FReep hippocrites

[liberaltrucker]

I just logged on to FR as DUmmie and posted something of a peace offering. I said I'm interested in political debate as long as it's civil with no name calling. I was immediately booted. So much for civil political discorse with these "people".:grr:

[physioex]

1. Don't waste your time........

It will never happen.

[liberaltrucker]

2. I see that, now

At least we at DU respect differing opinions.

[tuvor]

3. As long as they're not conservative.

It's in the FAQs.

ON EDIT: More accurately, conservatives aren't allowed to post on DU.

[liberaltrucker]

5. Let me get this straight

Conservatives can't post on DU? WTF? I'm as liberal as they come, but I believe any open forum is open to all. if DU is as exclusive as FR, then it's no better.

[tuvor]

6. This is not an open forum!

Like I said, it's in the FAQ:

Why don't you let conservatives post?

Democratic Underground is not intended to provide a soap-box for our political opponents. If we let conservatives post here, then this discussion forum would be identical to all the other discussion forums on the Internet. If you want to debate conservatives, there are thousands of other websites on the Internet where you can do so -- just not this one.

By the way... There are lots of conservative discussion forums that don't permit liberals to post, including this one. <freerepublic.com>

http://www.democraticunderground.com/forums/faq.html#conservatives

[liberaltrucker]

13. OK, I'm a newbie

A little slack, please? :toast:

[tuvor]

15. Hey, no worries.

I'll bet a lot of the vets aren't clued in, either!

And welcome to DU! :hi: :toast:

[Tux]

22. Ignorant

Why can't they state their views as long as they are polite? Seems anti-democratic to me.

[tuvor]

10. Most of us try, but

I've seen a lot of posts in the past several days that indicate a lot of DUers DON'T respect opinions different from their own.

[Nothing Without Hope]

18. Yes, but you're right: most of us do try. That counts big-time

and you just have to try to keep your temper and calm things if you can when you get into a slugfest. I actually suspect many of those are instigated by freepers who deliberately disrupt.

There is still a range of opinions here. There are gun-owners and people who believe all guns other than those of the millitary or police should be forbidden. There are Republicans who are broken-hearted over what the neocons have done to their party and feel that they have major shared goals with us though they disagree on many points. There are strict vegans and carnivores. And so on. But if someone logs on and starts spouting about how Bush is a great American and it's treasonous to oppose his policies, they won't be welcome. What would be the point? They have plenty of places to go to talk to other people who feel the same way. Here they would only disrupt the discourse.

[Nothing Without Hope]

4. They're not interested in discourse. It's a lesson we should all remember.

The neocons are the same. They absolutely don't care about anyone else as long as they get what they want for themselves. The absolute selfishness is part of the problem - you can't reason with them, you can only expose what they really are to the public.

It was good of you to try, though.

[liberaltrucker]

8. But.......

How do we expose them to the public? The corps own the media.

[Nothing Without Hope]

14. Ahhh - that's under very active discussion all over DU and elsewhere

and there are many plans being made and brainstormed into existence. The situation is far from hopeless. Even in the corporate media the cracks are showing. For example, check out this Newsweek article by a senior editor. Read the whole thing, it will do your heart good:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7305206/site/newsweek

There are many, many more examples. Here's an LA Times article you'll enjoy:
http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/la-oe-chait1apr01.story

Keith Olbermann on MSNBC is an increasingly prominent newscaster who has consistently spoken the truth. He carried stories on the election theft for many weeks and was quite unflattering to the neocons and pseudoreligious extremist fundies in the Schiavo case. As amazing as it may seem, he is a real journalist and he has integrity. And his popularity and ratings are growing.

There are many more cracks in the dam. But we need our own independent plans, and as I said, there are many of them in various stages. Here's one, called "The Paper Chase Project," that "regular people" can do on the local level, a low-tech approach to getting the message out to people who would otherwise only hear the propaganda of the Poodle Press:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=3379870

Edited to add: And welcome to DU, liberaltrucker! I'm pleased to meet you and look forward to seeing you around! :hi:

[solinvictus]

7. FR isn't "conservative"...

FR is nothing more than a place to repeat RNC talking points for RimJob. FR has, will, and still does boot real paleo-conservatives who criticize the Chimperor.

[liberaltrucker]

11. Point taken

I just hope I don't get booted from DU for being too far LEFT.:)

[magellan]

12. Welcome, LiberalTrucker!

Don't worry, many of us are WAY left on the DU! Have you taken the test over at Political Compass to see just how left you are?

