Why is Walmart building a Super-Center in my town?

[hedgehog]

We've been losing population for twenty years. We used to have a downtown and several discount stores. Now downtown's gone, we're down to one discount store on shaky legs and several major employers (manufacturers) have closed.There is a Walmart 10 miles north, 10 miles south and 10 miles east. Are we witnessing the commercial equivalent of the shark that has to keep swimming to stay alive? When the last Walmart is built, does the entire structure collapse?

[napi21]

1. Where are you? n/t

[hedgehog]

5. Granby, New York

Granby is a town that warps around the city of Fulton. The bozos running Granby are so excited about the sales taxes from Walmart they don't give a damn about screwing the city or about what the Walmart will do to the traffic here.

[pstans]

13. There was a study down last winter in Iowa about companies and health care

Wal Mart had the most employees without health care. These employees then depended on the state to provide them Health Care.

Not sure where the Wal Mart wants to build in your town, but I can probably guess that it is on the outskirts of town. A negative to that would be the city has to built streets and infrastructure out to the store. It would take traffic away away from the main parts of town. Do a search on urban sprawl for more negatives.

[hedgehog]

24. The big mirage is lower taxes.

How do I explain to people that when a largely rural area develops into a suburb, taxes go up, not down?

[pstans]

28. I can give you 3 reasons off the top of my head

1. Employees don't revice health care, so the state has to pick up, which means more taxes.
2. Wal Marts are built on the outskirts of town where the land is cheap. The city then has to build streets, seweres, traffic lights out there.
3. Wal Marts push out smaller businesses. That means the money in the area only gets spent at Wal Mart, no more small grocery store, no more small hardware store, no more craft shop, no more gift shop. This money gets sent to Arkansas instead of staying in your community.

[SoCalDem]

48. And they are usually given a "sweetheart deal" regarding those "taxes"

Just as the full amonut is due to start being paid, they will abandon the concrete block box and the 5 acre asphalt patch..and move to the next "sucker-city"..

in their wake they leave behind closed-up Mom & pop businesses, closed down supermarkets, and unemployed workers:(

[LiberalEsto]

50. Maryland Dems are pushing a law to require they pay

for their employees'health insurance. It passed through our house of delegates and state senate, but the evil rethug governor vetoed it. Progressives and democrats are puching for an overr-de of the veto.

Keep your fingers crossed. If it passes here, other states will follow.

[napi21]

18. All I can tell you is that WM tried to build another store a bit north of

Gainesville Ga. That area is in the same position as you are. There are WM's within 5-10 mins already.

The local people contacted their City Councilmen and said, if you approve the rezoning for another WM, YOU'RE GONE!

The City Council voted not to give the permit to WM! The last thing I heard was a comment from the WM negotiator who said "I just don't understand why!"

That's the tactic that seems to be working all over the country. People don't want another WM, and they're threatening thier local council. It'w working too! I've read many articles where cities/towns have just said NO!

[hedgehog]

26. Again, the problem is that the Walmart is going into the town

on the edge of the city. The city will lose its tax base as existing retail dries up and face the increased traffic on residential streets, but the town will get any increased revenue. The city doesn't have any say in the rezoning process. Sweet, huh?

[napi21]

31. So, why can't you contact the town residents?

For sure, the decision is made by whoever has jurisdiction in the place WM wants to build. If the city is close to the other WM's, so is the town! Contact the people who live there. The smaller the town, the easier it is to convince the town coucil what they want or don't want!

[valerief]

36. Too bad you can't get Tom Delay to redistrict the town line

[Twist_U_Up]

29. It's Official: Wal-Mart Is Coming To Granby

http://fultondailynews.com/index.php/fulton/home_page/headlines/it_s_official_wal_mart_is_coming_to_granby

GRANBY, NY - Wal-Mart is coming to Granby.

Granby Town Supervisor Nancy Hawthorne said the company approached the Granby Town Board with a proposal for the store Wednesday evening, as well as an application for a zone change request.

The plans for the store are laid out on property along the state Route 3 corridor. Hawthorne explained that the front portion of the parcel is already zoned commercially while the rear portion is zoned agricultural.

“The commercial zone did not extend back far enough for the plans for the project,” Hawthorne said. The request was referred to the planning board for consideration, she said.

“There will be a site plan review and a State Environmental Quality Review,” Hawthorne said. “There are a lot of things to do.”

Hawthorne noted that the company’s target date is spring 2007.

The town of Granby requested that the city extend its water and sewer services along the state Route 3 corridor in September 2004.

