I'm finding it hard to go to chorus this semester. Some advice?

[Ladyhawk]

In fact, I haven't gone at all. I could still probably join, but I'm having a really hard time forcing myself into that room.

You see, a year ago, the director (who was a close friend at the time) broke a promise to me. I am an atheist. He is a fundamentalist Christian. We had agreed to disagree on the topic of religion.

He wrote, "Regarding the Christian thing, of course I will not force the issue with you. If you are uncomfortable bringing it up because of past experiences and baggage, I would be heartless to bring it up."

Last October he let me have it, rapid-firing questions at me. I learned he didn't believe in evolution, that Jesus was the only way...blah blah blah. Really, he didn't have to tell me all that shit. I was brainwashed at home, school and church for the first 18 years of my life.

Since then, I've put the close friendship on hold and settled for an acquaintanceship so I could still take chorus and voice. I was planning on doing the same thing this semester, but something came up.

I was over at his house, fixing / setting up computers when I saw a "Viva Bush" bumpersticker lying on his counter. On the television was a documentary about Adolf Hitler. The director's wife sat on the couch making little "concerned outrage" noises. Inside, I lost it. We're being led down the same merry fascist path by this...this pile of human excrement, Mr. "Viva Bush." These people believe in a personal imaginary friend and that this personal imaginary friend appointed George W. Bush.

What the hell was I doing there????

Chorus was the next day. I couldn't go. Another rehearsal two weeks later. I couldn't go. Tonight is probably my last chance and I find myself feeling sick. I want my music, but I don't know if I can stand to look at that man's face for two and a half hours.

Has the end of this "friendship" come?

Where can I find another musical outlet? Without music, I tend to lose it.

[sui generis]

1. Your chorus director stepped over the line

However, you need to speak your mind and tell him voluntarily that you are not comfortable around him because he can't seem to keep his religious convictions from overriding the joy of voice and chorus for you. Tell him he's made you miserable and has caused you to have to rethink your friendship with him.

Then go find a different chorus! Maybe something not related to school. If you love to sing, I am sure you will be able to find people to sing with - plus this gives you the chance to accumulate more experience with different musicians.

I am certain if you look you can find or else organize your own voice group.

[madrchsod]

2. depends what ya want to sing

church music? go to some churchs and check them out..back up or lead for a band? community chorus?..i can`t imagine anyone who can sing couldn`t find someone who needs another voice..

[Ladyhawk]

8. No church music, thank you. :)

When it comes to choral music, I especially like Baroque, Renaissance and Classical.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

10. Well, most Baroque, Renaissance, and Classical choral music

IS church music.

Look around for a Unitarian Church if a religious atmosphere bothers you. They often have excellent choirs that sing music from a variety of traditions.

[Ladyhawk]

11. When I think of church music, I think of hymns and those

stupid "praise" songs. Baroque, Renaissance and Classical = real music.

[Cheswick2.0]

13. but most of that music is religious

Is this a class you need for credit? If not, I don't blame you for not going back. He did indeed cross a line in your friendship. He was disrespectful about your beliefs and he put you on the spot.
However you seem to be as disrespectful of his. :shrug: It's too bad that you can't work it out, but that is not always possible.
Go find another chorus but unless you find an opera chorus you will be singing religious music. It's what the great composers wrote.

[Ladyhawk]

15. For everyone reading this thread: I don't have a problem with the music.

I may not like this man's views, but I don't go out of my way to disrespect them like he did to me.

[Cheswick2.0]

18. You didn't disrespect him to his face. I will give you that.

But the following comment isn't exactly respectful:

These people believe in a personal imaginary friend and that this personal imaginary friend appointed George W. Bush

They may or may not believe that God appointed bush...but what is with the personal imaginary friend stuff? If that is not disrespect I don't know what is.

You were the one who said you didn't like church music.

I am sorry your director did what he did. Unless you are going to a religious university (and I can't imagine why you would) his actions are something you should be able to complain to the college about. They don't want instructors chasing aways students. Then if you stick with only class time and do not go to his home or see him socially you should have nothing to fear.

[politicat]

3. Find another place.

If the wifey-poo can't keep her comments to herself, and he can't keep his to himself, then its time for you to go on.

If you're in California, there's a group called Voices of Reason that's a secular choir.... You might want to start something like that if you have the option.

Check the community college, the parks and rec department and the unitarian church. All three tend to have community, secular choirs.

Good luck...

