It's great that the Kerry daughters were booed at the MTV awards.

[lottie244]

Most Republicans and conservatives hate MTV and think it is sub-culture and responsible for the low morals of their children. That fact that this crowed would be so rude as to boo the Kerry daughters means that they embrace the Bush slut-twins and the Kerry daughters are much too classy to be considered one of them.

[amber dog democrat]

1. MTV - pretty obvious who they market to

Its the lowest common denominator of the infotainment industry.

[cleofus1]

2. what?

John Kerry's daughters were booed at the MTV awards? You're joking?

[Norquist Nemesis]

3. Haven't heard that one either?

What gives?

[RivetJoint]

4. Why are the Bush twins sluts?

Have you been having sex with them? Know people who have?

[Name removed]

16. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[RivetJoint]

17. Really?

I knew that they drank (like most college kids). BFD. Are all college girls who drink now called "fast and loose drunken sluts?"

[Ripley]

21. I've seen picture and read articles about Bush twins

putting away a bottle of expensive tequila in a bar in Europe. I never saw a picture of Chelsea or Kerry girls publically falling down drunk.

Having a drink? Who cares. Sloppy drunken mess in public...not very classy.

[RivetJoint]

25. And that

makes them sluts, how?

[Ripley]

33. Okay, let's talk clothing.

I've seen Jenna on the campaign trail - sticking out her tongue at the press. And wearing tube tops and tacky sheer, yes, slutty looking shirts and tight pants. Fine for a bar - her fave place - but awful inappropriate for campaigning for Pres Dad.

Someone had pics of her on Easter I believe and she was showing major boobs. Like I said - fine for a night out - but Easter?

Her choice of how she presents herself and behaves on the campaign trail is just as appropriate at Kerry's haircuts for Gawd's sake.

Why do you defend her? Or do you just like that type?

[CatWoman]

36. Ripley -- he's the DU police

watch out or he'll give you a ticket.

[Ripley]

38. Heh!

I got your back downstream. :hi:

[CatWoman]

LOL -- Good looking out

:hi:

[CatWoman]

40. LOL -- Good looking out

:hi:

[RivetJoint]

44. I'm not defending HER

I just don't think women should be called "Sluts" just because they drink.

[CatWoman]

51. but it's ok for you to attack my mother

because you and I disagree?

[RivetJoint]

55. And how did I attack your mother?

by asking if you touch her with the same fingers you use to type filth? That's an attack? Please explain.

[DS1]

81. I've been asking the same thing

This is shit that probably 90% of the college-age population does - oh no putting away from tequila somebody get me a bible and a stomach pump STAT.

I think that people who call the twins sluts are full of shit with their holier-than-thou attitudes.

[Norbert]

26. I know the bush twins like to drink but

never heard anything beyond that. As much distain as I have for bushco I don't think it's right to speculate on the sexual activity of the bush girls.

[Name removed]

47. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[CatWoman]

67. LOL

Go, Zomby, Go!!!

:D

[histohoney]

5. I didn't

watch the awards. What are you talking about?

[slutticus]

6. Link?

All I can find is that Eminem was booed....but nothing about Vanessa or Alexandra.......

Hmmmm..........

[onecent]

7. I think this is just a Drudge rumor

This came from Drudge didn't it? I saw stuff on cable news this morning re: MTV and it had nothing about this. I think it's just a Drudge rumor.

[Killarney]

8. Here's what happened

Kerry's daughters came on stage to ask young people to vote and also the Bush twins were on the TV screen via satellite from NYC.

Kerry's daughters were both cheered and booed. It sounded like 75% cheer, 25% boo to me.

Another weird tidbit from last night. Bruce Willis was there and sat next to P. Diddy. They danced together and hugged a lot. I thought Diddy was Dem and Willis was Repuke?

P. Diddy did a big "Vote or Die" thing that was good, but he didn't say who to vote for.

[coloradodem2005]

11. P. Diddy said in an interview that he is trying to get people to vote.

He also said that he favors Kerry.

[neebob]

12. I assumed "vote or die" is an implicit statement

If Bush (cough) wins, a lot of them are going to die.

[Mike Daniels]

15. DU and FR are the only places where politics trumps everything

Hate to break it to you, but in the real world most people can get along with people who don't share their political beliefs.

I really don't know why that it so hard to grasp here on DU and also FR where if you are from the opposite political side you're automatically the enemy are aren't worth cultivating as an acquaintance or what have you.

