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WilliamPitt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-24-05 10:42 PM
Original message
EXPLOIT THE RIFT
Edited on Tue May-24-05 10:45 PM by WilliamPitt
Members of the Republican Party’s political action corps pride themselves on discipline and adherence to the line. Most of the time they are very good at this, which explains to a degree their ascendancy of late. All of a sudden, however, that discipline has started to crack, and the outlines of a full-fledged civil war within the ranks of the GOP are beginning to become manifestly clear.

The public rift started several weeks ago, when Majority leaders Frist and DeLay dragged the rest of the party along on the demented sleigh-ride that was the Schiavo affair. Messrs. Frist and DeLay assumed, wrongly, that the American people would happily accept the idea that Congressman should serve as mother, father, husband, wife, doctor and priest on matters of life and death as they pertain to medical decisions. When some 80% of the public rejected this concept out of hand, according to every poll, the cracks began to publicly appear.

This actually started as a private rift back in November. The ‘movement conservatives’ – read: fundamentalist evangelical activist Christian base of the GOP – believed they were the ones who single-handedly delivered electoral victory to Bush in the last election, and were set upon being paid back for their efforts. This expected payback amounted to the assumption that the GOP majority in Congress would take up all the issues dear to the movement conservative heart.

The problem arose when a good number of the old-school conservatives within the GOP decided they didn’t really want the fundamentalists driving the bus. These old-school conservatives were likewise developing a significant disgust for the so-called leadership of the neo-conservatives in the White House and Pentagon, who had led the party into the bottomless blood-well of Iraq.

The old-schoolers were facing a significant challenge, because the neo-cons have been using the fundamentalists as shock troops, ‘useful idiots’ who helpfully carry the combined banners of ‘freedom,’ patriotism and the One True Faith in order to obscure the neo-con’s larger, less-palatable and incredibly dangerous geopolitical goals. We saw this time and again during the last election season.

The tension grew as, time and again, Congress failed to rally to the various movement conservative banners that were raised. Finally, the movement conservatives got sick of waiting, and plunged headlong into the Schiavo mess in order to promote their ‘culture of life’ ideals. In fact, this was a warning shot fired across the GOP’s bow, with Frist and DeLay standing as point-men for their own reasons – DeLay needs the fundamentalists help to avoid going to prison for a whole rainbow of ethics violations, and Frist needs them because he wants to run for President in 2008.

Well, history records the outcome of that effort. When the movement conservatives’ desires met public opinion on the matter of Schiavo, the sound was like two icebergs colliding in the North Atlantic. All of a sudden, the old-school conservatives found themselves lumped in with the fundies who drove the bus off the cliff. Approval ratings for Congress lingered in the low 30s, and the Democrats had been handed an unexpected public relations coup.

Flash forward to the recent filibuster fight. Majority Leader Frist stapled himself to the cause of getting rid of the filibuster come hell or high water as yet another Schiavo-esqe kowtow to the movement conservatives whom, he believed, would catapult him into the Oval Office. The old-school conservatives watched all this unfold with growing disgust and, in a moment of Caesarian calculation, stabbed their majority leader in the back by cutting a deal with the Democrats behind Frist’s back to preserve the filibuster.

Understand what this means. For many liberals and progressives, this deal was profoundly unpalatable because the deal itself included allowing a vote on three wildly unacceptable nominees to the appellate bench. There is no way to paint this with a rosy glow, yet the broader view may provide succor beyond the simple fact that the filibuster was preserved, and the terms under which it can be used remain in the hands of the Democrats.

Simply put, the movement conservatives had their lunch eaten by the old-schoolers on the matter of the filibuster. Mr. Frist lost control of his caucus, and the so-called ‘moderates’ who broke ranks even had the temerity to scold Mr. Bush, reminding him that the Senate does, in fact, have the right and requirement to advise and consent on nominees. Furthermore, the movement fundamentalists were slapped down because they dared to tamper with Senate tradition.

This was the first public shot fired in the GOP civil war, a battle between the movementarians and the old-schoolers. Within hours, this one battle became several battles. The day after Frist lost control of his caucus, 40 GOP House members defied Bush’s promised veto and piled on to an impressive majority that passed legislation approving stem cell research. Bush, whose threatened veto was yet another political sop to the movement conservatives, expected his threat to kill this legislation, but it didn’t by a long chalk.

