Kerry, Graham, Lieberman to unveil climate bill

[alp227]

Source: The Washington Post

In their last and best shot at enacting a climate bill this year, Sens. John F. Kerry (D-Mass.), Lindsey O. Graham (R-S.C.) and Joseph I. Lieberman (I-Conn.) plan to unveil a draft Monday that will provide a streamlined system for capping greenhouse gas emissions from the utilities and transport sector but still aims to reduce the nation's carbon dioxide output by 17 percent in 10 years.

The measure offers numerous concessions to businesses, including allowing manufacturing and energy-intensive industries four years before they would be subject to the carbon cap; provisions for offshore oil drilling; $10 billion for the coal industry to capture and store its carbon emissions; and enough loan guarantees and incentives to provide for the construction of 12 nuclear power plants.

"Because of the broad-based industry support that I expect the bill will garner, both at the rollout as well as beyond, I think this is the best path forward," said Fred Krupp, who heads the Environmental Defense Fund.

Read more: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/04/23/AR2010042304703.html?wprss=rss_politics

[PSPS]

1. "the best path forward"

"Because of the broad-based industry support that I expect the bill will garner, both at the rollout as well as beyond, I think this is the best path forward," said Fred Krupp, who heads the Environmental Defense Fund.

That's a laugh.

[alarimer]

2. What pathetic assholes

Yet more failure to stand up to corporatism and more evidence that our system is hopeless corrupt. Kick ALL the bastards out, from Obama to Kerry on down, if they continue to push this corporate bullshit.

[karynnj]

10. I guess you prefer doing nothing? This is likely the best that can pass the Senate

Just who do you think will replace Obama and Kerry? Who exactly do you want to vote for instead of Obama, Kucinich? I assume you no longer believe in Edwards. Do you really want a Republican President?

Also, if environment is your strongest issue, you are throwing out one of the strongest, most persistent environmentalists in Kerry.

Though I prefer not to use such words, that you use easily - I think they might apply more to you than to three Senators who have spent thousands of hours negotiating details to get a bill with any likelihood of passing. Where were you when I posted of 14 Democratic Senators arguing that coal power plants should be able to pollute at current level?

[ixion]

15. I prefer doing something that will actually do something, as opposed to doing something

that rewards those who caused the problem in the first place.

[karynnj]

23. Have you driven a car or used coal power derived electricity?

The fact is these companies produced both. This is not like tobacco companies that hid problems that they knew first. The government has incrementally required that different emissions be limited - such as sulfur dioxide which caused acid rain and lead in gasoline. Here, the pollutants are natural byproducts of creating energy from those sources.

The point of the research and subsidies in the bill is to move those companies to finding cleaner ways to produce that energy. The bill also provides money for a smarter electric grid and for various alternative energy sources. For the first time it would put a cost to carbon. That is a big deal - it means that the cost of creating carbon emissions will be included explicitly in company decisions.

You saw that Kerry/Boxer did not have enough votes - and it was a compromise that you also likely would not have supported.

To "do something" a bill has to pass. A comprehensive energy/climate change bill that ignores coal, oil, gas and nuclear will not pass. Kerry could easily write such a bill, but it would not make it to the Senate floor and if it did it would likely get nowhere near the 60 votes needed. (Though you would likely applaud it - and maybe Kucinich could sponsor the parallel bill in the House - also getting nowhere near the votes to pass. It would be a waste of both their time)

[alarimer]

22. Any climate bill that has corporate support is a shitty bill not worth supporting

And will do nothing but delay what really needs to be done.

This and the health care bill are both utter travesties and will hurt rather than help.

This is just more caving in to evil fucking corporations. Fuck them. Fuck Congress, Democrats, Republicans and Independents, the President and all his lackeys and every last self-centered human being, right and left, who refuse to recognize that DRASTIC changes need to be made. Not this piecemeal, penny-ante stuff.

The worst part of this bill is that it will prohibit states (like California) from having tougher regulations than federal ones, and it also prohibits the EPA from regulating greenhouse gases as pollutants, which they most certainly are.

