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Maven Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-21-09 10:17 AM
Response to Reply #6
153. HE'S PLAYING CHESS
:rofl:
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  -In A Shift, Obama Doesn't Plan To Reopen NAFTA Talks Purveyor  Apr-20-09 06:34 PM   #0 
  - "no plans to reopen negotiations on [NAFTA] . . . Obama vowed to do" that's CHANGE you can count on.  jody   Apr-20-09 06:42 PM   #1 
  - Blame Canada!  McCamy Taylor   Apr-20-09 06:43 PM   #2 
  - We'd LOVE to have NAFTA reopened  Canuckistanian   Apr-21-09 07:14 AM   #133 
  - Color me surprised...Not.  OhioChick   Apr-20-09 06:47 PM   #3 
  - yeah, like we couldn't see this coming  Skittles   Apr-20-09 07:06 PM   #9 
  - But, but, Free Trade has been GOOD for our economy!  ihavenobias   Apr-20-09 07:29 PM   #18 
  - Notice that those who oppose NAFTA actually have detailed reasons?  Zhade   Apr-20-09 08:16 PM   #31 
  - UNFUCKING BELIEVABLE - OBAMA IS BACKING OFF OF EVERYTHING  Roadcyclist   Apr-20-09 10:15 PM   #80 
  - I feel the same, except that every vote for Nader  No Elephants   Apr-21-09 03:38 AM   #114 
  - Absolutely, if McCain/Palin had won they'ed have two pliable morons  Grinchie   Apr-21-09 12:59 PM   #183 
  - Chill.....  4_TN_TITANS   Apr-21-09 08:16 AM   #137 
  - Are you kidding?  Roadcyclist   Apr-21-09 09:32 AM   #145 
  - He's picking the right battles -- but the wrong side.  JDPriestly   Apr-21-09 12:19 PM   #173 
  - The first thing I'd do is run like hell from the DLC goons he hired as his team.  Grinchie   Apr-21-09 01:41 PM   #189 
  - He still has that great smile, but that is about it.  JDPriestly   Apr-21-09 11:19 AM   #168 
  - Not only are those numbers significant enough to consider -  truedelphi   Apr-21-09 02:00 AM   #112 
     - Thats in chapter 11 of NAFTA. ( Tantamount to expropriation.) nt  Snotcicles   Apr-21-09 03:56 AM   #116 
        - Thank you for that reference.  truedelphi   Apr-21-09 01:24 PM   #187 
  - It's bad to bring back low paying jobs...  WarhammerTwo   Apr-21-09 11:11 AM   #165 
  - He already is, and the Back Office Government is Business as usual  Grinchie   Apr-21-09 12:51 PM   #182 
  - Su-prize, su-prize, su-prize!  RufusTFirefly   Apr-20-09 06:48 PM   #4 
  - He's going to run into his shadow if he keeps running away this fast from his promises.  Metta   Apr-20-09 06:51 PM   #5 
  - 'they can be addressed without having to reopen the agreement'  tomm2thumbs   Apr-20-09 06:53 PM   #6 
  - you have a lot of faith  Skittles   Apr-20-09 07:07 PM   #11 
  - So, in which category do you put politicians?  EFerrari   Apr-20-09 07:08 PM   #12 
  - Super double-secret invisible plan  Rage for Order   Apr-20-09 07:27 PM   #16 
  - just my take on it  tomm2thumbs   Apr-20-09 07:31 PM   #20 
  - No offense  Bluenorthwest   Apr-21-09 09:39 AM   #146 
     - non taken  tomm2thumbs   Apr-21-09 11:49 AM   #170 
  - Do you still believe in the Tooth Fairy, too?  Zhade   Apr-20-09 08:17 PM   #32 
  - yawn  tomm2thumbs   Apr-20-09 09:25 PM   #66 
  - HE'S PLAYING CHESS  Maven   Apr-21-09 10:17 AM   #153 
  - It just never gets better  gizmo1979   Apr-20-09 06:58 PM   #7 
  - Not with Republicans and center right corporate Dems  depakid   Apr-20-09 08:03 PM   #29 
  - That's what I'm afraid of  lbrtbell   Apr-20-09 11:44 PM   #92 
  - well if the Dems we voted in do NOT keep their promises - what difference are they from the pukes?  Donnachaidh   Apr-21-09 03:49 PM   #194 
