Haaretz: Kerry ceasefire proposal called for open Israel-Gaza borders (updated)

[Jefferson23]

BETHLEHEM (Ma'an) -- A draft of US Secretary of State John Kerry's ceasefire proposal that was shown to Israeli officials on Friday called for the opening of Gaza-Israel border crossings and ensuring "the economic livelihood" of Palestinians in the Strip, an Israeli newspaper reported Sunday.

The document, titled "Framework for Humanitarian Ceasefire in Gaza," also said a lasting truce would make possible the "transfer of funds to Gaza for the payment of salaries for public employees," Haaretz reported.

According to the report, the proposed ceasefire would also "address all security concerns."

Israel would not be allowed to continue its operation to destroy tunnels during the initial ceasefire, the draft reportedly stipulated.

http://www.maannews.net/eng/ViewDetails.aspx?ID=716522

[oberliner]

1. An article about an article

Here's the actual Ha'aretz article with the actual Ha'aretz reporting and the actual draft of the actual document itself:

http://www.haaretz.com/news/diplomacy-defense/.premium-1.607379

Hats off to Ma'an for the Cliff's Notes version!

[Jefferson23]

2. Snark ready, how nice, oberliner.n/t

[geek tragedy]

26. That is what caused the Israelis to call

John Kerry a terrorist? Oops , I'm sorry, they accused him of launching "a strategic terrorist attack."

Things have gone past the point of no return there.

Let them figure out how to deal with the 500 million people around them without our 'interference.'

[JDPriestly]

62. Sorry. But if that is the Kerry proposal (I doubt that it is), it does not

sufficiently deal with Israel's number one concern: security.

It deals with some of the Palestinian concerns and is in that respect helpful, but it does not deal with how Israelis can be secured.

The tunnels should be removed.

The US removes tunnels when we find them leading from Mexico. That is a question of national sovereignty.

Helping the economic situation in Palestine is a great idea, but it can't work if Israel feels insecure. Both sides have just grievances. If we are to have peace, we have to make sure that the grievances on each side are dealt with.

[geek tragedy]

74. Seriously? Cease fire doesn't mean "continue to blow stuff up" nt

[JDPriestly]

75. No. It doesn't. Not on either side.

[Jefferson23]

3. Obama demands an immediate, unconditional ceasefire in Gaza

Senior US official calls reports of Kerry truce draft, that imply secretary of state betrayed Israel, 'inaccurate and insulting.'

Yitzhak Benhorin, Attila Somfalvi, Elior Levy
Published: 07.28.14, 00:00 / Israel News

US President Barack Obama spoke to Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu on the phone on Sunday, demanding an immediate and unconditional humanitarian ceasefire that would later lead to a permanent end to hostilities in Gaza based on the 2012 ceasefire agreement reached at the end of Operation Pillar of Defense.

The conversation between the two came at the end of a tense day for Israeli-American diplomatic relations.
Israeli officials slammed US Secretary of State John Kerry after a document allegedly presenting his ceasefire proposal was published by Haaretz.

The document, that was is supposed to serve as the basis of ceasefire negotiations between Hamas and Israel, reportedly made scarce reference to Israel's security needs.

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4550899,00.html

[JDPriestly]

63. This rings true. The propsal was very one-sided, pro-Palestinian.

It did not speak to the question of Israeli security, a legitimate concern on the part of Israelis.

[Jefferson23]

71. JD, when has the US ever been lopsided on behalf of the Palestinians?

The proposal was the most reasonable I have ever seen from the US.

[JDPriestly]

76. I doubt that was the real proposal. We shall wait and see.

Doesn't sound to me like it would work at all. I suspect it is not a true account of what happened.

[bemildred]

4. UN council agrees on demand for Gaza cease-fire

UNITED NATIONS (AP) -- The U.N. Security Council has agreed on a statement calling for "an immediate and unconditional humanitarian cease-fire" in the Gaza fighting between Israel and Hamas and is meeting at midnight to adopt it.

Rwanda, the current council president, announced agreement Sunday on a presidential statement which also calls on the parties "to engage in efforts to achieve a durable and fully respected cease-fire, based on the Egyptian initiative."

The council will meet as Muslims celebrate the Eid al-Fitr holiday marking the end of the fasting month of Ramadan.

