Yesterday was a great victory for us in my opinion...

[Independent_Liberal]

We were able to save the filibuster.

7 Repub Senators caved.

I absolutely love it.

We have to keep fighting. If you've jumped on the victim bandwagon, it's time to jump off it now.

Pessimism gets us nowhere.

We have more battles ahead. I think we're on the road to something big.

[WilliamPitt]

1. Read

http://www.truthout.org/docs_2005/052505X.shtml

[endarkenment]

7. paint it any way you want but...

the republicans broke the fillibuster on Owen without having to re-write the rules or get 60 votes.

[bleedingheart]

11. I put a link to your article on our local county web site

I think it is a good read..

[LightningFlash]

2. In these types of wars, you both win and lose. n.t

[fertilizeonarbusto]

3. This is a very unpopular opinion around here

but I tend to agree. Or maybe I think that optimism is more conducive to eventual victory. Think of Churchill during the worst of the Blitz: always, always officially optimistic. He got the British people to think they could win.

[Pirate Smile]

8. I don't know. I think a lot of people agree but just don't yell it as

often as people who think it was bad.

[RaleighNCDUer]

14. It wasn't optimism that won the Battle of Britain.

It was fighting tooth and claw like a cornered rat against a vastly superior enemy, and refusing to back down, compromise or surrender.

When we start fighting like that, then I'll be optimistic.

[rigel99]

4. Keep those rose colored glasses on but here are the facts...

1. the repugs can call to remove the filibuster anytime again
2. we gave up 3 very harsh judges to the citizens of the US who will suffer their hateful bigotry
3. if the senators caved, then that meant Frist did not have the votes needed to kill the filibuster
4. Dems gave up the right to use the filibuster

bottom line, we negotiated with terrorists.


a better show of backbone would be democrats walking out of the senate and not coming back for days/weeks/months to show just one ONE BRANCH government we have become... and then the citizens get in the streets and demand impeachment...

calling this a victory is like saying 'they only used a little bit of gas in the gas chambers of auschwitz', as a gay person in today's climate I"m very upset people want to praise the very democrats that have let this happen to save their jobs....

no, my friend, this is not pessimism, but healthy realism to what a joke the whole filibuster issue was, in a true democracy, we would not have to give a president better part of 97% of his judges, let him fire massively most of the federal judges and install his own guard, this is not a democracy and we should all be in the streets stopping traffic till our demands are heard....

[Chipper Chat]

5. Yeah, but the trump card is.....

Frist has been embarrased and his iron grip has been relaxed. McCain (albeit Mr. 2-Face) has let the moderate wing of the GOP out of prison, and Bush has been rebuked regardless of the smiley face he wears. Those seven Republicans did not "cave in." They are courageous and principled, especially Lindsay Graham (who has the most to lose). As a staunch Democrat I have nothing but respect for the "GOP 7."

[geomon666]

6. How can you have respect for those people.

As a staunch Democrat I have nothing but respect for the "GOP 7."

After everything they've done to this country, how can you respect them? Because of some percieved goodness? Did they not vote to make her a federal judge?

[Chipper Chat]

10. I respect them for standing up to the cat killer.

I've always respected the 2 Maine women, Warner...well...pass, Graham - still would blast him for what he did to Clinton. McCain - still have some hope for him.
Something I learned: I've always been a fence-sitter on Chuck Hagel. But after hearing his comments blasting the deal, now I know he just cannot remove his nose from shrub's ass - and I have written him off.

[The Magistrate]

9. It Is Impossible, Mr. Chat, For Me To Agree

To warrant respect, those seven would have to break with Frist on all votes. Inded, in this matter, they would have had to serve him notice they would vote against any attempt to shut off the fillibuster, now or in the future, and require him to public abjure that course, and acknowledge his error in attempting to subvert the rules and traditions of the Senate.

It seems to me it would have been a better course to force the enemy to bring this matter to a vote, now, and let the chips fall as they would. Either these persons would have abandoned Frist publicly and seen to the defeat of the pernicious course he pressed, or they would have stood by him, and the country been treated to the spectacle of a dictatorial over-reach so colossal as to ensure a serious and lasting plitical backlash from persons committed to our democratic system of rule, that would likely bear great fruit at the polls in '06....

[Chipper Chat]

12. I agree with you 100%.

I myself was itching for that scenario. But it didn't happen, so we'll just have to see how this plays out. Of course we could be right back to square 1 in a few months if shrub, who we all know is ultra-defensive, just for spite proposes Rodgers or Owen for SCOTUS. Talk about raising the stakes!

[Independent_Liberal]

13. I knew not everyone would agree with me...

I guess it all depends on how you look at it.

I just look at it as "we were able to save the filibuster for now." There will be other battles in the future. We should always be ready. We won't win everytime on everything.

But we should be anything but victims.

[endarkenment]

15. Half of us lost sight of what the primary issue was

It wasn't the fillibuster, it was the nomination of hideously unacceptable judges to lifetime jobs at very high levels. Owens is one step away from a SC seat. They got their appointment. We got a promise that maybe next time we dare to say no they won't take away our fillibuster.