Economists Say We Should Tax The Rich At 90 Percent

[tecelote]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/10/22/economists-tax-rich_n_6024430.html

Outrageous?! But, Dems should push this and then settle for a mere half at 45%.

That's what Repubs would do.

[shenmue]

1. Yep

[Iamthetruth]

2. You realize

The highest tax bracket now is 39.6% already?

[shenmue]

3. So?

[MaggieD]

4. When you add in....

The extra Medicare tax for Obamacare for high earners and other business taxes I'm already paying an effective rate of 41%. Add in a few other misc. taxes I pay on a state and local level and I'm at 50%.

What you're proposing would kill small businesses. I can promise you I'm not busting my ass to give the government more than I get to keep. I'd shut my business down and retire first, and take the 25 good jobs with great benefits down with it.

All we really need to do is take away all the loopholes big corps get that help them avoid paying taxes (that aren't available to small businesses anyway).

[tecelote]

5. Obamacare isn't a tax. You have healthcare options.

Most small business people are not part of the Rich sector. That's big business people.

I agree with the loopholes, especially offshore banking.

[MaggieD]

6. Sorry - you're wrong

The ACA is partially paid for with an additional Medicare tax on high earners. It started in 2013 and is part of the ACA law.

And LOTS of small businesses are in the highest brackets. I know. I've been a business consultant and small business owner for 20 plus years. Again, they don't have the loopholes available to them.

[4dsc]

8. If your effective at is 41% then you need a new tax person

No one is paying an effective rate of 41%. No one in the highest tax bracket is paying the maximum amount of 39.6%. No one.

Do you understand that effective tax amount even means?

[LiberalFighter]

11. There are many that are clueless on what it means about the top tax rate.

And others intentionally mislead people about the tax rates.

I personally knew one person that refused to believe that the top tax rate only applied to just part of the income.

[MaggieD]

13. I'm not one of them

I know exactly what my EFFECTIVE total tax rate is, and how much I pay in taxes.

There seem to be MANY people here that do not understand that FEDERAL taxes are only ONE of the myriad of taxes that people pay.

[MaggieD]

12. You have no clue

Gotta love the Internet experts that think they know stuff they have no clue about.

[4dsc]

16. You need a new tax person then

because no one pay an effective rate of 41%-50%.

[MaggieD]

17. I have had THREE different accountants

Yes, people DO pay effective rates on income that is over 40% of their total income. Again, there are MORE taxes than just federal taxes. I am self employed, and my spouse is my business partner. That means we pay BOTH sides of SSI, which is over 15% on the first $117K each. We also have to pay 1% extra each related to the high earner extra Medicare tax (part of the ACA law, and effective 2013).

In addition, I pay a business tax on ALL revenue of 1.5% whether I make a profit or not. That turns into about 7% on profits. I also live in a state that requires me to pay sales tax on services my company provides, whether I can pass those along to the client or not (and I cannot or I would not be competitive with other service vendors outside my state). That's another 9% of revenue.

There is more, but frankly it's none of your business. And I am NOT complaining. I am lucky to be in such a tax bracket. But frankly, I am tired of so much of my real hard work going to pay the department of defense. It sickens me.

The bottom line is people have no clue how much small business owners pay in taxes. This ridiculous chant to raise, raise, raise taxes is completely uninformed. It won't cause the mega corps to pay one more dime in taxes -- it will only hit the small businesses trying to compete with them.

The solution is not to raise taxes - it's to close loopholes that are not available to anyone but the ultra rich and mega corps.

[CJCRANE]

9. The top marginal rate is on income *over* $450,000.

The Eisenhower era top marginal rate was on income over the equivalent of about $4 million in today's money IIRC.

[Generic Brad]

18. You must be rich then

The 90% tax rate is suggested for the wealthy. That must be one heck of a revenue generating small business you have.

[MaggieD]

19. Do you have a problem with "rich" liberals?

If so, why? Let me ask you something - would you be willing to pay half of what you made in taxes from working your ass off while billionaires and mega corps use loopholes to pay almost nothing? If not, why do you expect me to do that?

I have 25 employees. I pay 100% of the health, dental, and vision insurance (same plan I have - a good one), 2-3 times minimum wage after I train them (they have no college degree), 21 PTO days per year, 3 different bonus programs, a 401k with match and immediate vesting, and other benefits.

IOW, I LIVE my values. Should I have to further support more useless wars while GE, the Koch brothers, Boeing, etc hire more $1000 per hour lawyers I can't afford so they can pay no taxes at all?

Pardon me, but fuck that. I'd shut down my business and retire first. I will be honest - it sickens me to read the BS here some days. Makes me wonder why I even bother caring about the so-called liberal agenda. There are plenty here as extremist as the tea party crazies.

[Generic Brad]

20. I would not classify you as rich

You appear to be all worked up over an idea that is not directed at you.