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/UN_UNITED_NATIONS_ISRAEL_PALESTINIANS?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2014-07-27-21-49-34

[HooptieWagon]

45. Hmmm... the US didn't veto?

That's encouraging. And Netanyahu should heed the warning shot fired across his bow. If not, hopefully Obama's stronger message is a full broadside.

[bemildred]

46. No, apparently not.

I believe part of the Israeli's outrage is because of that.

I think that was intended to get Bibi's attention, but he appears to have decided to ignore it. He seems to see it as an existential crisis for Israel. He could well be right.

And you have to keep in mind that hand-wringing is the usual US policy in these things, we always view them with regret and alarm and then veto any real sanctions. So watch to see what happens when a resolution with teeth in it comes along.

[Jefferson23]

5. Obama presses Netanyahu: It is imperative to reach immediate humanitarian cease-fire

Senior U.S. official: Israeli criticism of Kerry was 'extremely offensive.'

By Barak Ravid | 23:22 27.07.14 |

U.S. President Barack Obama called Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu on Sunday, the third such call since the launch of the IDF operation in Gaza. Obama stressed to Netanyahu that it is "strategically imperative" to reach an immediate humanitarian cease-fire "that ends hostilities now and leads to a permanent cessation of hostilities based on the November 2012 ceasefire agreement,".

http://www.haaretz.com/news/diplomacy-defense/.premium-1.607501

[bemildred]

6. Hmm. That sounds pretty affrimative. "strategically imperative". 'extremely offensive". nt

[Jefferson23]

7. I think so too, sounds like they have about had it. n/t

[shaayecanaan]

9. Haven't we thought that before, though...

too many times, too many times...

[bemildred]

11. Yeah, you have to watch out for the old bait-and-switch.

But I don't think you need to inform the Palestinians that the Israelis can't be trusted.

[Jefferson23]

12. Too many times is right. I can explain how I interpret this latest have had it moment..for what

it's worth. I see this as a call for ending the violence for a number of reasons, Obama
knows on some level the longer Bibi and his cronies drop off into the abyss destroying
Gaza it will get harder for his administration to give them political cover. I realize that
has never been much of a concern in the past, this time is different. Despite the
Goldstone recantation from OCL, of which those who do study this conflict closely and
for whom I am no match by any stretch of the imagination, feel that Goldstone
gave Israel a carte blanch for future war crimes. Imho, I understand why they feel
that way but I see it a bit different..1000 dead, 6000 wounded, mostly civilians.
How many more times can this type of monstrous act occur before the repercussions
are out of the hands of the US to protect? Israel has lost a great deal, once coined
the Pariah State, these actions when you already see the amount of press attention
to their pathetic pretext for destroying Gaza being exposed, a pariah state description
is fast becoming an understatement.

Bibi's racist cabinet is not making it easy either, they are calling out for blood in such a blatant
manner..not sure I have ever seen anything quite like it before.

Primarily, Obama/Kerry want to get back to the Kerry Plan, and they want it done before
they leave office. Abbas was apparently going to accept before the peace negotiations fell apart.

The hope rests in a few areas of leverage that Meshal may have with the tunnels to negotiate for
the Palestinians to receive a viable state, not a Bantustan. In return giving up arms and especially
all the tunnel information..which appears is more sophisticated than Israel's intelligence was telling
them in the past.

Also, I have no idea if Nazzralah is serious about supporting Hamas, and to what
extent, but Israel should not be taking that lightly..Israel knows they can't carpet bomb all of
Palestine. If they end up fighting on the ground, that is not a place Israel wants to be. Not sure
about Iran, either..other than money for aid.

I see glimmers of possibilities, yet there are too many agendas and there will be bad actors
looking to sabotage coming events.

[King_David]

14. That's funny ,

Israel has always been a parish state and always will be a pariah state no matter what happens , no matter what concessions no matter left , right , center government no matter if adversary or poster is posting in extremist right wing left wing or center forum .... Because it is the Jewish state - period.

[Jefferson23]

15. They have never ended the occupation, just an fyi...bad strawman there.n/t

[King_David]

18. According to Hamas Israel has been occupied since 1948

The Jewish state was a pariah state way before 1967 and and it always will be ...
It's the Jewish State part of Israel that makes it so.