  - A Democrat's staying home has the same impact as a Democrat's voting  No Elephants   Apr-21-09 03:52 AM   #115 
  - Well Obama's certainly not playing to his base.  Lasher   Apr-21-09 03:59 AM   #117 
     - If you voted for Obama, you helped elect Obama. For you at this point,, that may be  No Elephants   Apr-21-09 04:12 AM   #119 
        - Oh I forgot: rah rah at least he's not a Republican.  Lasher   Apr-21-09 04:27 AM   #124 
  - Or for the overseas worker, the abuse of whom is why we lose jobs here.  Zhade   Apr-20-09 08:18 PM   #33 
  - I wonder if Mexico's exporting more goods, or workers to us with NAFTA!!!  cascadiance   Apr-20-09 06:59 PM   #8 
  - No plans because the whole treaty will soon be scrapped.  wroberts189   Apr-20-09 07:07 PM   #10 
  - It must be nice there.  Jackpine Radical   Apr-20-09 08:41 PM   #50 
  - I'm surprised we were just strung along  ardvark   Apr-20-09 07:09 PM   #13 
  - Some people see an aardvark as not quite an elephant, but not quite a mule, either. Are you  No Elephants   Apr-21-09 04:14 AM   #120 
     - i am a donkey  ardvark   Apr-21-09 08:12 AM   #136 
  - Hmm ...  Laelth   Apr-20-09 07:19 PM   #14 
  - unfortunately...  Two Americas   Apr-20-09 07:52 PM   #24 
  - I hear you, and I am equally puzzled by the "no dissent" mantra of some Obama supporters.  Laelth   Apr-20-09 08:19 PM   #34 
  - Did you read the article?  stillcool   Apr-20-09 08:25 PM   #40 
  - Yes, I read it.  Laelth   Apr-20-09 08:42 PM   #51 
  - Is there a way to..  mvd   Apr-20-09 08:47 PM   #54 
  - Sure, that could be done.  Laelth   Apr-20-09 08:53 PM   #56 
     - I have to agree  mvd   Apr-20-09 08:56 PM   #58 
  - ah..signaling...  stillcool   Apr-20-09 09:36 PM   #71 
  - Not on this subject.  Laelth   Apr-20-09 09:39 PM   #73 
     - No..as far as I know this was the first..  stillcool   Apr-20-09 09:44 PM   #74 
  - no choice  Two Americas   Apr-20-09 10:18 PM   #81 
     - I have the answer to that...  ElboRuum   Apr-21-09 12:31 PM   #176 
        - I think the debate is important  Two Americas   Apr-21-09 12:43 PM   #180 
           - I disagree. But of course you already knew that.  ElboRuum   Apr-21-09 04:48 PM   #196 
              - thanks  Two Americas   Apr-21-09 05:57 PM   #204 
                 - Some perhaps...  ElboRuum   Apr-22-09 12:47 PM   #220 
                    - that is where the confusion is, in my opinion  Two Americas   Apr-22-09 05:15 PM   #222 
  - Well, C'mon!  polmaven   Apr-21-09 10:28 AM   #156 
     - I learned how to translate the ..  stillcool   Apr-21-09 12:34 PM   #179 
  - Did you get the memo????????  flyarm   Apr-21-09 12:17 AM   #100 
     - Guess not.  Laelth   Apr-21-09 10:25 AM   #155 
  - Yeah, that Dennis Kucinich sure is a corporate whore.  Zhade   Apr-20-09 08:20 PM   #35 
  - yes  Two Americas   Apr-20-09 08:30 PM   #42 
  - You don't have to convince me, I'm fucking DONE with politicians.  Zhade   Apr-20-09 08:35 PM   #46 
     - you should be able to say that  Two Americas   Apr-20-09 10:24 PM   #82 
  - Yes, they can. But maybe they cannot BOTH be better than this AND get elected  No Elephants   Apr-21-09 04:30 AM   #125 
     - if that is true  Two Americas   Apr-21-09 06:20 PM   #206 
  - Are you referring to the article  stillcool   Apr-20-09 08:27 PM   #41 
  - Great post!!  OwnedByFerrets   Apr-20-09 09:24 PM   #65 
  - what he said. well put.  bbgrunt   Apr-20-09 11:19 PM   #86 
