Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

4 Afghan women immolate themselves

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Latest Breaking News Donate to DU
 
DuctapeFatwa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 05:39 PM
Original message
4 Afghan women immolate themselves
Four more ladies have immolated themselves in western Afghanistan over the last three days, a Kabul-based independent daily has reported. "Despite government and humanitarian agencies' efforts four more cases of self-immolation have been reported in Heart province," Erada reported. All the victims, the daily said, were young girls and the reason behind the motivation has yet to be known. However, the daily cited humanitarian aid workers who blamed the recently imposed restrictions on women by Heart's governor Ismael Khan for self-burning.

http://www.nni-news.com/current/world/news-05.htm
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
maxsolomon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 05:40 PM
Response to Original message
1. everything going according to plan, george?
maybe we should have finished the first job before we took on another.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Scairp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 07:50 PM
Response to Reply #1
10. Truer words were never spoken
I guess it never occurred to the talking Shrub that two wars at a time was a little too much even for our crack military. He's such an asshole.:mad:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Turbineguy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 05:44 PM
Response to Original message
2. I hate to see this
Every death is some sort of small victory for Bush.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
mobuto Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 11:12 PM
Response to Reply #2
26. WTF?
Please explain.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Turbineguy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 05:44 PM
Response to Original message
3. Dupe
Edited on Tue Mar-02-04 05:45 PM by Turbineguy
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
roguevalley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 06:15 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. Incredible sadness. Lots of women were losing it under the taliban
and now, with the return of the gangsters thanks to
us abandoning them, they are losing it again. God
bless them. I cannot imagine the courage it takes to
do what they did. I don't consider suicide cowardly.
Hurtful to those left, yes. But cowardly? Nope.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DuctapeFatwa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 06:58 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. US hasn't abandoned them. They're paying them. pipeline.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Scairp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 07:53 PM
Response to Reply #6
11. I thought I read something
Edited on Tue Mar-02-04 07:55 PM by Scairp
Regarding the opium growth in Afghanistan for 2003. Apparently, they had a bumper crop of the stuff. Thanks to the Idiot in Chief, more heroin than ever before will be hitting the streets of America.

Edited to add a link.
http://www.newsday.com/news/nationworld/world/wire/sns-ap-us-international-narcotics,0,1779150.story?coll=sns-ap-world-headlines
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DuctapeFatwa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 07:56 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. And the child organ trade is booming, too! bush is not lying when he says

America has helped Afghanistan's economy. It has improved a lot. Not for everybody, of course.

Like any democracy, those who put US business interests and investors first will prosper.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
orwell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 06:21 PM
Response to Original message
5. Afghani Mission Accomplished?
Wasn't there someone on DU earlier today posting about how well the women in Afghanistan are doing due to our 'liberation' efforts?

I'm sure this story will be all over MSRNC tonight, in between promos for Average Joe and Britney Does Dallas...

Really...I'm sure...

O
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Minstrel Boy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 07:05 PM
Response to Original message
7. Rumsfeld on Herat's warlord, Ismael Khan:
"an appealing person...thoughtful, measured and self-confident"
http://www.wsws.org/articles/2002/nov2002/afgh-n30.shtml

"Secretary Rumsfeld meets with Ismail Khan in Herat, Afghanistan":
http://www.defenselink.mil/photos/Jun2002/020427-D-9880W-408.html

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
mobuto Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 10:54 PM
Response to Reply #7
22. Pact with the devil
The decision to support Afghan warlords was a critical mistake. Not just for the people of Afghanistan, but for our own interests. If we had had our own troops at Tora Bora, for instance, Osama bin Laden would never have been able to escape to freedom. The war on terrorism is criticial to our security, but Bush has been running it on the cheap since day one. We should have our troops in Afghanistan and Northwestern Pakistan, not Iraq.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rfkrocks Donating Member (846 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 07:06 PM
Response to Original message
8. laura bush
where the frig is laura bush? she apparently has forgotten these poor girls after the 9/11 photo op. instead of rasiing pork for her husband the king of shame and dumping on dems-she should be calling attention to this like Sen Clinton did to the Chinese, about destroying female babies, in 1995 woman's conference.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Disturbed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 07:24 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. Laura
She is a phony just like her husband.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
FizzFuzz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 08:00 PM
Response to Original message
13. my godmygodmygod
that women, young girls, live under such oppression, torture and helplessness that the only voice they are left is that....

mygodmygodmygod

send
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
FizzFuzz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 08:00 PM
Response to Original message
14. my godmygodmygod
that women, young girls, live under such oppression, torture and helplessness that the only voice they are left is that....

mygodmygodmygod

send prayers
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
FizzFuzz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 08:00 PM
Response to Original message
15. my godmygodmygod
that women, young girls, live under such oppression, torture and helplessness that the only voice they are left is that....

mygodmygodmygod

send prayers send
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
FizzFuzz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 08:00 PM
Response to Original message
16. my godmygodmygod
that women, young girls, live under such oppression, torture and helplessness that the only voice they are left is that....

mygodmygodmygod

send prayers send vibes
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
FizzFuzz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 08:00 PM
Response to Original message
17. my godmygodmygod
Edited on Tue Mar-02-04 08:01 PM by FizzFuzz
that women, young girls, live under such oppression, torture and helplessness that the only voice they are left is that....

mygodmygodmygod

send prayers send vibes send thoughts that somehow Bushco will be stopped...

