Bono: "...my least favorite John Lennon song? Imagine."

[Karmadillo]

http://www.wsws.org/articles/2005/dec2005/time-d22.shtml

Time names super-rich trio as 2005 “Persons of the Year”

<edit>

The victims of these tragedies were overwhelmingly poor, the vast majority still suffering to this day due in large part to the lack of preparation and allocation of adequate resources combined with the indifference of government authorities. Millions of ordinary people around the world looked on in horror, responding with an outpouring of sympathy and compassion for those affected. Many volunteered their time or made personal donations to relief agencies.

Taking the year’s events into account, one struggles to come to grips with Time’s seemingly bizarre naming on Monday of two multibillionaires—Bill and Melinda Gates—and one multimillionaire—U2’s Bono—as their 2005 Persons of the Year for their altruistic work. In a year dominated by an endless string of natural disasters, which laid bare in their wake vast social inequalities and misery, the actions of these three massively wealthy individuals have had a negligible impact.

Time magazine’s annual selection of its Man, Woman or Persons of the Year is not necessarily based on popularity. Past choices have included Adolf Hitler (1938), Joseph Stalin (1939, 1942), Richard Nixon (1971, 1972) and George Bush (2004). But the magazine’s choice is said to be based on people who have “made a difference” in the course of the year—for better or for worse.

For 2005, Time writes that the Gateses and Bono have been selected “for being shrewd about doing good, for rewiring politics and re-engineering justice, for making mercy smarter and hope strategic and then daring the rest of us to follow.” In reality, the primary reason they have been selected is because of their immense personal fortunes. From the viewpoint of the editorial offices of the mass media in America, wealth and power dazzle and impress, and should be duly acknowledged. It matters not that these Persons of the Year travel in an orbit thoroughly disconnected from the lives of the overwhelming majority of the world’s population.

<edit>

By playing it safe in its selection of Bono and the Gateses, Time also sidestepped one of the year’s biggest stories: the deepening debacle in Iraq. The grim milestone of 2,000 US soldiers killed in the war and occupation was passed in October. Opposition to the Bush administration’s policies—both in Iraq and at home—intensified. One mother, Cindy Sheehan—who lost her son to this war—galvanized this antiwar sentiment. From the viewpoint of people who make a difference, and provoked controversy, she would have made a more apt choice.

<edit>

This conformist and opportunist outlook was summed up by Bono in remarks quoted by Time in their “Persons of the Year” issue. Standing on the balcony of his Manhattan apartment overlooking Central Park, Bono commented, “You know what my least favorite John Lennon song is? ‘Imagine.’ At the root of it is some rigorous thinking about the way things could be, but people have stolen the idea and made it an anthem for wishful thinking. I’m against wishful thinking. I hate it.”

more...

[TallahasseeGrannie]

1. I've always agreed with him on "Imagine"

Love the tune, but it reminds me a living life in a daze or stupor on some kind of happy chemical.

[tx_dem41]

5. Hi TallahasseeGrannie!

I just wanted to wish you and your family a Happy Holidays!

I'm a big fan of your posts!

[Ian David]

33. That's not it at all. It's an expression of Humanist and communist ideals

I'm big on the Humanist part, but not so hot about the communist part.

"Immagine no possessions"(??) -- but what about my collection of Avante Garde lesbian cinema!

[Skidmore]

57. You'd have to share.

[Moochy]

105. but you could charge people

:rofl:

it's that new communism stuff, like in China.

[patcox2]

37. That would be "heroin," that happy chemical.

John was a middlebrow intellect at best, and he didn't even have the honesty and moral conviction to stand by what he wrote. When interviewed about the song, he insisted that he didn't mean there is no god, but rather that the world would be better without "organized" religion.

[mmonk]

47. Without imagination, you only get acceptance

of unjustifiable things. I will stick with "Imagine" and the premise of hope and a just society.

[QC]

54. Always reminded me of those beerish late-nite B.S. sessions in the dorm.

But that's just me. I've always thought of the Beatles as a band that did some pretty good light pop, not prophets.

[BloodyWilliam]

64. I painfully agree

It always grated on me, like utopian hippie claptrap.

But maybe I'm cynical!

[TallahasseeGrannie]

99. It's a lovely song

But... no possessions... nothing to "believe in" is kind of spooky to me. I picture people in gray gowns walking around aimlessly or something..bumping into each other.

I also never thought of the Beatles heavy duty intellects. Just damned fun.

[tx_dem41]

2. I can see where he is coming from. Bono is heading a movement...

where "wishful thinking" easily leads to cynicism. And cynicism infesting a global cause is deadly.

[acmejack]

3. The statement about Imagine is one of the stupider things he has said.

That really pisses me off!

On edit: Why is thinking of how it should be such a bad thing? Cynicism my butt. A happy daze, please, give me a break!

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

4. Bono has a good point

There's a big difference between wishing people wouldn't starve and taking actions so they don't. And he did indicate Lennon was thinking rigorously but somehow people tended to interpret the song passively.

[tx_dem41]

6. You said it better than I did in my post.

Passivism...is the term I was looking for. Thanks.

