Updated: A poll for the modification of the SOP

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

Last edited Tue Oct 23, 2012, 01:43 PM - Edit history (2)

Proposed: Discuss the right to keep and bear arms relating to laws, the Second Amendment and the use of firearms for self-defense, committing crimes and violence.



ETA: As I read the current SOP, laws which are not gun control measures nor the actual second amendment can only be discussed in relation to a crime or an instance of self-defense or other violence. This would IMHO exclude the discussion of laws such as SYG as it is not a "gun control law".

Sorry for any confusion.

4 votes, 4 passes | Time left: Unlimited
	In favor of this change
	3 (75%)
	Against this and favor the current SOP
	1 (25%)
	Against this and favor an SOP which I'll post below
	0 (0%)
	4 DU members did not wish to select any of the options provided.
Show usernames Disclaimer: This is an Internet poll

[Trunk Monkey]

1. It's already been made quite clear the SOP for this group isn't going to change NT

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

6. re: "It's already been made quite clear..."

I only recall that an expansion to topics beyond laws, crime and rights being denied.

[Trunk Monkey]

10. After reading your edit I admit you have an interesting premise

I'm interested to see what happens

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

11. me, too

[Glaug-Eldare]

2. I don't see the need for a change.

The proposed SOP and the current SOP are so close together, I don't see what difference it would really make.

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

5. Mostly, I just wanted to make explicit...

...that laws relating to the RKBA whether gun control laws or laws like SYG were within the SOP. Many folks read things rather literally.

It was clear to me when I wrote the proposed SOP but now I see that it was not clear to others when they compared the OP to the SOP.

[Glaug-Eldare]

7. Ah, I see what you mean.

Now that you explained the reasoning, I've withdrawn my "no" vote. I don't think it's necessary, considering gun rights legislation is regularly covered here without issue, but it'd be a good thing to change if/when the SOP is committed to more substantial revision. Thanks for the clarification!

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

8. You're welcome

Best regards

[holdencaufield]

3. I'm confused ...

"Proposed: Discuss the right to keep and bear arms relating to laws, the Second Amendment and the use of firearms for self-defense, committing crimes and violence. "



Are we not doing that now?

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

4. Responding to this post as it's most recent

As I read the current SOP, laws which are not gun control measures nor the actual second amendment can only be discussed in relation to a crime or an instance of self-defense or other violence. This would IMHO exclude the discussion of laws such as SYG as it is not a "gun control law". (All in the wording)



Probably best to forget it. I may be over thinking the whole thing.

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

9. OP updated n/t

[ellisonz]

12. lol

SYG is a self-defense law - did you miss the part of the SOP that says clearly you can discuss "the use of firearms for self-defense."

[SecularMotion]

13. The gunners seem to have as much trouble interpreting the SOP

as they have interpreting the 2nd amendment.

[ellisonz]

16. +1000

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

18. It seems you pro-control folks...

...are at least consistent in your view of both the 2A and the group SOP in reading into both what isn't there.

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

14. No...

...but there is no explicit inclusion of the discussion of laws regarding the use of firearms for self-defense.

I would think that there should also be a provision for the discussion of laws which would protect the RKBA. There is nothing in the current SOP addressing that area either.

[ellisonz]

15. What part of "use of" don't you understand?

Do you think it's just talking about Ronald Reagan's Dirty Harry wet dreams?

Show me there has been a problem that requires a solution!

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

17. Please highlight for me...

...which of the boldface words below is the word law.

Discuss gun control laws, the Second Amendment, the use of firearms for self-defense, and the use of firearms to commit crime and violence.

My reading of the SOP covers -
The discussion of:

• gun control laws
  
• the 2A
  
• the use of firearms for self-defense
  
• the use of firearms to commit crime
  
• the use of firearms to commit violence

None of those five refers to a discussion of the laws underlying the use of firearms for self-defense.
You ad hominem comments are ill-considered.

BTW, where you been? IMHO, you're been scarce.

[ellisonz]

19. Oy Vey

Laws governing the use of firearms for self-defense is discussion of the use of firearms for self-defense!!!

"BTW, where you been? IMHO, you're been scarce."

Not barking up a tree/also working and family.

"You ad hominem comments are ill-considered."

If I can't piss on Ronald Reagan's grave, whose grave can I piss on?

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

20. In the current SOP...

...the "Laws governing the use of firearms for self-defense" is not there. It would be grammatically incorrect to form a conjunction of fourth word "laws" and the third clause "the use of firearms for self-defense" and then insert the word "governing" and claim that the current SOP explicitly says this.


>insert face palm here<

[ellisonz]

22. I shudder to think how you would read the General Welfare Clause of the Constitution.

EAT YOUR BROCCOLI ! ! !

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

23. A topic on which...

...HW and I agree is that of broccoli.

[gejohnston]

21. If I can't piss on Ronald Reagan's grave, whose grave can I piss on?

Want the whole list? Jerry Falwell's comes to mind. Isn't Nixon's closer to you?

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

24. kick n/t