But of course so-called Democrats are all bought and paid for by corporations so even if they were all Democrats, we still would not be able to do what is truly necessary.

Oh well, millions of people will die, which is probably what the planet needs anyway.

[No Elephants]

27. How do we know for certain that this is the best bill that can pass the Senate?.

What is the basis for the assumption that whatever is thrown at us is all that possibly can be done, even if Democrats fight tooth and nail for something better?


So somebody might fillibusters. So what? Let failure to act on the climate have a Republican label on it--or a Blue Dog label or a center right wing of the Democratic Party label, whichever is true. The people of America deserve at least that much.

[sfwriter]

18. Yes, but we don't have a majority...

Face it, Progressives are a minority. Pro-corporate Dems and Republicans outnumber us ten to one.

I say get SOMETHING in place. Get it started. Make carbon an area of government influence, and keep fighting for a better government.

[politicasista]

25. They do not care. Notice how the above poster dodged the question that

karynnj asked? They probably did not ask or wonder why Dems that are often touted as DU's favorite liberal progressives opposed this bill. They are too busy screaming at Kerry to even care, or just wanting to rant. And no, am not a Graham, Lieberman fan either.

Not surprising there are crickets or people can't answer a simple question.

[No Elephants]

29. Alarimer did not dodge the question.

[politicasista]

39. Yep. Call them names behind the anonymity of their keyboard

Some DUers manage to let their chosen heroes off the hook sometimes. JMHO.

[No Elephants]

28. I saw a poll recently, but don't remember where, that liberas are half of the Democratic Party.

It's harder to fight for a better government when Senators cover for each other.

Let someone have his or her fingerprints on something, as Bunning did for filibustering extension of unemployment benefits.

[DCBob]

3. Anything Lieberman is part of has to be wrong.

imo.

[wisteria]

4. The man is not my favorite, but he is not wrong on everything. n/t

[DCBob]

7. Yes, of course you are correct. but I just despise that asshole..

I wish his name wasn't on this bill.

[karynnj]

11. Not on this issue -

In 2004, he had only one point lower on the League of Conservation Voters score than Kerry. Kerry had done more on the environment and the LCV for the first time ever endorsed in the primary - Choosing Kerry.

On foreign policy and many other things, I agree with you.

[wisteria]

5. I am so hoping that this does come off on Monday. It is the right thing to do next. n/t

[ixion]

6. Wow. Look for a real warthog of a bill

from that team.

Yep, turns out I was right.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=115x243636

[karynnj]

12. Kerry and Lieberman are two of the leading environmentalists in the Senate

Not to mention Greenpeace also condemned Waxman/Markey. They also attacked Kerry/Boxer, which could not get enough votes. Seems to me they are not realistic on what can pass. The fact is that any bill that included anything for nuclear would be attacked by them. (Note - any bill without it is unlikely to get more than about 30 votes.)

http://www.greenpeace.org/usa/news/greenpeace-waxman-markey-clim

That bill narrowly passed the House. The Senate is far harder needing 60%.

[JI7]

32. not Lieberman , only Kerry

[karynnj]

40. I think Lieberman had a 95 LCV lifetime ranking to Kerry's 96 in 2004

I'm not positive of the numbers, but both were in the mid 90s - the highest in the Senate and Kerry was one point higher.

Lieberman is awful on an enormous number of things, but not this.

[NecklyTyler]

8. 390 and climbing when we need to be less than 350

The planet can't wait 10 years for a 17% reduction, we need a reduction starting right now. Carbon pollution needs to be capped where it is right now with a hefty tax on usage to pay for the damage being done to the atmosphere. The proceeds from the tax should be used for production of clean, renewable energy to replace our dependence on fossil fuel

[karynnj]

13. Can you get 60 Senators for that?

[No Elephants]

30. Are you saying invoking cloture on a fillibuster and a "no" vote on a bill are the same thing?

We are now talking as though everything requires 60 votes, which is not true.