Pcat

[Ladyhawk]

4. Where is this "Voices of Reason"?

I'm in California, up in the foothills area.

The red zone is for Bushies and Bushies only...there is no Kerrying in a red zone...Don't tell me which zone is for Bushies and which is for Kerries...I know what this is about...you want me to have an abortion...

Sorry, I got caught up in old lines from Airplane!.

[politicat]

6. Voices of Reason is a secular Choir based out of CFI west

http://www.cfiwest.org/groups/voicesofreason.htm

The CFI West is in Hollywood.

http://voicesofreason.com/

From the site:

Do you like to sing?  

The Voices of Reason is a community a cappella group sponsored jointly by the Center for Inquiry-West and Atheists United.  The group embraces a spectrum of world views, and experiments  seeking a harmony of philosophies.  All are welcome.


Rehearsals are from 6:30 to 9:00 p.m. the second and fourth Sundays of every month at the Center for Inquiry-West.  Visit them on the World Wide Web at http://voicesofreason.com. 

Schedules do change, so contact them for updates and more information.

Their director died not long ago, so you really do want to contact.

Pcat

[Ladyhawk]

7. Alas, it's way too south for me, anyway. :)

Thanks for the info. I actually contacted the director and asked him if there was a community chorus in the next county over. Most likely there is one in the valley. It would mean over two hours of driving a week, but it might be worth it.

[Name removed]

5. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Ladyhawk]

9. I probably should clarify...

...that the director and I have already tried to hash this out. He apologized about the proselytization attempt, helped me with some heavy things (I have herniated discs), but part of his apology cautioned that he might do it again. I haven't been particularly thrilled with the prospect of friendship since then. From my perspective, he broke the trust. He broke the friendship.

Yet, because a proselytizing fundamentalist is never wrong, he will never admit his wrongdoing...at least not in a way that is meaningful to me.

I am beginning to think that fundamentalists and ex-fundamentalists cannot be friends. Period. (At least not in BushAmerica.)

[ironflange]

12. Atheist here, but I have no problem with singing sacred music

You don't have to believe to enjoy it, it's like an actor playing a role. I was in a choir once, learning Verdi's Requiem, and the Dies Irae was a little drab one night. The choir director said, "I don't care if you don't believe this stuff, just try to sound like you do."

Don't cut all sacred music out because of this asshole. Like the man said, you don't have to believe it to still enjoy it. To make an analogy, I love the Godfather I & II (III sucks), but that doesn't mean I'm in favor of organized crime.

[Ladyhawk]

14. It's not the music that is bothering me. :)

I prefer sacred Renaissance, Baroque and Classical. I don't like hymns and praise songs, probably because those are the ones I associate with my long brainwashing.

[ironflange]

16. Oh, sorry

Yeah, those pieces mostly suck.

[politicat]

17. Am I reading this right? Given a choice between Messiah and Jesus wants

me for a Sunbeam, Messiah wins hands down... (does for me, too. I don't mind religious classical music, though I'm as atheist as they come.)

The issue isn't the music... it's the director. Yes?

Pcat

Edited: There may be someone in your area willing to carpool... CFI west draws from as far away as Ventura and Ojai.

Which city are you in? (I lived in Ventura and Thousand Oaks for a few years....)

Pcat

[Ladyhawk]

19. It's not the music; it's the director.

How do I put this? We were friends and I feel betrayed. He promised not to proselytize me and chose to, anyway. Learning about his support for * made my stomach crawl. He's a bushbot. I can't help but feel he is dangerous. It's been a year and I've tried very hard to forgive and forget. I can forgive, but I can't forget. Even he said he might try to convert me again.

You have to understand that I am an ex-fundamentalist. I have gone through excruciating pain to leave that warped religion behind. Having someone in my life constantly bringing it up is NOT OK with me. From his own admission, he may go fundy on me at any moment.

For awhile he was a close friend, then he crossed a line. He will not say, "I'm sorry and I won't do it again." What he said was, "I'm sorry, but this is the way I am and I might do it again." That is NOT OK with me.

I'm more sad than angry. I tried to work it out, but because he's "right," anything I have to say is discarded. He has all the answers, so he never needs to listen. Have you ever really known a fundy? If so, you know that they cannot be reasoned with if they think god is on their side.

I missed chorus again tonight. I cried for a long time.

[politicat]

20. That's not okay. Friendship - the real stuff - means remembering cues and

and triggers. Real friends don't bring up painful subjects knowing they're painful.



Pcat