Obama calls Eagles owner to congraulate him for signing Vick

[Freddie Stubbs]

Source: Yahoo

Michael Vick has been getting support from all sides during his road to redemption. He's now getting it from the leader of the free world.

NBC's Peter King reports that Barack Obama called Philadelphia Eagles owner Jeffrey Lurie earlier this week to congratulate him for giving Vick a second chance after his release from prison. According to King, the president said that released prisoners rarely receive a level playing field and that Vick's story could begin to change that.

Forget your political allegiances or feelings about Michael Vick and take a step back to think about this. The sitting president of the United States went out of his way to publicly praise a man who, 3 1/2 years ago, many thought would never play again in the NFL. Even the most ardent believers in Vick couldn't have fathomed a turn-around like this.

In retrospect it seems obvious that Vick would get a second chance in the NFL, but it wasn't so clear-cut back when he was lying to the commissioner, getting sternly admonished in federal court and serving out a sentence at Leavenworth. We tend to take for granted unbelievable events when they slowly unfold before our eyes. The step-by-step nature of these sorts of tales tend to minimize the shock when taken in over a long process. So though it now seems like it was all pre-destined to work out like this, it wasn't: Vick's rise and fall and rise is a truly stunning tale. He went from star to pariah to inmate to backup to MVP candidate to political prop for the leader of the free world all in a span of a couple years.

Read more: http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdown_corner/post/Obama-calls-Eagles-owner-to-congraulate-him-for-?urn=nfl-300632

[rurallib]

1. Hope Vick thanked Obama for the tax cut.

[Bodhi BloodWave]

18. what makes you think vick has a lot of money to spend?

[Roland99]

26. up to $10 million over two years is a good start for speculating.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=4397938

[Bodhi BloodWave]

37. he also has a lot of restrictions on his money tho

http://rollingout.com/insiderohome/ro-today/11975-michael-vick-imprisoned-by-financial-debt-as-he-returns-to-nfl-glory.html

Vick has earned $4.1 million since signing with the Eagles in 2009, but he owes creditors close to $12 million.


Until his debt is paid off, two-thirds of every dollar Vick earns will be paid to his creditors and to satisfy taxes. He can only spend $4,250 per month on rent and utilities; $1,355 per month for his two children's private school tuition; $472 per month on a car; and his mother receives $2.500 per month.


His bankruptcy lawyers will also receive a substantial amount of Vick's future earnings. Vick will have to pay $2.6 million to his bankruptcy lawyers and $800,000 to his agent between now and 2015.


With his outstanding play on the field in 2010, it's likely that Vick will sign a new NFL contract with a very lucrative signing bonus. However, the more money he earns, the more he has to pay his creditors. If Vick earns less than $2.5 million, he would only have to pay 25 percent of his earnings to creditors. But if he earns $10 million or more, the percentage will increase to 40 percent.

[uncle ray]

46. it's hardly worth making millions anymore.

[Roland99]

56. isn't it?

methinks someone is a bit too obsessed with their Fantasy Football QB.

[IamK]

71. at least his taxes are not going up....

[onehandle]

61. The math says any way you slice it, he still gets Obama's tax cut for the rich.

He should thank him.

And stay the fuck away from Bo.

[Zax2me]

73. Not as many as you might think

Who among us can afford to buy your girlfriend a 90,000 dollar birthday present?
http://bossip.com/320289/it-pays-to-hold-mike-vick-down12006
He moved a lot of his money obviously into 'safe spots' before he got sent off to prison.
So don't feel too sorry for him.

[Name removed]

39. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Bodhi BloodWave]

42. i'm not playing stupid

I'm simply aware he has a lot of restriction on the money he can spend and that 2/rd of it goes straight to creditors and taxes.

Admittedly the amount going to creditors will increase depending on how much money he earns, so basically the better he earns the more he has to pay back until its all paid down.

Once he is clear of debt and such is another matter obviously.

[Hassin Bin Sober]

47. Furthermore, his decreased tax "burden" will increase the disposable income ..

.... he retains and has available to pay creditors. No matter which way you slice it, Vick got a huge tax cut - that was the point of this sub-thread. Or can you not grasp the concept of pre-tax versus after-tax dollars?

[pam4water]

106. Tax cut don't have a stimulation effect, that has been well established. Why

post that lie here of all places?

[Hassin Bin Sober]

113. Did you mean to post to me?

I said no such thing. The only thing stimulated is Vick's bank account due to the Obama tax cuts.

The other poster made some bizarre post hinting Vick didn't get a tax cut because all his money goes to creditors. That's not true - that's all I was saying.

[TheEuclideanOne]

54. Poor guy, Can't keep all of the millions he makes

I can see why you are making the case that he does not have alot of money. :sarcasm: Brilliant line of reasoning. :sarcasm:

So, at what point am I supposed to feel bad for the guy?

[Zax2me]

74. This -

http://bossip.com/320289/it-pays-to-hold-mike-vick-down12006

[petronius]

2. There are small businesses all over America who quietly hire ex-offenders

and do their best to help out their communities. Why couldn't the president have made a point of calling a few of those people instead? Completely tone-deaf...

