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applegrove

(118,682 posts)
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 08:43 PM Nov 2015

Hey progressives, Hillary isn’t the enemy: I’m a Sanders supporter, but I’m sick of Bernie Bros’ Cli

Hey progressives, Hillary isn’t the enemy: I’m a Sanders supporter, but I’m sick of Bernie Bros’ Clinton Derangement Syndrome

by Matthew Rozsa at Salon

http://www.salon.com/2015/11/12/hey_progressives_hillary_isnt_the_enemy_im_a_sanders_supporter_but_im_sick_of_bernie_bros_clinton_derangement_syndrome/

"SNIP.............


1. Hillary Clinton may not be as liberal as Bernie Sanders, either in her background or current policy positions, but that doesn’t mean she isn’t liberal.

There are plenty of valid liberal concerns about Clinton, from her decision as Senator to support the Iraq War to her unsettling coziness with Wall Street. While this certainly places her to the right of Sanders, that does not mean that she isn’t a liberal herself. During her husband’s presidency, Clinton took the lead in pushing for a progressive health care reform plan that was thwarted by many of the same special interest and ideological groups that later coalesced against the Affordable Care Act. Throughout the ‘00s, Clinton developed a reputation as a staunch legislative progressive, accumulating a record that placed her to the left of 85 percent of her fellow senators. There are even issues like gun control in which Clinton’s stance makes Sanders seem conservative by comparison. As Harry Enten recently explained at FiveThirtyEight.com, “Clinton rates as a ‘hard core liberal’ per the OnTheIssues.org scale. She is as liberal as Elizabeth Warren and barely more moderate than Bernie Sanders. And while Obama is also a “hard core liberal,” Clinton again was rated as more liberal than Obama.”

Of course, none of this would mean very much if Clinton wasn’t also campaigning on progressive policy stances. This brings us to our next point.

2. If Sanders supporters want his candidacy to have a lasting historical impact in the event that he doesn’t win the nomination, their best chance rests in supporting Clinton’s candidacy.

Pundits have already noted that Clinton’s rhetoric and policy stances have moved to the left as a result of Sanders’ campaign. Her current platform advocates raising the minimum wage to $15-an-hour in high cost cities and states, raising capital gains taxes on high-earners, and protecting employees’ right to form labor unions… all positions that, to be sure, are either shared by Sanders or still fall slightly to the right of him, but none of which could be fairly described as anything other than progressive. Like Sanders, she has made income inequality a front-and-center issue in her campaign message, denouncing the American business culture that devalues employees’ contributions and declaring that we should “reward businesses who invest in long-term value rather than the quick buck—because that leads to higher growth for the economy, higher wages for workers, and yes, bigger profits, everybody will have a better time.”



..............SNIP"

