Georgia War Shows 'Weak' Russia, U.S. Official Says

[inanna]

Source: Washington Post

Russia's conflict with Georgia is the sign of a "weak" Russian nation, not a newly assertive one, and Moscow now has put its place in the world order at risk, the top U.S. diplomat for relations with the country said in an interview yesterday.

"There is a Russia narrative that 'we were weak in the '90s, but now we are back and we are not going to take it more.' But being angry and seeking revanchist victory is not the sign of a strong nation. It is the sign of a weak one," said Daniel Fried, assistant secretary of state for European and Eurasian affairs.

"Russia is going to have to come to terms with the reality it can either integrate with the world or it can be a self-isolated bully. But it can't be both. And that's a choice Russia has to have," Fried said.

Read more: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/08/27/AR2008082703192.html

[Newsjock]

1. And in other news

The U.S. conflict with Iraq is the sign of a "weak" American nation, not a newly assertive one, and Washington now has put its place in the world order at risk, the top Russian diplomat for relations with the country said in an interview yesterday.

"There is an American narrative that 'we were weak in the '90s, but now we are back and we are not going to take it more.' But being angry and seeking revanchist victory is not the sign of a strong nation. It is the sign of a weak one," said Sergey Lavrov, Russian foreign minister.

"The United States is going to have to come to terms with the reality it can either integrate with the world or it can be a self-isolated bully. But it can't be both. And that's a choice America has to have," Lavrov said.

:sarcasm:

[inanna]

2. Yes these comments...

from the Bush administration are outrageously hypocritical.

[Wilber_Stool]

4. Georgia is the graveyard of America's unipolar world.

That was the headline from this story in the Guardian.

[People4Change]

7. Pravda.ru story discusses how Russia can retaliate FINANCIALLY against US

http://english.pravda.ru/world/americas/25-08-2008/106188-russia_usa-0
Russia may Hit the US very hard below the belt

I found this part of the story most enlightening:

"Flynt Leverett, a former National Security Council senior director and CIA senior analyst, said that Moscow was becoming a very important buyer of US Treasury bonds and US government agency issues. The specialist believes that those officials, who urge Washington to put forward various ultimatums to Russia, would hardly prefer Moscow disposing of its dollar assets. Leverett wrote for The National Interest that Moscow was sounding out opportunities of selling Russian crude for roubles, which would obviously affect long-term dollar positions."

We have Bush and company to blame for our country's huge debt that may now be used by countries such as Russia and China against us.


By the way, I found this 2nd story even more disturbing:
http://english.pravda.ru/world/ussr/27-08-2008/106216-nato_georgia-0

NATO’s navy delivers weapons to Georgia under the guise of humanitarian aid
Front page / World / Former USSR
27.08.2008 Source: Pravda.Ru

"NATO has been increasing its naval presence in the Black Sea during the recent several days.

The US Navy destroyer USS McFaul, which is currently docked in the Georgian port of Batumi, carries about 50 Tomahawk cruise missiles on board. They are outfitted with nuclear warheads and are meant to hit ground targets. The remaining NATO ships are currently concentrated in the northern part of the Black Sea,” a source in the military intelligence of the Russian Federation said.

He added that other NATO ships drifting in the Black Sea were armed with 64 anti-ship Harpoon missiles and about eight helicopters.

Washington insists that the ships, which appeared near Georgia’s shores, have been deployed there in accordance with George W. Bush’s decision, who ordered to deliver humanitarian aid to the Georgian military."

HAS THE BUSH WHITE HOUSE GONE COMPLETELY INSANE?

[Igel]

13. Try this.

Original plan: NATO ships in Black Sea for manoeuvres and visits with other NATO nations. There are NATO countries on the Black Sea. Then July came, with ratcheted up tensions that most people ignored, then August. NATO continued to expect to follow its plan. Russia doesn't get to re-write several-month-old NATO plans; it wouldn't sit still for NATO's rewriting plans for Russian troop exercises--see the one in late July in N. Ossetia, for instance (which NATO wasn't informed about--it was an unannounced response to an announced NATO-Georgian troop exercise in Georgia).

Now Russia is trying to say that there's somehow something illegal about the ship movements--not yet, to be sure, they have 3 weeks there before some are in violation--and that it's a response to Russia's occupation of Poti and scuttling of everything in that harbor (to prevent looting, no doubt, just as destroying or confiscating everything in the part kept it out of subhuman hands). Before the war, Russia complained about the ships' going into the Black Sea, but had no support and little publicity about it. It's their lake, Romania apparently has no claim on it. Ah. That sounds familiar.