[wisteria]

9. We can do this, we can pass something that will beneift our planet. n/t

[hayu_lol]

14. A Troika consisting of Kerry, Lieberman and Graham(senator Leghorn...

Cleghorn)is a Troika designed in Hell. None have accomplished much to date and the future with them in control looks like more of the same.

Matter of fact, Graham is already publicly waffling.

[karynnj]

26. Kerry has accomplished a lot on many issues

It was Kerry, who more than anyone, exposed the Contra portion of Iran/Contra. Without his investigation, done with little support from anyone (although Lugar, the then chair of the SFRC and Helms allowed him to do it) It is not clear that the extent of what was illegally done would ever have been public otherwise.

Kerry's investigation of BCCI, which the entire DC power elite fought, produced information that Morgenthau, NYC DA used to close BCCI, OBL's bank. Kerry then used this knowledge to write legislation to fight international money laundering in the 1990s. Both democrats and Republicans fought it in the 1990s, but it became law after 911. Those tools have been the strongest tools we have had in fighting non-state terrorists - as conceded even by people like George Will in 2006. Until this Congress, Kerry was the only Senator on both Finance and SFRC. That and his background on BCCI, led him to write the recent provision that passed in a recent jobs bill that will make it harder for people to hide assets off shore to avoid taxes.

Kerry and Kennedy wrote the precursor bill to SCHIP and Kerry was a co-sponsor of Kennedy's and Hatch's bill.

Kerry was the author and cosponsor of the affordable housing act, working through about 4 Congresses (8 years) getting progressively more co-sponsors until in 2008, Dodd (one of those co-sponsors) included it in a banking bill.

Kerry/Lugar/Berman is a keystone of US policy in Pakistan, a key ally.

You were a big Hillary supporter - care to compare her Senate accomplishments - Kerry beats her even if you limit it to work done in the first 8 years for each!

As to Graham, he is not waffling - he is furious that on the weekend before they were to unveil a bill they have worked months on, reid pulled the rug out - to shift gears to a not yet written immigration bill.

[politicasista]

38. Point Proven. Nothing is never good enough for some n/t

[No Elephants]

31. Yep, Graham is now using this as leverage on everything else. Turd.

Lie down with dogs, get up with fleas.

[alfredo]

16. Graham has wimped out.

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/?fbid=yyXtpM6FzeT

[DCBob]

17. This bill is dead even before it arrived...

thanks to :puke: Lindsay Gramnesty.

[alfredo]

21. We should push ahead anyway. It only strengthens our case that the

GOP stands for the polluters and pillagers, not us.

[No Elephants]

33. Pushing a lousy bill through on our own will really show 'em!

And America will get screwed...again.

[alfredo]

37. Showing how anti environmental protection the Reps and

DINO's are gives us room to push real change.

[DCBob]

35. I know this bill is just a first step but it seems like false security...

We need drastic measures to have any impact. I fear this is too little too late. BTW, we already have a "strong case".. no one seriously thinks the GOPers care about climate change or the environment.

[alfredo]

36. We have a strong case, but we don't have the votes. We need

to make the no's pay a price for not working for the people's best interests. We have to keep pushing. If we fail we start over again and again.

Wording a bill that will be acceptable to the Reps and DINO's makes a bad bill. Start with a real bill with real changes and then make the assholes show their real colors.

[sfwriter]

19. Yes, Republicans are quitters... Pass it on.

They do nothing...

[alfredo]

20. Know nothings, do nothings. assholes.

[politicasista]

24. Looks like the "we told you so" people are jumping for joy and piling on

the Senator and the bill failing in this thread. Maybe because it wasn't their favorite liberal/progressive that leading on this issue? No Graham, Lieberman fan either. But we can always give those who were never on board a pass cause they are "cool" and have good reason for not supporting something. :sarcasm:

Whatever Kerry tries to do, it always looks like it is not good enough for some. Peeps will always find fault with any Democrat, including our President Obama for trying.






Sorry for sarcasm, but that's how me feels. Not wishing failure on anyone.

[No Elephants]

34. Self delete.

[Ter]

41. So what do the Freepers think of Graham now?

Primary?