[acmejack]

9. To a lot of us that song has been an anthem.

FYI, I have been and activist since my teens & I am now in my fifties.

[tx_dem41]

13. I understand. I think his criticism was not really with the song itself..

he even acknowledges the lyrics, but with the way SOME people perceive it. Obviously not how you perceive it.

[bpilgrim]

22. sounds like a neoCON perception of the songs interpretation by some

to me.

i think he was just try'n to SHOCK&AWE people for headlines like they do so well on fox.

911 changed EVERYTHING, eh?

peace

[tx_dem41]

27. Like it or not, Bono has had to deal with a lot of NEOcons

on the environmental issues and 3rd World debt issues. Perhaps you have identified the EXACT reason for his gripe with it, Bpilg.

Peace to you too. And Happy Holidays!

[bpilgrim]

38. their 'big ideas' appear to be rubbing off on him, and thats a real shame

Seasons Greetings & a Happy New Year to you and yours, too, tx_dem41 :toast:

peace

[bpilgrim]

10. EVERYTHING

begins with our IMAGINATION.

fyi

peace

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

15. Sure it does

but if it stays there, that's where it ends too, and that was Bono's greater point. Look, I don't necessarily agree with ever tack he takes, but the guy was trying to say that a song which was designed for people like you who know that imagination is a great beginning has been bastardized by the people who really think "good thoughts" are doing something.

[bpilgrim]

29. bastardized by the people who really think "good thoughts" are doing somet

well, has he done some kind of study that suggest this is the case?

besides simply thinking good thoughts has been shown scientifically to be beneficial to ones health and well being which is all the better for fighting the good fight ain't it?

any artist worth their salt should know better to judge others interpretations of art.

cheap SHOCK-n-AWE headline comment, imho.

peace

[montana500]

44. John Lennon had more talent on his ass hairs.......

than Bono has in his whole body.

[Maestro]

63. Once again I agree with you

Bono expressed an opinion; nothing more nothing less. Leave the guy alone. He's not a freeper people. Let's attack Nugent or someone of his ilk. This Bono bashing is ridiculous. And welcome back! :hi:

[bpilgrim]

7. Clear Channel & the neoCONs hate imagine, too

always look on the bright side of life...

peace

[RT_Fanatic]

8. F--k you, Bono

Just because you've sold your soul for luncheons with Bush and Jesse Helms, don't bring John Lennon into it. As a songwriter, a musician, a human being, you're not fit to wipe his ass. Merry Fucking Christmas, "Person of the Year."

[yknot]

67. Heh, agreed n/t

[mattclearing]

11. You can't blame the song for peoples' reaction to it.

I like Bono, but this strikes me as a particularly dumb comment.

Picking Imagine out to be the least favorite, especially when there are unlistenable (if well-intentioned) Lennon songs like, "Woman Is the Nigger of the World" out there, seems to me like reaching to make a point.

You don't knock an undeniably great song to make a point and expect to be taken seriously.

[bpilgrim]

14. and how does he know what folks reactions are to it?

and i also agree with your point about why would he pick this internationally reveered song as his least favorite of all Lennon's songs.

reminds me of a fox commentator with this quote :eyes:

peace

[mattclearing]

35. Bono needs to go back to making music and stop being such a

pretentious jerk. U2's last album was inferior to most Lennon solo albums, and that's sad.

Let Bono live 500 years and he won't write a song like Imagine.

One is as close as he gets.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

16. God was my least favorite Lennon song

I believe in Elvis





(just kidding..it's actually one of my fav's)

[The White Tree]

20. It seems to me that is the point he is making.

I'm basing that only on reading what is posted here. But I don't think he is criticizing Lennon for writing the song, or the song itself, rather he is criticizing the way people have taken it and mis-interpreted it for their own goals. People did the same thing with Bruce Springsteens "Born in the USA" mis-using it as a song about unwavering patriotism when it was more about disillusionment with America after Vietnam.

I think that is a valid point which he is making with the use of a little hypebole. I'll cut him that slack.

[mattclearing]

39. Like I said, saying the song is misunderstood and knocking the

song as one's least favorite are two different things.

Imagine is no one's least favorite Lennon song, not even Bono's, no matter what he says...there are songs of Lennon's that are unlistenably awful, and if Bono listened to the entire Lennon catalog, he would find that Imagine is far from his least favorite Lennon song.

Like you said, he is using hyperbole to make a point.

[Adenoid_Hynkel]

118. yeah, but that wouldn't give the knee-jerk bono-bashers a reason to whine

why actually bother to listen to what he really said when you can act like hannity insteaad?

[i_c_a_White_Ghost]

12. It's a great song

However, I see his point. John Lennon himself said it was done with a bit of honey. Depending on one's views, you either think it's the best or too sweet. Either way, John Lennon wrote so many great tunes, 'In My Life', Norwegian Wood', Tommorow Never Knows, Strawberry Fields, all of which I rank higher than Imagine.

[stanwyck]

88. I want it played at my wake

it's one of the songs I want played at my wake. Along with Etta James' "At Last" and Louis Armstrong's "What A Wonderful World."