  - There's a huge difference between criticizing Obama and not voting for Obama. And, btw, I am  No Elephants   Apr-21-09 04:05 AM   #118 
     - sorry I don't agree  Two Americas   Apr-21-09 10:44 AM   #157 
  - Unfortunately, since Perot ran, the Republicans and Democrats joined forces to  No Elephants   Apr-21-09 04:34 AM   #126 
  - Deleted sub-thread  Name removed   Apr-20-09 07:21 PM   #15 
  - Of course not.  HeresyLives   Apr-20-09 07:28 PM   #17 
  - Gee, what a surprise, he's breaking ANOTHER of his promises.  Zhade   Apr-20-09 07:30 PM   #19 
  - What promise has 'he' broken?  stillcool   Apr-20-09 08:12 PM   #30 
     - Discontinuing the occupation of Iraq for starters  nolabels   Apr-20-09 11:53 PM   #93 
     - What did he say during the primaries...18 months?  stillcool   Apr-21-09 12:21 AM   #101 
        - What bothers me is people believe every P.R. BS the establishment puts out  nolabels   Apr-21-09 08:34 AM   #139 
           - We will never leave Iraq...  stillcool   Apr-21-09 09:49 AM   #148 
     - Reuters (February, 09): "Obama wants to re-open NAFTA"  jewishlibrl   Apr-21-09 12:12 AM   #98 
        - What did you 'hear' different today...  stillcool   Apr-21-09 12:26 AM   #103 
  - I guess a headline in the New York Times..  stillcool   Apr-20-09 07:34 PM   #21 
  - The issue was "modifying NAFTA"...the article above seems to say  KoKo   Apr-20-09 07:52 PM   #25 
  - Apparently it doesn't matter.  stillcool   Apr-20-09 08:03 PM   #28 
  - Two things: First, the  No Elephants   Apr-21-09 04:24 AM   #122 
  - how dare you interrupt this PUMA circle jerk with reason?  dionysus   Apr-21-09 10:59 AM   #163 
  - Apparently...  ElboRuum   Apr-21-09 12:46 PM   #181 
     - It's like feeding time..  stillcool   Apr-21-09 01:27 PM   #188 
  - BOO! BOO! BOO! eom.  Hotler   Apr-20-09 07:37 PM   #22 
  - President Obama has been introduced to world politics and its survival  ShareTheWoods   Apr-20-09 07:46 PM   #23 
  - And, in your parable, who are the great-thinking lions when it comes to these treaties?  No Elephants   Apr-21-09 05:17 AM   #127 
  - If it quacks like a duck?  Generator   Apr-20-09 07:54 PM   #26 
  - Say it ain;t so BO. Man, not a good week. C'mon Obama, be a Progressive, not Regressive.  EndElectoral   Apr-20-09 08:00 PM   #27 
  - Obama Administration = Third term of the Clinton Administration. Buyers remorse setting in.  Postman   Apr-20-09 08:20 PM   #36 
  - only to those who don't read....  stillcool   Apr-20-09 08:40 PM   #49 
  - But some of us can read between the lines...  Baby Snooks   Apr-20-09 11:20 PM   #87 
  - I tend to read the words ...  stillcool   Apr-21-09 12:09 AM   #97 
  - And some people parse too closely to get the "truth" they want  Maven   Apr-21-09 10:21 AM   #154 
     - you mean reading the words..  stillcool   Apr-21-09 12:28 PM   #175 
        - No, I mean selectively focusing on certain qualifiers and ignoring the overall message.  Maven   Apr-21-09 01:15 PM   #185 
           - What overall message from the New York Times...  stillcool   Apr-21-09 01:20 PM   #186 
  - Big time.  closeupready   Apr-20-09 10:25 PM   #83 
  - Obama has been strenously disappointing - he had such momentum  debbierlus   Apr-20-09 08:20 PM   #37 
  - oh please...  stillcool   Apr-20-09 08:22 PM   #38 
  - Reinvent myself? I donated to his campaign & I joined in the joyfest for a VERY short time  debbierlus   Apr-20-09 08:33 PM   #45 