At that time, Hawthorne said assurances for water and sewer were the only things holding the company up from making a final application for a new store. The city council rejected the request, however, citing the potential losses that a Wal-Mart would create for Fulton as the primary reason for the decision.

Hawthorne noted, however, that obstacle is gone.

She explained that the company has indicated that it would do an on-site septic system and perhaps a temporary well for water service until the town’s newest water district is up and running.

“They would have to request an extension of the district,” she noted.

“I am very happy about (the plans),” Hawthorne noted. “It is an exciting project. Most of the people I have talked to have been very positive and are looking forward to it.

“I think a lot of people will be really pleased to hear it is not a dead issue after all,” Hawthorne added. “Especially consumers because there are not a lot of places to shop in this area.”

Different view

While Granby has started to lay out the “welcome wagon” for the new business, its neighbors in Fulton could begin looking at damage control.

Ron Woodward, executive assistant to Fulton Mayor Daryl Hayden, said that since its seems that Wal-Mart’s move to Granby is inevitable, the city may have to consider what it can salvage.

“I think a Wal-Mart in Granby will hurt us either way,” Woodward said. “But we need to focus on what we’re doing. ... I don’t think it would be out of line to sit down and talk with them about the city providing water and sewer.”

Woodward noted that while the store would pull from the sales tax base, the city could try to recoup some of that loss through water and sewer services.

“Any new water and sewer customers help the ones that are already here and stabilize the budget,” Woodward said. “It certainly seems that (the city) not providing them water and sewer is not going to stop them from coming.

“You can’t throw the baby out with the bath water,” Woodward added. “We have to look at what is best and decide how the city can pick up the pieces.”

Woodward noted that the city has not talked with Wal-Mart officials since the mention of a store in Granby first surfaced.

Hawthorne noted, however, that despite opinions to the contrary, she believes Fulton businesses have much to gain from the new business.

“I think this is exciting for Fulton, too,” Hawthorne said. “I know some people don’t but many residents are looking forward to this and feel it will bring new customers for their existing businesses as well as new business.”

Referencing the stretch of road on Route 31 in Clay, Hawthorne pointed out the amount of growth in that area during the past decade.

“Where Wal-Mart goes, other businesses follow,” she added.

[proud patriot]

43. Twist_U_Up please read

In the future please limit your snips of articles to 4
paragraphs as per Democratic Underground Copyright Rules.

proud patriot Moderator
Democratic Underground

[DemocratSinceBirth]

2. Within Fifteen Miles Of My HomeThere Must Be Seven Super WalMarts

eom

[dogman]

3. One possibility.

Your town may have offered new tax incentives. Their tax incentives at one of the other stores may be due to expire. They also want to knock that last discount store off it's shaky legs.

[gizmo1979]

4. I live in sheboygan wi we're

getting 2 super wal-marts.Our population is only 50,000!

[jaxx]

19. We're getting one too.......pop. of 33,500

Already have one wally, which will close when the new one opens in a NEW shopping center. This will be half filled, and go along well with the shuttered retail scattered around town. We have lost major mfg jobs and companies in the last year, real estate is down, unemployment is up. Where the hell do they think their customer base will materialize from, the local minimum wage jobs?

Sorry for the rant, but this really pisses me off.

[gizmo1979]

23. Same situation here

I guess they'll sell to their employees.

[sandnsea]

6. You're in an Enterprise Zone

http://www.fultoncda.com/edz_benefits/edz_home.html

[hedgehog]

14. As a retailer, I think Walmart is excluded from the Enterprise Zone Benefi

[sandnsea]

30. Regardless

The businesses that are eligible will be creating jobs and the pay will likely only be adequate if the people can shop at Wal-mart.

[pstans]

32. I looked that the link and noticed this

Gas Discounts
For businesses increasing gas volume by a specific amount based on its service classification -- 7.5 to 15% average discount.

Wouldn't it be better to encourage companies to conserve oil?

[pstans]

7. Start a group to oppose the store being built

Start a group in opposition to the store. Attend city council meeting and barrage the members of the city council and planning and zoning commisions with phone calls against it. Sress the importance of supporting local business and building downtown.

I saw you live in NY. Check out James Howard Kunstler website at www.kunstler.com. He is a strong advocate for smart growth and lives in Saratoga, NY. If you send him an email, he might be willing to give some advice or help.

Be a strong, oppostional hedgehog that refuses to see its shadow and go away!