Bono has no songs to equal "Imagine".

[vi5]

17. Hahahaha...

I love it when people get themselves all tied in knots when anyone dares to say something negative about the sainted Beatles.

That being said, I don't know much about Lennon's life to be honest with you so I'd honestly be curious to hear some of the things he did to actually back up his sentiments. All I know is that Bono has done a lot of good for a lot of people, and raised a lot of money and awareness of any number of specific causes which needed and demanded people's attentions and money. So people getting pissed at him because he doesn't like some song is laughable. Instead why don't they point out all of the wonderful charitable things that Lennon did in his lifetime to raise awareness and money for causes which would make what he is imagining in his song become an actual reality. Because with Bono you can actually point to that stuff. Yeah, it irks me to see him cozy up to people like Bush but a cheesy photo-op doesn't undo or negate all the good he has done with his fame and his time and his money and neither does him not liking some pop song.

[i_c_a_White_Ghost]

42. the Beatles were sainted for a reason

their music was good. Way ahead of it's time. Whether you like them or not, you gotta remember they wrote songs 40 years ago that still stand up. As for Bono, I know for a fact he liked the Beatles.

[vi5]

43. Whatever...

I don't like the Beatles. Never have, never will. I understand many, many people do and good for them. I've given up arguing with them over the merits of their music and agre to co-exist peacefully with them. And I know that Bono is a huge Beatles fan. Which is precisely why the reactions from people on this thread and the bile they are throwing at him because he said 1 particular John Lennon song wasn't his favorite. This makes him a neocon? This makes his hundreds of hours devoted to incredibly noble causes worthy of disdain from people on here? Regardless of how I feel about the Beatles, that seems more than a little pathetic to me.

[i_c_a_White_Ghost]

45. About Bono

I agree with you. He's no Neo-con. He was just spouting an opinion about 1 song. As far as the Beatles go, you can think they suck for all I care. The fact is, they changed music.

[vi5]

49. "the fact is..."

Apparently we differ not only on our opinion of the Beatles, but the definition of "fact" as well. And you know what. I'm o.k. with that.

Happy Holidays.

[i_c_a_White_Ghost]

50. I like differences

Same to you. Merry Christmas:thumbsup:

[mattclearing]

62. He didn't say it wasn't his favorite. He said it was his least favorite.

Considering that Lennon has some truly awful songs, it seems like hyperbole to make a point. Like it or not, Imagine is a great song, certainly in the top ten of Lennon's songs by any objective standard.

Except in Bonoland.

[DS1]

71. Knighted. HUGE difference.

[NashVegas]

112. "The Most Overrated Boy Band in History"

I loved the Beatles when I was four. Loathe them now. Like so many bands of their era, they took the sex and mystery out of love songs and replaced it with pubescent longing.

Cole Porter: "goldfish in the privacy of bowls do it"
Lennon / McCartney: "I wanna hold your hand"

PS - there are few things that amuse me as much as Lennon fans when they think they see/hear someone pissing on his grave.

[Vinnie From Indy]

18. It is kind of funny that BONO would be against wishful thinking

After all, it was Bono that believed BushCo when they promised 15 or so billion to his Africa Aids initiative. I laughed out loud when I heard that announced. I said monkeys have a better chance of flying out Smirky's rear end than Bono seeing anywhere close to that amount of money for "them" people in Africa. And, he hasn't. Surprise! Surprise! BushCo stiffed the program, as I understand it, to the tune of 12 billion. LOL! I guess for BONO delusional thinking is preferable to wishful thinking.

[fishwax]

77. lol

that was definitely wishful thinking ...

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

19. When Bono writes songs as good as Lennon's he can talk.

A little professional envy?

[PassingFair]

127. Bono is holier than thou, and thou, and thou...

In my opinion, he was slamming the reality based community with that comment.

Bless his little bleeding, holy, sanctified heart....

:sarcasm:

[DemonFighterLives]

21. Bono for all his greatness has not written a song with the kind of

staying power as Lennon's Imagine. He could have said something intelligent without kicking the dead superhero and peace activist.
Bono just took a step down in my books where I was almost going to put him on the shelf with Lennon or near to him.

If Bono had his head right, he would be jumping on the left's bandwagon and driving the haves and have mores from power. It would do more to end strife worlwide than anything else.

As another poster stated Cindy Sheehan would have been a better choice.
Maybe another expose on some whistleblowers- perhaps Sybil Edmunds.

:donut:

[fishwax]

78. where did he kick the dead superhero?

where did the live superhero and peace activist kick the dead superhero and peace activist?

[DemonFighterLives]

86. I just don't see how Lennon even had to come up

Sorry if I disturbed you!

[fishwax]

96. didn't disturb me ...

I was just curious where Bono bashed Lennon is all. As for why Lennon even had to come up, it seems possible the interviewer brought him up, or it came up in some other way naturally.

But I agree with you about Sheehan. I think Bono is quite pretentious, that his efforts are honorable but not always the most efficient or effective means of instigating change (the same could be said of Lennon), and, finally, that awarding him person of the year is a bit of a joke.