[Jefferson23]

19. What are you rejecting here? No two state solution? No viable state for the Palesrtinians?

You don't trust Meshal's recent words but you want the Palestinians to trust Bibi..is that it?

Your comments make no sense to me.

[King_David]

20. Of course they don't

You said Israel will become a pariah state .... No matter what the topic or issue is , Israel always has been and always will be a pariah state as long as it's a Jewish state .

[Jefferson23]

22. According to you, ok. n/t

[stranger81]

23. I don't believe that at all.

I think that, by and large, the international community really wants to get behind Israel and genuinely want it to succeed. Some, but not all, of that goodwill is generated by sympathy for the obviously terrible plight of the people who fled there. It is true that there are some states that do not have good will towards Israel; some of them are probably intractably opposed to it so long as it purports to be a state exclusively for people who are not its native inhabitants, and some of them are probably "persuadables" who may eventually come to have good relationships with Israel, depending on its future conduct.

The problem is that Israel, for the last several decades, has been taking offensive action against territories it is occupying in violation of international law -- in other words, international normative standards of conduct -- and its choice to do that has alienated some of the countries that would otherwise find themselves naturally inclined to support Israel.

One thing's for sure: the only country that has the power to alter Israel's standing in the international community is Israel. It can choose to stop this brutal, illegal, immoral and incredibly destructive campaign at any time of its choosing. The country could choose tomorrow to begin treating the people they displaced like persons of worth and value equal to their own. They won't do that, of course, but there are no external obstacles preventing them from choosing a saner, more humane path.

[King_David]

24. That's funny too,

As the great Abba Ebban said :


If Algeria introduced a resolution declaring that the earth was flat and that Israel had flattened it, it would pass by a vote of 164 to 13 with 26 abstentions.

Abba Eban


Read more at http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/a/abbaeban167935.html#5liZBm6jV4cb0mrV.99

[stranger81]

25. You're not comprehending any of this, are you.

I do not sense that you have any desire here for a genuine exchange of views.

There's a word for posters of that nature.

[King_David]

29. Welcome to IP

I hope you continue to contribute to our group even after the current Gaza crisis is over.

[stranger81]

32. Been here for years, actually . . . .

just dropped off for a while after a particular poster joined and started contributing roughly half of the posts on the board. I understand that for at least for a short time, that won't be the case anymore, so I've wandered back over.

[oberliner]

31. I don't think they'd get to 13 anymore

Possibly 5.

[King_David]

34. LOL yes that's true .

[sabbat hunter]

43. the occupation

is legal under international law, it is the settlements that are illegal.

[stranger81]

44. The way Israel is going about conducting its occupation is manifestly illegal.

As the occupying force, it has an obligation not to use military force against the occupied civilian population in order to put down resistance. It also has an obligation to provide for the safety and security of the population it's occupying. Israel is fulfilling none, and actively flouting all, of these obligations.

[JDPriestly]

64. How is this supposed to work?

"As the occupying force, it has an obligation not to use military force against the occupied civilian population in order to put down resistance."

Occupying forces, almost by definition, use military or police force to put down resistances in the occupied territory. How else could the occupying force continue to occupy the territory.

Please clarify.

We used force to quell resistance in the areas we occupied after WWII. I don't understand what you mean.

[stranger81]

66. Occupying forces, by international law, are bound to use only police force -- NOT military force --

to put down resistance from an occupied population.

Of course, ideally, international law discourages occupation in the first place. There's always that alternative.

[JDPriestly]

68. If Palestine were capable of putting down the resistance of its own extremists,

there would be peace, a two-state solution and the future possibility of one state of people of diverse religions living in tolerance one day. Not tomorrow, but one day. The two-state solution would be a first step. But before they can have that, Palestinians have to be able to police themselves to keep the peace. Same for Israelis. But with Israel, the violence comes from the government forces. That is easier to end than violence that arises spontaneously from the people of nation with little experience in self-government and self-policing.

[stranger81]

69. The fact remains that if the Palestinians are unable to control resistance forces themselves,

international law entitles Israel only to use police force to respond to those elements itself -- not military force against a captive, occupied civilian population. A military campaign of any sort in response to Hamas rockets is outside the bounds of international law -- much less a military campaign that has so far resulted in a civilian death rate upwards of 80%.