35 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Hey progressives, Hillary isn’t the enemy: I’m a Sanders supporter, but I’m sick of Bernie Bros’ Cli (Original Post) applegrove Nov 2015 OP
She is the enemy of teaparty, though...Therefore, one can extrapolate why randys1 Nov 2015 #1
Because she hates tea? bobbobbins01 Nov 2015 #5
I'm sick of threads like this. Whiny threads. Get over it. This is primary season. If you can't roguevalley Nov 2015 #10
Was that aimed at me? bobbobbins01 Nov 2015 #13
Good post thanks rbrnmw Nov 2015 #2
Key:"Pundits have already noted that Clinton’s rhetoric and policy stances have moved to the left... tecelote Nov 2015 #3
Caused her to realize she can move left. There's a big difference. Hortensis Nov 2015 #21
The Democratic electorate hasn't moved right AgingAmerican Nov 2015 #30
They didn't move nearly as much right as conservatives did, Hortensis Nov 2015 #32
blah blah blah blah blah......more hillary bullshit bowens43 Nov 2015 #4
I'll bet your didn't read the entire article.... CajunBlazer Nov 2015 #24
I'm a supporter of Sanders, but.... merrily Nov 2015 #6
Hey merrily! We got another one....Drink! artislife Nov 2015 #12
No Sale. Tierra_y_Libertad Nov 2015 #7
I'm sick of Sanders Supporter Derangement Syndrome Autumn Nov 2015 #8
funny that a side that has hillarysupporters.com should whine here about anything. roguevalley Nov 2015 #11
I haven't seen the claim this place has turned into BernieUnderground.com in a long time. hootinholler Nov 2015 #14
Maybe she's not the enemy, but she's pretty corrupted. I don't want her to be the nominee. reformist2 Nov 2015 #9
Matthew Rozsa. Apparently a Dale Carnegie super scholar. hootinholler Nov 2015 #15
Seems sketchy TSIAS Nov 2015 #16
k&r DesertRat Nov 2015 #17
Oh please. 99Forever Nov 2015 #18
Thankfully Aerows Nov 2015 #19
No, her most ardent supporters on DU don't like posting here because.... CajunBlazer Nov 2015 #25
Cajun. I've been to the crawfish festival in Breaux Bridge Aerows Nov 2015 #28
Cool, I am what we call a "pure breed" Cajun CajunBlazer Nov 2015 #34
I think we can be good friends Aerows Nov 2015 #35
"Bernie Bros" aren't a thing that actually exists. phleshdef Nov 2015 #20
What people like Rozsa have never realized is... Chan790 Nov 2015 #22
Hillary supporters have completely abandoned the issues AgingAmerican Nov 2015 #23
Funny avatar you've got for a Sanders supporter FiveGoodMen Nov 2015 #26
And I thought if it wasn't your viewpoint that you should have the except box around it. LiberalArkie Nov 2015 #29
Its a quote from the author of the article, not the OP author. JoePhilly Nov 2015 #31
An intellegent post for a change.... CajunBlazer Nov 2015 #27
its primary season so... retrowire Nov 2015 #33

randys1

(16,286 posts)
1. She is the enemy of teaparty, though...Therefore, one can extrapolate why
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 08:45 PM
Nov 2015

so many do see her as the enemy

Innuendo implied

roguevalley

(40,656 posts)
10. I'm sick of threads like this. Whiny threads. Get over it. This is primary season. If you can't
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 05:16 AM
Nov 2015

stand the heat get out of the kitchen.

tecelote

(5,122 posts)
3. Key:"Pundits have already noted that Clinton’s rhetoric and policy stances have moved to the left...
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 08:48 PM
Nov 2015

...as a result of Sanders’ campaign."

Enough said.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
21. Caused her to realize she can move left. There's a big difference.
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 04:31 PM
Nov 2015

But probably both are true. Examination of her record over the decades shows that she tends to move left and right with the Democratic Party electorate.

 

AgingAmerican

(12,958 posts)
30. The Democratic electorate hasn't moved right
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 05:30 PM
Nov 2015

Only the party establishment has which is why we keep losing control of the congress.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
32. They didn't move nearly as much right as conservatives did,
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 05:51 PM
Nov 2015

but as a group they did become less liberal overall for a while. That's how I started as a moderate liberal and ended up being called a strong or radical liberal -- I didn't change. Some fairly moderate people even stopped identifying themselves as Democrat or liberal because they bought into the notion that there was something wrong with it. In any case, this is how Democrats came to support such horrible things as the three-strikes law in the numbers they did.

 

bowens43

(16,064 posts)
4. blah blah blah blah blah......more hillary bullshit
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 08:56 PM
Nov 2015

she may not be the enemy but she is not a friend ..... she is not fit to be POTUS.

CajunBlazer

(5,648 posts)
24. I'll bet your didn't read the entire article....
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 05:11 PM
Nov 2015

or maybe you're not as logical as you think you are.

Autumn

(45,106 posts)
8. I'm sick of Sanders Supporter Derangement Syndrome
Thu Nov 12, 2015, 10:28 PM
Nov 2015

Please Matthew Rozsa get over it and support Hillary.

hootinholler

(26,449 posts)
15. Matthew Rozsa. Apparently a Dale Carnegie super scholar.
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 10:20 AM
Nov 2015

Clickbait headline which Salon is better than, even though someone there seems to like clickbait headlines.