:)

[DemonFighterLives]

130. I like Bono and U2 plenty

I haven't read the article, but have felt a little funny with Bono flying around with O'Neil was it? Then seeing him photo op with dubby. I really don't see where he has called dub out on the war in Iraq (maybe I missed it).
He seems to close and comfy with the righties from my opinion.

[leveymg]

23. I wonder, then, what Bono's favorite Lennon song is?

From his Balcony on Central Park West, could Bono possibly have the lyrics to Revolution going through his head? Stranger things have happened.

You say you want a revolution
Well, you know
We all want to change the world
You tell me that it's evolution
Well, you know
We all want to change the world
But when you talk about destruction
Don't you know that you can count me out?

Don't you know it's gonna be
Alright?
Alright?
Alright?

You say you've got a real solution
Well, you know
We'd all love to see the plan
You ask me for a contribution
Well, you know
We are doing what we can
But if you want money for people with minds that hate
All I can tell is, brother, you'll have to wait

Don't you know it's gonna be
Alright?
Alright?
Alright?

You say you'll change the constitution
Well, you know
We all want to change your head
You tell me it's the institution
Well, you know
You'd better free your mind instead
But if you go carrying pictures of Chairman Mao
You ain't gonna make it with anyone anyhow

Don't you know it's gonna be
Alright?
Alright?
Alright?
Alright?
Alright?
Alright?

[Adenoid_Hynkel]

116. I believe it's 'instant karma'

if memory serves me correctly

[Adenoid_Hynkel]

117. .

.

[H2O Man]

24. Almost all of the world's problems

can be traced directly to that darned John Lennon."Imagine this" and "imagine that." Married Yoko Only. Selfish prick, he! I say most of the problems that started before Ringo started the Beatles can be traced to John, too!

[The Stranger]

25. Bono and his pathetic, untalented band have always envied the Beatles.

What other mindless drivel would you expect from a self-promoting millionaire faux activist?

[KG]

26. ' Imagine there's no Bono...

it's easy if you try.....'

[Binka]

58. Snarf! Brilliant!

Peyton & I say Happy Holidays!

[KG]

83. cute kid!

and her mom is a hottie! :hi:

[lukasahero]

66. Sounds a lot like the bumper sticker

"Visualize - no liberals".

What the hell has gotten into this place? This guy is doing more to bring awareness AND money AND resources AND aid to those in this world who really need it than ANYONE here and yet we're joking about imagining him gone because he criticized a John Lennon song? John Lennon would be appalled.

Edited to fix bumper sticker.

[Vinnie From Indy]

100. I, for one, would ask what in the world he would hope to gain by slamming

Lennon.

[lukasahero]

135. And I would ask how saying "Imagine" wasn't his favorite song

is slamming John Lennon? His comment reflected on what people have made of the song, not the spirit in which it was written.

[Adenoid_Hynkel]

119. considering U2 did a huge tribute to lennon at their dec 8th show...

i think people here are ignorant to act like this is an attack on the beatles.

[MakeItSo]

97. At least John had two names, a first and last

Can you "imagine" going through your life known only by a silly nickname that sounds like slang for an erection?

[Wickerman]

28. I admire many of the political things Bono has done

but he can't hold Lennon's er, inkwell, when it comes to songwriting. Hopefully he is just using this moment to get people to actually consider the words. But, again, wishful thinking is better, and more of a tool to get people thinking than no thinking at all - and God knows there is enough of that in Bono's body of work.

[Neil Lisst]

32. I like him, too, but he can't hold Jim Morrison's inkwell, either.

Early morning, April 4 ...

was great, though, and I give him his props for that. But to bag on IMAGINE? I've got a weeeee proposal for him.

[H2O Man]

40. True.

I think the best song Bono did was "God PartII," which is a pretty nice imitation of the Plastic Ono Band. (Likewise, Paul McCartney's best post-Beatle song was "Let Me Roll It," another Plastic Ono Band tribute.) But a Plastic Bono Band seems rather unoriginal, and Bono, like U2, doesn't rank with the greatest rockers.

[Adenoid_Hynkel]

120. God Part II was a response to albert goldman's lennon-bashing book

that came out around the time

[AntiCoup2K4]

122. God Part II was actually written in DEFENSE of John Lennon...

When a right wing PIG named Albert Goldman wrote a piece of shit "biography" about John.

Don’t believe the devil
I don’t believe his book
But the truth is not the same
Without the lies he made up

<snip>

Don’t believe in goldman
His type like a curse
Instant karma’s going to get him
If I don’t get him first
Don’t believe in rock ’n roll
Can really change the world
As it spins in revolution, spirals and turns
I...i believe in love

<snip>

Yeah, sure he's bashing John Lennon :eyes:

However, he does add.....

Don’t believe in the 60’s,
The golden age of pop
You glorify the past
When the future dries up

Here he's saying essentially what he said in the article above. Sure they were great songs with great lyrics, and they represent some great values (at least in some cases, like Lennon, Dylan, etc.)

