Tennessee county wants to ban gays (American Taliban alert!)

[jsw_81]

DAYTON, Tenn. March 17 — The county that was the site of the Scopes "Monkey Trial" over the teaching of evolution is asking lawmakers to amend state law so the county can charge homosexuals with crimes against nature.

The Rhea County commissioners approved the request 8-0 Tuesday.

Commissioner J.C. Fugate, who introduced the measure, also asked the county attorney to find a way to enact an ordinance banning homosexuals from living in the county.

"We need to keep them out of here," Fugate said.

http://abcnews.go.com/wire/US/ap20040317_1181.html

[montanacowboy]

1. I still say the worst thing Lincoln

did was to fight the Civil War to preserve the Union - this speaks volumes

[prodigal_green]

4. OMG

I say that EVERY day now.

Why the hell did we want these people to stay in the Union anyway? OK, lots of cheap natural resources, but we've got other sources now. Maybe it is time for a nice cordial divorce a la Czech Republic and Slovenia?

[Melodybe]

12. Hello, some of us DUers are in the South!

I am working my ass off registering people to vote and campaigning for the Democrats.

I demand an apology, quit assuming that all southerners are stupid and backward bible thumpers!

[truthspeaker]

16. and we have our share of bigoted whack-jobs up north too!

[Sandpiper]

17. You're right

Not all southerners are stupid, backward bible thumpers. The south just has a disporportianately high number of them. And because of that, your region will forever be associated with the Krazy Kristian Krusaders. Is it fair? Probably not, but that's pretty much the way it is.

On edit: I lived in the south for 11 years, lest you think I'm just a condescending Californian.

[Name removed]

61. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[comsymp]

29. An apology for regional bigotry?

Lotsa luck-

Just remind yourself how fortunate we bassackwards, ignorant, bible-thumping and wife-beating Southerners are that we're allowed to bask in the enlightenment and inclusiveness our esteemed Northern brethren (and sistren?) bring to the board.

[Sandpiper]

54. Is it regional bigotry

To point out that the south is almost always on the wrong side of every major social issue?

[comsymp]

55. Nah, that would just be ignorance

[Sandpiper]

65. I guess I just imagined all that stuff about

Slavery, Jim Crow, the Klan, Jerry Falwell, Pat Robertson, George Wallace, Strom Thurmond, Jesse Helms, Trent Lott etc.

Sorry about that. The south is real bastion for progressive causes. :eyes:

[comsymp]

67. No, not imagined- just closed-minded and either

unfamiliar with, or ignoring American history.

Slavery- check emancipation dates by state sometime. Then look up the fascinating, to me, tidbit about the Ulysses S Grant family still owning slaves years after Juneteenth. For grins, you might want to look at the ratification date of some of the other amendments as well... and pls consider the fact that you have North Carolina to thank for the first 10.

Jim Crow- you think that's an exclusively Southern thing and that other areas of the country were/are on the "right" side of that issue??? I'd argue that integration, such as it is in the US, is more successful in the South than in any other area of the country.

The Klan- here's a news flash: the Klan is still going strong around the country and one of their nat'l HQ's is in Indiana- hardly a Southern state. For more info, check out SPLC sometime- another Southern institution, btw. You'll also find interesting info on various other neo-Nazi, White Pride-type movements (primarily based OUTSIDE the South)

Falwell- Oral Roberts, Tulsa OK
Robertson- Coughlin (Canada, MI), O'Connor (PA-NY), Sheen (IL)

Wallace- Reagan (CA), Wilson (CA)... How 'bout the accomplishments of Sanford or Hunt (NC) and, yes, even Zell's record in GA

Thurmond- Hatch (UT), Frank Murkowski (AK)

Jesse Helms- McCarthy (WI), Santorum (PA)

Lott- Sununu (NH), Prescott Bush (CT), Brownback (KS)

Buchanan (DC), Coulter (CT), Dornan (CA)... need I continue?

