2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumBill Clinton Urges Arkansans Not To Use Midterm Vote As Protest Against Obama
Former President Bill Clinton told voters in Arkansas Monday it would be a mistake to use the midterm elections as an opportunity to protest the policies of President Barack Obama.
According to a story from Time, Clinton told those gathered to support Democrats and ignore Republicans who are urging them to use their vote to make a statement against Obama.
At the University of Central Arkansas Clinton told the crowd, "They want you to make this a protest vote."
Clinton appeared with U.S. Sen. Mark Pryor (D), who is running against Republican U.S. Rep. Tom Cotton.
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http://www.al.com/news/index.ssf/2014/10/bill_clinton_urges_arkansians.html
mmcgrath408
(1 post)Hello, I am new to this forum. I would like to contribute to this forum in terms off politics environment media etc. Thanks
gopiscrap
(23,765 posts)Rhiannon12866
(206,016 posts)We're glad to have you with us!
You seem to have found your way to the Politics Forum (though we discuss politics pretty much everywhere here) and here are the Environment & Energy Forum and a link to the various Media forums we have here. Hope you find a lot that interests you!
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=forum&id=1127
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Aristus
(66,462 posts)DonCoquixote
(13,616 posts)He wants so bad to tarnish Obama on the way out that he build the tdea of a "protest" vote. If Hillarty wins, expect umpteen narratives about how "NOW" things can get done, especially with a backdrop of Syria being bmbed.
not classy (or useful), to say the least. Very unhappy about this.
karynnj
(59,504 posts)Last edited Tue Oct 7, 2014, 12:01 PM - Edit history (2)
slipped. The Clintons, in respect to Obama, have likely always been a mixed blessing. It is absolutely true that they can reach some people he can't and that Bill Clinton was positioned to be an unusually helpful surrogate.
It is clear that they both are NOW - at the last minute - going to have a highly publicized effort to "help" with the midterm. Just as in 2012, when parts of the media were completely gaga over Bill Clinton's speech and campaigning assigning him a huge amount of weight in the Obama win, the same will happen now. Clinton's speech - just as Biden's and Kerry's - was excellent and he was given the red meat speech that defended Obama and listed the real accomplishments. This was a speech that could say things in stronger ways than the candidate himself could -- and Clinton was exactly the right person to say it. However, it was not the speech, but the actual truths that could be claimed that swayed anyone I knew who was an independent.
I want the close races to go to the Democrats and want this even if many might be credited to the Clintons efforts. The alternative is too scary. This will, of course, likely cement the already inevitability that Clinton will be the nominee. It can be said at that point that given both her success and her popularity that she completely deserves to be the nominee.
The one thing I really am not happy with is the completely thoughtless way both Hillary and the Clinton ally, Panetta, have chosen to put out their views of the foreign policy on both Iraq and Syria. There was no excuse for the Hillary comment (to Golberg) that actually expressed that Obama not following her advise to give heavy armaments to the rebels in 2011/2012 led to ISIS. This has led to Obama being trashed by not just the Republicans, but at least half of the Democrats in the media! This when Obama has been seriously working on a broad based, international and regional effort to drain this swamp.
The timing of those books was completely unhelpful --- and unnecessary. Would it have hurt either person to at least wait until after the election? You could also ask if they could have waited until after Obama/Kerry/Biden et al had a chance to get the international effort going, but that - unlike the election - had no established time frame and might not work.
One of the strangest things is that the Obama administration might have to protect HRC from attacks that were actually strengthened by her and Panetta. (ie Jen Psaki, the State Department spokesperson, was badgered on Fox about why the Obama failed to get a SOFA in Iraq and then asked if it was because they learned their lesson that they did get one in Afghanistan. Psaki answered that they were different countries, different circumstances, that there was no way to get Maliki to agree etc and only after that credited the SOFA in Afghanistan to lot of hard work by Secretary Kerry. )
I assume that one reason that HRC was made SOS was that Obama wanted to align the interests of the Clintons to his interests - ensuring they were on his side completely. One question is whether the Clintonites having taken the positions they did might now have interests that no longer are those of Obama.
Assume that the incredible mess that is the middle east becomes less inflamed -- or even reaches a level where the countries, Sunni and Shia, see that the militants on both sides hurt their entire region and they all work to calm things down, this would make Obama look better. The question is whether Obama succeeding helps or hurts the Clintons. Had they stayed quiet, it certainly would as anything good done on fp by Obama would reflect well on HRC. I wonder if these leaks are really the Clintons gambling against Obama (and the world) succeeding here.
Seeing this, it would be fascinating to be enough of a real insider, to know if Obama regrets ever having made the bargain he did to get Clinton support 2008 - 2012. (Consider that had Obama lost in 2012, ACA might not have been actually implemented. He needed the entire party behind him in those elections and he could not have anyone big jumping onto the campaign wagon -- just to drag their feet on the ground, slowing it down while they still appeared to support it.)
Well said. With respect to last paragraph: I'd love to know, too. Obama's own eventual memoir could be interesting.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)in fact, I got the exact opposite.
At the University of Central Arkansas Clinton told the crowd, "They want you to make this a protest vote."
Maybe I misread!
karynnj
(59,504 posts)Clinton could have made the same strong case without making it about Obama. For instances, he could have spoken like he did in 2012, when Obama was on the ticket. He could have moved away from Obama himself to defending what Obama and the Democrats did on the economy and on health care.