Suddenly, George has a problem. Stem cell research is very popular among the folks, and can help millions of Americans afflicted with a wide variety of diseases. Take diabetes for one example. There are 18.2 million Americans suffering from diabetes today, a lot of them children. According to the American Diabetes Association, more than 213,000 people will die of diabetes this year alone.

The total annual economic cost of diabetes in 2002 was estimated to be $132 billion, amounting to one out of every 10 health care dollars spent in the United States. Right now, diabetes has no cure, though the people suffering from it have been hearing for years that a cure is right around the corner. Stem cell research could provide that.

George is going to have a hell of a time explaining to these people why Jesus says they can’t be cured.

And then, of course, there was Mr. John Bolton. Bolton’s nomination as UN Ambassador exposed yet another fault line within the GOP ranks, as seemingly loyal Republicans balked at voting for him after hearing the details of his working relationship with his peers, among other things. The seemingly guaranteed approval of Bolton has been thrown into a cocked hat, and will serve as yet another battle front between the movementarians, backed by the neo-cons, and the old-schoolers.

Beyond the filibuster brawl, Mr. Bolton and the looming stem-cell crunch is the matter of Social Security reform. Many old-school conservatives are leery of the Bush plan to overhaul this program, probably because they can do simple math. The plan, because of this resistance, has appeared dead in the water for weeks, and yet the White House keeps pushing. Bush, for his part, actually asked Republicans on Tuesday to “resist pressure from constituents” and support his plan. Big talk for a guy who doesn’t have to run again.

The lingering election beef. Schiavo. The filibuster deal, which earned the following reaction from the president of the Iowa Christian Coalition: “We’ll educate people in the caucuses, and this is not going to do them a lot of good in terms of their presidential aspirations.” The stem cell fight, the 40 Republican defectors in the House, and the threatened veto. Bolton. The looming brawl over Social Security reform. The once-mighty GOP coalition is fragmenting before our very eyes.

Those of us who have watched the White House and Congress run roughshod over the best traditions and ideals of this nation can do two things while this fight unfolds: Sit back and enjoy the rift, or exploit it.

I vote for Option B.

The time has come to mount a bull-throated charge to get American troops out of Iraq. Eleven U.S. troops have died in the last 48 hours, bringing the total to 1,647. Billions and billions of taxpayer dollars have been poured into the sand to no avail. The public dialogue on Iraq is paralyzed, locked between those who believe we have to stay and those who think slogans like ‘Out Now!” with no plans to augment the sentiment are the only proper response. It is Vietnam all over again.

Rather than leave the dialogue stuck in this rut, the time has come to develop an intelligent, effective plan for the removal of troops from Iraq and the delivery of that nation back into the hands of the people who live there. Democratic leaders Reid, Pelosi and Dean must be made to see this as the only intelligent choice. More to the point, Republican old-schoolers who are disgusted with the neo-cons and their ‘useful idiot’ movementarian shock troops can be brought on board as a part of their insurgency against their rotten leaders.

Cindy Sheehan, who lost a son to this Iraq mess, knows in her heart this is possible. “Members of Congress know that Iraq is a mistake,” Sheehan wrote me on Tuesday night. “I know, because I have spoken to many members of the House and Senate, Democrats and Republicans alike, who all acknowledge that Iraq is a catastrophe. Eleven of America's children have been senselessly killed in the last 24 hours. Hundreds have been killed since the Duelfer Report that said that Iraq had no WMD and couldn't have had them for about a decade.”

“Dozens of our nation's children have been needlessly murdered since the ‘smoking gun’ memo from Great Britain dated 23 July, 2002, was exposed at the beginning of this month,” continued Sheehan. My son, Casey, was killed after ‘Mission Accomplished’ on 01 May, 2003. How many innocent Iraqis have been killed? We don't know, because we don't count them. It is time to end the selfish and destructive partisan politics that infect our government and are responsible for so much death and devastation in Iraq. It is time for every member of Congress to look in their hearts and cry out for an end to the immoral and illegal occupation of Iraq.”

“It has been encouraging to me,” continued Sheehan, “to see that conscientious Republicans have begun to split with their party line on such things as the Bolton nomination and the so-called ‘nuclear option.’ It is time that Republican members of Congress break with their party and their President on the issue of Iraq, and work with like-minded Democratic members of Congress to get our troops out of the quagmire as soon as safely possible. Tragically, for too many American and Iraqi families, it is way past time.”