And as for the smartass comment about the South being a bastion for progressive causes, take a few minutes to familiarize yourself with some facts- like Hunt (NC)/Clinton (AR)/Miller (GA) on public education and race issues, for instance. Also, Carville (LA), Jesse Jackson (SC), MLK (GA), Morris Dees (AL), Hightower & Jordan (TX)... need I continue? Maybe you could give Doug Wilder (VA) a call to discuss minorities elected to statewide office around the country... or contact current or former US Reps like Lee (TX), Meeks (FL), Clayton or Watt (NC), or folks like Shirley Franklin or Andrew Young...


RIF

[comsymp]

69. Damn, damn, damn!

Forgot to mention Fred Phelps (KS) or the State of Colorado...

[Sandpiper]

70. I forgot to mention

Roy Moore, Bob Jones University and David Duke

[comsymp]

72. I don't see how tit-for-tat does anything but undermine your position...

that it's the South that's consistently wrong on issues, etc., but OK, I'll play some more


Roy Moore- Antonin Scalia (NJ), Wm Rehnquist (WI/AZ)

Bob Jones U- Well, there's obviously ORU (OK)- frankly, I'm not familiar enough with private religious colleges in the US to make sound comparisons beyond this.

David Duke- Richard Butler (CA) and http://www.adl.org/learn/additional_resources/publications_supremacist.asp">most of these guys


Howard Beach, Boston busing riots, minority profiling and abuse by police depts in NY, CA, MI, IL...

ON EDIT: In all fairness, Clarence Thomas gets 1/2 credit for being Southern (GA & PA)

[Sandpiper]

75. It's not tit for tat

You've named a smattering of people from different parts of the country.

Everyone I've named is from the south.

Oh, I forgot. Billy and Franklin Graham, and The Southern Baptist Convention.

[comsymp]

78. Duh- Of COURSE I've named folks from all over the country

That's my whole point, which is to challenge your spurious assertion about the South. You made a blanket statement regarding the South, then provided examples to attempt to back up your claim. For each example you gave, I gave at least one, often more, examples of equally wacky individuals/institutions/events from non-Southern states.

But since we're still playing:

Graham- Farrakhan (MA)

Southern Baptist Convention- Roman Catholic Church, LDS, etc., etc.

But let's not forget the SCLC... generally accepted as a bastion of progressive thought

AND ON EDIT: SMATTERING???

[Sandpiper]

80. Aw, forget it

I'd written a reply, but is there really a point to continuing this fruitless exchange?

[comsymp]

82. No, that was NOT the point you made

Your point was:

Is it regional bigotry To point out that the south is almost always on the wrong side of every major social issue?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=1244928&mesg_id=1246273&page=

Now, if you want to disavow that point and try for the one you're attempting to offer now, we can do that- but be prepared to back up your assertion.

As for the RCC being regional, sure- for centuries it was virtually nonexistent in the South and is still primarily popular in the NE and Great Lakes States.

But it's 5:00 and I'm ready to go home...

ON EDIT: responding to your edit- probably not- doubtful you or anybody else are going to be convinced to give up cherished prejudices.

[Sandpiper]

83. Ok, just for your viewing pleasure

Issues that the South has been on the wrong side of:

Slavery
Voting Rights
Women's Rights
Worker's Rights
Segregation
Gay rights
School Prayer
Separation of Church and State
Teaching Evolution in Public Schools


Nope, not going to do disavow that point. I'll happily accept your admission that the south is the most backward region in the country though.

[comsymp]

87. And I'll happily invite you to hold your breath until I do

But now that you have reeled off a list of yet unsubstantiated accusations, prove it. Please back up your claims- show me anything, ANYTHING that will actually support your allegations.

I'm dying to see this~

Oh, one hint that may help you understand where you're dead wrong- you seem to think of the South as a single entity.

[comsymp]

88. Never mind

It'll just be the same argument with somebody else who isn't interested in educating him/herself next month- and my time is too valuable for this.

Reply, don't, whatever... I won't be around for a while anyway.

[Sandpiper]

84. As I said in a prior post

I lived in the south for 11 years. My feelings and thoughts about the south come from firsthand experience.

[comsymp]

85. And I've lived here for 39 of 41

Will you concede that it's even remotely possible that, during the additional 27 years I may have acquired a little more familiarity with the subject than you enjoy?