[Rabrrrrrr]

5. Perhaps because this is a great big obvious one that a much greater population will care about.

and, therefore, far more people will "get" the message than they would if Obama called some joe blow in, say, St. Germain, WI because 99.9% of the population won't know Joe Blow, won't know the city, and won't know whatever felon it might have been that got hired.

[nyy1998]

9. Agreed, well said! nt

[petronius]

13. I'm sure that was the reasoning, but it's pretty flawed IMO

A guy with a freak-of-nature athletic ability getting a second chance from a multi-million dollar sports team isn't going to do anything at all to inspire a business-person in St. Germain to consider hiring the Joe Blow with the auto theft record. Vick has little in common with the average ex-offender, and I doubt many business owners self-identify with Lurie.

Getting the 99.9% to care about Joe Blow, and the John Doe who took a chance on him, is the president's job (well, the speechwriter's job, or whoever plans phone calls). The feel I get from this move is closer to "let them eat cake" than anything: Vick overcame his adversity, so what the heck is wrong with the rest of you? It's just a very tone-deaf comparison...

[TheEuclideanOne]

31. Right and Wrong

Yes, Vick is well known, moreso than some Joe Blow. But so are his crimes and so many people are so completely disgusted by these crimes that they do not even think Vick should be out of jail, let alone making millions of dollars. Could Obama pick a stupider decision to publicly approve of? The only thing he could have done worse in this area would be to congratulate somebody for re-hiring a man who raped a bunch of 6 year old girls.

In either scenario, people will hear about it and will be completely disgusted at the same time. Also, because of the nature of his crimes, people will not be singing kumbaya about forgiveness. Instead they will be singing about the injust nature of a scumbag like this getting a second chance.

[bitchkitty]

35. So you think this is good for Obama's image?

Vick tortured and killed innocent animals. Not that it makes any difference to me at this point - I know how I feel about this President. His standing up for a animal-abuser just makes me feel better about my decision.

[KoKo]

90. It's actually GOOD for Obama's Image. It shows he believes in REDEMPTION for SINS...!

Much of the Christian Right believes that, also. It's part of Obama's Chess Game that will win him a second term.

Remember that old Mafia Saying? "It's About BIDNESS!"

Politics in America Today...and forever has BEEN about "BIDNESS." It's good for Obama to say this...because we Democrats will always vote for him because the Alternative is SO DREADFUL. He's a crafty fellow...knows how to play that GAME... Even if it means exhaulting a Dog Murderer and Torturer.

If it was an AXE MURDERER of Innocents in Passaic, New Jersey...who knows? If it was a Repug...I guess we Dems should forgive him or her, also if they tortured and murdered. It just depends on whether Muslims are Dogs.....and how we categorize the people we Americans Support when the killing is done. :shrug: How it seems to me...anyway.

[bitchkitty]

108. Let me guess - it's 3D chess that he's playing?

I see.

There are none so blind...

[nyy1998]

127. Remember,he spent some significant time in "Audacity of Hope" talking about 2nd chance for felons nt

[TheEuclideanOne]

130. Actually, I think that is what really happened.

I don't believe that Obama called just to congratulate him on re-hiring Vick. I think that the President probably called about the Green Stadium and the topic of Vick came up. As somebody who talks about a 2nd chance for felons, his natural reaction was to focus on giving felons a 2nd chance, without contemplating just what that meant with regards to Vick.

[TheEuclideanOne]

129. Actually, it will be people like you who re-elect him

Obama is lucky to have people like you, the ones who will "always vote for him" and even if he makes the worst possible decisions, ones that will even harm you and the country, you have his vote. But, if you were a true supporter of the party, you would be pretty angry about things like this. You might think that you are doing the right thing by blindly supporting all of his actions, but the results will not be as you hope. Look at the last election, Obama made this mistake. He thought that no matter what he did, it did not matter because "the alternative is SO DREADFUL", but look at the outcome. Obama and a bunch of very simple minded people like yourself think that if you cheerlead our party, regardless of whether they make good decisions or bad, that you are being the most supportive that you can be. However, if you can not see the outcome in 2010 as a sign of what is to come in 2012, your blindness will be your downfall.

I am guessing that you have good intentions, but are just not that bright, but let me throw this out at you anyway .... Do you honestly believe that the Christian Right, based on their most recent behavior in the last 2 years, will vote for Obama based on this being an example that he believes in Redemption for Sins? Have you even watched the news in the last 2 years? We all would have liked to believe that Obama was a master chess player, but when his chess board consists of a King and a bunch of pawns, and the other side just gotten their 2nd Queen, even the most ardent supporter has got to rethink that.

[madokie]

60. Who says he hasn't?

I'd hardly think that he'd pull this one out of his hat only.
Methinks there is more bullshit in this thread than a feedlot has ;-)

[Rabrrrrrr]

3. I was with the article until the asshole writer proclaimed Obama thinks of Vick as a political prop.

Now I' not going to read the rest.

I do agree, however, that it is a wonderful thing when someone is given a second chance, and I salute Obama for making the call to support someone taking a chance on a former prisoner.