Exploit the rift. The time is now.
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Triana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-24-05 10:47 PM
Response to Original message
1. Kudos to you, Will...
...wonderfully said!

:applause:
:woohoo:

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Cleita Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-24-05 10:50 PM
Response to Original message
2. Once you realize the inmates are in charge of
the asylum, it's not a big jump to break rank. I once had a job like that. Like a good employees, most of us were loyal to the management even when we began to realize they couldn't give clear instructions to the employees. Then we discovered that their M/O was to pick a scapegoat to blame for everything they did that went wrong and to take the credit for work others did.

It took awhile for us to realize the managers were incompetent and frankly crazy. Then we were able to cope with the situation and get headquarters to come investigate what was going on. Sometimes it takes the rank and file to vote with their consciences not their loyalty to what are frankly looney tune's characters in charge of our country.
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autorank Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-24-05 10:52 PM
Response to Original message
3. Very well said! Option B -- Make them eat each other...alive...
in front of the entire country.

Stopping stem cell research means killing hundreds of thousands of Americans a year. WWJD...it's obvious, heal the people.

NEW LEADERS FOR A NEW DEMOCRATIC PARTY
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knowbody0 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-24-05 10:53 PM
Response to Original message
4. you are truly a gifted man, William Pitt
we need to stop whining, collect our amunition and forge ahead.

NOW
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Tigress DEM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-24-05 11:23 PM
Response to Reply #4
15. Um.. how about "collect our amunition and .. retreat" ?
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RevCheesehead Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-24-05 10:58 PM
Response to Original message
5. what about the media?
How do we get them to report what's really going on? Or do we do what we can to exploit the rift, hoping for a bloodbath?

My greatest concern about this country is its overwhelming apathy. In fact, it may already be too late for the media to make a difference. They have "entertained" us into irrelevancy.
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Griffy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-24-05 11:03 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. ANSWER.. todays media bias forum... new idea!
to not wait to be covered.. but to march into the Washington Post office and DEMAND the truth be printed... sit in if needed,.. WITH congress people if needed! its time to press the press!

we can win on all fronts if we force the media to report the truth!

watch the Cspan video once its out...

read Conyers opening statement here..

www.bradblog.com
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oxbow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 01:38 AM
Response to Reply #7
27. I will gladly take part in a WaPo sit-in
or any other like-minded action in the DC area!

Also, where is the thread about the Congressman who put forward a bill for an Iraq exit strategy? That is the boat we should all be rowing together out of this mess!
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bpilgrim Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-24-05 10:59 PM
Response to Original message
6. CIVIL WAR
Edited on Tue May-24-05 11:53 PM by bpilgrim
is that the 'rift' you talk'n bout... if so, we been here for YEARS, bet! :hi:


http://images.globalfreepress.com

Prudence, indeed, will dictate that governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shown that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such government, and to provide new guards for their future security. — Adopted in Congress 4 July 1776

peace
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rocktivity Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-24-05 11:06 PM
Response to Original message
8. This is why I'm hoping it's true that Frist plans to go full speed ahead
Edited on Tue May-24-05 11:23 PM by rocknation
As he's shown with the Schiavo and Justice Sunday Jesus freak shows, alienating moderates by damning the torpedoes is what he does best.

P.S. Just in case you missed my reply to your earlier post.

:headbang:
rocknation
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WilliamPitt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-24-05 11:07 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. LOL, you got me
:toast:
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4morewars Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-24-05 11:08 PM
Response to Original message
10. bush*, cheney, et al to the Hague !!!!
To be tried as the war pigs that they are !
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rocktivity Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-24-05 11:20 PM
Response to Reply #10
13. To the Hauge? That's not so outlandish, 4morewars
Edited on Tue May-24-05 11:30 PM by rocknation
If the rift between the Fristians and GOP moderates can be widened enough, anything becomes possible--even impeachment proceedings. If the moderates can be convinced that their party has no future with the Fristians in charge, it just might motivate them into jettisoning Georgie.

:headbang:
rocknation
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4morewars Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-24-05 11:46 PM
Response to Reply #13
20. I'm OK with either !
or both !!!!
:yourock:
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Tigress DEM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-24-05 11:25 PM
Response to Reply #10
16. Couldn't we sentence them to Guantanamo Bay?
Hague probably still follows the "quaint" Geneva Convention.
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4morewars Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-24-05 11:48 PM
Response to Reply #16
21. I'm OK with that as well !
I'm also not against hanging war criminals.
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Tigress DEM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 01:11 AM
Response to Reply #21
25. After 3 years in Guantanamo....
I think they should have to live on Welfare for a year. No car, no job over minimum wage, no handouts from family or friends, no cheating or it starts over whenever they break those rules. Like parole with a point, you know?