     - the 'joy-fest'?  stillcool   Apr-20-09 08:38 PM   #47 
        - You're SO right, stillcool. It's just not that simple nor just  Fire1   Apr-20-09 09:50 PM   #77 
  - The "hope" was hype  meowomon   Apr-20-09 11:35 PM   #91 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Apr-21-09 10:53 AM   #159 
  - Good  RB TexLa   Apr-20-09 08:24 PM   #39 
  - Why change NAFTA?  bvar22   Apr-20-09 08:30 PM   #43 
  - This should surprise nobody.nt  Marie26   Apr-20-09 08:31 PM   #44 
  - And next, instead of card check...right to work! n/t  24601   Apr-20-09 08:40 PM   #48 
  - Honestly people! Obama is doing the wrong thing now so he can do the right thing later!  joeybee12   Apr-20-09 08:43 PM   #52 
  - LOL!  yardwork   Apr-20-09 09:50 PM   #76 
  - AND HE'S DONE IT ALL IN NINETY DAYS!!  Skittles   Apr-21-09 04:24 AM   #123 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Apr-20-09 08:47 PM   #53 
  - Well, it IS, but we sure got suckered anyway.  Zhade   Apr-20-09 08:59 PM   #59 
  - Have we been had or WTF?  lonestarnot   Apr-20-09 08:48 PM   #55 
  - is....  unkachuck   Apr-20-09 08:55 PM   #57 
  - recommend  xchrom   Apr-20-09 08:59 PM   #60 
  - each day I feel the new boss is same as the old boss.  Gin   Apr-20-09 09:01 PM   #61 
  - Austan Goolsbee is a vampire. That is all. nt  Romulox   Apr-20-09 09:08 PM   #62 
  - Deleted sub-thread  Name removed   Apr-20-09 09:11 PM   #63 
  - This thing just keeps getting better and fucking better.  OwnedByFerrets   Apr-20-09 09:22 PM   #64 
  - NAFTA is a treaty and if Mexico doesn't want to re-negotiate it  caseymoz   Apr-20-09 09:25 PM   #67 
  - NAFTA is NOT a treaty in the US Constitutional sense--it was not passed by 2/3 of the Senate. nt  Romulox   Apr-20-09 09:30 PM   #68 
  - Wow! You have a point. I forgot about that fast-track  caseymoz   Apr-21-09 01:18 AM   #107 
  - Can't the Senate and the President agree to revoke America's participation  No Elephants   Apr-21-09 05:35 AM   #128 
     - Since it's not a real treaty, just an legal agreement, it's not as difficult.  pampango   Apr-21-09 10:01 AM   #152 
  - Who believed otherwise?  Orwellian_Ghost   Apr-20-09 09:31 PM   #69 
  - President Obama: One disappointment after another  katandmoon   Apr-20-09 09:34 PM   #70 
  - Yes, it's quite sad. He had a lot of potential but he's throwing it away.  closeupready   Apr-20-09 10:27 PM   #84 
  - No, Bush was one disappointment after another.  caseymoz   Apr-21-09 01:24 AM   #109 
  - SOLD OUT AGAIN  FreakinDJ   Apr-20-09 09:39 PM   #72 
  - It's all about the money, honey...  Baby Snooks   Apr-20-09 11:31 PM   #89 
  - Because we would rather have Jindal or Mittens or Palin or Cantor?  No Elephants   Apr-21-09 05:38 AM   #129 
  - *sigh*  Celeborn Skywalker   Apr-20-09 09:45 PM   #75 
  - In the immortal words of LBJ...  razors edge   Apr-20-09 10:07 PM   #78 
  - This is very bad. He's sucking bad on economic issues. Worse and worse. (nt)  w4rma   Apr-20-09 10:15 PM   #79 
  - There's "free trade" and then there's "fair trade"...  MrMickeysMom   Apr-20-09 10:30 PM   #85 
  - I don't know which I love more... the bait or the switch.  lumberjack_jeff   Apr-20-09 11:25 PM   #88 
  - Seems like more effort was put in to the bait, the switch.... not so much.  harun   Apr-21-09 12:32 PM   #177 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Apr-20-09 11:34 PM   #90 
  - spoken like a true freepre...  dionysus   Apr-21-09 10:55 AM   #160 