[hedgehog]

20. The problem is that the Walmart is set to build inthe town

while it is going to screw the city. New York State is set up so that the counties are divided between urban centers (cities and villages) and suburban or rural rings (towns). Generally in upstate New York, the towns are run by a small clique of republicans, even though some towns have morphed into giant suburbs like Amherst. The common goal of every town in New York seems to be to screwthe nearest city whether it be Buffalo, NYC or as in this case, Fulton. They're all full of welfare cheats, dontcha' know. That's why taxes are so high. .

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

8. No Walmart in my county

which is in northwest Arkansas, within a couple hours' drive of WalMart headquarters. I've never been able to figure out why Walmart does what it does, but I think you are right. News here is always about the Waltons or WalMart being involved in some sort of lawsuit or someting.

[PatrioticLeftie]

9. As long as there is money to steal, they'll try to steal it

What do you expect from crooks?

[karlrschneider]

10. I guess they won't be satisfied 'til they have put one in every town on th

damn planet. Thre's one in our little 5,000 pop town. :grr:

BTW, I literally LOLd at your hobby list in the profile.
:D

[Rainscents]

11. WalMart is going up 1/2 block from my home and I am NOT happy about it!

[Lubernaut]

15. They just built one 5 blocks from me..

Thankfully it's a ways off the street and incorporates a different
design than the rest, but I stll hate it.

[McKenzie]

12. a pisser but the big box stores are doomed

once the oil becomes expensive the long supply chains these stores operate will not be viable. It's likely that small businesses will then become essential and they will draw their goods from a much more local base. Moving stuff several thousand miles, possibly even only a few hundred miles, is just not going to be economically viable without cheap, abundant oil.

[tularetom]

37. If this is true (and it seems perfectly plausible)

then wally world is in deeper shit than probably all other retailers because of their supply chain that stretches halfway around the world to mainland china. Oil prices will wipe out any competitive edge they have selling their cheap crap from China. Can't wait for that to happen!!

[midnight armadillo]

38. Not to mention the heating bills!!

40' ceilings must cost a staggering amount to keep warm. The buildings are also built so cheaply that insulation must be minimal as well.

[McKenzie]

39. you guys might find this link interesting

It is by Jim Kunstler whom I respect a lot. He's been accused of being Malthusian but that is unfair and probably symptomatic of the head in the sand tendency of people who don't like facing unpleasant facts more than it is a valid comment on Jim's opinions.

There is a good comment on Walwart in the article.

regards

http://www.kunstler.com/spch_hudson.htm

<edit1> speling/gramma

<edit2> I believe JK is a registered Democrat btw.

[depakid]

16. Because your community hasn't been aggressive enough

to keep them out.

Wallmart has tried several times to get in around here (Washington County, Oregon) and we fight them tooth and nail. Thus far- they've failed at every turn.

These people are parasites- they suck the life (and money) out of communities. It' just downright self-destructive behavior to let them in.

[skullj]

17. I think you are exactly right.

I live in a small-medium size city in California. There has been a Wal-mart here for about ten years, and now they are trying to get a super Wal-mart built about two miles from it. The execs at wal-mart have for years successfully equated quantity with profits, but unfortunately they have to keep expanding for profit to increase (~kinda like Worldcom). Wal-mart is already starting to have money problems, and I think we will soon see the empire deflate as quickly as it expanded.

hopefully.

[hedgehog]

21. Like I said above,

some sharks have to keep swimming or they die.

[skullj]

51. Yep, that pretty much sums it up! n/t

[shenmue]

22. Because they want to dominate the Earth

And then Mars.

Yes, they want to suck the blood dry from the community and become the only game in town. They "increase" competition like bleeding "increases" the cleansing of a wound. Overall, you'd still rather not be wounded!

:sarcasm:

I hate those bastards. Fight them if you can. Make anti-WM fliers and hide them in the restrooms...leave the workers pamphlets about how to unionize...

Good luck.



:patriot:

[49jim]

25. I live in Oswego....

didn't think there were any democrats in Oswego County!!

[hedgehog]

27. Even the Democrat running for legislature from Granby is a

Republican!

Help me Howard Dean, you're my only hope!

[Twist_U_Up]

35. Oswego = Repub Corruption

hehe Granby here also.

The funny thing about Scab-Mart is that they hire Union people to build their stores. Apparently the Union guys build them faster with less mistakes and are safer.

I know how Woodward from Fulton means about throwing the baby out with the bathwater. I'm a Union Ironworker and just finished building a Scab mart in Camillus. Trust me, I had hesitations about working on the project but construction jobs are few and far between,if you want work you have to travel.So I took it

So I took it upon myself to wear all my Union Gear and left some nice reading material laying around for all the non union guys to read while they where on break. Needless to say a few of the bosses running around picking them up as fast as I could throw them down.