[geek tragedy]

27. Ok, then no need to mooch off the US taxpayer

and come crying to us every time the UN issues a criticism.

[King_David]

28. As Sbba Ebban said about the UN

If Algeria introduced a resolution declaring that the earth was flat and that Israel had flattened it, it would pass by a vote of 164 to 13 with 26 abstentions.

Abba Eban


Read more at http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/a/abbaeban167935.html#5liZBm6jV4cb0mrV.99

[geek tragedy]

30. The USA has a lot of true friends who belong to the UN

Israel is not one of them.

[King_David]

33. USA and Israel and Canada and Australia

Obama would disagree with you but you righ Israel hasn't got many friends at the UN because it is a Jewish state.( USA excepted)

[geek tragedy]

35. Obama will say what he has to politically.

Israel's behavior is why it is a pariah. Colonialism is not popular anywhere.

Just ask Israel's dear friends, apartheid South Africa.

[King_David]

38. Nothing new since 1948

That's why Abba Ebban said what he said.

[geek tragedy]

39. Well, the 48 years of military occupation

has happened. Apartheid was unequivocally rejected by every member of the UN (except for Israel).

The world has changed for the better, Israel has gone in the opposite direction. Liberal Zionism was a reality back then. Now it's an oxymoron.

[King_David]

40. Your "feelings" on the Jewish State are clear

Thanks for sharing and again it's nothing new and your in sync majority on this with the rest of the world view.

It is part of the reason Israel really does exist and is supported by vast majority of worlds Jewish people.

[geek tragedy]

41. Contemptible but typical. Keep projecting, becaue it's very well known

Last edited Mon Jul 28, 2014, 09:19 PM - Edit history (1)

that Israel itself is more racist than the most racist state in the United States.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2012/oct/23/israeli-poll-majority-apartheid-policies

[Jefferson23]

8. IDF hits 20 Gaza targets between ceasefires

Total of Palestinian casualties rises to 1,031, with over 6,000 wounded; Palestinians say IDF attacked car in
Khan Younis, killing one.

Ynetnews, News Agencies
Latest Update: 07.27.14, 20:27

The IAF attacked over 20 terrorist targets in the Gaza Strip on Sunday in between humanitarian ceasefires, including smuggling tunnels, rocket launchers, and terrorist infrastructure.

The IDF destroyed several smuggling tunnels in the south of the Gaza Strip and forces in the north have almost completed eliminating another. In addition, three more shafts leading into the tunnels were discovered.

Fighting subsided in Gaza on Sunday after Hamas said it backed a 24-hour humanitarian truce, but there was no sign of any comprehensive deal to end their conflict with Israel.

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4550824,00.html

[JDPriestly]

65. Seems to me that the Israelis should provide supplies for Palestinians, the things

they need and then close the smuggling tunnels. No tunnels should be needed or permitted. Tunnels underground between nations are unnecessary and can harbor and hide crimes of all kinds. The tunnels should be destroyed and supplies should be provided over land.

[Jefferson23]

70. Right, but they did not and now they should be negotiating to get information and

deal with this by advancing a political solution and stop the bombing and killing.

The Palestinians must have a viable state, no bantustan.

[JDPriestly]

77. The Palestinians have never shown they could create a viablle state for themselves.

They always get waylaid. Whether that is due to the outside influence of Israel or some group of Palestinians in some other country makes no difference. It always tets waylaid. That makes the Paelstinians look like they cannot enforce law, mush less a peace.

I have an idea as to how they could get a long-term peace plan going that would start in small increments and extend over a period of years. I will post it later.

[Jefferson23]

78. No one can build a viable state when the land and resources are cut off from you.

You seem to think the Palestinians are not entitled to these basics in life, and Israel
has demonstrated they have no intention of conceding the land to allow for that to
occur...thus the resistance.

Gaza, one example:The Gaza Strip: A Case of Economic De,Development
http://www.palestine-studies.org/files/pdf/jps/1069.pdf

[JDPriestly]

83. The Palestinians strted out with plenty of land and then started war after war

with Israel (I think that Israel may have started one of the wars as I recall) and lost over and over. They would be much better off today if they had competed with Israel to make the land they had serve their people and joined with Israel to make a good life for each person in the area. Instead they fought and wasted resources on losing over and over. They need to come to terms with the facts that a) they need help and b) war is not the answer, especially for them.