[T Wolf]

4. Oh please. As if criminals from that income level ever have trouble geting another high-paying

position.

Obama shows his bias in favor of the rich again.

[Myrina]

6. VOMIT

Can POTUS do one more thing to piss me off before the year ends? Seriously?
Jesus H. Christ on a pogo stick, I can't take any more from him.
I swear he's TRYING to make people hate him.

[ceile]

76. +1000!

nauseating.

[MissDeeds]

125. +10001 n/t

[woo me with science]

7. Defense of the most vulnerable among us.

And for those who will post after this:

No, it is NOT about defending people's right to serve their time and have a second chance.

It is about how you choose to use your bully pulpit. It is about selecting, out of ALL the people and causes you could choose to support from that presidential stage, to publicly support someone who did this:



Defense of the most vulnerable among us.

[texastoast]

14. Can we post that pic on the White House website?

Apparently, our leader hasn't really seen what he's congratualtions mean to caring people.

[woo me with science]

17. I support this.

This dog and the urine-drenched TSA target with cancer.

[midnight]

64. I suppose the type of sport that leaves man's best friend

looking like this does not deserve the president of the free world speaking on his behave...

[Mojambo]

8. Oh man. I'm going to enjoy the fuck out of this thread. n/t

[Boudica the Lyoness]

10. I think Obama should have made the goodwill gesture

of letting Vick keep his dog, Bo, while the Obama family are in Hawaii.

I also think Obama should show us just how much he approves of the TSA freedom frisks and porn scans by letting us watch his wife and daughters go through them.

[woo me with science]

16. +100000000000000000000000000

I am so fucking sick and tired of being fucking sick and tired.

[truebrit71]

20. Yup.

Me too.

[corpseratemedia]

65. spoke for me too

[COLGATE4]

133. K&R X100000000000000000

[tomm2thumbs]

52. perfectly put - thank you

[MissDeeds]

126. Spot on

Could not agree more.

[golddigger]

11. Fucking Bullshit. Why don't you let

him babysit your dog Obama while you are at it.

[texastoast]

12. How about somebody who is not in the spotlight

And who really deserves it a lot more than the Vick prick.

[astonamous]

45. Could have called Tia and congratulated her for giving second chances

[jtuck004]

58. Got that right!! n/t

[CBGLuthier]

15. How Embarrassing for Mr. Obama.

Oh yeah, Michael Vick getting a "second shot" will sure improve the life of the average ex-con of color.

How embarrassing. Low point of the admin.

[Bodhi BloodWave]

19. and a lot of posts in this thread is a low point for democrats, not to low tho since i've seen worse

[Skittles]

96. yes; apologizing for animal torturers is getting lower than low

I absolutely AGREE

[Bodhi BloodWave]

103. I'd place holding onto hatred to be even lower n/t

[Name removed]

22. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[TheEuclideanOne]

25. Agreed. How Obama can endorse such a sport is beyond me.

Yes, I do equate this phone call to Obama endorsing dog fighting. It is shocking that Obama would choose this piece of scum to use as an example of somebody getting a second chance. Absolutlely sick and, quite frankly not very smart polical move either. It won't get him respect by anybody who loves their dog.

[Bluenorthwest]

21. The Sanctified Straight people can do no wrong apparently

For the President, vicious abuse of innocent beings is just a charming sort of side line to the Holy, God Ordained perfection of Michael Vick.
Oh, The Holy, Sanctified Ones, they murder puppies for fun, and yet the Obama/Robinson family sees them as superior to GLBT people who would not harm a fly. This President and First Lady would probably fire an employee who arched an eyebrow at their own dog.
Christian people, who forgive torture, theft, murder, animal abuse, rape, you name it. But gay people having rights? Oh, no Lordy, no!
Vile. Vile. Vile. Why would he even make such a call?

[queerart]

59. Everyone's Gods Send Blessings To You For Your Post!

Lets see.... he called (and invited to the Whitehouse) someone arrested going into their own home.....


He then calls this fellow that is sorry (that he got caught mind you) for dog fighting......


What about a call to the Gay fellow tortured for HOURS in NYC, and left to die?.... (TORTURED FOR FUCKING HOURS!)
http://www.thedailybeast.com/cheat-sheet/item/gay-man-tortured-in-ny-hate-crime/tragic/


You can damn well be if it had been a Soccer Mom tortured for hours... there would have been a call, and a photo op no doubt....


One didn't need to be a political wonk to figure out who was who during the Presidential race..... one candidate met in person with a Gay group (in which he took considerable shit for by his own party)....


The other candidate didn't even pretend... he just sent his wife.....

[Fearless]

88. +1

[dballance]

23. Vick is Disgusting

He'll go on to make millions and be touted as a redemption story. What about the poor animals he abused? Many of them were put down. If he weren't a star athlete he'd still be rotting in jail where he deserves to be. Our priorities as a country are so screwed up.

[CountAllVotes]

24. msg. to Michael Vick

Rot in hell you evil bastard! :mad: :grr: :argh:

[TheEuclideanOne]

28. Shocking how Obama can publicly say to Vick "I approve of what you did":

Does Obama not realize just how many people feel just as you do? What the hell is wrong with this guy?