I think if politicians had to live in the margins of existence they would have a better appreciation for all life, not just their own.
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frank frankly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-24-05 11:10 PM
Response to Original message
11. outstanding
I hope they take your advice.

And such a writer!
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The_Casual_Observer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-24-05 11:17 PM
Response to Original message
12.  "bull-throated charge to get American troops out of Iraq"
And walk away from all that oil? They are following the linear course on this one (they always follow the simplest linear course), consolidated permanent bases in Iraq for the protection of our strategic resources. This is the foreign policy of the United States of America.
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Tigress DEM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-24-05 11:28 PM
Response to Reply #12
17. Yeah, all the money they've been getting has been going ...
into military bases and to protecting the oil. Eletricity back for 8 hours a day in the "lucky" areas.

Follow the money.
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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-24-05 11:20 PM
Response to Original message
14. Specific suggestions. Remove the tyrants and their dictator, no matter ...
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VelmaD Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-24-05 11:29 PM
Response to Original message
18. Wow.
Just. Wow.

This is the reason I'm your number one fan-girl. :)
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villager Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-24-05 11:33 PM
Response to Original message
19. I always thought the Repubs were like the "Mirror, Mirror" episode
...on the original "Star Trek," where Kirk, et al, from the "good" universe get beamed into the Enterprise of the "bad" universe.

Their fascist/assassin counterparts are likewise beamed onto the "good" Enterprise, but while the good guys can fake being bad guys, the bad guys are incapable of faking being good guys (they didn't have the MSM to help them out!) and are put in the brig within minutes.

We're seeing the fascist/assassins start to fall out among themselves, and you're right, Will, we need to get some martial art wisdom on this and exploit the enemy's weakness...

(hmmm... martial arts and Star Trek in the same post -- must be in late-night "fanboy" mode, or somethin'...)
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fishnfla Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-24-05 11:49 PM
Response to Original message
22. More mandatory reading
The June issue of Harper's: "40 Years in the Sand-What Happened the Last Time Freedom Marched in Iraq" by Karl E. Meyer ?availablity online

About the British foray into the "bottomless blood well" of Iraq at the turn of the century. The parallels are eerily similar, its like an echo today. Mandatory reading for our Dem leaders. That and time to brush up on some TE Lawrence
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murielkane Donating Member (59 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 12:11 AM
Response to Original message
23. The rift isn't going to open wider without pocketbook issues
Sure, the libertarians don't like the coming police state, and the Paleocons aren't happy about Neocon interventionism. But the bottom line for them is still the bottom line -- do they have more money in their pocket at the end of the day as a result of the Republican policies?

We down here in the underground know that Bush is screwing up the economy big-time. But somehow those guys up on the surface don't seem to know that. All they can see is their tax cuts, the gutting of government regulations, and a cheap and cowed work force. They welcome the destruction of bankruptcy laws and class-action lawsuits. They see the privatization of Social Security as something that will put more money in both their pockets and those of their Wall Street buddies, while keeping the workers in line. They favor judges who will back the corporatist agenda and suppress individual rights.

That's what's at the real heart of the Republican Party. Everything else is just secondary trappings. And unless we can convince a fair chunk of those Republicans that having a prosperous and secure middle class is essential to the economic well-being of the country as a whole, their party is not going to rift in any serious or long-term way.

If we can't do that, we'll wind up, at best, where we were after Watergate. Bush might be discredited. The business/religious coalition might not stand. But the money-and-power guys will still be in control and ready to bring on the next reincarnation of Ronald Reagan after an election cycle or two.

I don't want to see that. I want to use the current opportunity to make something genuinely different happen. And that means starting to put different ideas in people's heads -- even in businessmen's heads -- right now.

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Kurovski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 12:29 AM
Response to Original message
24. Great idea.
And compellingly put. I don't think I've ever seen the words "demented sleigh-ride" together in one place before, but that sums it up very well indeed.
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Polemicist Donating Member (299 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 01:14 AM
Response to Original message
26. I believe the GOP will break the "social issue sword"...
that has been welded by their party leaders on behalf of their fundamentalist supporters, on the rock of America's love of individual liberties and freedom. But the GOP knew that they had to fight these battles and they knew they might lose them.