But listening to songs isn't going to change the fucking world. Taking Action is what's going to change the world. And nobody in their right mind could accuse Bono of not taking action.

[H2O Man]

131. No kidding.

Read closer: I did not say that song was trashing John. I said it was a Plastic Ono Band tribute. Hence, your post is nonsense.

Listening to music has the ability to change the listener's world, by the way .... just as reading a good book, or listening to a good speech. Perhaps you are too busy to notice.

[Zomby Woof]

102. And Bono was in error there

MLK was shot in the LATE AFTERNOON. Not "early morning". Poetic license is no excuse to foster historical ignorance.

[MadHound]

30. Funny, coming from a man who couldn't fill Lennon's shoes,

Either musically or in his activist work. Where is Bono during this illegal, immoral war? Out in the streets with the protesters? Composing anti-war anthems? Using his celebrity status to try and bring the fighting to an end? No, that's right, Bono is hobnobbing with Bush, Helms and other RWers:eyes:

And quite frankly Bono sold his soul for the almighty dollar after U2's albumn "Boy". Sorry Bono, but your opinion is just so much crap.

[vi5]

41. Either that.....

or he thinks people dying all over the world of starvation, poverty, and disease is just as important an issue to raise awareness of and protest and fight against. Just because the issue he feels strongest about isn't the exact one that you, I or anyone else on here feels is the most important doesn't make his work any less noble. And the fact that people feel the need to bitch about and insult a guy who has done a lot of good work just because Imagine isn't his favorite John Lennon song is.....well, it's a bit sad. I could see if he said Lennon sucked or insulted the guy himself. But all of the reactions on this thread because he said a particular song was his least favorite? HOnestly.

[MadHound]

52. Sorry, but Bono lost me long ago

Like I said upthread, I think that Bono and U2 sold out after "Boy". And while yes, he has done some admirable charity work in his time, when he starts hobnobbing with the rich and the Neo-Cons, that is a huge mistake in my book. His meetings with Bushco simply gives cover to their miserliness and other illegal, immoral activities, especiall when he praises them with words such as “Bush in his second term is as bold in his commitments to Africa as he was in the first term, he indeed deserves a place in history in turning the fate of that continent around.” Sorry, but Lennon wouldn't be taking lunch with a gang of thugs and murderers that started an illegal, immoral war, all in the cause of oil and empire, he wouldn't sell his soul out in that manner. Sadly, Bono has.

And to be ripping on anybody's music, not based on the music itself, but people's reaction to it is just childish and wrong. Where was he during the early seventies when "Imagine" and other Lennon songs were the anathems of the anti-war movement? No, these comments come off more as sour grapes than anything else.

[NashVegas]

113. What Exactly Do You Mean

When you say they sold out after Boy? In what way? For accepting fame? For going on to make other good albums that gained mass appeal?

[MadHound]

133. On Boy, U2 was out ahead of the pack, making hip, smart songs

That entertained a person on a number of distinct levels, intellecually, emotionally, musically, etc. This led to their initial big success, because it wasn't formulaic crap of the day. But starting with October, and especially War, you could hear more and more pop pabulum creeping into their music, the same old formulaic crap that all of the other bands were churning out. By the early ninties with Joshua Tree, the transformation was complete, and they were nothing but another top forty band churning out the hits.

Also as time went by they became much more full of themselves, especially Bono. At first they were simply another working class band. But now they almost demand that you bow down before the almighty Bono and his back up band U2. Ptahh! This at a time when cutting edge bands like the Talking Heads were still, in many ways, out there on the bleeding edge, and weren't so full of themselves.

U2 had the potential to be a truly out of the normal, exhuding greatness band. This potential comes through in their first album, and on selected tracks on the next few albums. But as you progress through the years, you can hear where the money comes in and starts to corrupt them, as they put out ever more formulaic pop pabulum for the masses. And here they are now, selling I-pods and hobnobbing with members of the corrupt and bloody administration that we have. Somehow, I think deep down within their souls, the musicians that they were are aghast in horror at the suck ups to evil that they have become. Now that they've gotten the lucre they craved, perhaps they will allow their conscience to emerge again, and show us the band that U2 could have been if they hadn't been seduced by the dark side of rock and roll, and sold their souls for the filthy cash.

[NashVegas]

136. Oh Boy (no pun intended)

You're reminding me of an old Mad Magazine cartoon involving a guy who was into a band called The Esoterics.

'nuff said.

[The Stranger]

60. Everyone is against starvation and poverty -- that is an easy one.

Now you protest the illegal worldwide war being waged (like Cindy Sheehan, who comes to mind) to the people Bono hobnobs with and you will show me some real guts, true activism and unquestioned principles.

Otherwise, he and his mediocre band is better off flying around to their concerts in their corporate lear jets.

[NorthELiberal]

103. "Just because the issue he feels strongest.........

......... about isn't the exact one that you, I or anyone else on here feels is the most important doesn't make his work any less noble."

I agree. Not everyone can be on the forefront of every issue. In the end there are only 24 hours in a day (part of it spent sleeping). Can't expect everyone to do everything.