I have news for camp weathervane: This primary heat is nothing compare to what will come from those who actually have Clinton Derangement Syndrome. That would be whom I call the Talibornagain.

 

Aerows

(39,961 posts)
19. Thankfully
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 04:22 PM
Nov 2015

Her most ardent supporters on DU tend to be Canadians, and don't have the privilege to vote either for her or against her.

CajunBlazer

(5,648 posts)
25. No, her most ardent supporters on DU don't like posting here because....
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 05:18 PM
Nov 2015

Last edited Fri Nov 13, 2015, 06:13 PM - Edit history (1)

....unlike Bernie himself, many of his supporter don't seem to be people who want to engage in a civil conversation. Note that the post has received a large number of REC's but most of those people have not posted.

Bernie supporters won't get others to vote for your candidate by turning them off. Folks here would rather have a Bernie love fest and act like Republicans in trying to knock down other candidates rather than promoting their own. You don't get others to switch and for your candidate by ripping apart their original candidate of choice. Such tactics make folks defensive and more and more unwilling to join you.

 

Aerows

(39,961 posts)
28. Cajun. I've been to the crawfish festival in Breaux Bridge
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 05:23 PM
Nov 2015

lived in Lafayette and know some folks up St. Martinville way.

Wishing you the best, despite us apparently being on odd ends of the Democratic candidates.

CajunBlazer

(5,648 posts)
34. Cool, I am what we call a "pure breed" Cajun
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 06:24 PM
Nov 2015

That is I cannot identify anyone in my family tree who who was not a Cajun. One of my aunts traced many branches of my mothers family tree back into Canada (then Acadia, now Nova Scotia) and then back into France in the late 1600' and early 1700's I was born, grew up, and went to college in Lafayette. Of course I still have roots there, but now call Birmingham home. This state is where anyone to the left of Genghis Khan is considered a liberal.

I wish you the best because you are a Bernie supporter. I have nothing a against Bernie - though I do have some concerns about his electability in the general elections. I can imagine what the Republicans would try to do with the whole socialist identification thing. On the other hand I would certainly vote for him if he is the Democratic nominee.

 

Aerows

(39,961 posts)
35. I think we can be good friends
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 07:12 PM
Nov 2015

by not letting politics get in the way! One good friend > any politician

 

Chan790

(20,176 posts)
22. What people like Rozsa have never realized is...
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 04:42 PM
Nov 2015

Hillary from the day she first ran for the Senate has always been the enemy.

For some of us, the goal of securing the nomination for Sanders comes second to denying it to Hillary. I'm voting for Sanders because he's the most progressive candidate we have...but make no mistake, I'm voting against Hillary. That is what I am doing...I am voting against Hillary Clinton ever being the Democratic nominee for President, let alone actually President.

1.) She's not liberal. She's not even moderate. She's a center-to-center-right Democrat.

2.) I'm not even going treat as a rational argument worthy of rebuttal. It's analogous to Philippe Petain's argument that the best way to save France was to become a satellite-state to Nazi Germany. If Clinton secures the nomination...it's already all over for progressives. The only question is to we wish to facilitate our demise on the progressive left. It's a choice between the cattle-stunner and the cutthroat knife.

 

AgingAmerican

(12,958 posts)
23. Hillary supporters have completely abandoned the issues
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 04:52 PM
Nov 2015

And now rely almost solely on negative attacks against Sanders supporters. What are they so scared of? The electorate?

LiberalArkie

(15,719 posts)
29. And I thought if it wasn't your viewpoint that you should have the except box around it.
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 05:28 PM
Nov 2015

A person got banned recently for posting an article and they claimed that they could not tell it wasn't his thoughts because it wasn't in the excerpt box.

retrowire

(10,345 posts)
33. its primary season so...
Fri Nov 13, 2015, 05:55 PM
Nov 2015

scrutinizing or own candidates is exactly what we're supposed to be doing.

so please, carry on.

hot kitchen phrase goes here.

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