I have a question about Bernie being so polite in these debates - if he

[polly7]

does as she does and goes for the jugular, does he risk being punished somehow by the DNC? You can tell that some of the things she says makes him want so badly to correct the record in much more detail, but it would be devastating for her for people to see.

Or maybe she just realizes his IS too polite to do what he needs to and that he would never want to see her humiliated.

[firebrand80]

1. I just think he doesn't like to go negative nt

[polly7]

2. That's probably right.

He's got the patience of a saint, imo. I couldn't take it.

[firebrand80]

4. Let's not get carried away nt

[polly7]

6. I'm not. nt.

[Vinca]

3. He's just not that kind of person.

If he happened to respond in kind, how long do you suppose it would take Hillary to play the anti-woman card? 2 seconds? 3?

[polly7]

5. True, exactly ....... but I just wonder what kind of control the DNC has over he and his campaign,

if there's something they can threaten him with or do that might be part of it too? I don't understand your system very well.

[Vinca]

9. I think they'd like to control him, but I don't think it's likely to happen.

He only ran as a Democrat in order not to automatically hand the presidency to a Republican. (My husband is from your neck of the woods and insists your type of government is what we should have here.)

[polly7]

10. Well, our gov't doesn't always work so well either ...... we did end up with Harper

long enough to mess up quite a bit. And thank you, I'm glad to hear he's not controlled by anyone and to know it's just the way he is.

[karynnj]

7. this is the Bernie people have seen in Vt

He does make corrections and he does it strongly. There is no gain to be had by attacking Clinton more. Much of his appeal, other than message, is he seems a nice, thoroughly decent man.

Consider that the polished HRC invariably loses luster as she appears angry or even mean.

[polly7]

8. No, I don't mean attacking ... I should have worded that differently.

I just mean being more forceful in correcting some of the things brought up that are left to remain as fact for those who dismiss him so easily already, like the MSM, for example. Yes, he is a nice, thoroughly decent man.

[Broward]

11. He's in a tough spot.

However, I think when you're dealing with an unscrupulous liar for an opponent you need to take the gloves off.

[polly7]

12. It is a tough spot to be in.

I think she knows it, too, and is using it to her advantage. jmho.

[oasis]

13. Like the way Bernie so politely mentioned Kissinger?

[polly7]

14. SHE brought up Kissinger in a previous debate.

She's proud of her relationship with him ....... what's the problem?

[oasis]

18. Why was Bernie using Kissinger to zing Hillary?

[polly7]

19. To zing? That's what bringing up a war-criminal's relationship with a

possible next President is, a 'zinger'? He knows Kissinger's record and how he sees the rest of the world, why should he be expected to shut up about it when Clinton, apparently, believes people have forgotten enough of the evil he's done that he should now be seen as a respected ally?

“Control oil and you control nations; control food and you control the people.”

“Military men are just dumb, stupid animals to be used as pawns in foreign policy.”


Why did she use Kissinger to boost her creds in the first place?

[oasis]

24. Hillary never implied Kissinger was in her close circle of influence.

[polly7]

26. You never answered my question and ignored my comments. nt.

[TCJ70]

16. That's her albatross now...

...she brought him into it in the last debate.

[oasis]

21. Albatross? No. He's generally known as famous Sec of State who,

under Nixon, smoothed relations between U.S. And China.

[polly7]

23. 'Famous' - not really. An infamous war-criminal, evil freak. nt.

[oasis]

25. I never was a fan of Kissinger or anyone else in Nixon's regime.

The rest of America looks at Reagan, Kissinger, Condi Rice through a different lens than lefties do. Bernie's dig at Hiilary via Kissinger was a dog whistle to the fringe left, and not "polite".

[polly7]

27. So she's appealing to right-wingers then with her claiming close ties to him?

I wouldn't be polite about that either - especially for a man who's caused horror and suffering for millions.


Seriously, I do just shake my head at some of the excuses here for this shit.

[oasis]

35. Hill's shaping her message for General Election voters as well.

Many in the general population believe Kissinger did a hell of a job as SOS. His praise of Hillary translates into a validation of her wisdom of world affairs. That's what she was attempting to convey. There was no way she implied she was taking his advice.

[polly7]

36. So, she's appealing to right-wing, war-loving, Kissinger respecting types?

Holy shit, that's bad, imo.

How does admiring a murderous asshole who believes he was right in causing the deaths of fucking MILLIONS of people tout your 'wisdom of world affairs'???

[oasis]

39. I'm guessing she's giving K credit for the totality of his work as SOS.

Again, not enough American voters are aware of the Iran/Mossadec, Chile/Allende and the other underhanded operations. Bernie was hoping a left leaning audience would be outraged by Hill using him as a job reference, that's why he rolled out his rant about Kissinger.