In my opinion, we can't say the Democratic party has returned to a track of ascendancy, until we defeat their coalition on an important issue of social/economic policy. We rolled over on bankruptcy, torts, the estate tax, and have voted for tax cuts for the wealthy, and enormous budget deficits. The Democratic Party must make it's stand on it's core values of economic and social justice.

The way to do this, is not budge an inch toward compromise on Social Security. We know there is no crisis here. But we can pivot and move the discussion to where there is a crisis, Medicare and health care for Americans. We can tell the American public it's crazy to worry about Social Security shortfalls 20 or 50 years from now, when we are facing Medicare insolvency in 5 years and a health care crisis today.

Iraq will always be Iraq. A mistaken foreign misadventure that will influence events in Washington with little control by any party or politician. We don't need to hook our wagon to that war in any regard right now. It's a millstone around the necks of the Republican Party and we would be wise to allow it to weigh them down for a bit longer. The American people will lead the battle to end the Iraq war, and until that outcry occurs, no politicians will stake a stand there.

I believe that steadily, every day, Iraq is becoming more unpopular in America. I think in 12 months, we can move to disengage in Iraq. But now we need a signature social/economic defeat to hang on the GOP. That's Social Security. Don't give an inch and let them beat themselves to death on that rock and the rock of Iraq.

I know this is a cynical view. But realism can't be emotional. This is what we need to do to regain control of Congress and the White House, ultimately for the good of the people of America.
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tavalon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 03:53 AM
Response to Original message
28. While I don't agree
that Frist was the cuckold in this situation, it is the best way to portray him. Anything to cut him down to size or just metaphorically slice his throat is ok fine with me. My grudge with Frist is even a little more personal for me than for most of the rest of the folks here. I tend to see him much more as a mobster in the way that Delay is. Mobsters keep close tabs on the people they've got their thumb on.

I liked the way your article brought together the events of the last few months and ended with a game plan. I was worried that the article that I knew was coming would be more of a "rah rah democrats" piece. This is much better. I don't know why I worried.
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dbt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 06:02 AM
Response to Original message
29. Kick for the morning crew!
"The movement conservatives had their lunch eaten by the old-schoolers." Law me, Mister Will, but that phrase has a ring to it as nice as Earl's banjo!
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Cooley Hurd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 06:12 AM
Response to Original message
30. I've been waiting for this...
The fundies are just so "out there," and I knew it was a matter of time before the few reality-based repugs would run screaming. :thumbsup:
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steve2470 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 06:40 AM
Response to Original message
31. Great post ! Keep up your good work nt
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CWebster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 06:55 AM
Response to Original message
32. Betcha there ain't no rift
just a shift in strategy to avoid the political fallout of the increasing popular recognition of abuse of power.

It is just a shift in strategy when the outcome is the same.

But if you are playing up the rift on the Right--the same could be made for the Left when Lieberman calls the shots.
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bklyncowgirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 07:06 AM
Response to Original message
33. Great post.
The only answer is to go after these guys and go after them hard.
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dusty64 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 07:15 AM
Response to Original message
34. Sounds like a plan!
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ananda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 07:15 AM
Response to Original message
35. fantasyworld yet again!
This guy Pitt is really starting to get on my nerves.

First he tries to make lemonade out of the rotten, sour lemons of the new anti-filibuster compromise, where there is NO good outcome.

Now he's trying to say that Dems should take advantage of an illusionary rift in the Reeptile party. There are two problems with that fantasy.

One -- The Republicans and Democrats are essentially, now, one party. There's no major difference between the two. Dems are consistently cowed or bought into voting for, or acceding to, policies or laws that should be unthinkable.

Two -- The entire Congress is controlled by the corporo-fascist juggernaut, hugely wealthy, very powerful, and utterly amoral.

I don't live in fantasyland. Reality hurts, but it's real.

Sue
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 09:13 AM
Response to Reply #35
38. Reality? Reality is Repubs Are Human Just Like The Rest of Us
They are NOT all powerful, monolithic beasts w/ mind control powers. They can and DO fuck up and they have weaknesses that can be exploited.