Then, in August, there's the Russo-Georgian conflict: US proposal, send in 2 hospital ships. Russia balks, pulls rank. No can do, treaty violation, it's anti-humanitarian to send in hospital ships, people are dying there. Now, the Montreux Convention's not binding on the US, I don't think; we didn't sign it. But that doesn't keep Medvid's lips from moving. The Russian pressure that helped push Turkey into NATO is re-applied. Turkey honors the treaty, denies entry to the hospital ships. (I'm just waiting for Russia to have a ship "stall" in the Dardanelles for a while, the old Soviet tactic to keep anybody but Russia from having military ships in the Black Sea.)

US response: Send in one destroyer with humanitarian aid. It's permitted. And arguably more efficient--it's what they did in Indonesia. As a military ship, should the Russians try to board it and intimidate or search the ship, there'd be a big problem. Best to avoid Poti, since the Russians continue their board-and-search regime there. So go to Batumi: This has a second feature. Batumi had a Russian base; Russia turned it over to the Georgians, but in theory have a lease on it until 12/08. If a US ship is there, it would be harder for the Russians to claim the place as a base. Both sides have avoided having their personnel run into each other, and wisely so.

Show me the insanity. Sounds like a bit of chess, insane only if it's insane to actually challenge Russia. Perhaps it is; but it strikes me as insane to lie down and encourage Russia, as well.

[The Stranger]

15. The Neocons have to manufacture an enemy, and imaginary terrorists no longer get it done for them.

[mediaman007]

3. I guess we showed them!

[antisoros]

5. Weak Russia

McCain club members like Payne and Scheunemann, are in it for the money. Download this interesting pdf, and use the search function and you will find several acquaintances of right wing agenda folks. Download fast because the Mods delete a lot of foreign policy stuff. McCain wants to use foreign policy as his stepping stone to the White House. Russia has zero enemies to the East.
http://www.scribd.com/doc/4733423/worldwide-strategic-energy-final-draft-business-plan

Scheunemann and his Georgian bosses and beneficiaries.
http://mfa.gov.ge/index.php?lang_id=ENG&sec_id=85&info_id=6482

As for the "unipolar" initiatives, that is untenable. If McCain wins, we get a Russia-China polarity and another Cold War That can be prevented if we face the McCain challenge with common sense.

[coalition_unwilling]

6. OMG--do these cretins

actually believe the BS they spew?

[magellan]

8. Propaganda

If Russia's so weak, why doesn't Bush** send our ships straight into Poti with their humanitarian aid instead of avoiding Russia's ships by heading to another port?

It's lies like these that will get us into a another war, and I don't know any sane person who thinks we can take on Russia without it going very badly for everyone.

[Robbien]

9. Standard policy of this admin is to charge the other guy for sins they committed themselves

Russia was the one who appeared weak?

Yeah, right.

[AlphaCentauri]

10. So weak that they put the house in order in 3 days

how many more years we need in Afghanistan and Iraq?

[newfie11]

11. another line of propaganda

from the biggest liars in 200 years.

[Dutch]

12. Absurd, juvenile fantasising

Whatever one's opinion of the rights and wrongs of Russia's recent actions, this really illustrates the Bush regime's pathetic grasp of the situation and deliberately provocative and jingoistic approach. And as for a member of the regime lecturing anybody on integrating with the world and not being "a self-isolated bully", well that can only merit a hearty :rofl:.

[Igel]

14. That's a bit better.

Challenge wicker-boy (Rogozin) on his own terms. Can't win the basketball match sitting on the sidelines pondering if you should bid 4 clubs no-trump over your opponent's opening bid of 3 spades.

There are times for diplomatic language. Those times are when the cultural context is shared. It's not.

Too bad it's a low-ranking officer, though. Should have been Rice.

[Wilber_Stool]

16. "Can't win the basketball match

sitting on the sidelines pondering if you should bid 4 clubs no-trump over your opponent's opening bid of 3 spades."
Now there's a mixed metaphor you can really sink your teeth into.

[David__77]

17. Please... of course it's a sign of strength.

They said the same thing about Germany in the 30's. Yes, Russia has structural weaknesses, but it's more than capable of totally upending the current world order as well. These US ravings only stoke the fires.

[underpants]

18. Whew! for a few days there I thought they WEREN'T going to screw this up too

Glad to see everything is back to normal