Six month checkup: Is anyone still planning to leave the US

[bluestateguy]

DU was host to many threads in the weeks after the last election on the subject of leaving the country. Those threads seem to have disappeared. I am curious to know if anyone here is still in the process of planning to leave the United States. To relocate to another country is a big chore, one that can take several months or a couple of years, but I was curious to know if this was still an option for any of you (or maybe you've already taken it). I suspected that many, though not all, of the people who, in November, said they would do it were just blowing smoke and that they would gingerly back away from the idea in the following months.

[radwriter0555]

1. Yes, of course. I put my house on the market last week, and as of today

have a full priced offer in the lucrative Los Angeles real estate market.

I've sent off my child's documents to enroll her in the school in Valbonne, France, and coincidentally am marrying my frenchman on Thursday and we will receive the benefits of French citizenship.

He will stay here for the time being while I open our business in Sophia Antipolis.

I'm a woman of my word. We leave in June.

[OldLeftieLawyer]

3. Best of luck to you!!!

And to your Frenchman, the lucky fellow!!

Bravissima!

[radwriter0555]

8. merci! and, he's got a TITLE. I get to be a Countess. That just might be

my favorite part.... aside from the 100%+ profit on a house I bought 2 years ago.

So, please, henceforth, address me as Madame la Comtesse Radwriter0555, okay? :)
:grins:

[OldLeftieLawyer]

14. Como no, Madame la Comtesse...........

Sounds just about perfect. The profit's just icing on the cake...

:toast:

[radwriter0555]

17. You'll have to stop around for tea, of course. Us old liberals can grouse

about the days we knew when.

[OldLeftieLawyer]

18. If you're ever in the Martimes,

do drop by for some sherry, a langue du chat or twelve, and, of course, the TV on to C-Span, so that we'll have something at which to scream.........

[OldLeftieLawyer]

2. We bought a house on Prince Edward Island

We're financially secure, and we could be out of here in a matter of hours, if we so decided.

I'm not sure what it would take to make us leave the land of our birth, but, just in case, it's a very nice house in a very nice place in Canada.

[smirkymonkey]

4. I am working on Dual Citizenship - US/Italy

I have everything except my grandfathers birth certificate from Italy and will be getting that as soon as I can afford it (I'm out of work - due to the booming economy here).

I probably wouldn't live in Italy, even though I find the country a wonderful tourist destination. I would live somewhere else in the EU, probably one of the English speaking countries as neither my German or French is good enough to get a real job in those countries.

Also, when I get a job I am going to take Italian lessons just in case. I might just end up living in some little peasant village like my ancestors after all.

[Kat45]

51. How do you get US/Italy dual citizenship?

What do you need? (I'm Italian-America, and you've piqued my curiousity.)

[smirkymonkey]

54. I went to the Italian Consulate website in NY and looked up

the requirements. Basically, if your father, mother, grandfather or grandmother was born in Italy, you can qualify but there are certain restrictions.

My father was born here, but my grandfather was born in Italy. However - my grandfather was not naturalized until AFTER my father was born and my father never FORMALLY renounced Italian citizenship.

You need birth certificates, marriage certificates, death certificates (if applicable) and naturalization cert. (also, if applicable.) It can be a little pricey to get certificates from Italy (about $100) but I have found everthing through family here with the exception of my grandfathers birth certificate.

Good Luck!

[Kat45]

56. I think my mother has my grandmother's birth certificate from Italy

But since my mother's the youngest in her family, I wouldn't be surprised if her mother had been naturalized long before she was born. I'm assuming you're saying that's one of the requirements?

[smirkymonkey]

57. Yes, the grandparent must still be an Italian citizen at the time

of your parent's birth. You still might want to make sure though. My grandfather wasn't naturalized until after all his children were born. Good luck!

[ofrfxsk]

5. I stated several times that I wasn't going anywhere.

Change comes from within and I love this country too much to leave.

[radwriter0555]

6. yeah, that's what the germans under hitler said too.

I don't want to end up like them or the victims of hitler... and soon, bush.