[Killarney]

18. blah blah blah blah

I just thought it was odd that P. Diddy and Bruce Willis were dancing and hugging and sitting next to each other like they obviously came together. I figured it was an odd match. I figured Willis would be at the RNC if he was anywhere. I don't know why he was at the VMA's anyway as he has nothing to promote right now. I wondered if maybe he switched sides and that's why he was with Diddy. Maybe he's working on Diddy's Vote or Die thing. I dunno.

A mind that questions and wonders is a good thing.

Good day. :)

[psychopomp]

42. Mike Daniels came off very direct

but he has a point and made it quite well, though it is on a different tack than you'd intended.

I wonder, sometimes, how people can expect to heal when they take the "otherization" of bushbots to the limits that they do.

[Misunderestimator]

9. I saw one of the Kerry daughters on CNN this morning talking about it...

I didn't hear exactly what she said, as I was doing other things, but she said something to the effect that she could have a million people boo at her and it wouldn't stop her from saying what she wanted to say. She was very gracious.

[neebob]

10. I think they were booing the Bush twins

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=2282561#2282655

I was watching, and it looked like confusion to me. Perhaps the Bush twins were on the screen when the Kerrys came out. They did cut the audience sound when they switched to Jenna and Barbara.

I can't imagine why they'd boo the Kerrys, and while I have mixed feelings about the other two being booed, you know, they have been campaigning for their dad and they're old enough to know better.

Not that a bunch of obscenely rich people who sailed in on massive yachts with two or three changes of clothes for an evening self-congratulation and partying have any right to judge. At least some of them - P. Diddy, for one - are using their powers for good.

[Riptide]

20. I watched it. I did not think they were booing the Kerry girls...

I did not hear that at all, I believe it was directed at the Bush twins.

[tuvor]

24. I saw the booing, too.

And until your post I didn't consider that the bushes were still on the jumbotron. I just figured all of the booing and cheering was for the Kerrys.

Whattaya wanna bet the show's producer was trying to please his Viacom bosses by training the camera on the Kerrys?

[leesa]

13. Lottie tends to post things like this.

An inflammatory headline, then...?

[RivetJoint]

14. Are you trying to make a point?

If so, what?

[Name removed]

22. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

27. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

35. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Ripley]

37. You're dripping on my rug dear!

Rivet here thinks you have to have sex with Jenna in order to be a judge of her sluttiness. Got it now? Where do these people come from?

[CatWoman]

39. Heh

maybe he's trying to restore honor and dignity?

or he's trying to be a uniter, not a divider?

:shrug:

[RivetJoint]

60. How do you know she's a

slut. Riply...where's your evidence of her having sex with multiple partners in an indiscriminate manner?

[Name removed]

45. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[CatWoman]

49. My mother has been dead for over 30 years

nice bringing her into the debate.

Talking about someone utterly lacking in class.................

[Lerkfish]

30. I'm a little confused as well...

parts of the originator's point make no sense:

1. Kerry daughters booed = great
2. Bush twins = sluts
3. Republicans hate MTV due to its degradation or something
4. I get lost right around this point.

:)

[radwriter0555]

19. they were booed cause it was a MUSIC show and these kids don't want

nasty partisan politics rammed down their throats. They're there to PARTY, not listen to political speeches.

That's why both were booed.

[Deja Q]

23. How do you know they're sluts?!

Britney Spears, for example, is a slut. Her exploits are well known.

All the * twins did was follow daddy's lead and booze it up, much as a school of fish would.

[RivetJoint]

28. How do you know Britney

is a slut? As far as we know (from tabloid accounts) she's had sex with just a couple of her boyfriends.

[ProfessorGAC]

29. Hey, Rivet. You Need To Read More

There are tales of Britney's escapades on tour, that have been out there 5 years now. She has even since admitted that the whole virgin thing was made-up in her early days.

Two boyfriends? Come on!
The Professor

[RivetJoint]

31. Hey Professor

of rumor. You need to learn not to believe everything you read in the tabloids.

I like your "there are tales of..."

What an authoritative source!

[Norbert]

32. What about Britney's lost weekend/72 hour marriage.

This is a little more than tabloid or urban kegend.

[RivetJoint]

46. What about it?

That makes her a slut? Do you even no if that marriage was "consummated?" Where you there?

[ProfessorGAC]

34. I Don't Read Tabloids

Not of any type, any description. I don't even read the Chicago Sun-Times because it's laid out tabloid style.