[Sandpiper]

89. Yes, I'll concede that point

n/t

[NorthernSpy]

74. Fred Phelps is a native Mississippian (just for the record)

Beats me why he chose to settle in Kansas, but he's not really from there.

Helen Chenoweth, whom you mention further down, actually was born in Kansas before winding up in Idaho, but note that she makes a habit of extolling her "confederate heritage" -- if that counts.

Anyway: just for the record.


Mary

[comsymp]

76. OK, half credit for Fred

Have seen no bio info on him, although it was interesting to find out that Falwell referred to him as "a first class nut"...

Still full credit for Westboro Baptist, tho-

Chenowith, tho... not sure what "Confederate heritage" she's referring to... Kansas???

Oh, did I mention Laramie yet?

[Chelzek]

32. As another person in the south

I think you need to get more perspective. Compared to the north, we ARE full of nut case fundamentalist conservatives. There are a few liberal areas here and there, but let's face reality.

[ButterflyBlood]

39. correct

you never hear about anything this stupid north of the Mason-Dixon line.

[comsymp]

40. Nope, rarely HEAR ABOUT it...

Although places like Skokie and Howard Beach come to mind- names like Rodney King, Shepherd, Louima...


I don't recall hearing about this one:

Days after the brutal murder of Matthew Shepard, police in New York City broke up a peaceful rally meant to mourn and protest his killing. Officers in riot gear and horseback arrested nearly 120 demonstrators and injured numerous others. Activists request letters to the Mayor of New York, protesting this incident, and asking for investigations and redress for numerous other documented cases of police brutality and use of excessive force.
http://www.ilga.org/Current%20activities/Urgent%20actions/iglhrc/usa_police_brutality_breaks_up_g.htm

Clifton, New Jersey: Several 13- and 14-year-olds spray paint swastikas on Jewish homes.
Los Angeles, California: A group of skinheads tries to provoke a race war by plotting to shoot members of an African-American church.
Houston, Texas: A youth tells police he shot a gay man to death because he hates homosexuals.
Broward County, Florida: While yelling racial hate names, a mob of youthful partygoers beats to death a Vietnamese-American college student.
http://www.crf-usa.org/bria/bria10_3.html


and so on, and so on

[kayell]

42. Rick Santorum

[comsymp]

45. LOL, 'Nuff said

*muttering "Dornan, Chenowith, Hatch..."

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

49. Nixon Reagan

[comsymp]

56. Kinda hoped you'd stop by

Here we go again, huh?

[prodigal_green]

43. My ENTIRE family lives in the South

I know that there are plenty of good, intelligent people living down there who fight hard every day for justice and peace. I know that there are plenty of jackasses up North too.

I also know that the dominant culture is pretty entrenched in the various regions of this country: North, South, Upper-midwest, West, Southwest. There are irreconcilable differences with regard to religion, culture, economy, etc. So much so, that perhaps it is time to just recognize those differences and split up.

The Civil War was not fought to free the slaves any more than WWII was fought to save the Jews in Europe any more than the Iraq War was to liberate the Iraqis. It's always about money.

[specter]

57. Thanks

We dont all live on turnip trucks!!!

[kayell]

41. Great, bigots want to kick me out of their county, and DU bigots want

to kick me out of the US.

A southern lesbian and damn proud of being both!

[QC]

66. This is rich--a bigoted complaint about bigots!

Who says irony is dead?

Sorry to interrupt your Two Minutes Hate, but there's a considerable number of Southern liberals here at DU, not a few of them gay, and we are doing what we can for the cause. I guess it's not enough that we should have to deal with the Freepers we live around and are sometimes even related to--you apparently think we should also come here and catch shit from fellow liberals.

[Sandpiper]

22. Sounds appealing on its face

But how many more years might blacks have been in chains were it not for the civil war?

[absyntheNsugar]

91. And let slavery continue?

And let the antebellum plantation continue to opress both poor whites AND blacks....

Something they never teach you in history classes was that many poor Southern towns actually CHEERED Union soldiers. Why? Under antebellum life, there were plantation owners, and everyone else. Two class system.

