Will Francis’ Statements on Women and Gays ‘Make a Mess’ Inside the Church?

[cbayer]

http://www.religiondispatches.org/archive/atheologies/7216/will_francis__statements_on_women_and_gays__make_a_mess__inside_the_church/

July 29, 2013
By MARY E. HUNT



Pope Francis made his first foray abroad since becoming pope and by all accounts his stock is up. In the case of World Youth Day in Rio de Janeiro, however, the encore will be more important than the performance itself. Will his comments on the plane ride home regarding the role of women and ‘the gay lobby’ translate into changes inside the institutional church? One can only hope, though it remains too early to tell.

I wasn’t there, but I watched enough live coverage to get a feel for the scene at Copacabana Beach. Whether I wanted it or not, I probably earned the plenary indulgence promised to his Twitter followers! These Vatican people think of everything from age to age.

Rio was a happy place for a pope’s international debut. The date was set several years ago so his predecessor, Pope Benedict XVI, had been expected to make the trip. Luckily for the kyriarchal church it was Francis instead; a Latin American pope in Latin America was a winner before he set a foot on the sand.

For Argentines, Brazil has many tastes of home. People are outgoing and friendly. The normal way to greet someone—a neighbor, a friend, a co-worker—is with a kiss or two. After two years in Buenos Aires, I came home habituated to the custom and greeted my father’s golf partner with a kiss. We almost needed two ambulances on the course as Irish-American gentlemen of a certain vintage were not accustomed to such displays of public affection. So the sight of Francis kissing every baby in sight and hugging everyone else, while remarkable to those from more restrained cultures, was just the pope doing what comes naturally. Still, it left a good feeling, and religions rely as much on feelings as on doctrine.

more at link

[hrmjustin]

1. I hope it causes a stir!

[cbayer]

2. The writer is quite dubious and critical.

She also uses the term kyriarchy, which I was completely unfamiliar with.

It basically means patriarchy beyond gender and appears quite fitting when applied to the RCC.

[okasha]

3. Well, Dolan is already spluttering

"but, but, but....." Francis' statement certainly seems to have messed with the good Cardinal's head.

[cbayer]

4. Good. I hope it messes with a bunch of them.

[okasha]

5. I see some signs that "the mess" is already in progress.

I live in a conservative-but-Democratic part of Texas. Like Lost One's from upriver, my congresscritter voted against atheist military chaplains.

However. I went to the funeral of a friend's mother a couple weeks ago. The friend is openly gay and devoutly Catholic. A number of openly LGBT couples attended the Mass. Except for non-Catholic spouses, all of them went up to the altar rail and received Communion without a hint of demur from anyone, clerical or lay. I'm glad to see the Pope encouraging change, though on LGBT issues the people in the pews and the parish priests are way out in front of the hierarchy.

[cbayer]

6. Hope Zimmerman's not speeding through your part of Texas,

going nowhere in particular with a loaded gun in his glove compartment!
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=3380824

Sorry for your friend's loss, but that's a great scenario. I agree that the local priests and parishioners in many communities are way ahead on this and the pope is just catching up.

[okasha]

7. No idea where Forney is,

which puts it outside my neighborhood. Sounds like it might be somewhere up around Dallas. (And it just occurred to me what the local teenagers probably make of the name )

My friend's mom made it to a round 100, which is a pretty good run. The service was a celebration of her long life, and the sermon was theologically on the lines of universal salvation. Not a word about sin or "hell and damnation."