[ofrfxsk]

12. I don't know what you are trying to imply.

My mother is a first generation American. My father is third. They have worked hard to get what they have and I value everything this country has given us in return.
I firmly believe in MY right to protest, write letters and speak freely about what disturbs me and I will not give that up because some shithead is in power for another 3 years. If you are that weak and feel the need to escape reality to live in comfort where no one will challenge you, then be my guest.
I want my country back. To give in is nothing more than cowering in a cave.

Edit: typos

[radwriter0555]

15. Protesting and writing letters did nothing for the victims of hitler, whom

bush is emulating.

As I said, it will take NATO in the streets of Washington DC to bring down the bush regime in about 12 years.

Nothing implied here, just a straightforward prediction.

[Zhade]

16. It's awesome you believe in your rights.

Too bad this government doesn't, and one day soon you may not have a choice.

[ofrfxsk]

20. So, leaving the country is your only solution?

You and radwriter give them too much power by laying down. I don't talk about it much but I "do" about it. Maybe you should too.
And don't imply that I'm a '30's German Nazi propagandized robot again. You don't know a thing about me.

[Zhade]

34. Couple things...

"I don't talk about it much but I "do" about it. Maybe you should too."

You have NO idea what I do, and I don't answer to you.

"And don't imply that I'm a '30's German Nazi propagandized robot again. You don't know a thing about me."

Considering I never even said that about you, this reveals that you know so little about ME that you can't even tell what I've said to you.

Get your own house in order before barking at others, please. Thanks.

[radwriter0555]

45. My point is that as a vocal dissident I will one of the first to be picked

off by the nazis in power.

I am not sticking around for the lists and the camps and the gulags and the fake terror attacks and the failing economy and the falling dollar and the horrible schools and the cancer and the pollution and the rednecks and the racists and the freepers.

I'm going to where I'm WELCOME and where my quality of life is assured, not where I'm in peril every single day.

[ScreamingMeemie]

39. oops

wrong spot.

[ForrestGump]

23. I already replied to your post

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=105&topic_id=1933615

Sendng you a very hearty one right now...

[ofrfxsk]

26. Good grief

I'm a freeper. :eyes:

[ForrestGump]

28. If the descriptor's fit

You must be a sh**

(in memory of Johnny Cochrane)

Freeper? I don't recall calling anyone a Freeper then or now. Plenty of f***wits on our side, too, you know.

[ofrfxsk]

31. Hey Forrest. I've been around a long time in the demo party.

I'm no freeper. Believe it or don't.

[ForrestGump]

32. No worries.

Never said you are, did not intend to even hint that you are, and -- in all honesty -- it never once entered my mind that you might be one.

[Zhade]

41. AWESOME post.

You have my respect.

[Seabiscuit]

37. I for one am not leaving, but I would be the last person on the planet to

condemn anyone who chose to leave because this country no longer resembles the one they grew up in by rudely saying they're "cowering in a cave". Bush's policies haven't affected me personally enough yet, but if and when they do I would most definitely consider leaving Jeezusland.

[bluestateguy]

7. TO ALL OF YOU WHO LEAVE: KEEP UP YOUR US VOTER REGISRATION

We need every vote we can get. Who wins American elections has implications for the whole world. It's not too much to ask for your absentee vote every 2 years.

[Mr. Flibble]

9. That's like US corporations moving themselves offshore to shelter their $.

Unethical. Then again, that's allowed too. And it's obvious that playing fair is only an issue taught to children and NOT a maxim for adults to live by.

[radwriter0555]

10. ah, so the germans who fled germany under hitler's occupation were

unethical?

No, we're saving our own lives... it will take NATO in the streets of Washington DC to unseat the bush regime, in about 12 or more years. I don't want to stick around for the mayhem and destruction in between.

[Bridget Burke]

43. Some of us don't have the extra cash....

Or a nobly born suitor to whisk us out of the country.

I don't blame anyone for leaving--for whatever reason. But not everybody has your advantages.

[bluestateguy]

11. In theory you're right

In theory Communism works out just fine. In theory.

Anyway, the way I see it many white conservatives see it as their duty to pump out as many kids as possible so as to make more and more Republicans. That's what were competing with--the vending machine Right.

[miss_kitty]

46. nice sock puppet,

HT...