All the shaming of Israel, all the pointing of fingers will not do a bit of good for Palestine unless Israel feels reasonably secure.

Qatar, a country mentioned in the article cited in the OP as proposing negotiating points for the Palestinians has a per capita income of 93,352. (2013)

In the US the per capita income is only 53,143.

United Arab Emirates is 41,692.

Saudi Arabia: 25,852.

Compare to Mexico at 10,307.

If countries like the UAE, Saudi Arabia and Qatar wish to help the Palestinians, they should help them build an infrastructure where they are and discourage them from fighting Israel.

If you look at the situation strategically, Israel has no reason to fight with Palestinians other than to insure its security. That is why I think the key to ending the killing is starting programs of development in Palestine and perhaps repatriation of land in exchange for security. But Palestinians have to demonstrate a willingness and ability to enforce security before Israel can afford to risk it.

Above all, the Palestinians need to close the tunnels to Israel. It's the rockets but als the Palestinians emerging from tunnels into Israel or at least stories about those events that angered Israel. Israel does have the right to defend itself.

[Jefferson23]

84. I appreciate you explaining your perspective on the conflict, I sincerely do. Yet we have

deep differences based on the history of the conflict and what led to the present day crisis
and how it can be resolved. I'll leave it there, and know that we both look to see equity
for both sides..they each deserve that, at a minimum.

[JDPriestly]

87. Yes. Equity and peace for both sides.

[Israeli]

10. MK Danon: 'We need a ceasefire from Obama's attacks'

MK Danny Danon responded to US President Barack Obama's demand for an unconditional ceasefire saying, "We need a ceasefire from the attacks coming from Obama and the government in Washington........."

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4550897,00.html

[Jefferson23]

13. He is a reliable jerk, isn't he? lol

[Israeli]

36. ...a reliable Right wing jerk Jefferson....

So says his own website :

Danny Danon ...
A REAL Likudnik .
Thinks Right ! Does Right ! .

http://www.dannydanon.com/eng/

In an August 2011 interview with Teymoor Nabili on Al Jazeera English, Mr. Danon said "There is place only for one state on the land of Israel.... I do not believe in a two-state solution "

http://www.aljazeera.com/programmes/talktojazeera/2011/08/201185103022120129.html

He loves Glenn Beck and Fox news ...

Hates Obama and the Israeli Left .

At least he is honest ....which is about the best thing I could say about Danny Danon .

[Jefferson23]

37. Yes, he puts it out there, very proud it seems too. n/t

[Jefferson23]

16. Netanyahu: Gaza operation won't end until tunnels destroyed

PM: World must demand demilitarization of Gaza; at least four Israelis killed by Gaza mortar fire; rocket barrage fired at north; Palestinians: Three killed in IDF strike on Gaza hospital.


By Haaretz | Jul. 28, 2014 | 8:37 PM

Latest updates (Monday):

8:28 P.M. Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu says that Israel is prepared for a prolonged operation in Gaza, with striking its tunnels as the first and necessary toward demilitarizing the coastal territories.

"There is no war more just than this," Netanyahu said, adding that it had been a difficult day, following reports of fatalities.

"Bravery and determination are needed to fight a terror group which seeks our destruction," he says, adding that the operation would not end before the tunnels from the Gaza Strip are neutralized. "We must be prepared for a prolonged campaign," Netanyahu says.

8:18 P.M. Projectile lands outside in an open area in Eshkol Regional Council. (Shirly Seidler)

http://www.haaretz.com/news/diplomacy-defense/1.607542

[R. Daneel Olivaw]

48. The goalposts always move with Bibi babykiller.

He first blamed Hamas for the deaths of three settlers, without providing proof.

Next he moved on to outrage for Hamas firing rockets in response for Israel attacking Hamas.

After that it was on to killing civilians and children.

Now it's the tunnels.

Oh what does Bibi baby killer have up his sleeve next? Does he want the Palestinians to stop breathing in order for there to be peace?

I hope Obama gives the fucking jerk an ultimatum, and if Bibi balks then Obama should just let the UN vote on sanctions to shut Israel down.