[hedgehog]

45. Hey - what do you guys have going on in Oswego ?

The Republican mayor is soliciting sex from underage girls, the Republican police chief has stolen goods on 2 of his properties and the word is the FBI tripped over those guys while looking into something else. I know you people in Oswego have big heads and all, but you'd think you were living in DC or something!

[mamalone]

33. I live in Upstate NY too......

and we are also getting a Super Walmart in our town. It is so sad...we are the county seat of a very rural county (Orleans) and the town really is attractive, even though it is poor. Lots of old sandstone storefronts, slate sidewalks, those old wrought iron streetlights and a beautiful brick courthouse. An elderly neighbor has lived here her whole life...she is 99yo. The stories she tells of how bustling and alive the community used to be are so heartbreaking, given what it is now. And once Walmart moves in we will lose the few businesses that have managed to stay afloat. You know what though? I am one of the very few who opposed Walmart coming in. Everyone in the community is just tickled pink. :eyes:

[hedgehog]

44. I know Orleans

and it is like so much of Upstate New York, beautiful. The problem is no jobs. The kids go to the stae universities of colleges and leave for the south and south east. It's been a slow motion disaster for us with no one offering a real solution. Normally education would be the answer, but not when our educational capital is forced to up stakes and leave. I remember thirty years ago professors in Buffalo chiding us for wanting to stay in Buffalo. Who did they think was paying their salaries?

[ShaneGR]

34. sometimes, Walmarts are awesome in forgotten towns

If the town he's in doesn't have a lot of commercial activity, places like Walmart enable locals to get quality goods for cheap. Goods they may not have been able to get before.

I'm no fan of Walmarts densely populating suburban areas and taking AWAY business from small competitors, but sometimes Walmarts do provide a service to rural communities.

[lapislzi]

40. Let me address the question in your subject line

Walmart is in your town because good people of conscience allow it. I am making no judgements about you because I know nothing about you. But I do know that Walmarts get built when people allow them to be built. Walmart is in your town because not enough was done to stop it. Who stood up? Who opposed? Who's on your town planning board?

I am currently involved in a battle to stop a big-box development in my town (PM me for details; I am in NY too). I am running for office because of this ill-conceived development. I have to try to stop it because it will destroy my town if allowed to proceed.

Think about it. Your local town board has more control over your day-to-day quality of life than any other government body. This is an arena where one person can make a difference. I am counting on it. We are a group of committed citizens; we are organized; and we will win.

IT'S NOT A DONE DEAL. (Well, in your case maybe it is, but for all you people in towns where a big-box is on the agenda: take heed. They are not in charge. The people are in charge.)

[lostnfound]

41. to kill the discount store..?

:shrug:
Actually I am somewhat serious. In many towns, a Walmart was built, the local business went OUT of business, and then the Walmart closed, leaving townspeople to be forced to drive a long distance to the next town (and thus to another Walmart).

[mzteris]

42. reminds me of that 300 lb gorilla joke...

because they CAN.

[bobbieinok]

46. Walmart 1st went into small rural towns and killed all the businesses

I saw this in IA and OK

then Walmart went into cities, like Tulsa

then a superstore went in on the northeast side of Tulsa; somewhat later another went in on the southwest side.....almost immediately a good grocery store went out of business

now there's at least one Walmart grocery store catty corner from a large Albertsons

[GreenPartyVoter]

49. That happened here in Maine, too.

[GreenPartyVoter]

47. That is bizarre. I can't fathom that many Mall*Warts in so small an area

[FM Arouet666]

52. Why does cancer consume the body?

Cancer is probably not the best analogy, after all the end result is death, and Walmart wants us plebes to survive, buying exploitation goods for eternity. Perhaps the Borg, resistance is futile?

[hedgehog]

53. I've decided it's OK because Walmart doesn't understand Fulton

You might say Fulton is quirky. In recent years
- a man set fire to his house while looking for his cat under his bed with a lighter.
- our Lake Neahtawahnta started killing things (well, the algae did).
- the canine officer let his dog out for a run and the trained beast ran off. While looking for the dog in the patrol car, the officer ran it over. (that one was sad).
- a roadrunner was spotted in a grocery store parking lot, in upstate New York, in March (and people just walked past)
- we used to have a lady who walked to the grocery store in her slippers and house coat - down the middle of the street.
- yesterday someone found a 3 1/2' iguana on her porch.

I expect the Walmart to either go belly-up

or

lose its roof to the snow load

twice.