Who remembers the controversy about the Catholic Church and JFK ??

[kentuck]

When JFK was nominated, I recall that many thought his Catholic religion would be a negative in his run for he White House. It was a serious issue at that time. But JFK reassuredthe voters that the Church would not play a part in his politics. However, in hindsight, perhaps we should have taken the issue more seriously back then??

[efhmc]

1. I do and I was remembering this the other day when baby bush was

having one of his religious orgasm over the pope.

[HockeyMom]

2. Good old days

when religion was a PRIVATE matter and people didn't want one SPECIFIC religion ruling the country (and politics).

[classof56]

3. Well, it was a definite problem in the Baptist church I attended.

I recall our pastor pontificating (pardon the expression) when JFK was elected that the next step would be to amend the constitution to remove presidential term limits and then there would be a Catholic takeover of the entire country. Obviously, Nov. 22, 1963 put an end to that, but it was all God's work, you see. Just ask the pastor! I once heard that Al Smith (hope I'm remembering this right without googling) said, having lost a mid-30s election after taking a good deal of flack about being Catholic: "Wire the Pope and tell him to unpack." Maybe it was Al Landon...my memory ain't what it usta be!

Tired Old Cynic

[punpirate]

8. It was Al Smith...

... but in 1928. Hoover ran an exceptionally anti-Catholic campaign (a bit odd, since Hoover was a devout Quaker).

Smith ran again in 1932, but his friendliness with corporations didn't play well in that time against Roosevelt's populism and he lost in the Democratic primaries.

JFK did have some fairly strong back-channel lines of communication with the Vatican, especially through his father. The biggest effect of that was to reinforce his anti-communist stance, which should have been received well by the right wing, but wasn't, because of what they perceived as his creeping socialism.

[classof56]

16. Thank you for this!

Saves me some googlin' time and very instructive!

TOC

[FreedomAngel82]

14. I've heard the stories

that people thought in the WH they had a secret tunnel to the Pope and the Pope would help JFK take over the world. LOL! Do they not see how silly that sounds?

[classof56]

17. I'm betting most of them don't. Their ignorance abounds!

It's one of the reasons I no longer attend mainstream fundamentalist churches. I have a Catholic friend who told me she always thought JFK was too intellectual to be a strong Catholic. Then awhile back I had a Catholic priest tell me I'm a heretic, so I remain very confused! Well, sorta...

TOC

[rurallib]

4. I am confused by your last line.

The issue was taken very seriously. Kennedy took it on head first in the West Virginia primary, a mostly protestant state. I believe he said the Pope will have no say in how America is run and Kennedy would have no say in how the Church was run. JFK won handily astonoshing pollsters and Hubert Humphrey the presumed winner. He vaulted into the limelight with that win.
This is from memory only.
What do you mean with your last line? Had someone stopped Kennedy we wouldn't be in this theocracy? Kennedy had a very keen awareness of the separation of church and state and at least half the country was set on keeping an eye on him.

[kentuck]

9. No. But what we are seeing with religion and the Catholic Church now...

is what many people were fearful of back in 1960. But, neither the Catholic Church nor other religions were as vocal then as now.They were more respectful of the separation between church and state, in my opinion.

[Steel City Slim]

5. I Remember That

I think he went to West Virginia a gave a speech putting that to rest. There were also questions about Richard Nixon's Quaker upbringing making him unable to go to war against "Russia".

[Lydia Leftcoast]

6. Yes, a lot of Protestants were very worried

However, Kennedy was not a fanatical Catholic, and we in fact had nothing to worry about.

[Solly Mack]

7. The thing is, the same party that attacked him

politically by promoting that fear...a fear which did catch on with many voters...is the same party wanting to impose a right wing theocracy on us now. That speaks volumes to intent and motive.

In a battle of faiths, only one faith will remain standing. I urge everyone to support the separation of church and state and demand that our representatives stop using religion as a political weapon.

[MADem]

10. I do, I was in South Carolina at the time

It was UGLY. Every stereotype in the book came out over that election. The sensible Kennedy supporter simply didn't talk politics for one's own health and well being. "He's gonna take orders from the damn POPE!!!" to "He is gonna force his religion on ALL of us!" to "Damn northerners!"

We did take the issue seriously, and JFK was ABSOLUTELY clear in his statements about the issue. He charmed the Southern Baptists, see here: http://usinfo.state.gov/usa/infousa/facts/democrac/66.htm

Four paragraphs, but read the whole thing, it is worth it: But because I am a Catholic and no Catholic has ever been elected President, the real issues in this campaign have been obscured -- perhaps deliberately, in some quarters less responsible than this. So it is apparently necessary for me to state once again -- not what kind of church I believe in for that should be important only to me, but what kind of America I believe in.