Now, it may be that we are too far gone as a country and the elections are thoroughly rigged, I won't argue with that because it sure is possible, but w/ your attitude, why not just slit your wrists and give up? I go w/ the assumption that it's possible we can make strides in the right direction, otherwise, why not just lay down and die, or move to another country?
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BeFree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 09:42 AM
Response to Reply #35
39. You don't like lemonade?
One -- There is still a vast difference between the parties, it's just that the power of the reptiles obscures it. Sure, there are a few dems who are DINOs and suck up to the power, but we dems are different, and, frankly, I am getting tired of having to tell that to folks like you, time and time again.

Two -- You are almost completely correct. Save for a few dems hanging by the last few populist threads, congress is corrupted. The only thing good is that they could all be replaced next year. Could, if we all got together and voted out the reptiles.
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warrior1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 07:35 AM
Response to Original message
36. You are so right Mr. Pitt
May I pass this on?

Thanks
Mary
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 09:03 AM
Response to Original message
37. An Exit Plan Isn't The ONLY Way To Exploit The Rift Either
Edited on Wed May-25-05 09:07 AM by Beetwasher
Now is the time for a full frontal assault on the GOP on MANY different fronts. We need to seize this opportunity and overwhelm them with wedge issues. Dems need to take the offensive, big time, and not let up EVER AGAIN.

Some suggestions:

Start a national campaign to GET GOV'T OUT OF OUR PERSONAL LIVES.

Start a NATIONAL DIALOGUE ON THE HEALTH CARE PROBLEMS IN THIS COUNTRY. DEMS DEMAND THAT ALL CHILDREN BE COVERED.

Start a national campaign DEMANDING ALTERNATIVE ENERGY SOURCES.

Just a few, but there are certainly more.



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Vincardog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 10:41 AM
Response to Reply #37
42. Let's start with {Paper Ballots and hand counts, Raising the Minimum wage
providing every child with free health care. Making sure every American who wants to work can find a job?
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me b zola Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 04:13 PM
Response to Reply #37
56. good post
a way to exploit the alternative energy issue is to tie energy in with the 'war on terrorism'. The administration is going to push for nuclear energy, but oh how easy it is to remind them that they are not guarding the already existing nuke plants, that they have been wasting 'homeland security' money on nonsense item. While * holds hands with the Saudi crowned prince & subsidizing tax breaks for buying huge gas guzzling autos, common citizens are manufacturing in their own garages conversion kits which makes any diesel engine run on vegtible oil.
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Vincardog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 10:38 AM
Response to Original message
40. aWoL knows how to take his toys and go home.
We need to tell our troops to pack up and advance to their Home base asap. Tell the UN, Ole Europe and the Arabs 'Sorry we messed with Iraq. Could you all please keep it peacefully? We will pay for it.
or barring that
Let the NeoCons just declare victory and leave.
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catmandu57 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 10:40 AM
Response to Original message
41. It's time to come out of the trench
These "people" are giving us enough ammunition to fight back. let lil georgie* veto stem cell research, let the fool frist try to go nuclear, americans understand a deal is a deal, bust the deal and spin the wheel.
There are many issues we can use to drive the wedge in, from the advancement of business issues over the fristian conservative social issues, to the waste of our blood and treasure daily in a war that builds in itensity day after day.
The robbing of main street for the benefit of wall street, the money throw down the rathole of Iraq that could've went to medicare and a prescription benefit, on and on and on.
There's blood in the water and it taste good.
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Taxloss Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 10:43 AM
Response to Original message
43. Nice to have you back, Will.
Another great piece.
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Tierra_y_Libertad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 10:57 AM
Response to Original message
44. Want to get out of Iraq? Don't vote for those who vote for it.
Regardless of party. If they vote for more appropriations, don't vote for them.

Politicians, of either stripe, don't work on "principles" they work on garnering votes and the money that gets them votes. As long as they get both despite what they do, they will continue to do what they think best serves their interest in preserving, or gaining, their seat at the trough.

Make them work for your votes.
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rndmprsn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 11:02 AM
Response to Original message
45. i for one and SO ready to fight!
we just need leadership...please oh god...please provide leadership in our time of need.
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REACTIVATED IN CT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 11:42 AM
Response to Original message
46. Great quote


Three things cannot be long hidden: the sun, the moon, and the truth.
- Buddha. Hindu Prince Gautama Siddharta, the founder of Buddhism, 563-483 B.C.