[liberaltrucker]

17. Not yet

But I will now. I'll post results.

[liberaltrucker]

19. Economic

-7.63 Social -3.85. Guess I'm kinda Lib, huh?

[magellan]

26. Kinda

...comparatively speaking! You are Gandhi-esque, which is where I was the first time I took the test. This week however, I'm Economic -8.75, Social -6.77. WOAH! lol

Every month or so someone starts a thread asking for everyone's results from the Political Compass. Most DUers fall into the same SW quadrant of the graph to different degrees. I don't think there's an absolute position for anyone...For instance, I've noticed my liberalism tends to move further left in direct response to how badly BushCo has ruffled my feathers.

In any case, you're in good company here! :hi:

[Blue_In_AK]

24. You needn't worry about being too far left.

I'm sure you're fine. Welcome to DU, LiberalTrucker.

[Swamp Rat]

9. Reptiles don't discuss - they vomit.

What a bunch of Red Commie Stalinists! The Busheviks want a fucking police state, not a free America. :mad:

[Nevernose]

16. We're not really interested in discourse either

Go to the AOL boards if you want discourse. This is a place for liberals to discuss issues from various liberal perspectives. FR is a place for so-called conservatives. They've got theirs, we've got ours.

[liberaltrucker]

21. DARN

Guess I should've donned the flame-proof suit:) I'm a DUer, OK? I just wanted to, hopefully, open talk with the opposition. Is that so wrong? Jeez, I'm beginning to understand the Israel-Palestine problem. If we, as Americans, can't resolve our differences without resorting to name-calling and worse, then, IMHO, it may be time for us libs to get that AK.

[Nevernose]

27. I didn't call you any names

And, while I don't own an AK-47, I am in fact one of those liberals who exercises their second amendment right to bear arms.

[Piperay]

28. It's a two way street

they don't want us there and we don't want them here.

[ngGale]

30. We come here to get away from them...

it's enough of them on TV media. This is our refuge where we come to discuss our issues and be with like minded people.

No offense!

[Piperay]

31. No offense because I agree

I do not want them here, that's why I come here to get away from them.

[buckup]

20. lol. I just read that rule

And i think it's kinda dumb. Granted, this place should be centered around progressive thought, but what about a Freeper who is... uh.... progressive-curious? (sounds dirty) Should they not also be allowed to post?

Kind of funny that many progressives pride themselves on being open-minded... but the board doesn't accept that. Weird.

I am a progressive. I enjoy a good steak every once in a while. I believe that some wars are necessary evils, but Iraq was anything but. And I think conservatives should not automatically be banned unless they are flame-baiting... But, that's just me.

I love DU. Great place to join people who respect my thoughts.

[Blue_In_AK]

25. Progressive-curious? That's cute.

By the way, there are several reformed Republicans on this board. My guess is we're far more inclusive than FR.

[thebigidea]

32. in order to feel sufficiently open-minded, you need 1000s of RWers here?

how open-minded would this place stay if it were flooded with talking points-spouting conservatives?

[NightOwwl]

33. If you want to argue/debate

someone who doesn't agree with the basic policies of the Democratic party, you've got plenty of choices (Yahoo Groups for example.) DU has been around a lot longer than you, with great success. There are many differing opinions around here and lots of good discussions. So accept it as it is, and enjoy; and if that's not possible, find another forum that suits your requirements. There are plenty to choose from.

[Blue_In_AK]

23. You should have known better. n/t

[Iterate]

29. You'll find plenty of civil political discourse here

I'm fairly new to the site and have found it to be a wonderful place for dialog. There's a natural fallacy in seeing the world as left/right right/wrong, or in thinking that it's all about convincing someone else of your position. There's much more to it than that.

It's also not all about issues: the subject can also be cultural differences, history, subtext, rational solutions. Much to learn here, and many interesting people to learn with. I can't imagine having that opportunity on a different type of site. Along the way you can refine or defend your own positions, finding you are not alone, or simply finding you are off-base and need to think again.

Plus some things are just fun, like the political compass, amusing, but nothing to take seriously.

I think anyone could pick one topic, or one question, say perhaps "Do all governments have a responsibility to take military action in case of genocide?" Post it and you'll see a wide variety of opinions, good debate, some outrage, some new information. Find something of interest, stay on the topic and you'll have 1000 posts in no time.

[buckup]

34. .... lol. Is that a real thread? I'm interested.

Btw, when I did the political compass thing, i was right neard the Dali Llama. How cool is that?

[Blue_In_AK]

35. Me, too, BuckUp. n/t