[CountAllVotes]

32. beats the hell out of me!

Don't I wish I had an answer for you re: this! It angers me, especially when I think of those poor dogs Vick abused for his own sick pleasures! :puke:

Vick belongs in jail and he managed to buy his way out of it. Now he is back on the playing field tossing balls around again. What a sick bastard!

He has no sympathy at all from me and I find nothing admirable at all about him! :grr:

And why the POTUS would commend him is absolutely beyond me! :mad:

:dem:

[TheEuclideanOne]

38. You would think that Obama would have somebody who can warn him about

moves like this ahead of time. You would think that somebody could say, "Just to put things into perspective, Mr. President, you are about to pick up the phone and congratulate somebody would brutally killed countless dogs for pleasure. Are you sure you want to do this? It was only a few years ago that most of the country considered this guy the biggest scumbag on the planet and many still do. Are you SURE that there is not any other person on this planet that you can pat on the back?"

[CountAllVotes]

78. Pres. Obama showed poor judgment

Sorry, but that is the truth of the matter. He should have said nothing at all rather than acknowledge and provide positive affirmation of this situation.

:wtf: is wrong with him anyway? :(

[Rabrrrrrr]

94. Forgiveness DOES NOT MEAN "I approve what you did". Fucking Christ. Stop spreading that shit.

[TheEuclideanOne]

99. In my book it does.

In my book, somebody who can forgive somebody like that so quickly can not really disapprove that much, but I will concede to you on this one.... So, he "forgives" Michael Vick and does not "approve". Great. In an administration of fuck up after fuck up, does Obama have to "PICK MICHAEL VICK TO FORGIVE"??!?!?!?!?!!??. Can he not end out the last few days of this year by not making me further regret being a Supporter?

If he is going to pick a high profile person, is there no other person than this scumbag? If you remove all of the people that are in the following groups (below), you still have millions of people that don't like people who torture animals. So, great, you win....He selected Michael Vick to forgive (but not approve).

a)willing to ignore Vick's actions because he is a sports star
b)People who wonder why anybody is upset because these are just dogs and not people

[Rabrrrrrr]

104. Then your book does not understand forgiveness.

of course, those who know me know that I am coming at forgiveness from a biblical/Jesus standpoint which understands that putting parameters on forgiveness completely takes away all the power of forgiveness.

Unfortunately, our common social attitude and understanding of forgiveness in this country is more like retribution and vengeance, and so very few people actually understand what forgiveness is. Apparently, you fit in that category, and I hope that you can find space in your heart to change your thought on it. Forgiveness it too powerful and wonderful a tool to put human requirements on it.

The whole point and beauty of forgiveness is that it is unearned.

[PaulaFarrell]

134. Not up to Obama to forgive

He was not harmed personally, therefore it is not his prerogative to forgive. The best he can offer is to be non-judgmental.

[TheEuclideanOne]

100. So let me ask you .....What did he do to redeem himself?

Please let me know and do not include any of the things that he was forced to do, like going to prison or losing money. I honestly don't see that he has done a whole lot, so in my book, Obama is "foregiving" somebody who has not redeemed themself.

[Rabrrrrrr]

102. As far as I know, he's done nothing. :shrug:

Nothing in the forgiveness book asks for the person being forgiven to redeem themselves, however. Any kind of "forgiveness" that demands the person redeem themselves is not forgiveness.

Look, as far as I am concerned, Vick is an unrepentant scumbag. But forgiveness has absolutely no value if it is not first and foremost for the unrepentant scumbags.

Forgiveness can, in many instances, be the first step in someone finding their redemption. To require said redemption before forgiveness is to be a teabagger.

[Robbie88]

122. Exactly. n/t

[Roland99]

27. Great...let's give an award to a fucking douchebag thug & put REAL heroes (Bradley Manning) in jail.

:puke:

[Myrina]

85. +1000

n/t

[northernlights]

29. the same Obama that went around bragging how he was going to get a shelter dog

and instead accepted an elitist dog that quite literally would not be allowed into the hands of the most ardent dog-lover unless they were wealthy enough. Because their breeders won't let them go to "the little people."

It was back then that I began to smell hypocrisy up the yin-yang. That and Mrs. Obama breaking ground for her organic garden at the exact same time Obama was handing off food safety to a Monsanto exec.

:puke: :puke: :puke: :puke:

[CountAllVotes]

40. well ....

In some (note that word "some") fairness, dog "Bo" was a gift from the late Sen. Kennedy so I can't blame Pres. Obama for accepting this gift.

HOWEVER, I couldn't agree more with you. These dog breeders make me sick! They pick and choose who they'll sell their dogs to and act like freaking royalty! Many of them are sick SOBs too and run puppy mills (which is a whole other subject).

In any event, yes, I do remember Pres. Obama saying he'd adopt a shelter dog. Being one of his daughters is allergic to certain types of dogs, they said they needed a dog that their daughter would not be allergic to.

