2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumHuffPost: Democratic Debate Exposes The Real Divide Between Clinton And Sanders:
He thinks it's possible to change politics. She doesn't.
Sanders argument is a lot more inspiring. It promises big changes -- a revolution, literally. It suggests that progressives can realize their goals if they only put in enough effort, and build a coalition large enough to overcome the power of special interests. Its precisely the kind of message that resonates with idealists, which probably helps explain why Sanders has been such a hit on college campuses and with young voters.
But Sanders vision also requires a big leap of faith. While mass movements have changed American politics before -- the Civil Rights movement comes quickly to mind -- its taken years and sometimes decades of organizing and fighting. Even then, progress was slow, painful, and disheartening to many of its proponents.
Clintons argument, by contrast, isnt likely to excite anybody. It amounts to saying that the future is limited, rather than limitless -- and that best hope for the next four years is to avoid backtracking, rather making great strides forward. Thats not a lot of comfort to people struggling with tuition or medical bills, or unable to find a good job.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/clinton-sanders-debate_us_56bd67d2e4b0b40245c60e1f
pat_k
(9,313 posts)...In stark contrast to Obamas 2008 campaign slogan yes we can, Hillary seems to be telling voters no we cant" -- Link to Article on Salon.com
Note: The Salon page doesen't seem to be loading properly, so I've included a good bit of the text below.
The big Hillary realism lie: Clinton supporters present a false choice and misread our political moment
Walker Bragman
...Over the past few weeks, media outlets like the Washington Post and the New York Times, as well as the usual talking heads, have been weighing in on the growing split between idealists and realists; Bernies dreamers against Hillarys pragmatists. This dichotomy presents a false narrative...
Although poll data shows that Bernie Sanders, the Independent senator from Vermont, performs better against the GOP field in a general election than the current Democratic front-runner, according to Real Clear Politics averages; although he draws the biggest crowds of any candidate in the race, and has set the record for most individual donations of any candidate in history; although many voters agree with his message, and trust him, his electability remains a concern among Democrats. Additionally, even if he were to be elected, many worry about the feasibility of his ideas.
Hillary Clinton has been distinguishing herself from the senator by playing up these fears that Sanders, a self-described Democratic Socialist is too far removed from politics as usual to be a viable candidate...
... In stark contrast to Obamas 2008 campaign slogan yes we can, Hillary seems to be telling voters no we cant. Of course, it might be more accurate to describe her message as we tried, but couldnt do it back then, so we cant do it nowlets settle.
Since the 90s many Democrats have become disheartened and disillusioned as a result of their partys perceived weakness. Instead of digging their heels in, and preparing for the tough fights ahead, they now resign themselves to limiting their goals such that expectations and hope match only the incremental progress they perceive as feasible. This is dubbed realism....
... the corruption of establishment politics due to the influence of money, as well as the greatest wealth inequality our country has seen since the Gilded Age, are the defining issues of a new realignment. The rigged system is, as Amy Davidson of the New Yorker put it, the meta-issue that encompasses all others; it transcends party lines, ideology, generations, skin color, sexuality and gender...
The reality of politics today is that in order to get even half of what you want, you need to ask for the whole farm. No matter how reasonable and achievable Clintons policies may be on paper, she will still face as much opposition as Bernie Sanders would from Congress. So the real question for voters to decide is which of the two candidates watered-down policies they prefer. Bernies single-payer system might very well get shot down by the GOP, but we could still end up with a public option from that battleand thats the point. We should at least have the debate....
Cheese Sandwich
(9,086 posts)cui bono
(19,926 posts)to happen overnight.
OWS was 4 years ago. That was the spark, imo. That's already a good amount of time to get to where we are now. We elect Bernie now and then we take over the House and Senate on his coattails. We get a lot of local liberals elected too. It will be amazing. And during Bernie's 8 years in office we will get some great legislation that will really help this country and its people. Then another 8 years for whoever his VP was and we're on the right path for a Newer Deal.
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MisterP
(23,730 posts)being a little to Ike's right--not to position himself but to point out what the well-heeled right has been able to do since the Second Red Scare
onecaliberal
(32,878 posts)SamKnause
(13,108 posts)I think that is a strange approach.
Just my 2 cents.
Hydra
(14,459 posts)Getting Obama's support for her campaign is exactly the kind of thing an insider wants to do- and you can see how terrified her team of that becoming irrelevant.
The establishment is not polling well though lately...
Helen Borg
(3,963 posts)No way out of that. Anything else is BS. Case closed.
dixiegrrrrl
(60,010 posts)Read that somewhere here on DU before I hit the hay last night.
billhicks76
(5,082 posts)Lock em she said. Most racist policies in real time I've seen.Bill Clinton locked up more kids than Bush Sr or Reagan. And supported GW Bush when he broke the record. They are despicable.
Kip Humphrey
(4,753 posts)Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)intheflow
(28,484 posts)Remember the Battle of Seattle? And I was at a protest march in DC in 1996 about the welfare "reform" Clinton signed off on. We had 9/11 Interruptus, but the fight for economic equality never went away, it just went underground and reemerged at the Occupy movement.
Hydra
(14,459 posts)But now it looks like we may have a vocal majority support from the people we needed to get moving.