[The Stranger]

59. Touche.

Well struck.

[bullwinkle428]

31. Don't people have to take the time to think about things before

they feel sufficiently motivated to act upon the feelings that were generated?

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

34. Well it has been 30 years and all

:D

[bullwinkle428]

115. I guess I was thinking in terms of younger people just hearing "Imagine"

for the first time...not so much old farts like me who've been hearing the song for years and still fall victim to too many bouts of apathy...

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

128. and I was just being a smartass

[fishwax]

79. it would appear not ...

knee jerk reactions make for a much better message board experience :)

[Inland]

36. It's a perfect storm of dogma.....

Socialist website meets pop music taste.

Something for everyone to sling shit over.

[DanCa]

46. I love the song Imagine but i think the meanning is generaly mistaken.

John Lennon says - imagine- in the sense that something may or not come to pass. I dont think at least imo that he was saying god didn't exist that he was saying imagine if we could put aside our differences about religion and not have heaven or hell become wedge issues. How can this man write such a beautiful song as as merry christmas (the war is over) in one breathe and imagine in the next if he were openly hostile to existence of a higher power?. Of course this is just my interpetation and people are free to interpet songs any way they wish. Look at how badly people have interpeted "Born in the USA" as a nationlism song and not as a protest song for instance.
I will say this about John Lennon he was an incredible man of peace, and love no matter what his religous affilation was. I can't say enough good things about him and he has truly written some of the most beautiful and songs in all of history.

[Terran]

48. That's an awfully strange way to look at a work of art...

Other people misinterpret its meaning, so you don't like it yourself, for that reason. That's very shallow, at best. "Imagine" has nothing to do with passivity--it's just the opposite, in fact. Activism starts with imagination, and the courage to see new possibilities in the world.

[maxsolomon]

51. Aren't the lyrics based in Buddhism?

No posessions
No God
No Hell
No Heaven

correct me if i'm wrong (and i'm sure someone here can), but strictly speaking, Buddhism is A-theist, without a God.

[i_c_a_White_Ghost]

53. I believe that's correct

John didn't really believe in "organized" religon

[The-Cynic]

55. He said that once in an interview

I found that statement odd, but I've heard him say he based it loosely on some of his thoughts and dreams from.....its on a special cd I picked up at the library.

[OneBlueSky]

56. "Imagine" is a GREAT song because . . .

what Lennon was trying to do was to get people to THINK! . . . something that the vast majority of Americans, at least, seem to try their damnedest not to do on a daily basis . . .

[blogslut]

61. I dig them both

My favorite U2 song: Bad

My favorite John Lennon song: God

I don't care to put anybody on a pedestal. They're songs and one either digs them or they don't.

[hiaasenrocks]

65. I like some of U2's music....

mostly for nostalgia reasons, having grown up in the 1980s.

But I often get sick of Bono's attitude. He does appear at times to be showboating his activism.

The article notes that he has been known to "spend several thousand dollars at a restaurant for a nice Pinot Noir." That's his right. It's his money. But as long as he is spending thousands of dollars on wine in a single sitting, his call for activism (asking other people and organizations for money) ring awfully hollow, in my opinion.

So fuck him.

[johnnie]

68. The only thing wrong with "Imagine" is..

There's no line:
"Imagine there's no Bono"

The lyrics to the song are very simple and it seems that pseudo-intellects, like Bono over-think them.

" Imagine there's no heaven,
It's easy if you try,
No hell below us,
Above us only sky,
Imagine all the people
living for today."

The concept of a heaven and hell has cause quite a lot of bullshit. It's about religions teaching that if you follow what they say you will go to heaven if you follow another you will burn in hell. I'm sure anyone could come up with examples on how religion has caused problems.

" Imagine there's no countries,
It isnt hard to do,
Nothing to kill or die for,
No religion too,
Imagine all the people
living life in peace."

Pretty simple lyrics if you ask me.

" Imagine no possessions,
I wonder if you can,
No need for greed or hunger,
A brotherhood of man,
Imagine all the people
Sharing all the world."

Of course we all have some sort of possessions, but the need to have more than other people can be a problem. Stabbing people in the back to get more stuff is not a good thing.

I think most people freak out about the song because of the heaven and hell line. In my opinion, if the people who believe in this concept gets nervous over that line, they have a problem with their own faith and Lennon's lyrics shakes their own faith.

"Imagine" is a very simple set of lyrics that asks the listener to Imagine being able to live in a peaceful world. Bono just fancies himself as some intelligent guy, but he obviously doesn't even get a simple message.

[rene moon]

69. Uh, he was talking about how people have lost the meaning of the song

Did any on this board even read the TIME article? Sheesh, read it before you judge.

And by the way, I dont like "Imagine" either. I love the Beatles but I am not a big fan of Lennon.

[johnnie]

72. Honestly, I didn't read the whole thing

I really don't care what Bono has to say. My knee-jerk reaction was more toward other people that I have heard that dig on the song than it was with what Bono thought. My bad.

[DS1]

70. Right - The guy who has 2 inch lifts in his shoes hates wishful thinking.

What an asshole.