:P

[Zhade]

13. Yes, but circumstances have worsened and made it harder.

I can get into Canada as a skilled worker, but I want to bring my two friends. One is my roomie, and she lost her job, so money supply crashed hard.

I don't know what to do about my son - his mom (my ex-wife) is a fundie, and as far as I know she's not anti-b*s*, so he can't come with me. He's six, and he's going to grow up in this insane country.

Damn, now I'm all depressed. Maybe I can't leave after all...how can I leave him behind? How can I stay?

[OldLeftieLawyer]

19. You can't leave

He's your first responsibility. Stay, and make it better for him.

Our kids are grown. I wouldn't be thinking of leaving if they were little.

[Zhade]

33. Sadly, he's not in my care, or even close.

I'd only be able to really take care of him if I moved back to Virginia, which I can't do (no savings, no jobs out there that I can live on, no friends or family to stay with).

The situation sucks either way. And I don't think I can be a good father, even from afar, if I'm in prison, Less so if I'm dead.

For now, I'm still planning on leaving when it gets bad enough here, because I am the type who WILL be rounded up if it gets a lot worse.

[I7G0D]

47. Do whatever

you have to do (legally) to help take care of your kid. He should come first, not leaving him behind.

[Zhade]

52. Obviously.

NT!

[mtnsnake]

21. One thing we're not doing is vacationing in Florida this year

Screw Jeb Bush. We're going to Mexico! Yup, my wife and I saved up and we're going to visit Mexico next week for our vacation.

As far as leaving the country for good, we'd do it in a heartbeat if it were at all feasible for us. Canada would be our first choice, since we often go there anyway, with our close proximity to in northern NY.

[Goathead]

22. Working on dual citizenship too (U.S. / Ireland)

Looking into moving to Europe, Central America or possibly Argentina. I've had it with peoples attitudes in this country, this nation no longer represents my own values. As stated by another poster it doesn't look like the Bushies/Neocons will be unseated except by force.

[Radio_Lady]

24. We headed to Seattle, then out of the country to Vancouver, B.C.

Just a pleasure trip, not permanent.

It might be nice to live in Canada, possibly Victoria (where there is NO SMOKING ANYWHERE), but we couldn't consider it because medical care would not be available to us. Also, all of our grandchildren would be far away.

[shesemsmom]

25. It depends on the draft situation

planning on getting pass ports as soon as we can afford them

[Scout1071]

27. I'll soon be off to vacation in Cancun, does that count?

[BikeWriter]

29. I have a standing offer from a Canadian First Nations Lady...

...to move there and marry her. She and I were as close as either end of an IM could make us for five years, plus she says they have subsistence hunting. If we require a moose, fish, or whatever we go and fill the larder. The offer is very tempting. Moose gumbo, jambalaya, or ettoufee anyone?

[MrSandman]

30. About four months since the new Gov took office...

And I am ready to move out of state. I wasn't planning to move before.


Does that count?

[Withywindle]

35. Nope. staying and fighting - for now

I admit I blew some smoke. :smoke:


That said, the SO and I each have a parent with foreign citizenship, and got the families on the case looking into things....just in case, y'know.

[fudge stripe cookays]

36. Yep.

We're still trying to get our bills in order, but that may be happening a bit sooner than I thought. As soon as I know for sure, we'll apply, and in 15 months we'll be able to get out.

Fortunately, I'm married to a Canadian, so I have a little extra help.
FSC

[uppityperson]

38. Still staying but thinking more of leaving

Some of my ancestors moved to USA in the early 1900s to get out of German political situation. Some moved here earlier due to economic situations in other countries. I've always said I'm staying and fighting on, but have been considering moving away more and more.

[ScreamingMeemie]

40. I never said I would...and I'm still not.

:hi: It's my country too.

[SophieZ]

42. It's our country, but aliens are runnin' it.

Watch for these updates, in no particular order:

US bombs Iran. China backs Iran.

The draft is reinstituted, because of the "emergency threat" from Iran.

The military industrial complex continues to slurp up the lion's share of the federal budget, and the media/Bush cabal continue to fine-tune their ability to raise and lower the fear level of the American people.

Every possible pool of money -- public and corporate pension funds, Social Security, whatever -- is raided by the corporadoes and government looters.