In any event, he could have put in a request for a dog that places dogs that need homes and yes, they do have breeds that are available to adopt that people are not allergic to like petfinder.com for example.

On edit: As for the food safety issue/Monsanto and the "organic garden", yep, the hypocrisy is beyond reproach! :puke:

[northernlights]

30. what's all this shit about the dog torturer lately? Oh, right, he can spike a football into the grou

nd almost as well as he can beat or electrocute or hang a dog to death.

Whoopdefuckdedoodle. :puke: :puke: :puke:

[meow mix]

33. disgusting, dog killers everywhere now feel vindicated

see its not that bad obama says so

[onehandle]

34. ugh. nt

[timefortherevolution]

36. Unbelievable. Still thinking that this is a joke...

[frylock]

41. it's only a two-minute prayer ffs

[TBF]

43. Now I am not only embarrassed I worked on the Obama campaign,

I am completely disgusted. Mr. Obama will not only never get another penny from me, he will also never get another vote from me.

[SoapBox]

44. My personal opinion...This was just wrong.

...Prez O?

Why would you step into this pile of shit situation?

Stupid.

Vick...stupid.

You...stupid as well.

This Vick clown has a PR machine going and it is trying to make
him out to be some angel. He should just STFU, play ball...and stay
hidden away for MANY, MANY years.

Need I remind everyone?

The dogs.

[IamK]

48. I have never been a fan of dog killers.... I kind of hoped the prez felt the same way... n/t

[shireen]

49. If Michael Vick wants redemption,

he needs to use the millions he's earning as a football player to help shelter animals, promote spay/neuter programs, and actively speak out against dog fighting and animal abuse. And he needs to keep doing it for the rest of his life.

I'm not seeing that happen.

[KoKo]

53. Agree.! Well Said!

[amyrose2712]

83. He has been speaking out..

http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&q=Vick+Speaking+Against+Dogfighting#hl=en&sa=X&ei=IS4ZTaPjCYaBlAe-wt3iCw&ved=0CBIQBSgA&q=Vick+Speaking+Against+Dog+Fighting&spell=1&fp=a20cfd04ba3c5cf9

[Myrina]

84. yeah and he wants another dog.

... that's like an alcoholic saying "I can handle working in a liquor store" and people actually believing him.


:wtf:

[shireen]

121. i didn't know that so i went to find some video of it

Apparently, he is working with the Humane Society, taking about the evils of dog fighting at schools.

Some excerpts from
http://www.examiner.com/humanist-in-portland/michael-vick-speaks-out-against-dog-fighting-video?render=print

Some excerpts:
i really didn't think about what i was doing
I never thought i would get caught
...
Didn't have anyone to tell me right from wrong
...
I flew home every week to fight dogs
for what reason?
i don't know ...

Not a word about the pain he inflicted.
He needed people to tell him right from wrong -- :wtf:

Listening to him, watching him talk, i sense no empathy, no remorse. He's just sorry he got caught.

Speaking out about dogfighting is about rehabilitating his image so he can move on to make millions.

I'm not buying it.

[sirthomas66]

128. This a man who is sorry only for getting caught and damaging his

NFL career. Nothing more.

[goddess40]

50. Another dumb move

by Obama. How many more wrong and embarrassing moves do we have to witness?

[pitohui]

57. is it a dumb move? to speak of redemption at xmas?

the usa has a huge population of prisoners and former prisoners, and most don't ever get a chance or the slightest encouragement to turn their lives around

maybe it isn't about all vick, all the time

maybe, just maybe, it's about what obama said it was about -- someone giving a despised con a chance to change his life and prove he could be a hero

this is the kind of inspiration that might mean very little to you and me, yet might mean a great deal to a prisoner wondering if it's worth trying to change his life when he gets out

ex-prisoners who don't get a chance to start over and earn a legit income become a huge burden on their families and communities, and this is a problem i've seen not just in the black community but in the white community too -- could it be, just maybe, it's about that?

yes, it's america, and we all love football, but i think it's more than just obama admiring some cool football plays...he isn't a stupid or unkind man, i think he really cares

yes, we all love dogs, but maybe the message here is that we should love to learn our human neighbors too

[northernlights]

62. what redemption? Vick never once asked about his dog's welfare, nor contributed to their rehab

although he did have the fucking gall to ask Best Friends to put in a good word for him. :wtf:

Everything he has done has been about poor Vick and how tough it is he lost his career and now how touch it is that he's not allowed to have a dog in his hom because he so LOOOOOOVES dogs. Oh, and how *hard* it is for him to explain to his kids why they can't have a dog.

Not one word of sorrow over the torment he caused countless numbers of dogs. Not one word of regret over the suffering he inflicted when he tortured them to death. With his own hands. For fun.

There can be no redemption until there is atonement, admission, acknowledgement...and atonement.

[amyrose2712]

82. Well...

"The Newark appearance was part of a nationwide series of anti-dogfighting lectures the Eagles athlete has given, mostly to inner-city youth in major cities like Atlanta and Chicago, since he was released from federal custody in July. The Newark event was one of the few to be open to the media."

http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2009/12/michael_vick_warns_newark_stud.html

Just got this from a quick Google search.