  - that's not a very nice thing to say... makes me think you don't like the guy  dionysus   Apr-21-09 01:47 PM   #190 
  - Except it's not a shift. I remember his top aides being busted telling Canada  960   Apr-20-09 11:55 PM   #94 
  - That incident was known as "NAFTA-Gate"  jewishlibrl   Apr-21-09 12:24 AM   #102 
  - Obama denied it  rollingrock   Apr-21-09 12:30 AM   #104 
  - Bad news . .. unless Obama simply plans to overturn these trade agreements?  defendandprotect   Apr-20-09 11:56 PM   #95 
  - How many campaign promises can you break in the least amount of time?  rollingrock   Apr-20-09 11:56 PM   #96 
  - Oh MY...who would have thought???????  flyarm   Apr-21-09 12:13 AM   #99 
  - He wrongly thinks the powerbrokers got him elected when in the end, they will crush him like Clinton  grahamhgreen   Apr-21-09 01:00 AM   #105 
  - Clinton was crushed? He was a two term President and is now worth well over $100 million. Hordes  No Elephants   Apr-21-09 05:45 AM   #130 
     - Point taken.  grahamhgreen   Apr-21-09 12:27 PM   #174 
  - C'mon, he's only been in 90 days or so. Give him at least 10 more days  BigBearJohn   Apr-21-09 01:10 AM   #106 
  - As I recall this was a big issue with the Clinton haters, green & otherwise,  The_Casual_Observer   Apr-21-09 01:22 AM   #108 
  - In the Democratic party, but still pissed as hell. n/t  amandabeech   Apr-21-09 03:16 AM   #113 
  - Fiercely anti-Clinton ("hater" is your word, not mine), right here, and critical of this and other  bread_and_roses   Apr-21-09 05:46 AM   #131 
  - Sigh. And ONCE AGAIN......  TheWatcher   Apr-21-09 01:38 AM   #110 
  - And FURTHERMORE.....  TheWatcher   Apr-21-09 01:40 AM   #111 
  - Ohio will be very pissed about this.  Joanne98   Apr-21-09 04:20 AM   #121 
  - Oh.....Ohio sure is pissed.  OhioChick   Apr-21-09 07:40 AM   #134 
  - When will Labor quit kissing the ass of democrats?  Citizen Worker   Apr-21-09 06:48 AM   #132 
  - the funny thing is  ardvark   Apr-21-09 09:57 AM   #151 
  - Deleted message  Name removed   Apr-21-09 08:01 AM   #135 
  - maybe you should truck on over to free republic with that stuff...  dionysus   Apr-21-09 10:45 AM   #158 
  - Drip, drip, drip  democrank   Apr-21-09 08:21 AM   #138 
  - gee what a surprise  Torn_Scorned_Ignored   Apr-21-09 08:49 AM   #140 
  - corporate interests first, Americans last... oh and Americans pay the bill  fascisthunter   Apr-21-09 09:11 AM   #141 
  - Coming Soon to a Crumbling Republic Near You - Bill Clinton Take 2!  paparush   Apr-21-09 09:15 AM   #142 
  - Don't you Just Love the Non-Choices Presented by our Bipartisan System?  Moochy   Apr-21-09 09:20 AM   #143 
  - well, at least AIG got another 30 Billion yesterday, that should count for something  ardvark   Apr-21-09 09:54 AM   #149 
     - Still waiting for AIG's "viable business plan" deadline. Anyone?  Romulox   Apr-21-09 11:16 AM   #167 
  - Figures.....  BlueJac   Apr-21-09 09:28 AM   #144 
  - How hopeful and changealicious! n/t  QC   Apr-21-09 09:43 AM   #147 
  - It's Obama that turned out to be George Bush Light.  pam4water   Apr-21-09 09:55 AM   #150 
  - If you can't see major differences between Obama and Bush, I feel sorry for you  karynnj   Apr-21-09 11:09 AM   #164 
     - This thread is about TRADE. On the issue of TRADE, there is virtually no difference between the two  Romulox   Apr-21-09 11:15 AM   #166 
        - The post though did not say that it was limited to Trade  karynnj   Apr-21-09 11:35 AM   #169 