Bolton, if confirmed, enrages America's allies and opponents.

The trillions in federal debt continue to grow. Finally, the US dollar drops in free fall

Republicans in the Senate end the filibuster, ramrod every last disgusting judicial nomination through.

Rehnquist resigns or cannot continue as Chief Justice; Bush appoints Scalia or Thomas.

Drivers licenses to contain a radio frequency computer chip on them.

Cell phones (newer ones) already contain GPS.

More Americans jailed indefinitely without charges, called "enemy combatants." Judiciary backs up Bush.

Without any significant Communists to kick around, the populace is intermittently whipped into a frenzy to attack gay people and Muslims.

Journalists who tell the truth are fired, demoted or um, commit suicide.

Corporations pay ever less taxes, as do the wealthiest Americans. Middle and working class citizens pick up the slack.

Election flaws and fraud continue to be covered up, shoved under the rug, by complicit media and colluding politicians and election officials.

We live under a Shoot and Loot Government.

We have no meaningful vote, because the voting mechanisms are more insecure than Woody Allen.

I'm waiting for someone to tell me how to change it. Believe me, I have been busting my butt trying.

[cassandra uprising]

44. fascinating thread

while, i wasn't on du at the time of the election, i too screamed flee.

some of my favorite americans became ex-pats, nina simone and james baldwin to name a few (does david sedaris count?) all to france, funny enough.

my plan has been that when the time was right, i would apply to grad school in europe and plant the seed of dual citizenship. i have a friend who obtained an italian green card (or working visa, i can't remember)through attending and working at the university of bologna. he hasn't come back and that was about five years ago.

i've always wanted to live in another country, just for the perspective, but with the current political climate, i seriously consider obtaining dual citizenship more and more.

my punk rock roots tell me to stay and fight and that leaving is the bourgeois / elitists way out. -not to offend those who are leaving, by any means, but the choice of moving to another country for citizenship doesn't seem to be an option for those without money.

my sense tells me to go ex-pat.

the jury is out on where the heart is at, i am the hopes and dreams of my immigrant great-grandparents. and i love this country too much to watch go down her go down the tubes without doing everything i could in my power to put up a fight.

again, my sense tells me to go ex-pat.

tough question, awesome replies from both sides of the argument, and another reason why i'm a hooked on du.

[Doctor_J]

48. trying, but it looks like I'll be in Roveland another year

hoping for escape a year from now.

[Zorra]

49. I left right after Buh stole the 2000 election, and am still gone.

I am now more convinced than ever that I made the correct decision.

I cannot, in good conscience, support the Buh dictatorship in any way.

[Technowitch]

50. Planning, no. Thinking about it, yes.

I actually think we're closer to actually deciding to do it than we were a month after the election.

The USA has become a very scary place. Particularly for left-wing progressive types like myself and my same-sex wife.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

53. I'm keeping my options open

That's all I'll say.

[derby378]

55. This land is our land - not theirs

I'm staying. Someone has to find a way to boot these neo-fascists out of DC.

[Iterate]

58. Already gone; a better life in many ways, but

friends and family still have to endure it. I had good reasons to leave, to start over, but I was never under a moment's illusion I was escaping the zealots and BFEE, and I sure don't think that way now. I haven't escaped any sort of battle.

Global means global and anywhere you go it will be the more or less the same issues. People often flippantly toss out the phrase "world domination" but it's more true than they know. If unopposed, that bunch in the white house will not rest until they have every inch locked up, developed, WM/McD/MBNAed, militarized, baptized, suburbanized, and slave-wage employed. They're not going to tolerate the EU as it is now, or China, or India, or Venezuela, not in the long run. They can't. And even if they did win it all, they'd start to turn on each other. It's inherent in the nature of their thinking.

So I may have bought some breathing room, bought some time, but it's also more difficult to fight them from long range, harder to campaign, harder to have a local influence when you're not a native. One person alone doesn't stand a chance, but by learning, listening, organizing with Ami's and Germans, maybe something, some influence. The big difference is that I drink better wine while it happens.

Hmmm, I think I just said we won't have peace again in our lifetime. Maybe so.