[orwell]

73. Imagine...

...there's no Bono. And no U2 too.

No records to buy up.

And no pretention too.

Imagine all the rock stars, living in the street.

Uhooooooo

You may sayaaaay I'm a dreamer.
But I'm not the only one.
I hope one dayaaaay you'll join us.
And the worrrrrld will be as one.

[rene moon]

75. Bono has done a lot for the poor in Africa

Which is more than I can say for any other rock stars.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

74. He's Right. And By Saying It The Way He Did He Is Actually Showing A

greater respect for the song.

[fishwax]

76. i don't really like imagine either

but it's far from my least favorite Lennon song ...

[WildEyedLiberal]

80. This is the dumbest thread I've ever seen

First of all, nowhere does Bono insult Lennon's talent as a songwriter. Second of all, the seething resentment present in the article cited in the OP and in various responses to this thread are pretty disgusting. Do people here really think philanthropy is invalid if it is performed by "rich" people? I'd like you all to name me ONE individual - not a group or a country, but ONE individual - who has done as much to raise money and awareness for the plight of the poorest of the poor in Africa as Bono. Go on - since he's a "rich, talentless hack" I'm sure you all have someone better in mind who's done more good than he.

This thread just reeks of knee-jerk pseudocommunistic petty jealousy of the rich, and it's really pathetic. Time, for once, made a good choice - it chose to select people whose actions have brought hope to a continent that the rest of the world has forgotten about. This thread just personifies the distasteful rabid anti-everyone-with-any-money attitude that turns so many people off the left-wing.

[lukasahero]

81. Excellent rant! Thank you! eom

[QC]

82. It sounds like a fangurl AOL chat were someone just dissed

the object of their affections.

Seriously.

And for the record, I don't like "Imagine" either. It always seemed simpleminded and naive to me, like some college sophomore stoners sitting around throwing out what-ifs. And John Lennon seemed a lot less interested in charity than in hanging out in his palatial apartment with that talentless freak hanger-on of his.

[WildEyedLiberal]

84. Well, apparently around here...

... it's far more important to give lip service to liberal ideals (such as peace and justice and eliminating poverty) than it is to actually do anything about them. You can see proof of that in the endless threads that canonize the flavor-of-the-week Democrat who gave a fiery speech about how bad Bush sucks while simultaneously demonizing those liberal Democrats who believe that opposing the Bush agenda takes more than strong language and a few hastily thrown f-bombs.

[QC]

93. We apparently don't like heresy much either.

The reaction to Bono's particular heresy is more or less what one would expect if he walked into a Southern Baptist Church and declared that there is no God.

I've never understood the deification of Lennon, to tell the truth. He's always seemed to me a nice enough man, if pretty damn weird in some ways, and a decent and fairly influential pop songwriter, but nothing more.

[Karmadillo]

98. Pseudocommunistic petty jealousy of the rich?

1. I'm guessing the article is more concerned with inequities that allow a massive concentration of wealth in a few hands while millions starve to death every year. You may be satisfied with this state of affairs, but you should, with an act of imagination, be able to understand others may prefer to attempt to create something more equitable.

2. Rabid anti-everyone-with-any-money is obviously not in the article. If you feel the need to resort to such a ridiculous smear to make your point, maybe you should re-examine the validity of your point.

[NorthELiberal]

104. "This is the dumbest thread I've ever seen"

I am not sure if it is theeeee dumbest....... but it sure comes close. It reminds me of the threads knocking Bill Maher after almost every show over one little thing he said.

[WildEyedLiberal]

114. Yeah I've definitely seen dumber

It's definitely ONE of the dumbest, though. Dumbest thread of today, perhaps. Welcome to DU!

[Borgnine]

85. Obviously Bono has never heard Revolution 9.

And I say that as the biggest Beatles nut in the world.

Imagine is a nice tune. What's wrong with hoping for a better tomorrow? Being a cynical ass is great fun, but how can you get anywhere without setting goals for yourself?

[porphyrian]

87. My least favorite U2 song...

All of them.

I like that Bono has worked to bring attention to the plight of Africa, and had some hand (if only bring attention to it) in stopping the violence in Northern Ireland, though.

[deutsey]

89. Maybe Bono should "steal it back" the way he stole "Helter Skelter"

back from Charles Manson.

:eyes:

My only problem with "Imagine" is that it's been way overplayed.

I prefer Lennon's edgier or funnier stuff, but I don't see where Imagine has been hijacked and made an anthem for wishful thinking.

[warrens]

90. My least favorite Bono song

All of them.

[enigmatic]

91. I understand completely what he's saying

I'm both a U2 and a Beatlemaniac from wayyyy back, and I understand what Bono said completely; the song lyrics (which I still love, though it's Lennon's most overplayed by a mile)has very specific call to action on how the word can be, but has been hijacked by the "ignorance is bliss" crowd to mean a very abstract, passive stream of conciousness set of lyrics that wasn't the point of Lennon's song. Bono's absolutely right about this, and Lennon would have agreed.