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proud patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 11:44 AM
Response to Original message
47. Okay , I just changed my window messages
:hi:
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proud patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 02:16 PM
Response to Reply #47
52. here are the new messages on my car windows
"America Used to have Checks and Balances"

"Bush Diverted resources from hunting osama
to invade Iraq"

"Get government out of my church"

and on the front bumper

"bush takes liberties away"
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libodem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 01:03 PM
Response to Original message
48. Bless you, Will Pitt
For saying the things that need to be said. From the outside looking in it has seemed impossible to drive any wedges in their stronghold of unity. While our young Democrats seem to be greenparty voters concerned with the environment and protecting animal rights, the middle-aged concerned about civil-rights and fair labor practices and the centrists looking enough like moderate repubs, to be legitimate enough to garner votes from all sides. Their side has appeared to be walking in lock-step with the campuses full of young repubs, displaying anti-abortion pamphlets, the middle hoping to climb on the back of the 'old money wealthy' so that they might have their own empires, and their old money rich just hoping to keep everything they have, so they won't have to share anything or give anything back to this great country which has afforded them so much opportunity. So strange, they call tax and spend, decry big government, bastardize the free press and then turn around create their own media productions to promote their image and agenda, borrow and spend as well as create mountains of bureaucracy. I hope they destroy each other.
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markus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 01:37 PM
Response to Original message
49. An apt analysis leads to the wrong conclusion
I don't believe America is ready for a broad anti-war movement in regards to Iraq. In the 1960s, there was no clear consequence to retreating from Vietnam except for the loss of face. That in itself was monumental, given the much higher causalities. But a victory for the North Vietnamese posed no direct threat to the United States.

People are not so sure about Iraq. I am as profoundly anti-war as most other DUers. I don't think Iraq is the central issue for those who do not have family members on the ground.

The central concerns remain economic. And, frankly, Bush's numbers on that respect are worse than the numbers on Iraq. The recent United pension scandal was a wonderful opportunity lost to point out precisely what is going on: the Bush plan is nothing but a pension fund raid done on a tremendous scale.

The fundamental economics of Social Security aren't rosy, but they aren't bleak, either. The trust fund is invested in Treasury Bills, and the Clinton administration was wisely piling up a surplus to make sure those notes were covered.

Bush undid that with his sweeping tax cuts. As one Senator pointed out a few weeks ago on Meet The Press, the simple act of not making one quarter of Bush's tax cuts permanent solves the liquidity crisis of the trust fund, which was itself created entirely by the Bush tax cuts.

Pure and simple, the same party that brought us the Savings and Loan scandal is undertaking to steal the Social Security Trust Fund.

I think there is something there to get people angry about. That, together with the spiraling health care and college and housing costs, will get people up and out of their seats. In spite of twenty fives years of Reaganesue rhetoric, people still expect government to step in and tackle the problems to big to handle themselves.

Iraq will play a role in that anger. Lives and money wasted while our own country dribbles away down the sewer; the hubris of the NeoCon national builders who care more about playing Risk with east and central Asia than they do about jobs in Ohio or Medicare in Florida or housing costs in California; all of these are of a piece.

As long as people are afraid that a unilateral withdrawal from Iraq will open the floodgates of terrorism, they will not be ready to follow us down that road. I believe we would agree that a failed Iraqi state could be contained just as Saddam Hussien was contained (but at a terrible, terrible cost to Iraqis. A million died under sanctions. How many will die during a civil war under a blockage?).

We instead have to speak to the other issues at hand. Bush is so busy on the evangelista's agenda, he is not addressing the real needs of the people. Instead, he is using the evangelista's enthusiasm cover a massive robbery of our retirement funds by the corporate class.

I say, let the Iraq wound fester. In and of itself it will continue to weaken Bush et al. But let's begin that bull-throated campaign against the theft of our Social Security by the wealthiest Americans, against the erosion of a century's progress in building a stable middle class in the name of "productivity" and "share holder value".

It's time to turn the people against Wall Street, and take back what they have stolen from us and save what remains for our retirement.

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Polemicist Donating Member (299 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 02:27 PM
Response to Reply #49
53. Yes, yes, yes, Markus has it right....
As much as I hate Iraq and think we need to withdraw immediately, this isn't yet the consensus of the American public. When we are trying to wrest control of government, out of the hands of the anti-government fanatics, we shouldn't walk the plank solely on an anti-war platform. I'm not saying don't oppose the war, just don't make that our lead proposal.

Fight the battles for the social and economic values of the Democratic Party. Win some of these economic issues. Stop the silly assault on Social Security, nothing need be done on this issue while the anti-government radicals control Congress. We can tweak Social Security when we regain the Presidency and Congress. Don't give an inch on Social Security.