[Taitertots]

22. And the 1%er comes out to lecture everyone about how we should sabotage the economy...

So they can stay rich.

Close your business. Tomorrow, I'll open a company and take all your old clients and rehire all your old employees. And, I'll gladly pay the optimal tax rate. Nothing you do can offset the economic effects of sound policies.

[MaggieD]

23. PM me - we'll do it

Last edited Fri Oct 31, 2014, 10:49 AM - Edit history (1)

First you'll need about half a million to get started. Then you'll have to prove to the client you have the expertise to do the job. Then you'll have to convince the employees with training and experience that you're not a jerk that will treat them like crap.

Are you just talking shit or do you have what it takes?

On edit: it's "tomorrow". Where did you go? Just resting up and getting ready for the 60-70 hours per week you'll need to do for the next several years before the business is on solid enough ground for you to work a normal work week? Come on - time to get going. You're dying to invest half a million so you can work your ass off and give most of it to the government. No time to rest.

[Taitertots]

24. Are you actually closing your business?

Or just smoke screening your self-serving support for bad economic policies?

The more important topic is: Why do you support policies that hurt almost everyone?

[MaggieD]

25. So much for your false bravado I guess

Perhaps you lack understanding about just how insulting it is to hear "Democrats" slam small business owners that have literally sacrificed and busted their tales to build businesses that provide most of the non-exploitive good jobs in this country.

So, now that we have dispensed with this baloney that you'll just take my place and be the savior for all the jobs you want to ruin, maybe you can explain what "policies" you ASSUME I support that "Hurt almost everyone" - huh?

My employees would tend to disagree with your assumptions, by the way.

[Taitertots]

26. You oppose the optimal tax rate. That hurts almost everyone.

You seem to think a lot of song and dance about owning a business will divert attention from your self-centered tax ideology.

Come on. Try to explain why the government should make almost everyone poorer so that a tiny fraction of the country can become rich.

[MaggieD]

27. Optimal for who?

Not my workers. Becuase I'm not kidding. If the government wants more than 41%, screw them. I quit. I'm not going to bust my butt to give the government more than that just so they can start more wars and give Exxon, GE, Boeing and hedge fund managers more of my hard earned money.

Just. Not. Going. To. Happen.

The Willard Romney's of the world aren't going to pay more than their puny 11% no matter how much they increase the marginal rates because they aren't paying anywhere close to the top rates now, and more importantly much less as a percentage than I pay.

CLOSE THE DAMN LOOPHOLES. Don't just keep slamming small business owners and other self employed people that actually work their asses off for a living. Sadly, too many Liberals seem to have bought into the idea that raising marginal rates is the solution. No, the solution is to enforce the rates we already have and stop creating loopholes for the mega corps and super wealthy only available to them to avoid taxes.

[Taitertots]

28. Who? Almost everyone (including all your employees). More than 99% of the country.

Go ahead and try to spite the country for having the audacity to expect you to pay the optimal tax rate. You will be replaced and your employees will find new jobs. You are responding to an OP about economic research showing that the effect of vengeful entitled rich people is negligible.

"CLOSE THE DAMN LOOPHOLES"
I agree. Doesn't change the fact that all the evidence and economic theory indicate that the optimal rate is much higher for the top bracket.

[MaggieD]

29. How will my employees benefit....

... from me shutting down my business? I don't think they'd agree.

Sorry, I'm not going to bust my ass to give the government half, and neither are any of the other hundreds of small business owners I know.

So much for the uninformed fantasies of the extreme left. They will never be more than your vengeful fantasies.

[Taitertots]

30. Because you are replaceable and/or they can get jobs elsewhere

Go ahead and cut off your nose to spite your face.

All the evidence and mainstream economic theory indicate that (under current conditions) increasing the top marginal rate will increase GDP, decrease unemployment, and increase tax revenue.

[MaggieD]

31. Spite myself? Uh, no

I could retire right this frigging minute and not change my lifestyle one iota. My home is paid off, I have no debt, and my retirement account is well past my goal. That's why I've started to find even more ways to pass on more money to my already well compensated employees instead of paying even more to the government.

And that is the case for lots of small business owners. Your so called "mainstream economic theory" is anything but. It's pie in the sky BS that ignores the real issue, and that is corporate subsidies and loopholes designed purely for mega corps and billionaires. They have you completely snowed - just how they like you.

[Initech]

7. No CEO on the planet should be making 475 times what the average worker makes. Ever.

[Herself]

10. tax rates for the rich could be 100%, and it woudn't make a difference

because of the loop holes and off shore hiding of revenue.
It's not the rate, it's the loop holes

[MaggieD]

14. Exactly

All these tax increases do is hit the small business owners. Get rid of the loopholes that these big corps use to pay nothing. I'm sick of them paying nothing while I pay hundreds of thousands a year.

[dmosh42]

15. Yeah, but they run the government!