, you are registered. You should also be able to do it my mail. But I don't agree with open primaries. If someone has not declared their party affiliation within some time limit before the primaries (90 Days), why should they be able to vote in that party's primary? The party is voting for their candidates.

I don't want my primary vote nullified by some Karl Rove operative who can walk into a voting booth with no party affiliation and cast their vote for the expressed desire to cancel my vote out and who has no vested interest in the person they voted for except to disrupt.

Thanks for your thoughtful post.

[pbmus]

18. Cornell was just wrong last night on so many issues ...

I believe he is starting to be out of touch with the reality of truth ...

[JCanete]

22. what the shit? As much as Frank trashed Bernie in the primaries

he's going to come back and pretend like he's pro Bernie and Bernie's approach? Saying that Bernie's movement has been important and effective is really nice after basically suggesting that he was dead wrong over the last few months.

Also, continuing to say that you can take money and not be influenced is nice and all, and probably true, but you can't keep not being influenced and keep getting money!

I'm sorry, but if Hillary had been good on Wall Street reform we wouldn't have had her repeat more than once that she "basically" told them to cut it out. Seriously? She had to parse a non-legislative scolding with basically?

I'm going to vote for her in the GE, but I"m not exactly sure why somebody getting paid by the industry is the person I should trust when it comes to whether or not its being effectively regulated. I've appreciated Barney Frank for his brilliant rhetoric against the GOP, and he's not all bad to me now, but he's not exactly an impartial actor here.