[Jefferson23]

50. If this were exclusive to Palestinians, then I don't know how forceful Obama would be.

But we now have this looming, bemildred posted earlier: Iran and Hizbullah Announce Military Support for Gaza.

That's what makes this different, one can only hope he will make an unprecedented move
to intervene against Israel to stop this before all hell breaks lose. How leaders imagine they
can control what happens after these hostilities begin is beyond my understanding..seems
like pure fantasy to me.

[azurnoir]

52. even a week ago Hezbollah did not seem all too anxious to get involved

I guess we'll see whether this is just political jabbering or real actions in the coming days

[Jefferson23]

53. It surprised me, Hamas had virtually no means of significant support. I can't ignore the

concern/actions Obama has recently expressed, his insistence that it end..perhaps because
their intelligence is telling them that Hizbullah and Iran are not bullshitting...or don't take the
chance they're willing to get involved. I have said before, when Hizbullah made such strong
statements, that is worrisome..they have a reputation I think they would like to maintain,and
I don't know if they have a history of dick waving and then shutting up. We'll find out soon
enough..ugh.

[Jefferson23]

57. Jumblatt, Nasrallah agree Israel logic is ‘killing’

Jul. 28, 2014 | 11:05 AM

The Daily Star

BEIRUT: Progressive Socialist Party leader Walid Jumblatt said he and Hezbollah chief Sayyed Hasan Nasrallah agree that Israel’s fundamental principle was the logic of power and killing.

“ Sayyed Hasan Nasrallah and I have reached a common conviction that the logic of Israel is the logic of power, arrogance and killing,” Jumblatt said in remarks published Monday by the local newspaper As-Safir.

He cited the 1982 Israeli siege of Beirut followed by the Sabra and Shatila massacres and the 1996 Qana massacre and the successive wars.

Jumblatt met Nasrallah for more than two hours Saturday night. The two leaders discussed the Israeli war on Gaza, the presidential election crisis in Lebanon and the turmoil in Syria and Iraq.

The Druze MP said he had a desire to meet Nasrallah to “hear his assessment [on Gaza], particularly since Palestine is the core [issue] for the Arab and Islamic world.”

“We have reached a common conclusion that Hamas and Gaza will come out victorious," he said.

Nasrallah Friday vowed “all means of support” for Gaza.

Read more: http://www.dailystar.com.lb/News/Lebanon-News/2014/Jul-28/265361-jumblatt-nasrallah-agree-israel-logic-is-killing.ashx#ixzz38pe9QV64
(The Daily Star :: Lebanon News :: http://www.dailystar.com.lb)

[azurnoir]

61. Don't know quite what to make of that

I wonder how did they reach that conclusion?

[Jefferson23]

72. I can't imagine.

[R. Daneel Olivaw]

54. Yep. I read that and responded. Shit.

Have you ever read On the Beach?

[Jefferson23]

55. The nuke story, right? No, I have not. n/t

[R. Daneel Olivaw]

56. It partially takes place in the Mid East as things get out of hand, and then

it spirals out of control.

Now I am not saying that will happen, but if the other players get involved...which I'm not sure if they will then things could get out of hand very fast.


BTW: You'd like the book. It takes place in Melbourne.

[Jefferson23]

58. Thanks. n/t

[azurnoir]

59. I have have you ever seen the movie

it's a really old movie at that like Gregory Peck and Ava Gardener old and considering I was a little kid when I saw it., It scared the shit out of me first timme I considered the fact that we could wipe ourselves out

[R. Daneel Olivaw]

60. I read the book a long time ago, and saw the movie as well in film class.

Almost 30 years ago now.

We really aren't that far from a nuclear war, we just have the illusion that we aren't.

All it takes is one crazy leader, on any side, and mistaken intentions on the other.


You'd probably have better odds with a zombie apocalypse or captain trips than a nuclear war.

[azurnoir]

67. I'd take the captain anyday

especially considering the only time I get sick is when I actually have the flu shot

[stranger81]

49. No war more just than one that kills 80% civilians, more than 200 of them children?

Bibi is a monster.