Whishful thinking does nothing except in the abstract; doing something to change the status quo is action, no matter how small it is.

[johnnie]

92. But Bono says that it is his least favorite Lennon song because

Other people have made it into "wishful thinking". That is not what the song itself is about and for Bono to go along with other people's interpretation of the song is his own problem. It has nothing to do with what Lennon was saying when he wrote the song.

[enigmatic]

94. It's kinda like "Born In The USA"

Which Reagan tried to make into a conservative anthem when Springsteen's lyrics didn't mean anything of the sort; the song itself is still being hijacked to this day. I can't even listen to that song anymore on the radio, because of the the jingoism that usually is not far behind by brain-dead DJ's..

I don't begrudge Bono for what he said, especially since I've been a Lennon (and Beatles) freak since I was a kid.

[moondust]

95. Why does Bono hate freedom?

It's a Freedom Dream.

Here' another: "I Just Wanna Be Free" by Chicago. I suppose Bono hates that as well.

Be careful what you don't wish for.

[Zomby Woof]

101. I hate to agree with Bono

I LOVE John Lennon, but 'Imagine' was always one of my least favorites, not so much because of the "wishful thinking" idealism it promoted, but because Lennon had loads of possessions and a trail of litigation to match. It reeks a bit of hypocrisy.

I am not a fan of "don't do as I do, do as I say". As gifted as Lennon was, and as much as I love his music, that song, although possessing one of his great trademark melodies, is a wash lyrically.

[mmonk]

106. I like the idea of nothing to kill or die for.

No imagination = no ideas = no solutions. Imagine is a work of art.

[hopeisaplace]

123. I completely agree with you

imagination is where the unreachable begins. If we
don't paint the picture in song or art, then how will
the ideas flourish? Love what you said, thanks. I agree
completely with you.

It sounds like Bono was saying something like he prefers
action, results, doers to just wishing something or dreaming
that something better could happen. I get that too. Someone
like Bono, who has worked and seen first hand the struggles
we face on this planet, probably "imagines more people actually
working towards the cause". He definitely sounds like a results
driven individual. Having said that.. hope must always be a place..
lol :)

edit: spelling/grammer

[Scurrilous]

107. George Harrison on U2:

"Look at a group like U2. Bono and his band are so egocentric - the more you jump around, the bigger your hat is, the more people listen to your music.

The only important thing is to sell and make money. It's nothing to do with talent. Today there are groups who sell lots of records and then disappear. Will we remember U2 in 30 years? Or the Spice Girls? I doubt it."

[bloom]

108. I like U2 and I think it was a stupid thing to say. n/t

[tlsmith1963]

109. I'm Disappointed With Bono

Because he calls people like Bush & Jesse Helms his friends. What the Hell? Why would he want to be friends with the likes of them? It doesn't make sense, considering Bono's politics.

Tammy

[Fenris]

110. I don't like "Imagine," but for reasons other than Bono's

I think the lyrics are too simplistic. There's no depth to the words...the audience doesn't have to really work for the meaning.

[Cha]

111. That's just great, bono, that

"Imagine" is your least favorite John Lennon song..have a fucking happy "Time person of the year".

[Adenoid_Hynkel]

121. CALM THE FUCK DOWN, PEOPLE! you're totally twisting what he said

what is this -- faux news all of the sudden? you can have a 'least favorite' of something and not be slamming it.

bono isn't bashing lennon by any means. it's not even really a slam of 'imagine' --moreso the reaction to it.

he's a huge fan i just saw u2 in concert the other night and they paid tribute to lennon in the closer by playing 'instant karma' and 'happy xmas'

i've never really understood the knee-jerk hatred of U2 on this site.

[bud E. holly]

125. "not a slam of 'imagine' --moreso the reaction to it"

I agree. Bono could have chosen his words better to make his point less twistable. Yet, both he and Lennon would be more pleased to see their words and music stir up some kind of passionate discussion rather than unquestioning worship. Every time I hear someone say they dislike the Beatles collectively or Lennon individually, my first reaction is amazement and to get a little fired up. Same for U2, as I think they are one of the few working bands from that era that are still relevant and haven't devolved into an "oldies act" yet. The good news is, at least you can still get people fired up by stating an opinion about these guys. The worst thing that can happen to an artist is apathy. Especially rock n roll. If EVERYBODY thinks you're great, you're not doing something right. An artist with universal appeal is watering down the product too much.
Just my opinion.......

[bud E. holly]

129. And I'm really just talking about their music, ya know

Attacking them as people because they are less than perfect human beings and full of contradictions, well........I don't know any of you personally, but I'd say you're on shaky ground right away.:)

[Synnical]

124. Time names super-rich trio as 2005 “Persons of the Year"

This needs to be repeated and repeated again and again.

SUPER RICH

[rucky]

126. KissKissKiss Kissmenow. Just One kisskiss will do. n/t

[Vinca]

132. You know who my least favorite rock star is? Bono. nt

[Guaranteed]

134. I used to HATE "Imagine."

But it grew on me. It's a beautiful idea.

"A brotherhood of man."

It's hard to argue with that.