[prodigal_green]

2. Pointless

The SCOTUS already overturned sodomy laws. It's dead before it's written.

[LoZoccolo]

13. Let this be a lesson to non-ABBers though.

The SCOTUS did that just last year. Now if Bush* is elected and appoints some conservative justices - and you can't vote them out after X number of years like legislators - imagine what it would have been like if say, that case had come up two years later, after he had packed the bench with them.

[ButterflyBlood]

3. can't be done

clear violation of Lawrence vs. Texas. Also prior to Lawrence vs. Texas a Tennessee court overturned Tennessee's sodomy law, so this has both a state and federal decision against it.

[arcane1]

8. so the courts throw it out, then the fundies get red-faced and scream

and say the courts are 'persecuting' Christians, forcing secularism on them, and so on.... thus their sheep get more motivated than before, to stop this vicious "attack" on decency, morality, and yes God himself...

:puke:

[trapper914]

48. Don't forget their favorite!

"Legislating from the bench."

[arcane1]

50. I can't even think straight when I hear that one

makes my brain want to explode...

[Technowitch]

5. Should we be surprised?

There's bigotry everywhere, and I've little doubt that there are many in this country who'd just love to round up all the gays and lesbians and ship 'em off to re-education camps.

But first, they might start with mandatory little pink triangles on the clothing...

[newyawker99]

68. Hi Technowitch!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[democrat in Tallahassee]

6. this guy is probably gay himself. bet ya a dollar. why else

would he be so interested?

[arcane1]

9. "interested" is not the right word

"obsessed" is much more accurrate

[Melodybe]

7. My heart is with any gay person even in Tennessee

this is disgusting.

[maxanne]

10. only if we can round up

the worst homophobes in the nation (including of course the entire Phelps clan) and send them all to live there. I'd be just fine with giving them a county in Tennessee, as long as they stayed put.

[kitkatrose]

44. No. No no no no no.

We don't want them. Send them to a deserted island somewhere, where they can't impact innocent people. Then cut down all the trees and leave them with no technology so that they can't escape.

[OneBlueSky]

11. ya know, I've been waiting for a locality to try this . . .

I've thought occasionally that somewhere or other there would be an effort to simply ban gays and lesbians . . . also thought that a great response would be a huge influx of gays and lesbians to just take the place over . . . anyone want to move to Tennessee? . . . didn't think so . . .

[Rowdyboy]

14. Only in Mississippi!.....Oh, wait....This isn't in Mississippi!

Thank you, Jesus, for once we're not the laughingstock of the nation.
Tennessee is...

[Sandpiper]

19. Tennessee is home to the headquarters

Of the Southern Baptist Convention. Coincidence? I think not.

[BOSSHOG]

26. Thank God for Tennessee

More warm regards from Mississippi (where everyone is not a racist, homophobe dumbass)

ricky santorum is so afraid that gay marriages will lead to the legalization of bigamy, incest (heterosexual pasttimes by the way). However, what banning gay marriages will lead to is crap going on in Tennessee. What's next ovens? And Sean Hannity wants to stop our next election! Its perfectly fine to be paranoid if they really are after you.

[donsu]

15. not only is it this County in Tenn. but one of the Dakota's almost banned

abortions. It did not pass by one vote. one vote! and that state would have banned abortions.

it's like we are in the middle of a bad dream.

but it's real! these freaks have the power now and we damn well better take it back and soon.

[Neecy]

23. Bunnypants has empowered these freaks

...and we can expect them to get bolder and bolder with their pseudo-Christian 'values'. Expect the violent rhetoric to be followed with actual violence against *any* minority within the grasp of these freaks.

[TNDemo]

18. Good to see so many open minded and non-judgmental

types on DU. No stereotyping going on here. Glad everywhere else in the country is so open to the gay lifestyle. Wyoming comes to mind...

[ronnykmarshall]

21. Touche!

[Bertha Venation]

90. You beat me to it, TNDemo.

This thread turns my stomach.

[jsw_81]

20. I just checked...

And this county went overwhelmingly for Bush. Why am I not surprised?