These thing have been in the music industry for a long time. Those sources are no less authoritative than those on which you're relying.

You have NO information, and assume that what you don't know must be untrue. The music industry has been swirling with these stories for about 4 years, and those are not authoritative.

How convenient it must be to ignore the things that you would call rumors, and assume absolute correctness because of what you don't know. Sounds like some conservatives i know.

The Professor

[RivetJoint]

50. What are you a professor of?

Anti-logic? Until something is proved (i.e., Britney is a slut), it is wrong to make statements claiming it to be so. Unless you have evidence supporting the claim that she is a slut, then it is unfair to assert she is. I am not relying on ANY sources to say she is not a slut, that presumption is automatic. If one is to make a derogatory claim about another, it is only right that one do so with some type of proof. Agreed?

[ProfessorGAC]

58. How Convenient Again

No, i don't agree.

You haven't heard or read these things, so you assume they must be tabloid junk or completely untrue.

Therefore, i'm illogical for believing them. That's not terribly logical either.

This isn't a court of law. The presumption of innocence if irrelevant. This is simply the formulation of opinion. I'm asserting nothing. You are inferring something. I was questioning your castigation of others because they have information and have formed opinions that you don't share. I didn't even use the word "slut". Just because you haven't read the information others have, doesn't mean it's not accurate. It just means you weren't aware of it.

She stated in her own Rolling Stone article that it's been a long time since she was a virgin. Even through that period where she was playing the "teasing, naughty virgin" role, she admitted it was not true. That article is at least 2 years old. Now who's being illogical?

I don't care a whit, one way or the other about Ms. Spears. But, you're taking to task others based upon the fact that you haven't heard the things others have heard. How is that illogical to assume that there may be some fire behind the smoke, when the stories are manifest, and have been for some time?


The Professor

[Ripley]

41. Do you really think we all have to have sex with someone

before we can assess their sluttiness?

My, my, you must be young.

[Lerkfish]

43. Apropos of nothing, I really hate the word "slut"

Its a very misogynist term used very indiscriminately.
The closest male term is being a "player" but that not with the severe negative connotations.

/rant

[ProfessorGAC]

48. I Don't Disagree

You will notice, i didn't use it. But, the stories about Britney are multiple and manifest. My objection was RivetJoint calling others out when even she has admitted the virgin bit was a scam.
The Professor

[RivetJoint]

54. The Virgin scam bit

STILL does not make her a slut. The multiple and manifest VN vets lying about soon-to-be President Kerry do not make their stories true either. The mere presence of stories do not validate truth.

[ProfessorGAC]

62. Yawn!

The stories are what they are. You can choose to believe them or not. After reading her own RS interview, i choose to believe them.

The Kerry stories are PROVABLY untrue. The stories about Spears on tour are NOT provably untrue. And, based upon her own interview, i now think probably are.

Once again, i never used the word. You seem to be enjoying using it quite a bit.

I just think that before you castigate others, you should be aware of what they know and how long they've know it. And, you were hijacking this thread (and unfortunately, i've helped.)
The Professor

[RivetJoint]

68. I was not hijacking the

thread. Merely pointing out that calling women sluts is not in the "progressive" interest. Sorry you see it differently.

[Misunderestimator]

56. That is not apropos of nothing... it is an extremely denegrating term

to use towards women. I can't think of a single example where it would be ok to use.

[RivetJoint]

52. You should at least be able

to provide proof that she has had sex with the requisite number of people to attain the level of "slut." Whatever that number may be.

[CatWoman]

53. who are you that people need to prove anything to you?

The King of Siam?

The Queen of Spades?

[RivetJoint]

57. I didn't ask them to prove anything to me in particular

They posted on a public board that the Bush twins (and Britney Spears) were sluts...Ok, back it up for the general DU reader.

Why are you on my case?

[Name removed]

59. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[CatWoman]

61. Right on, big brother!!

:hi:

:loveya:

Did you see the cretin attack my mother above?

[Zomby Woof]

65. yep

And did you see my other reply to him above? :-)

[RivetJoint]

66. Praytell

How did I attack your mother? Where did I say anything against her?

[ProfessorGAC]

63. Thanks Zomby

Man, that was tiresome.
The Professor

[Misunderestimator]

69. And that was condescending... though I wouldn't use the same tactics...

I agree that calling a woman a "slut," no matter what the circumstances, is a slap in the face to all women. Call me tiresome too. :shrug:

[Zomby Woof]

70. I agree it's wrong to throw around the slut charge

But it's the "evidence" factor that raised suspicions of motive.