[tomm2thumbs]

51. I would have thought that Bo would have done the calling

[Safetykitten]

55. Ya know...

If you could put a more tone deaf person in charge of the country that happens to be a Democrat, let me know.

[naaman fletcher]

63. I'm a big believer in redemption

The main paid his dues, give him a chance. Redemption is a wonderfully American trait. I have been in most of the third world and in many areas if you do something bad you are forever stained with it, making it possible to thereafter be a part of normal society.

Redemption is also the best and most important part of Christianity.

[Vinca]

66. The only thing I care about Vick is that he never owns an animal again.

[sandyj999]

70. Exactly. He doesn't deserve the privilege. n/t

[sirthomas66]

67. Absolutely disgusting. Don't know which one of the two is more

disgusting at this point.

[BenzoDia]

68. I would've thought that liberals would be happy to see a man who went to Federal Prison

get his life back on track. But nope, not here!

[CrawlingChaos]

77. As someone from Best Friends put it

There's a big difference between being allowed to get on with your life and being allowed to rejoin the highly privileged ranks of the NFL.

Vick is a sick, twisted, sadistic sociopath and that WILL NOT CHANGE. It is disingenuous to try to compare him to a typical parolee looking for honest work.

[BenzoDia]

87. Ah I see, human rights except for those we don't like.

[Union Scribe]

91. What human rights are you talking about?

Having dump trucks full of cash arrive at your house on a weekly basis?

[BenzoDia]

93. I forgot, it's fashionable to hate the successful.

Rich, poor, whatever. A man fucked up in a big way, went to prison and lost it all, got out and was given a second chance (and blew past anyone's expectations).

The president thought it would be a good opportunity to point out that unforgiving punishment isn't the right way to treat people.

I really can't see what all the hate is about.

[Name removed]

97. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[northernlights]

101. maybe you should look at a picture of one of Vick's victims, and then you just might get the hate

This isn't about punishment. It's about ethics and morality, and compassion versus cruelty.

It's about the sickness of a society that worships a sadistic sociopath who tortured animals -- electrocuted, hanged, spiked head first into the ground -- for fun. Because he can throw or kick a motherfucking ball.

There has been no redemption here. Everything Vick has done has been about Vick. He offered no restitution to the organizations that rescued his dogs and rehabilitated them. He never bothered to ask about the dogs well being -- only if Best Friends would put in a good word for him.

He claims to love dogs...and wants to have a dog to *prove to everybody how much he loves them.* Well loving dogs isn't about using them to prove anything to anybody. And he's already demonstrated how much he "loves" dogs.

And then we wonder how Obama could "turn the page" on war criminals...

[woo me with science]

114. Well said. nt

[BenzoDia]

123. Okay, so in a thread about rehabilitation efforts we have comments about

Vick's money, how he's benefiting from "tax cuts for the rich", ties between Vick and Obama being the same color, Obama's "support" of dog fighting (???), and your own association between this and "turning the page" on war criminals. Did I also mention Vick's money?

Sorry, but there's a whole lot unfocused moral outrage going on here.

[astonamous]

110. Redemption is great and all, but...

Vick never spent time in prison for the abuse (torture) of animals. After lying about his involvement, he made a deal and was sentenced for some conspiracy bullshit charge. He received more time than his "friends" because of his lies.

What punishment would be just for someone who could attach live jumper cables to a dog then throw the dog into a pool full of water, stand there and watch while the dog simultaneously drowned and was electrocuted? I wonder what that sounded like. I wonder what that looked like. Do you think Vick will ever tell us what he was feeling or thinking while he participated in this form of entertainment? Was he laughing while the dog frantically clawed at the edge of the pool while blood poured from it's nose, ears and rectum? Did they stand around making bets on how long it would take for the poor dog to die?

I feel Obama could have found a better example of forgiveness and redemption. Vick is now a "hero" for NFL fans and while he may not be getting rich at it, he has been put up on that warrior pedestal. Obama just gave everyone permission to continue in that worship of an animal abuser that didn't know he was doing anything wrong until he got caught.

The animal shelters in this country are overflowing with healthy examples of how we, as a nation, feel about animals. Those cute little puppies that "got too big", "chewed up the rug", "required too much work", "can't be around the new baby", "can't move with us to our new home" and my personal favorite "is too old so we want to get a new puppy". Through no fault of their own, these animals are being murdered by the thousands because we just don't give a damn. They are stuffed into gas chambers and suffocated, heart stuck or just lined up on the cold cement floor and injected one after the other without love or tenderness or pre-sedation.

Anyone that says, "they are just dogs" are just assholes!

[woo me with science]

115. Excellent post. nt

[Union Scribe]

119. What more do you want for him? What "right" is he being denied?

He's "successful" as you said. He's rich as shit. Does he really need the President "attaboy"ing him to be made whole?

[BenzoDia]

124. I'm sorry you see it that way, but what I took from the article

is the President is saying ex-cons should get a second chance to prove themselves after getting out of prison.