I believe in an America where the separation of church and state is absolute -- where no Catholic prelate would tell the President (should he be a Catholic) how to act and no Protestant minister would tell his parishioners for whom to vote -- where no church or church school is granted any public funds or political preference -- and where no man is denied public office merely because his religion differs from the President who might appoint him or the people who might elect him.

I believe in an America that is officially neither Catholic, Protestant nor Jewish -- where no public official either requests or accepts instructions on public policy from the Pope, the National Council of Churches or any other ecclesiastical source -- where no religious body seeks to impose its will directly or indirectly upon the general populace or the public acts of its officials -- and where religious liberty is so indivisible that an act against one church is treated as an act against all.

For, while this year it may be a Catholic against whom the finger of suspicion is pointed, in other years it has been, and may someday be again, a Jew -- or a Quaker -- or a Unitarian -- or a Baptist. It was Virginia's harassment of Baptist preachers, for example, that led to Jefferson's statute of religious freedom. Today, I may be the victim -- but tomorrow it may be you -- until the whole fabric of our harmonious society is ripped apart at a time of great national peril.

The bolded bit, above, was done by me, I felt it salient to the present regime.

[FreedomAngel82]

22. Now it's opposite

but true. I don't see anybody in the north trying to inforce religion on anybody now days. I think maybe it was their plan all along and they were afraid Kennedy was going to beat them to it so they couldn't have that, so they indicted this fear into people knowing how people are with things like that.

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

11. what I remember is the anti-Catholic hate

from people who belonged to the same fundy churches that are Bush's base now.

Frankly, any Catholic that supports the fundy rw agenda should think again. The fundy protestants may appear to be allies, but many, if not most, think Catholics are heretics and the Pope is the Anti-Christ.

[MADem]

13. You know, you have made a very good point there

Perhaps it is time for the left to use the "Kennedy Wedge" to slice the Catholics from the uneasy embrace of the Right Wing.

They need to shop that damn speech I cited above around...it wears well with time, a genuine classic!

[FreedomAngel82]

23. Right

I remember hearing the Pope thought Bush was the anti-Christ and thought it was kinda funny how people who are Bush supporters think he is/was the anti-Christ. So now that the Pope is really conservative they're embracing him. Go figure huh?

[kskiska]

12. I remember.

I was still a teenager at the time and thought it was silly. Back then, though, even mainstream Protestants were wary of Catholics, regarding them as some crazy sect worthy of suspicion. Even so, I think maybe they exaggerated the issue of "taking orders from Rome" as a campaign ploy. However, I'd gladly go back to those days when the holy rollers stayed in the woodwork where they belonged. Ronnie Ray-gun pried the woodwork off and let them all out.

[madrchsod]

15. i remember

my sister and her friends were big kennedy fans. i was just starting high school..ya it was really a big deal-the pope was going to rule the united states. hmmmmmm, maybe this time he and his fellow "christians" will.well untill they get into a fight over how many angels can fit on the head of a pin...

[IowaGuy]

18. I was just 5 years old at the time, but my grand father...

who was a devoted Republican (in Kansas City, Mo - so you know he was devoted to be in such a minority at the time)..told me,(this was the earliest conversation I ever recall with him)... that he thought Kennedy would be to beholden too his religion and that the Pope would be running the country. He felt it was bad for a man to mix his religion with his offices duties.

He's probably rolling over in his grave now, looking at what has become of his Republican party...

[Junkdrawer]

19. Imagine: they worried Kennedy would listen to the Pope...

Kerry was attacked because he didn't follow every word of the Pope...

Go figure...

[FreedomAngel82]

24. Yep

Strange isn't it? :eyes: My how things have changed. I wasn't around in that time frame (I know of of course) but I've read a lot about it so I just think it's so strange how now days it's complete opposite.

[OffWithTheirHeads]

20. I remember a Nixon slogan from the era that pretty much sums

it up
"Don't let that mik lick our Dick"

Probably written by Rove, but typical of repukes even then.

[bobbieinok]

21. I was college in Houston....JFK did a 1 hour discussion with the Houston

Baptist Ministerial Alliance that was nationally televised....he attempted to assure them that if he were elected the pope would NOT be the de facto president

I wonder if that broadcast was recorded and is available somewhere

[FreedomAngel82]

25. That would be cool to see

I remember his quote about that: "I'm Catholic but not a Catholic president." Something like that anyways. I might have gotten it wrong.

[proud2BlibKansan]

26. oh yes I remember that

I was just a 7 year old little Catholic girl when he was elected. We had a horribly prejudiced neighbor who kept referring to JFK as "you Catholics' president".