[nomaco-10]

24. the entire South is being exploited as a ...

testing ground for the right wing agenda. I live in Tennessee and I've seen this first hand since bush* took office. There was even an anti-abortion bill that had some backing here and another anti-gay piece of legislation that was introduced in the first year of the emperor chimp's reign, neither will pass, but the very fact that they were introduced shows the kind of atmosphere that we as southerners are dealing with. These types of blatant, hate mongering pieces of legislation would never have seen the light of day when Clinton was in office, now thanks to the right wing takeover of the Whitehouse and the congress, these types of hate inspired legislation run rampant throughout the south. The Roy Moores, the Tom Delays and even members of our own party like Zell Miller feel emboldened to advance the stifling agenda of the moral majority and the homophobes that we as a country have fought so hard to squelch. This administration and it's minions have taken this country backwards and have done more harm than many will ever know. I don't think this country will stand with four more years of bush*, I really don't.

[LeahMira]

30. Happened when Reagan was elected also...

These types of blatant, hate mongering pieces of legislation would never have seen the light of day when Clinton was in office, now thanks to the right wing takeover of the Whitehouse and the congress, these types of hate inspired legislation run rampant throughout the south.

It wasn't about people who are homosexual at that time, but it was directed at people who are on welfare and people who are poor.

It seems that these hate-filled thoughts and feelings are just below the surface, ready to boil out at the first opportunity. I'm afraid it would take several generations of making it "socially unacceptable" to voice these sorts of ideas in public before they are rooted out of our culture. I'd like to hope not, but I've lived long enough to realize that the battles are never really won completely.

[mainer]

25. ah, jeez. I thought this was a joke

but it's real!

[rinsd]

27. Insanity.....

words escape me.

[jsw_81]

28. Freeper homophobes celebrate

this is to cool
2 posted on 03/17/2004 11:35:01 AM PST by knak

Does praying for a "domino effect" make me a bad person?
6 posted on 03/17/2004 11:37:50 AM PST by Semper Vigilantis

They should instead, pass a law that makes queers illegal...Put 'em in jail...Keep 'em there...Solves the problem...
14 posted on 03/17/2004 11:45:15 AM PST by Iscool

Imagine if every city in "the flyover" states enacted similar legislation. And if every city council fought every court loss all the way to their state supreme court. We could literally bring "the halls of justice" to a grinding halt.
25 posted on 03/17/2004 11:55:54 AM PST by kjam22

[ronnykmarshall]

33. Bigoted piles of crap.

[theHandpuppet]

38. Remind me again...

... why there are Log Cabin Republicans.

[AspenRose]

31. Wonder what Gov. Perry (TX) thinks about this.

Sorry I couldn't resist.

[salin]

34. Why do these people hate America?

Because trying to keep other americans out... and throw them in jail based on discrimination rather than law breaking is the antithesis of anything upon which our constitution is based. If they don't like the idea that "All Men are Created Equal"... then they should be the ones to move to another country.

[nomaco-10]

36. That's the irony.....

they consider themselves the "true" patriots of this country. They think they are purging their beloved homeland of undesirables. Remind you of another era in history?

[jsw_81]

47. It's incredibly ironic

The freepers, for example, are always talking about how they're "defending" the Constitution against liberals, but then you see something like this and they're willing to shred that same Constitution at a moment's notice to advance their own agenda. The next step is to put people in death camps. Don't think it could happen here?

[Chelzek]

35. Would Europe grant asylum?

Just a what if question - but let's say a law ever did come on the books making homosexuality a felony. Would Europe accept people seeking asylum from this country on those grounds?

[foreigncorrespondent]

64. Yes.

In most countries, including my country, you can claim asylum on the grounds of fear of persecusion in your own country. If you can get out of your country that is.

[theHandpuppet]

37. Does this mean that...

Mary Cheney, who works for the Bush/Cheney re-election campaign, will be arrested should she make a campaign stop in Rhea County? Do you think Daddy will make bail?