Here's another article on the subject:

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2010/12/27/president-obama-supportive-of-second-chance-for-michael-vick/?hpt=T2

President Obama believes in second chances. The president recently called Philadelphia Eagles owner Jeff Lurie and, during the conversation, the two discussed Michael Vick and the fresh start the quarterback has received while at the team, according to the White House.

“He of course condemns the crimes that Michael Vick was convicted of,” said White House Deputy Press Secretary Bill Burton, “but, as he's said previously, he does think that individuals who have paid for their crimes should have an opportunity to contribute to society again.”

Sounds like a liberal position to me.

[Old Troop]

69. I think the NFL should change its rules a little.

Once in each half, when the Eagles offense is on the field, the team opposing the Eagles should be allowed to release a pair of hungry dobermans. Talk about a quarterback scramble!

[roody]

72. I'm still waiting for Obama to weigh in on the

Georgia prison strike, since he is so interested in rehabilitation.

[Skittles]

98. anyone there make a lot of money?

no? forget it then

[flvegan]

75. (facepalm)

Dumb.

[pettypace]

79. Wouldn't it be great if it was Bill Clinton instead?

Then the headlines would be "Vick gets a bone from the Big Dog"

[golddigger]

80. Another bone-headed move in a seemingly

long list of bone-headed moves.

[KoKo]

81. A President who allows his OPS to call one Wing of his Party ..."Fucking Retards," and

then allow his Press Secretary to Mouth Off (under his direction) saying that "one wing" of the Democratic Party (who votes and voted for Obama) need to be Drug Tested...etc. and then allows the "supposed Left Wing Blogosphere" to go off and trash the folks that made them "what they are today in viewership to get ADS and $$$$$$$'s to build their website ....would seem to have some "misdirection" mostly brought about by THINK TANK MONEY from "SPECIAL INTERESTS."

Anyone disagree with me here? Let me hear where you think I'm wrong...:shrug: What I'm looking for is Reagan Trashing his BASE... I might have missed it..even though I was young and productive and a voter and active Dem at that time.

There are many who so disagree it will be interesting to hear from the "MINORITY." Must be good...what the "MINORITY" thinks...but then it's what it is that keeps it going. I won't say what keeps the "rest of us" going. It would be "off topic."

BTW...can anyone give a link to where Ronald Reagan called Pat Buchanan and the rest of his RW..."FUCKING RETARDS" or sent his Press Secretary to call Supporters from "one wing" of his partry.."Drug Users" that Reagan would have Sicked Nancy's "Just Say No" Drug Policy on the Dem RIGHT~

(that's one to think about!)

[Fearless]

86. There are several things I could say that would seem taboo...

Like what if Vick were white... Or if Obama was... Or they both were... But no PC police tonight hopefully.

[KoKo]

89. "we" are not allowed to think" INDEPENDENTLY"......we are not allowed to express viewpoints,

we are those who are zombie walkers ...we have "marks" on our head. We are the "Fucking Retards" we march to our "Drugs" .......we are not to be noticed, counted in our votes or even to be considered amongst the America we live in.

WE are NOT ALLOWED to THINK INDEPENDENTLY...because we DON'T VOTE INDEPENDENT! THOSE ARE THE ONLY VOTES THAT MATTER! INDEPENDENT VOTES. THE POLLSTERS OBSESS OVER the INDEPENDENTS! THEY are ALL that MATTER.

GET IT? I DO!

[Auggie]

92. I do not approve, Mr. President.

[Ghost of Tom Joad]

95. perhaps Obama would like to see some photos of the dogs

Vick abused. Maybe he could show those photos to his daughters.

[pam4water]

105. Seems like Obama realizes he is not competent as president and has gone off to some fantasy football

world -- or maybe basket ball. Didn't he call to congratulate some Basketball coach the other day?

[humbled_opinion]

107. WOW...

So now because Obama recognizes redemption and contritness of the person that will most likely be the NFL MVP of 2010, somehow by extension he supports the torture of animals? I just don't get it next up you will be crucifying the man because gas prices are going up which is in fact due to a recovering economy..... I wish people would just get off the soap boxes and get their priorities straight. Think about what you are criticizing and why....while the President fights in the bloody arena everday you know he is fighting for all of us that never have a voice in politics so give him a break, Please...

[dflprincess]

109. Rising oil prices may actually derail a recovery

Real financial regulation might have helped control speculators. Even the little bit we got is being implemented too slowly to prevent oil prices from going through the roof.

And please supply a link to where Vick has shown any sign of being contrite and not just sorry he got caught.

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

111. I always hate myself the next day

when I drunk-dial someone while I'm on my vacation.

:hi:

[Politicub]

112. *this* warranted a call from the president?

Seriously?

:eyes:

For the record, what Vick did is unforgivable in my book. People who abuse animals have something wrong with them.

[Turborama]

116. I got as far as: "leader of the free world"

There's something about that phrase which makes me feel really uneasy.