Bernie's rant was a departure from being "polite". I hope this will serve as an adequate reply to your OP.

[polly7]

40. 'His rant'?

You don't think people deserve to know about Kissinger? Sanders had family wiped out in the Holocaust, apart from not being a war-hawk himself, he undoubtedly has a HUGE problem with child/woman/innocent killers. He deserves the right to RANT when someone who's already used every dirty trick in the book against him tries to use this sadistic asshole as her 'job reference' ... as well as for trying to use the name alone (for those who don't know much about him) to put herself above Bernie for his 'lack' of 'advisers'.

So do all the young people who have no idea about Kissinger have the right to hear the name, google it and learn.

Hilarious if it wasn't so sick.

[Fuddnik]

30. He's generally known as a butcher on par with Joseph Stalin.

Look up his views on "depopulation".

Hell of a statesman there.

[oasis]

34. You say he's on par with Stalin. Others don't think so.

Obviously.

[bigtree]

15. he wasn't so polite in his criticisms

...and the yelling at Hillary when he got defensive was cringeworthy.

[polly7]

17. 'Yelling' in defense ......... he raises his voice at times defending himself

against pure bullshit. You found it cringe-worthy? Gee, that's sad.

[bigtree]

20. yes, it reminded me of the way our male-dominated society talks down to women

...often shouting them down. Politics hasn't actually been the most accommodating arena for women throughout history.

It was not only ineffective, but offensive to me. He did himself no favors for losing his cool like that.

[polly7]

22. Oh fuck. I've seen her 'yell' in many, many videos.

What a sexist post - women are 'victims' because - 'tone'.

[bigtree]

28. not tone

..intention and effect.

So, you disagree and that makes my opinion 'sexist?' You need to check the definition of that term.

[polly7]

29. Yes, your opinion is sexist.

I don't need to check the definition, I know it quite well.

[bigtree]

32. there's nothing discriminatory at all about what I said

...I've watched women talked down to in politics for decades. I lived through an era where women couldn't find a voice in politics. I found Bernie Sanders disrespectful and overbearing toward Hillary Clinton.

I found Hillary to be respectful and civil. That's not sexist or discriminatory. It's an observation based on years and years of watching politicians interact.

[bettyellen]

37. Ohh, the RW "playing a card" framing rears it's ugly head here.

Discussing sexism is always deemed sexist on Fox news, too.

[polly7]

38. LMAO. wtf? nt.

[MrMickeysMom]

31. He has honor...

You won't see any of that in the other Democrat running against him.

[madokie]

33. I personally think most people see through her

She's been front and center for so long that no one really cares, or not many really cares I might put it. Around here I mention her name and I'm in trouble no matter what company I'm in but when I mention Bernie I notice people perking up. I've heard no 'CONs say they'd vote for her period. Not many Dems either actually. Mind you I'm in Oklahoma and that might have something to do with it but I don't think that explains it totally though.

After the last two debates she's really not looking so good to anyone any more. Too aggressive, won't let Bernie talk or talks over him and says so much shit that is factually untrue that it turns people off. Its like she's mad because he has the audacity to challenge her for the nomination. I worry for her and us if she was to win the nomination by some stroke of luck. Like Bernie said all those bankers and wall street CEO's aren't giving her and her PAC's all that money for nothing. They expect something in return. When he pointed that out she really went off the rails. As if he had hit a nerve. Pretty much tells me that she is saying one thing to them and something totally different to the rest of us. I don't trust her. I'll vote for her if I have to but I don't think that'll be the case. She's going to have to change her demeanor or she'll take us all down with her and that's what has me worried about her. I don't think she has it in her to make any changes. She wants this Presidency so bad and its killing her that she's seeing it slipping away with each following day.

Its obvious that its hurting Bernie to have to be as aggressive as he has to be because of her distortions. Bernie is a gentleman and treats women with respect so this is not how he'd like to run a campaign. He's said over and over lets talk issues and pointing out that all this money that she has coming in from the 1% is Issues.

I don't know but I 'm giving up on her

[Fumesucker]

41. It's *killing* them that he won't do it, it drips from everything the campaign does

Imagine the strain in the smoke free smoke filled back rooms, to be a fly on those walls.

I do wonder if we have reached the trajectory tracking and collision avoidance part of the campaign.

Come on baby, get into my ScoobieVan...

[tokenlib]

42. Bernie is a class act, but that finger of his has a mind of its own...ha ha

It has to be hard to fight off the temptation to rip into her... Especially at those moments, I'd like to rip into her for the crap she flings....