Further, it might be difficult to entirely eradicate gays from good ol' Rhea County, since perfectly upstanding, born-again Christian heterosexual couples give birth to kids who will grow up to become gay adults. Should these couples be considered to have genes cursed by Satan and be forbidden to reproduce, or can the whole clan be forced to move out of the county to reduce the infestation?

Just wondering how this "cleansing" thing might work.

[Sophree]

46. How utterly ill-mannered,

uncouth, and UN-Southern of them.

Shame on them.

[smirkymonkey]

51. "The rest of the country want's an

amendment so that they can charge bigots with "crimes against nature". If only. These people make me sick. Why should gay people bother them? What is it with them anyway?

It sounds cliche, but I think these morons have some serious issues with their own sexuality. Gay people are disgusting, but it's ok to have sex with farm animals and sleep with your siblings. (sorry, Tenneseans, I know it's not all of you)

[Neecy]

52. you make a good point

So many of these raging homophobes, perhaps coincidentally, are also old, fat, toothless etc. WOMEN are repulsed by them, so it always amuses me how threatened they are by gay men. Gay men don't jump anything that moves. Like everyone else, they have personal standards and probably 99% of these 'phobes don't come close to meeting them.

It's almost as though they convince themselves that somebody finds them sexually appealing by being so fearful of gay men. It's an odd way of boosting self-esteem.

[smirkymonkey]

63. I know, I think it has a little bit

to do with projection on the part of straight male homophobes - I think mostly what they are afraid of is themselves and what they would do if there weren't such strict social taboos against "sodomy".

Little do they realize, that most likely, NOBODY finds them attractive.

[Generic Other]

53. Send condoms to Rhea County so the citizenry can be more proactive

You don't want gays and lesbians in your community? Support birth control. Of course, that means you also reduce the number of births altogether. In the case of this county, perhaps a good thing.

Eugenics starts at home.

[MAlibdem]

58. see recent scotus decisions

can't do it, homosexual relations are legal

[KamaAina]

59. What if my county wanted to ban ignorant fundie bigots?

You think they'd let us get away with that?

Of course in our case, we'd be "voting them off the island" :-)

[Deja Q]

60. Here are other crimes of nature:

Polluting the environment.

Money.

Techology.

Aquaducts.

Violence to the point of murder/mass murder. (No other species does even remotely the atrocities humankind has done.)

I could cite a truckload of examples.

More repukedom in action: Apply a universal law to only the things they personally hate. And I truly hate that.

Personally, I'd move out. Those vermin are the lowest of the low. I wouldn't want to be associated with them by living in the same state. I would not want to pay taxes to support filth like Fugate.

[alfredo]

62. Rover better watch what leg it humps. eom

[rocktop15]

71. That's the county about 5 minutes from where I live

I live in Chattanooga, TN. The local news media has been giving them hell for the above. It's a shame that people will think all of TN is like this when they read the aforementioned story. The local talk radio station (www.wgow.com/fm) has been destroying the commisioners over this. You have to keep in mind, that the county is very, very redneck with not much in the way of twenty first century renovation there. The town (Dayton, TN) consists of a McDonalds and Walmart. Pretty sad shape.

[bloom]

73. I think Tennessee is a lovely state

It is interesting that this is happening in the same place as the Scopes trial.

Perhaps it should become a tourist destination for odd ideas.



_______________________________________________

And any gloating yankees or others should read:
http://www.hartfordadvocate.com/gbase/News/content?oid=oid:32556

[tnlefty]

77. Hello rocktop15 from someone also very close to the area

I'm between Chatt and Cleveland and it's much further than 5 mins. for me to get to Dayton, but that's beside the point. Isn't the commissioner's meeting tonight to decide whether or not to basically evict people from the county?

I did see 2 women on the local news and I felt really bad for them. They seemed shocked and extremely distraught at all that is going on. Truly a shameful situation.

[WoodrowFan]

79. not only did it pass

but it passed 8-0! Not even one commissioner had the brains or conscience to say "no."

[blurp]

81. Homophobia banned in surrounding counties. Citizens now trapped.

[MadProphetMargin]

86. Welcome to the post-American century.

Leave your rights and dignity at the door, and get in line.


That is all.