[jimlup]

117. I think Obama would have been smarter to stay out of this one

But I do believe that Michael Vick deserves a 2nd chance. He has served a penalty for what he did. If we are a society that believes in people then we will believe in giving him a 2nd chance. That he is an exceptionally skilled football player should be irrelevant though I know that it isn't and I'm sad for those who need a 2nd chance and don't have the skills to sell themselves like Vick does.

[astonamous]

120. Animal abusers pose a very real risk to the community.

The seminal study on this issue dates back to work started in 1975 and sustained over more than 20-years. In what has proven to be one of the key findings from this long-term study, the Massachusetts SPCA and Northeastern University concluded that those who abuse animals are five times more likely to abuse humans. It is no great leap in logic to draw the conclusion that if an animal abuser is five times more likely to escalate to human victims, then such an offender posses an even greater risk of re-victimizing the same silent population he has already preyed upon. In Vick’s case, such an obvious conclusion is even more compelling when one considers that Vick engaged in a sustained six-year criminal enterprise dedicated to profiting from gambling on the outcome of dogfights while using the most cruel and barbaric methods imaginable to manage his “kennel” and maximize his profits. The ongoing nature of his conduct remains serious cause for concern and understandably contributes to the enduring distrust of his repeated public assertions of remorse and reformation. Some additional yet basic risk factors one should consider in assessing Vick’s case and the continuing threat convicted abusers present to society include:

1.The vulnerability of his victims;
2.The large number of his victims;
3.The number of victimizing incidents;
4.The severity of the injury and methods used to kill;
5.The duration of the abuse;
6.The degree of pre-planning or premeditation;
7.The existence of other criminal conduct at the scene of the animal abuse (e.g., drugs, gun law violations, gambling);
8.The fact that this offender served as an instigator of criminal acts involving multiple other perpetrators; and
9.The offender’s history of positive interactions with the victim animal(s) prior to the abuse.

In light of these factors, it is difficult to discern how Vick’s supporters could reasonably believe that he should be allowed to exercise control over another dog. The Animal Legal Defense Fund strongly disagrees with that view and recommends the longest possible ban on ownership be maintained. Whether his supporters are truly concerned about animal welfare or just too invested in Mr. Vick’s “comeback” to give a damn about the fate of the next dog who comes under Vick’s control—you will have to decide for yourself.

http://ourcompass.wordpress.com/2010/12/27/michael-vick-banned-from-dog-ownership-ask-an-attorney/

[jimlup]

131. I'm not taking a stand on Vick's acquisition of another dog

But if it is subject to supervision, I wouldn't necessarily be against it. I condemn animal abuse as much or more than most humans who I know (with the exception being my daughter who is vegetarian) but I also believe in rehabilitation and the right to a 2nd chance.

I'm glad Vick has reinvented himself as a football star and I applaud the Eagles for giving him a chance to do that despite the opposition from many. You wish to condemn the individual based on the statistics of the many. As I'm sure you realize, this is flawed reasoning.

If you did a study on football players in general, I bet you would find they are about 10x more likely to abuse their spouse than the general population. In some ways Vick is lucky because he has a chance to see his capacity for abuse in a mirror. He has a chance to change things. Few get such opportunities.

[astonamous]

132. I could care less about Vick's football comeback. I'm not watching.

I am only interested in people remembering what he did to his dogs and what he supported other people to do to innocent animals. In our society, we tend to forget yesterday's news and horrors quickly enough and the almighty pro athlete scores a touch-down and his previous crimes are no longer repulsive. Not only that, but the POTUS throws himself behind the "Vick" name. I guess what I'm saying is that if Vick is going to be put up on a pedestal for his athletic abilities, I wish there is always a caveat or mention of his dogs and their suffering. Vick should always have to be reminded that we will never forget what he did.

Vick was, I think, only forbidden to own a dog for 3 years. I don't know if that is true or not, but how would you supervise a dog in the Vick household? A dog can't be interviewed by a social worker to find out how things are going and you probably aren't going to be able to hang out in the home 24/7. Remember, Vick threw the family dog(s) in the ring as bait just to see what would happen. Little fluffy didn't do so well and do you think Vick has explained that to his kids?

I don't feel that Vick is truly repentant for the abuse and torture of his and other dogs. I know I have not heard him admit to, in any detail, what he did and I, like a lot of other people, do not feel he is sorry for anything more than the fact that he got caught.

If people don't want a bunch of us "crazy animal people" to jump all over a post regarding Michael Vick, they should quick posting tributes and announcements about how great he is. We will always remember what Vick stands for.

[onpatrol98]

118. Confused???

I'm not sure why he felt the need to do this... It is true that many felons do not get the opportunity to turn around their lives, but so much more can be done from the White House to help this than calling the Eagles owner. I assume this was just one of the "perks" of being President. He gets to call and congratulate winning teams and got a bit "chatty". I assume he didn't think it would be big deal. But, I'm sure he'll end up putting out a statement that says..."He doesn't condone dog fighting." But, then again, he might not. I've been getting vibes from some of his press conferences, interviews, etc. that he really doesn't like having to explain himself. Perhaps because he POTUS or because he thinks we should be focusing on more important issues. But, this does seem to be a strange and self created controversy that he really didn't need.

[Name removed]

135. Deleted message

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