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cal04 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-15-05 10:54 AM
Original message
Chavez: World Faces Major Energy Crisis
Edited on Sat Oct-15-05 10:55 AM by cal04
Spain - Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez said Saturday that the world faces an energy crisis but there is little chance of his country and other OPECmembers increasing production because they are already pumping near "their capacity." "The world will have to get used to a barrel price, I think, of above $50, and energy will have to be saved," he told reporters as leaders from Spanish- and Portuguese-speaking countries met in this central Spanish town.

After soaring in August, crude oil prices have been between $60 and $70 a barrel for more than a month. "We're at the doorway of major energy crisis worldwide," Chavez said. "We'll have to develop other resources such as wind, solar and nuclear energy — naturally for peaceful purposes." He said Venezuela was in talks with Argentina and Brazil regarding nuclear power. "Prices will continue to rise but oil is running out," he said. Chavez said a "lack of imagination in the United States and the war in Iraq, which has destabilized the market in the Middle East, has also driven up prices." Increased demand from countries such as China and India is making the problem worse, he said.

"The whole world right now is producing petroleum at their maximum capacity," he said. "In Venezuela, for example, we can't produce a single barrel more." Venezuela, a member of Organization of Petroleum Exporting Countries, is the world's fifth largest oil exporter and a major supplier to the U.S. market. Venezuela's state oil company, Petroleos de Venezuela, says it pumps 3.2 million barrels of crude oil a day. But industry analysts put the figure lower, saying the country has never fully restored output since an extended strike in 2003 that sought to force Chavez's resignation.

Increased production would not solve the price problem, Chavez said. "The cause of the increase in the price is not in the production. It's partly the intermediaries who make things dearer. It's also because of the increase in demand and the irrational capitalist consumerism model," he said. "The United States for example, with scarcely five percent of the world's population, uses almost 25 percent of the petroleum and combustion fuels produced in the world," he said.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051015/ap_on_bi_ge/spain_chavez_oil
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Delphinus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-15-05 11:06 AM
Response to Original message
1. Truth -
what I've come to expect from Hugh Chavez.

He's right in so many ways - there's a lack of imagination from the White House. ?Their philosophy is to bury their heads in the sand and hope the problem comes up later. Or don't worry about it because they've got the money and their friends have got the money to pay for whatever they want.
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Kagemusha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-15-05 11:09 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. I thought people regarded "the price needs to be $50" as a lie.
The rest I won't argue about but, for a reputed socialist, that's some pretty hard core "free market" principles for you. Just saying.
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mojavekid Donating Member (993 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-15-05 12:13 PM
Response to Reply #1
6. The Whitehouse demonizes Chavez,
because he is a real threat to their influence in S. American Oil and gas producing countries, his straight talk on the worlds petroleum production and reserves goes against their policy of keeping us in the dark.

All this creeping authoritarianism in America is a part of a plan to contain the population once shortage becomes a reality. It looks as if Britain will get to this point before us.

The Whitehouse IMHO knows exactly what they are doing in terms of energy, it is not their plan to conserve - unless they force conservation on "us" with rationing, but for them, it is about controlling or at the least policing as much of the worlds oil as possible. Iraq, Iran, Saudi Arabia, Sudan...
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Mojorabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-15-05 11:23 AM
Response to Original message
3. At least he is admitting
that the worlds supply of oil is running out in regard to demand.
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murray hill farm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-15-05 01:05 PM
Response to Reply #3
8. Strange, isnt it?
That it is now..and has come to be...that all of us in the Americas must look to Venezuela for the truth about what is happening in our world of the north, central and south americas..and the rest of the world. Only do we hear from Chavez the uncensored truth...and must look outside of our own media...all the way to Venezueal, to hear that truth.
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StrafingMoose Donating Member (742 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-15-05 11:28 AM
Response to Original message
4. "oil is running out"
Edited on Sat Oct-15-05 11:30 AM by StrafingMoose

I've always been receptive of the 'peak oil & gas' theory, which makes some sense.

I mean, a global economy basing itself almost uniquely on one resource to power its needs is, globaly stupid I agree.

After all, we're raping Mother Earth like hell and we could get a much diserved beating sometimes.

But the problem with the "peak oil" theorists is their data comes from....oil corporations and... 'quiet admissions' by big banks and their 'insiders' who 'speak the truth'.

These two could really use a 'synthetic shortage' of oil. And as far as I know, if these two components get together, they pretty much own your country.

The key issue here is that I haven't been convinced yet that oil is _just_ dead dinosaurs and plants (that IMO we would have ran out a long time ago if it was the case) OR a chemical reaction in the sub mantle of the earth. ie: abiotic.





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Mojorabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-15-05 11:54 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. Watching the chess game
being played all over the world to secure energy resources, the alliances between countries being made, etc has just about convinced me.
Everyone is jockying for position to obtain oil and natural gas. If abiotic oil was being found in any country, I don't think this would be happening.
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StrafingMoose Donating Member (742 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-15-05 01:00 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. Actually...
Edited on Sat Oct-15-05 01:03 PM by StrafingMoose
If you look at it this way, it does look like that.

Problem is that China and Russia are letting UK and USA get into all these 'istans ex-Soviet states (Turkmen, Tajik, Uzbek, etc) without much sabre ratling. It's their backyards. These 'istan states before 2003 were thought to have great reserves of oil & gas. The "oil corporations" say it was a dud, 20 out of 25 drilled wells were dry -- that's in the Caspian Sea. Yet againt, the source of this information are oil corporations and their 'honest insiders'.

About the only sabre ratling you'll hear is about Taiwan. Of course, it might be also about territorial waters in the sea, which might contain oil & gas.