Arkansas is one of the states that finally did move to expand Medicaid. This means that many people who never had health insurance have it now. Arkansas is an extremely poor state - so this likely was a bigger deal there than in states where fewer people are below that threshold.
As to the economy - we all have seen the charts on unemployment and what Obama has done - in spite of the Republicans - is remarkable. He could actually have argued, that just like he did, Obama greatly improved the economic situation from where it was when he entered office.
Instead, this looks like another attempt to distance Clinton from Obama. If HRC had not distanced herself on fp - even giving the Republicans a gift when she suggested that not doing more in Syria led to ISIS - I don't think I would have had any sensitivity here. In addition, this plays into the view that to the Clintons, loyalty is extremely important, but it is defined in only one direction -- to them. I doubt the Clintons would have been happy with a cabinet member who did this to Bill while he was still in office.
MBS
(9,688 posts)1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)Beacool
(30,253 posts)The Republicans are the ones making the midterm elections a referendum on Obama. Clinton is trying to separate both issues. If Obama was Mr. popularity in these highly contested states, he would be the one campaigning for these senators. In most cases, they don't want Obama anywhere near them. As it is, it will be close to a miracle if Pryor manages to keep his seat in AR.
DonCoquixote
(13,616 posts)Can it be that Hillary made sure to slam Obama's syria policy as the second term began? Oh that's right, She really does not want war in Syria and Iraq (sarcasm)
Can it be that because Obama did not Kick her and her Clinton era dvisors to the crub quick enough that Obama simply makes a better target for the left, who elected him to RELIEVE CLINTON FATIGUE cause by Clinton giving away the store to the right wing?
I really hope Hill is the genius some think she is, because as is, the GOP might be able to pour sauce on even a Mitt to make them palatable to the centrists.
karynnj
(59,504 posts)I DID say it was great that the Clintons were out there - and even said that HRC would deserve the credit she will get for doing so.
Where I have a problem is with her (and Panetta's ) deciding it was a good idea to stab Obama in the back even before the Midterm. My point was threefold there:
1) It is not helpful to Democrats to intentionally lower the President's support by splintering the party now. (That is MY opinion.)
2) It is not helpful in terms of foreign policy to do anything that could make it even tougher for Obama to pull anything off to make things better --- and negative American press and lower support here. Obviously at some point Clinton would need to make her differences known, but was this a good time?
3) I question ultimately if this is even good policy for Clinton. She can't both run on having been SOS and say that she had no role in most big decisions.
As to Pryor, the race has seesawed back and forth - and though it is now Cotton, there is still some chance for Pryor to pull it out -- even using the fact that AR is actually better off given they HAVE ACA with the Medicaid expansion. As to their relative popularity, Clinton is the home town boy and AR is a pretty racist state.
Beacool
(30,253 posts)peace13
(11,076 posts)What a douche. He'll make a great First Lady! No offense to ladies!
merrily
(45,251 posts)RussBLib
(9,036 posts)What is it about Obama's policies that makes Dem politicians run away? Surely not the economic recovery. Gay rights? No. Foreign policy? The GOP is much worse. I am a little stumped.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)that they don't want to alienate their base that dislikes President Obama for "PWB" ... Presidenting While Black.
DonCoquixote
(13,616 posts)or the often repeated "amatuer" insult, which frankly, is just a synonym for another word that ends with r that many PUMAS dare not say, but damned well THINK!
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)is preceded by the word, "Uppity."
DonCoquixote
(13,616 posts)and yes, we must advance the cause of women, but some PUMAS seem to think that they deserve rights long before the brown people get their turn in line.
MBS
(9,688 posts)Hearing the media describe Obama as being "blindsided" by the number of foreign crises and other sorts of piling-on from shockingly disloyal former cabinet members , all I can think of is (a) no one, surely, could ever be prepared to offer immediate resolution to Syria, Iraq, secret service meltdown, VA problems, Netanyahu, ISIL, Putin,Ebola, climate change, vacillating European allies (vis a vis Ukraine), all happening simultaneously, much of it damage caused by W, AND made infinitely worse by outrageous Republican obstructionism and lies, and (b) I can think of no one (at least no politically viable potential president) I would rather have in the driver's seat on foreign policy and environmental issues and judicial appointments right now than the Obama administration (including Kerry as SoS and several other administration members in addition to Obama himself).
Whatever Obama's perceived or real failings (yes, he's not perfect), I shudder to think of the alternative possibilities among other potential presidents. ANY alternative. Seriously, we are lucky to have this man as president. I only regret that he hasn't had the good fortune to have a congress that is willing either to cooperate or even to work at all.
In addition to the topics you mentioned, think also of his unheralded but important achievements judicial appointments (not just Supreme Court but federal courts of appeals, etc), Native Americans, workers' rights, etc.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)the instant article and another article covering the same event. http://www.politico.com/story/2014/10/bill-clinton-arkansas-midterm-elections-111634.html#ixzz3FS6e0kBM
More interesting is DU's take on and response to the two article's.
This article has Clinton speaking to Democrats about not listening to republicans that are urging them to use the mid-terms to serve as protest votes (i.e., staying home or voting against "establishment" Democrats) ...
The DU take on the latter article has President Clinton speaking to Democrats urging them to not listen to Democrats telling them TO vote FOR Democrats.
Interesting!
Liberal_Stalwart71
(20,450 posts)1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)I got it twisted.