In other words, the troll really isn't concerned with stopping misogyny or such - they seem to take it harder that their Republican friends the Bush twins and Britney were accused of such because of their political leanings, not because they are women.

If the Kerry daughters were accused of such, we would have never heard a peep from Rivet. Bank on it.

[Misunderestimator]

71. I'll go with you on that... thanks for the measured response

I still wouldn't use the word "slut" for any reason I can think of.

[RivetJoint]

72. BS

You know NOTHING about me. I don't think it's right to call ANY woman a slut. As far as your comment on the Kerry daughters...do you think we'd EVER see that on this board? NO!

Is asking for evidence now de facto proof of being a Republican? Does the converse hold true as well?

[ProfessorGAC]

73. That Was NOT The Point

I NEVER used the word slut in regards to anyone. So, just who did i slap in the face? Answer: Nobody.

I don't use that word. Not here at DU. Not anywhere. So, what was your point? That i don't get to dispute a point of disagreement between another poster and me, because of someone else's use of the word?
The Professor

[Misunderestimator]

75. Sorry if I misread anything... I thought the entire point of the argument

was the use of the word "slut."

[RivetJoint]

76. It was

[ProfessorGAC]

79. It Was Not, To Me

I know RivetJoint is saying it was, but that's not true.

It was about someone asking for proof of an opinion. That's what i objected to. Once again, i never used the word, so if RivetJoint says it was, then that poster's debate with me was completely without a point.
The Professor

[RivetJoint]

64. Maybe I'm just someone who thinks that calling women

sluts (especially with no proof) is NOT very progressive, and that anyone who thinks otherwise is probably a misogynist Repuke.

[ProfessorGAC]

74. Maybe I'm Someone Who Thinks. . .

. . .that losing a debate and then resorting to calling other people names is the sign of a conservative troll.
The Professor

[RivetJoint]

77. Where did I call you a name?

BTW, you realize that YOU just did that, don't you?

[Ripley]

78. You are changing your story now...

Now you say you are objecting to the misogynist term "slut" and attacking any of us who used it. I merely used "sluttiness" because I was responding to the original post.

You were defending the Bush twins, not the term.

This debate is about their behavior and everyone knows what the term the OP used means, whether we like the term or not. It is not a nice connotation and it fits.

So there.

[RivetJoint]

82. I was defending, and will

continue to defend, ANY woman who is called a slut. Even the Bush twins.

[Ripley]

84. You didn't say that initially.

Yeah, I believe that your only reason for posting here is to defend all women from being maligned by a word. Funny how you didn't say that...you just asked for proof that they behave that way.

How about these words:

childish, unprofessional, spoiled, bratty, tacky, sexy in a Frederick's of Hollywood way, party animal...uh I could go on...

Pictures show their behavior in full color. It's not about the word.

[RivetJoint]

85. I agree with some of those words...

But the issue was about the word SLUT. Some people are going to use that word to characterize women...I understand that. It's wrong, demeaning and offensive to me, BUT at least,if they are going to use it anyway, how about backing it up with a rationale for doing so?

[Ripley]

86. You said:

Have you been having sex with them? Know people who have?

You wanted to see proof they were sluts. That is NOT, NOT, NOT EVEN CLOSE to raising an objection to the OP's use of the word.

[RivetJoint]

87. Sigh

You'll never get it... I wanted some rationale for his use of the word, KNOWING that there would be none forthcoming.

[ProfessorGAC]

80. On Purpose, Genius

You called me a misogynistic Repuke. Is your memory that short? Now, you know how it feels.
The Professor

[RivetJoint]

83. I did not call you

a misogynistic repuke. First of all, I was responding to another poster, not you. Secondly, I said that anyone who called a woman a slut was most likely a misogynistic repuke. You claimed that you NEVER called anyone a slut, so why would you think that was aimed at you?

Again, what are you a professor of?

[sal]

88. I am a very nasty slut, rivetjoint, and I want you to spank me.

and then maybe you will calm the fuck down.

sheesh

[RivetJoint]

89. Another clever

witty, remark.

[Catherine Vincent]

90. You must be in love with the Bush twins.

No need to defend them so much, they don't know you. Who cares if they get called names?

[Moderator]

91. Locking.........

This has turned into flamebait. Please read the rules
re personal attacks:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/forums/rules.html#civility


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