Present who we are to the public. Fight to restore solvency to Medicare, ruined by Bush's outrageous corporate welfare program to pharmaceutical companies. Fight for extending health care coverage to more Americans. Fight to increase the minimum wage. Fight to roll back the Bush tax cuts, this will fix our looming budget deficit as well as secure Social Security.

Fight for individual and civil rights and personal privacy, under assault by the religious radicals. We have many ways to re-connect with a public growing weary of Republican excesses and poor choices for America.
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WilliamPitt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 01:38 PM
Response to Original message
50. LINK TO FINAL
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LightningFlash Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 01:48 PM
Response to Original message
51. We need some republicans willing to go George Galloway.
There is no way these republicans can put up with this madness, I wouldn't call it much of a stretch for them to turn on their leader. But I haven't seen one have the spine to be George Galloway!!!

We need a republican or leader period to become George Galloway, and lay out the facts for the last time without fear of reprisal!!!!
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Itsthetruth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 02:35 PM
Response to Reply #51
55. So William .... Do You Think We Should All Join The Republican Party
in order to exploit and deepen the rift between the right-wing Republicans and reactionary Republicans?

Perhaps we can take over the Republican Party just like we can take over the Democratic Party!

How bout that! We'd have two political parties run by and for the interests of working people!

In fairness, I don't think you're advocating that strategy. However, it's not much more unrealistic than the idea that an increasingly isolated and small group of marginalized progressives can seize control of the Democratic Party and boot out its corporate sponsors.

I really don't think Democratic Party leaders and big corporate interests are worried very much about that "threat". That's because they believe, based on decades of experience, that many progressives will stay inside the "big tent" no matter how much they slap progressives around or who they run for high office, including President.

And why should the the Democratic Party worry when some progressives make no demands on them and even try to defend actions Democratic leaders take that enable George Bush and the Republicans to implement their policies?

Case in point .... Democratic Party "moderates" did get some progressives to applaud the bi-partisan filibuster deal as some great victory against the Republican right-wing.

Republicans are split and divided! Meanwhile Bush's most extreme right-wing judicial nominations will be approved by the Senate without effective resistance by Democrats. That's all Bush and the Republican party really wanted. And they got it.



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XemaSab Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 02:30 PM
Response to Original message
54. The real rift is
the fundies versus the libertarians.

One or the other group is going to say "sayonara" soon.
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me b zola Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 04:25 PM
Response to Original message
57. most excellent post!
You are absolutely right. No matter how we feel about the compromise, lets put our energy toward defeating the enemy by enabling them to eat each other!

"George is going to have a hell of a time explaining to these people why Jesus says they can’t be cured."

Great line that speaks volumes. Rebulicans are not going to like it too well when they feel the holier-than-thou finger pointing at them questioning just how 'good-Christians' they are by believing in research that could lead to a cure for their loved-ones. Neither do old school repubs like government poking their nose into their personal life.


I'm ready for battle....EXPLOIT THE RIFT!!!!!!!
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AuntiBush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 09:09 PM
Response to Original message
58. Excellent Post! How true!
Ya know. I was in shock the other night w/regards to the 14 member deal. I hemmed and hauled as many did over this, feeling betrayed.

But by the next morning, I realized it was the right thing to do, and a good thing. Everything you say is right - everything and the "tides are turning" within the Republican party.

Oh. And I opt for plan B, too.

Nice post. Thank you.
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LibertyorDeath Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-25-05 09:13 PM
Response to Original message
59. They're hard at it

Democrats clear way for Senate vote on Bolton

By Vicki Allen 2 hours, 29 minutes ago

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Democrats agreed on Tuesday to clear the way for the Senate to vote on the controversial nomination of John Bolton as the next U.S. ambassador to the
United Nations, which was expected to pass mainly on party lines.

The Senate is to open debate on Wednesday on Bolton, the top U.S. diplomat for arms control and outspoken critic of the United Nations, who has been described by
President Bush as the right man to press for reforms at the world body.

Democrats have harshly criticized Bolton as a hard-line conservative ideologue and a bully who tried to pressure intelligence officials into making their findings support his political views.

The Senate Foreign Relations Committee voted on party lines this month to advance Bolton's nomination to the full Senate without a recommendation -- an extremely rare move.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=578&e=3...
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