[Jefferson23]

51. He is responsible, him and his sick cabinet...yes. n/t

[Jefferson23]

17. Israel’s Gaza Campaign Endangers US Security: Why Obama & Kerry are Furious

By Juan Cole | Jul. 28, 2014 |


The United States as a great Power is facing a large number of challenges in the Muslim world, and Israel’s Gaza campaign is endangering both American diplomacy there and the very security of the US. Given the series of setbacks for the US in the Middle East, in Iraq, Syria, Afghanistan and Egypt, Israeli PM Binyamin Netanyahu could scarcely have chosen a worst time to kill hundreds of Palestinian civilians in the full light of world media.

The ability of an al-Qaeda offshoot, the so-called “Islamic State,” to take substantial territory in Syria and northern Iraq has alarmed Washington. The US embassy in Baghdad is in as much danger as the capital itself from IS violence. IS recruiting, and the radicalization of Muslim youth, is given enormous help by the scenes of Israeli munitions killing Palestinian civilians.

As security deteriorates to unprecedented lows in Libya, the US has had to pull its ambassador and her staff from Tripoli. Fundamentalist radicals in Benghazi and elsewhere, already suspicious of the US, are seeing blood because of America’s statements in support of the Israeli military campaign. The radicals already despise the US, but one doesn’t want to give them recruitment tools among the general population, most of which had been grateful for the help with overthrowing Gaddafi.

Even long-term allies of the US in the region are disturbed by the Israeli campaign. Turkey is a member of NATO, which the US is actually pledged to defend from attack. Prime Minister Tayyip Erdogan has been scathing about the Israeli attack on Gaza, calling it a “genocide.” There is even a possibility that Turkey will send another Mavi Marmara-style aid ship to Gaza, this time flanked by Turkish destroyers. For the US, few dilemmas are more foreboding than a military conflict between its two most important Middle East allies.

Many Egyptians, both civilian and military, blame the US for having supported the Muslim Brotherhood in 2012-2013. In fact, the US was simply dealing with the government then in power. Egyptian anchors speak darkly of a plot by the US to impose fundamentalist rule and to partition Egypt. Many Egyptians deeply dislike Hamas, but virtually the entire population of Egypt wants to see the Israeli attacks on Gaza stop. To have high US officials defend it is distasteful to them.

http://www.juancole.com/2014/07/campaign-endangers-security.html

[Jefferson23]

21. Did Israel go too Far? The Massacre at the UN School/ Refugee Center

By Juan Cole | Jul. 26, 2014 |

Sharif Abdel Kouddous reports for The Nation from Gaza on the Israeli shelling of a UN school that killed 16 and wounded 200, even though the school’s coordinates had been given to the Israeli military. Despite Israeli water-muddying, there isn’t any doubt that the Israelis struck the school, nor is there any evidence that the school was an origin point for any Hamas rockets. Indeed, correspondents on the ground find no evidence for Hamas using civilians as human shields.

CBS explains that the Israeli military contacted the UN and told them that the compound would be attacked by Israel. The UN replied that they would need time to move the large number of refugees sheltering there. They tried to cooperate. They never heard back from the Israeli army, and then Israeli tanks opened fire. It is outrageous that Israeli media spokesmen attempted to assert or imply that the school was hit by Hamas rockets. They were lying pure and simple. Because the Israeli generals had already told the UN that they were going to shell the school!

I don’t think it is any accident that soon thereafter, Israel announced a unilateral ceasefire for Saturday (though it had already violated the ceasefire by Saturday morning). The images of dead children and of reckless and illegal shelling of civilian structures where there were no militants or munitions have piled up in the World’s consciousness, and even though the Israeli leadership likes to pose as macho, they are open to being pressured, and they are being heavily pressured, by the outside world.

Likewise, the eruption of large demonstrations on the West Bank must be worrisome to the Netanyahu government, since it would stretch the Israeli army thin to try to have it police both Gaza and the whole West Bank. Worse, the West Bank protesters are secular Fateh types, and are more sympathetic figures to the Arab neighbors like Egypt than are Hamas. Cracking down on them won’t be as relatively cost-free as the Israeli campaign against Hamas, which is disliked by the governments of most of Israel’s Arab neighbors or near neighbors. Still, the ceasefire is so far a phony ceasefire, and unless the siege on Gaza is lifted any ceasefire is just a prelude to another war.

http://www.juancole.com/2014/07/refugee-center-shells.html

[Jefferson23]

42. Israel should consider Hamas’ cease-fire offer more seriously ( Opinion )

Could Hamas be offering Israel the best interim agreement ever offered by an Arab administration?