And this "chess game" IMO is not so much to 'secure' to sources. But rather, deny it to other countries. In that sense, the Coalition succeeded in Iraq. No oil is coming out of this 10% world reserve, and the price are soaring and some people are happy as hell that Iraqi oil doesn't flood the market and lower the price.

IMO there's two way of seeing this chess game unfold:

1) A battle for the last scraps of oil
2) A battle for a market that _they_ know will last longer than we're being told.

All of these big institutions have all the interests in keeping high prices and and have a 'shortage' going on, and also have the people accepting it. After all, it's the people of all these countries who will take the toll (you and me).

Peak Oil & Gas of course might happen. But will it be natural, man-made, or both?

This is an internal Chevron document:



Among many other: http://www.consumerwatchdog.org/energy/fs/

Of course, I wouldn't consider this a 'proof' of a synthetic shortage, but they definitely have to be taken in account.




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ryanmuegge Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-15-05 01:27 PM
Response to Reply #4
10. Hey, don't question the credibility of Matt Simmons
Or the origin of petroleum. That could get you in trouble around here ;)
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StrafingMoose Donating Member (742 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-15-05 01:41 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. Hehe...


well, as far as I know, Simmons is Republican right? Then we have a green card to question whatever the guy his, since this is a Democratic forum... right? :P

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ryanmuegge Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-15-05 05:56 PM
Response to Reply #11
17. Yeah, he's a diehard Bush supporter
But it seems that the Colin Campbells and Michael Rupperts of the world say you're strange to question his background. It is weird, isn't it, that he was an advisor to Bush, but the administration hasn't tried to enact policies that destroy demand (this is a big part of Simmons' solutions). Does anyone else find this strange? Perhaps this does give credence to the "synthetic shortage" idea you all were talking about.

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StrafingMoose Donating Member (742 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-16-05 12:06 PM
Response to Reply #17
18. Yea...


But what about the Gulf of Mexico after Katrina? Were the damage that important? If not, it was still an excuse to up prices -- that _could_ have been a test...

Anyways, I bet Simmons had his say in Cheney's energy task force. Peak Oil has been been in the mainstream media not even for a year yet, so let's see what's coming. I hope it's not :P



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Solon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-16-05 12:20 PM
Response to Reply #4
19. Actually the problem is the opposite...
First, most Peak Oil theorists ARE skeptical of many countries' estimates for stated reserves, but in the opposite direction, and with good reason. Since the Mid-80s, the amount of oil an OPEC nation can export was tied to stated reserves, hence, since that time, every single one of them has damn near doubled their reserves, with no major discoveries, I might add, since that time to now.
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StrafingMoose Donating Member (742 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-16-05 02:15 PM
Response to Reply #19
20. Hmm.. I'm aware of that
Edited on Sun Oct-16-05 02:15 PM by StrafingMoose

But I don't see how it 'opposes' what I described. Sorry, my brain hurts today. x(
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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-15-05 01:20 PM
Response to Original message
9. Venezuela promises cheap oil to poor Chicagoans
From the Chicago Tribune

Venezuela promises cheap oil to poor Chicagoans

By Oscar Avila
Tribune staff reporter

October 13, 2005, 7:07 PM EDT

Venezuelan officials today promised to offer discounted oil to benefit poor Americans, with Chicago one of four U.S. cities to be included in the initial energy offer.

The pledge came at the start of a two-day series of events in Chicago by Venezuelan government officials to promote better relations between Americans and the controversial regime of leftist President Hugo Chavez.

"Venezuela Matters" is unusual public diplomacy by Chavez to mix his anti-American rhetoric with generosity toward the American people.

While Venezuela had offered the cheap oil after Hurricane Katrina struck, today's announcement provided new details, including word Chicago would be among the first cities to benefit from the South Americans' generosity.
(snip/...)

http://www.newsday.com/news/nationworld/nation/chi-051013venezuela,0,1424914.story?coll=ny-leadnationalnews-headlines
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lovuian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-15-05 01:44 PM
Response to Original message
12. Seems like Chavez wants his piece of the Power Pie!!!
but does he have a strong enough army to defend that valuable commodity america so needs!!! Thats the ???
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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-15-05 01:52 PM
Response to Reply #12
14. Just an observation, but I think he wants Bush to stay out of his affairs
Edited on Sat Oct-15-05 01:56 PM by Judi Lynn
and to stop funding his oligarchical "opposition," so he can get on about his business in bringing the poverty-ridden majority of Venezuelans literacy, adequate housing, and access to health care.

On edit:

He also undoubtedly wants to push Bush back out of his country's internal affairs to the point they don't need to be looking over their shoulders now each waking moment for an invasion, bombings, assassinations, another coup, outsider-directed national strikes.

Veneuezuela and ALL Latin American countries are entitled to make their own ways, direct their own affairs. That's what the precious "freedom" Bush bellows about represents. FREEDOM from agressors.

Hardly power playing.
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fshrink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-15-05 01:46 PM
Response to Original message
13. How come this guy is the only head of state
to speak these elementary truths?
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Massacure Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-15-05 04:33 PM
Response to Original message
15. The U.S. Navy by itself uses something like 26% of the world's diesel fuel
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-15-05 05:16 PM
Response to Original message
16. But Americans were told that alternative energy programs were obsolete.
By reagan, the man everybodywants to put on saint's level.
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robbibaba Donating Member (128 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-16-05 02:59 PM
Response to Original message
21. A good peak oil link
This link is for Matt Savinar's website. Trained as a lawyer, Matt lays out the case for 'peak oil' the way he would a court room case, raising questions and calling in the expert witnesses. It's the most thorough examination of the issue I've found. And somewhat depressing.

http://www.lifeaftertheoilcrash.net/
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