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Scairp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 08:04 PM
Response to Reply #17
18. We heard you the first time Fizz
Edited on Tue Mar-02-04 08:05 PM by Scairp
No need to repeat yourself.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
kainah Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 10:29 PM
Response to Original message
19. the Buddhist monks in Vietnam
I was probably about 13 when I saw that on TV. It was so disturbing that I knew immediately the war was wrong. Of course, we will NOT see these women now, not on this media. I am humbled before the sacrifice of these young women.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Athame Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 11:15 PM
Response to Reply #19
27. Yes, if we had the picture like we had from Vietnam
Edited on Tue Mar-02-04 11:20 PM by MaRadix
these women's sacrifice could turn the tide. Though I think this is more absolute desperation than spiritual/political drama. The plight of women in Afghanistan is indescribable.

For more information on their struggles go here http://rawa.false.net/index.html

edit to add link
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Shakespeare Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 10:37 PM
Response to Original message
20. WHERE IS THE POSTER who was just talking about how great things are there?
Huh? Where are you? Awfully quiet now, aren't you? But no, earlier you simply would not hear of it when we tried to tell you that the situation is Afghanistan has reverted back to something as bad or worse than it was before we invaded.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
NickB79 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 10:50 PM
Response to Original message
21. Just so I'm perfectly clear, immolation is burning oneself to death
Correct? Oh my God.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DuctapeFatwa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 11:05 PM
Response to Reply #21
24. yes. Here's a related story
Forced marriages contributing to Afghan women suicides

An Afghan official has said that forced marriages are contributing to suicide attempts among women in Afghanistan.

Afghan Deputy Women's Affairs Minister Suraya Sobah Rang's comments come in response to reports that many women in the western city of Herat committed suicide by self-immolation in the past year, Radio Liberty has reported.

Sobah Rang said there were 52 cases of women being admitted to hospital in Herat with burns last year, but only four of those cases were confirmed suicide attempts.

Sobah Rang said of the 52 women who were admitted to hospital, 35 had died. She said the causes of these kind of suicides and suicide attempts are Afghan traditions which are forcing some girls to marry someone they do not want to marry.--

http://www.nni-news.com/current/world/news-16.htm
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BigDaddyLove Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 11:04 PM
Response to Original message
23. They burned themselves to death because.........
"Ismael Khan has banned lady singers on television, closed beauty parlors as well as women tailoring in his own administered areas."?

Seems a little extreme.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TroglodyteScholar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 11:07 PM
Response to Reply #23
25. extreme...khan or the ladies' actions?
If you're referring to the ladies, let me suggest something to you. Glimpse freedom (or something like it) for the very first time in a very long and difficult life. Then have it snatched away just when you're starting to accept that it's real.

You'd just get over it, right?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BigDaddyLove Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 11:17 PM
Response to Reply #25
28. I wouldn't light myself on fire if that's what you're asking.
.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Athame Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 11:27 PM
Response to Reply #28
31. Might you consider, Big Daddy, that the news story did not tell all?
You obviously have no understanding of what women have been subjected to there. One does not set oneself on fire because of the closure of beauty salons.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TroglodyteScholar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 11:28 PM
Response to Reply #28
32. I hate to harp on this...
But can you even relate to these women in the smallest way?

I know I can't...and knowing that, I understand that any response can not simply be written off as extreme.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Athame Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-03-04 01:15 AM
Response to Reply #32
34. This is from an e-mail update I receive from RAWA
Britain and the US said war on Afghanistan would liberate women. We are still waiting

Mariam Rawi in Kabul

In truth, the situation of women in Afghanistan remains appalling. Though girls and women in Kabul, and some other cities, are free to go to school and have jobs, this is not the case in most parts of the country. In the western province of Herat, the warlord Ismail Khan imposes Taliban-like decrees. Many women have no access to education and are banned from working in foreign NGOs or UN offices, and there are hardly any women in government offices. Women cannot take a taxi or walk unless accompanied by a close male relative. If seen with men who are not close relatives, women can be arrested by the "special police" and forced to undergo a hospital examination to see if they have recently had sexual intercourse. Because of this continued oppression, every month a large number of girls commit suicide - many more than under the Taliban.

Women's rights fare no better in northern and southern Afghanistan, which are under the control of the Northern Alliance. One international NGO worker told Amnesty International: "During the Taliban era, if a woman went to market and showed an inch of flesh she would have been flogged; now she's raped."

Even in Kabul, where thousands of foreign troops are present, Afghan women do not feel safe, and many continue to wear the burka for protection. In some areas where girls' education does exist, parents are afraid to allow their daughters to take advantage of it following the burning down of several girls' schools. Girls have been abducted on the way to school and sexual assaults on children of both sexes are now commonplace, according to Human Rights Watch.