  - Reality sets in, not change.  MasonJar   Apr-21-09 10:55 AM   #161 
  - No surprises here. n/t  blindpig   Apr-21-09 10:58 AM   #162 
  - I guess we can all shine shoes and wait on the wealthy  Mari333   Apr-21-09 11:54 AM   #171 
  - He's determined to be a one-termer & then leave us stuck with  Justyce   Apr-21-09 11:57 AM   #172 
  - Yes. I'm sure that's it...  ElboRuum   Apr-21-09 12:33 PM   #178 
     - Guess I should've put a sarcasm tag for the sarcasm impaired...  Justyce   Apr-21-09 01:12 PM   #184 
        - No, I got the sarcasm...  ElboRuum   Apr-21-09 04:53 PM   #198 
           - He's pissing a lot of voters off. Think bigger than just DU. nt  Justyce   Apr-22-09 09:36 AM   #215 
              - I think you overestimate the political engagement of your average American  ElboRuum   Apr-22-09 12:49 PM   #221 
  - Key statement the perpetually perturbed appear to overlook ...  mzmolly   Apr-21-09 03:32 PM   #191 
  - Not fair you read more  SpartanDem   Apr-21-09 03:39 PM   #192 
  - .  mzmolly   Apr-21-09 03:45 PM   #193 
  - They can be "addressed", but they can't be CHANGED.  Zhade   Apr-21-09 03:52 PM   #195 
  - NAFTA called for such protections  mzmolly   Apr-21-09 08:04 PM   #210 
  - Exactly, they are currently side agreements which can be incorporated into the full....  Spazito   Apr-21-09 04:53 PM   #197 
  - That statement contradicts the OP; the Agreement can't be changed unless it is re-negotiated. nt  Romulox   Apr-21-09 05:44 PM   #202 
  - The side agreements ARE part of the totality of NAFTA...  Spazito   Apr-21-09 06:07 PM   #205 
     - By definition and your admission they are not.  Romulox   Apr-21-09 06:22 PM   #207 
        - It seems you did not read the info I edited into my post...  Spazito   Apr-21-09 06:34 PM   #208 
           - Right. That's because time is linear in nature.  Romulox   Apr-22-09 07:52 AM   #214 
  - Good to have this clarification  mzmolly   Apr-21-09 08:14 PM   #212 
  - This is a point on which a little history will help. Google "NAFTA side agreements". nt  Romulox   Apr-21-09 05:43 PM   #201 
     - Consider it googled.  mzmolly   Apr-21-09 08:11 PM   #211 
        - It may be a thoughtful approach, but it contradicts his campaign pledge nonetheless!  Romulox   Apr-22-09 07:50 AM   #213 
           - Obama has said he wishes to add the environmental and labor protections  mzmolly   Apr-22-09 11:59 AM   #217 
              - Which is logically impossible without renogitiating the "treaty".  Romulox   Apr-22-09 12:03 PM   #218 
                 - I guess we'll find out. It would appear that people are having a debate  mzmolly   Apr-22-09 12:40 PM   #219 
  - This is his first "official" broken promise; albeit a bad one  oviedodem   Apr-21-09 05:37 PM   #199 
  - Labor gets fucked yet again, this is getting better by the day.  DainBramaged   Apr-21-09 05:43 PM   #200 
  - As they say in the mummy...  PatrynXX   Apr-21-09 05:56 PM   #203 
  - I guess by "change" he meant he would completely change his mind  leftofthedial   Apr-21-09 06:47 PM   #209 
  - Sometimes it does seem that way, doesn't it?  truedelphi   Apr-22-09 11:09 PM   #223 
  - A picture is worth a thousand words......  Bushknew   Apr-22-09 09:45 AM   #216 
  - Well, that should certainly help replace those 4 1/2 million lost jobs.  Old Hob   Apr-23-09 01:03 AM   #224 
 

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