By Nicolas Pelham | 14:00 28.07.14

Before dismissing Hamas’ offer for a cease-fire, Israel might pause for a moment to ask whether it is looking a gift-horse in the mouth and then slaughtering it. Unlike Hamas’s previous terms for a ten-year hudna, or truce, the movement is not demanding an Israeli withdrawal from East Jerusalem, or indeed any settlement, or one inch of territory. It is not pinning an armistice on the return of one...

http://www.haaretz.com/opinion/.premium-1.607604

[Jefferson23]

47. Monday 28 Jul 2014 Deaths rise on both sides in Gaza and Israel

July 28

Israel’s government says it will continue with the military operation and that it persist until it has destroyed the threat of Hamas’s tunnels.

IDF says it has “proof” that the blast that hit Shifa hospital came from within Gaza City.

:: Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu says Israel needs to be prepared for an operation “that will take time”.

:: Hamas fighters have penetrated Israel from Gaza, entering a village and clashing with Israeli soldiers. The Israeli military reports five Palestinian fighters were killed, while Hamas claims it has killed 10 Israeli soldiers.

:: Four people in southern Israel have been killed by a Palestinian mortar strike, which injured a number of others – according to Israeli officials.

- See more at: http://blogs.channel4.com/paul-mason-blog/live-gaza-hopes-ceasefire-raised/1422#sthash.jZ9mLBbp.dpuf

[Jefferson23]

73. Bennett: Destruction of tunnels not enough - Hamas must be completely defeated

Economy Minister criticizes Netanyahu's remarks that wiping out tunnels is main target of operation.

By Barak Ravid | Jul. 29, 2014

Economy Minister Naftali Bennett lashed out at Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu on Tuesday over the latter's stated policy regarding the goals of the war in Gaza.

In a statement to the press, Bennett publicly countered Netanyahu's declarations of demolishing Hamas' terror tunnels as the primary goal of the operation – saying that it was the "defeat of Hamas" that Israel should consider as the ultimate target of the war.

Bennett nevertheless said that he did not support a full reoccupation of the Gaza Strip. Israel must operate in order to "forcefully root out Hamas' faith in its ability to win."

"The tunnels are not the root of this problem," Bennett. "They are strategic avenues for destroying Hamas. What needs to be done? A target must be marked: the demilitarization of Gaza, as in Judea and Samaria [West Bank]. No missiles, no tunnels. The IDF must be given a clear task: Make that happen."

http://www.haaretz.com/news/diplomacy-defense/1.607836

[bemildred]

80. Derp.

"The tunnels are not the root of this problem," Bennett. "They are strategic avenues for destroying Hamas. What needs to be done? A target must be marked: the demilitarization of Gaza, as in Judea and Samaria . No missiles, no tunnels. The IDF must be given a clear task: Make that happen." ]/b]

[Jefferson23]

81. At least you know with this guy where he is coming from, one of the no holds barred guys, I call

them...aka, The Death Squad.

[bemildred]

82. No idea what to do either, just mindless violence as a solution to everything. nt

[Jefferson23]

85. Types like this accomplish nothing, his dangerous ideas can spread and become

acceptable..the irony being, in his mind the other side is the only place you'll find barbarians.

[bemildred]

86. Oh, he is a barbarian, all right. Reminds me of Ted Cruz. nt

[Jefferson23]

79. Hamas denies agreeing to 24-hour humanitarian ceasefire

GAZA CITY (Ma'an) -- Hamas on Tuesday denied that it had accepted a deal for a humanitarian ceasefire for 24 hours, contrary to earlier reports.

Hamas spokesman Sami Abu Zuhri said that "Yasser Abed Rabbu's statement that Hamas agreed to a ceasefire for 24 hours is not true and has nothing to do with the resistance's stand."

"We will consider a ceasefire when Israel commits to it with international guarantees," Abu Zuhri added.

The Palestinian leadership had earlier declared they were "prepared" for an immediate humanitarian ceasefire for 24 hours, after Israeli bombardment since midnight had killed more than 100 Palestinians and injured hundreds, as well as knocking out the Gaza Strip's sole power plant.

http://www.maannews.net/eng/ViewDetails.aspx?ID=716838