In spite of its rhetoric, the Karzai government actively pursues policies that are anti-women. Women cannot find jobs, and girls' schools often lack the most basic materials, such as books and chairs. There is no legal protection for women, and the older legal systems prohibit them from getting help when they need it. Female singers are not allowed on Kabul television, and women's songs are not played, while scenes in films of women not wearing the hijab are censored.

The Karzai government has established a women's ministry just to throw dust in the eyes of the international community. In reality, this ministry has done nothing for women. There are complaints that money given to the women's ministry by foreign NGOs has been taken by powerful warlords in the Karzai cabinet.

The "war on terror" toppled the Taliban regime, but it has not removed religious fundamentalism, which is the main cause of misery for Afghan women. In fact, by bringing the warlords back to power, the US has replaced one misogynist fundamentalist regime with another.

But then the US never did fight the Taliban to save Afghan women. As recently as 2000 the Bush administration gave the Taliban $43m as a reward for reducing the opium harvest. Now the US supports the Northern Alliance, which was responsible for killing more than 50,000 civilians during its bloody rule in the 1990s. Those in power today - men such as Karim Khalili, Rabbani, Sayyaf, Fahim, Yunus Qanooni, Mohaqiq and Abdullah - were those who imposed anti-women restrictions as soon as they took control in 1992 and started a reign of terror throughout Afghanistan. Thousands of women and girls were systematically raped by armed thugs, and many committed suicide to avoid being sexually assaulted by them.

But lack of women's rights is not the only problem facing Afghanistan today. Neither opium cultivation nor warlordism and terrorism have been uprooted. There is no peace, stability or security. President Karzai is a prisoner within his own government, the nominal head of a regime in which former Northern Alliance commanders hold the real power. In such a climate, the results of the forthcoming elections in June can easily be predicted: the Northern Alliance will once again hijack the results to give legitimacy to its bloody rule.

In November 2001 Colin Powell, the US secretary of state, said: "The rights of women in Afghanistan will not be negotiable." But the women of Afghanistan have felt with their whole bodies the dishonesty of such statements from US and British leaders - we know that they have already negotiated away women's rights in Afghanistan by imposing the most treacherous warlords on the people. Their pretty speeches are made out of political expediency rather than genuine concern.

From 1992 to 2001 Afghan women were treated as cattle by all brands of fundamentalists, from jihadis to the Taliban. Some western writers have tried to suggest that this oppression has its roots in Afghan traditions and that it is disrespectful of "cultural difference" to criticise it. Yet Afghan women themselves are not silent victims. There is resistance, but you have to look for it, as any serious anti-fundamentalist group has to work semi-underground. The Revolutionary Association of Women of Afghanistan (RAWA), which was outlawed under the Taliban, still can't open an office in Kabul. We still can't distribute our magazine Payam-e-Zan (Women's Message) openly. Shopkeepers are still threatened with death for stocking our publications, and RAWA supporters have been tortured and imprisoned for distributing them. People who are caught reading our literature are still in danger.

Feminism does not need to be imported; it has already taken root in Afghanistan. Long before the US bombing, progressive organisations were trying to establish freedom, democracy, secularism and women's rights. Then, western governments and media showed little interest in the plight of Afghan women. When, before September 11 2001, RAWA gave footage of the execution of its leader, Zarmeena, to the BBC, CNN, ABC and others, it was told that the footage was too shocking to broadcast. However, after September 11 these same media organisations aired the footage repeatedly. Similarly, some of RAWA's photographs documenting the Taliban's abuses of women were also used - without our permission. They were reproduced as flyers and dropped by American warplanes as they flew over Afghanistan.

This piece first appeared in New Internationalist magazine (www.newint.org)

Mariam Rawi, a member of the Revolutionary Association of Women of Afghanistan, is writing under a pseudonym

RAWA
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Sugarbleus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-03-04 01:41 AM
Response to Reply #34
36. I used to have that link to RAWA...it was a very moving info site..
I hate this current government for what they do and what they DON'T do. We were suppose to help the people of Afghanistan...THIS TIME..not abandon them..

What a freaking MESSSSSSS!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Minstrel Boy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 11:20 PM
Response to Reply #25
29. nice post, and welcome to DU
:hi:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BigDaddyLove Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 11:26 PM
Response to Reply #29
30. Yep........
He/she has ingested and can regurgitate the suggested party line(s), complete with the required hyperbole.

Excellent.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TroglodyteScholar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 11:31 PM
Response to Reply #30
33. uhhuh...
Resorting to personal attacks is a sure sign of someone who doesn't know wtf they're talking about.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bobbyboucher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-03-04 02:55 AM
Response to Reply #33
38. "Doesn't know what they are talking about", is
the biggest understatement of the year. Big Daddy cannot hide his apologist agenda and should be ignored.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DuctapeFatwa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-03-04 01:17 AM
Response to Reply #23
35. No, because they don't want to "marry" the men they're sold to
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bobbyboucher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-03-04 02:51 AM
Response to Reply #23
37. Bush couldn't have poo-pooed it better.
Nice contribution.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Fri May 03rd 2024, 12:58 AM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Latest Breaking News Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC