Ok, there was a mouse in the house and I put poison down. Just noticed the poison is gone.

[Drunken Irishman]

Now I feel bad. Why?

I know the mouse is probably dead, dying or about to die and that makes me sad. But I also hated the thing. When I first saw it, my skin crawled. I should be happy that it probably will be gone or is gone, but I can't help but feel sad that it is dead.

:(

[DarkTirade]

1. I got lucky, last time a mouse got in here

he decided to perch out in plain view and I just caught him in a little plastic container and put him oustide a ways away so he wouldn't find his way back. He may have been a little cold, but I didn't have to set traps or poison or anything.

[Dangerously Amused]

2. You feel bad because you caused a creature to die a horrible, agonizing death... needlessly.

Next time use a live trap and release him far away. Please.

[Drunken Irishman]

3. Eh, I probably won't do that.

The things still freak me out.

[Skittles]

5. more freaked out than poisoning something?

:o

[Drunken Irishman]

11. I know, I'm evil.

But to be fair, I poison myself every day when I drink a glass of whiskey after work.

:o

[Sebastian Doyle]

25. Well, there's always the kind of "live trap" that doesn't require a release

Otherwise known as a cat.



Just make sure he knows which mouse he's supposed to eat!

[flvegan]

9. You rule.

:thumbsup:

[Kali]

17. dumping out in unfamiliar territory is more likely to lead

to a "horrible, agonizing death... needlessly" than the fantasy of a ""happily free ever after" that catch-and-release gives the users.

An old fashioned snap trap is fast, humane, and permanent.

[petronius]

23. I've wondered about that - is dumping a house-rodent out in the woods

any different from dumping an unwanted puppy out by the roadside?

The only rodents we get in the house are brought in by the cat, so we put them back outside - but I doubt they survive.

[Sebastian Doyle]

35. Well, let's put it this way....

A few years ago I found this mouse while cleaning out a shed. Poor thing was frozen in fear when he saw me. I didn't have a trap handy, so I brought in the cat. Cat looks at the mouse and then looks at me as if he was saying "Fuck you. You caught it, YOU eat it." so he was no help.

So I figured it was the mouse's lucky day and I turned him loose in the field. Later that night I saw an owl flying low right around the place I released the prisoner, so I suspect his freedom was short-lived.

[petronius]

24. Duplicate post. So here is a snippet of a poem:

The troubles of our proud and angry dust
are from eternity, and shall not fail.
Bear them we can, and if we can we must.
Shoulder the sky, my lad, and drink your ale.

A. E. Housman

[Dangerously Amused]

26. It's "more likely"? Really? Could you cite to your source for this info, please?

[Kali]

31. My source is common sense, what's yours?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mousetrap

Live-catching mousetraps

Other trap designs catch mice alive so that they can be released into the wild. It is important to release the mouse promptly – as mice can die from stress or dehydration – and at some distance, as mice have a strong homing instinct. Survival after release is not guaranteed, since house mice will tend to seek out human buildings, where they might encounter lethal mousetraps or may be eaten by predators. In the wild, house mice are very poor competitors, and cannot survive away from human settlements in areas where other small mammals, such as wood mice, are present.<6>

[Dangerously Amused]

33. So you made up the "more likely" "fact" to support your argument. Thought so.

Where in that source does it say that "releasing a mouse in unfamiliar territory is more likely to lead to a horrible, agonizing death ... than ... a happily free ever after," as you state?

And let's focus on the assertion "more likely," as that is the premise of your argument.

[Kali]

34. lets try some logic

Mice = small prey animals that reproduce in high numbers = low survival rates in normal circumstances.

ANY organism placed in unfamiliar environment = high stress, competition for food, shelter, mates, cover etc.

Prey animal caught (high stress) and dumped in unfamiliar territory = MORE LIKELY to die than live happily ever after.

People that practice catch and release with house pests are just fooling themselves and not taking responsibility for humanely disposing of such creatures.

Now how about YOU give me some evidence that releasing a trapped house mouse will have anything over a 10% chance of survival. (browsing around I found a statistic of 5% survival of ALREADY ADAPTED mice in the wild)

[Dangerously Amused]

37. Let's try not changing the subject.

You just cited to a "source" which had nothing to do with the "facts" you asserted. The truth is, you make stuff up and assert it as "fact" to support your arguments. It gets old, and when people call you out it actually has the opposite effect of the intent. There's some logic for you.


"Now how about YOU give me some evidence..." Not. I don't have to prove anything here. I'm not the one making shit up.

[Kali]

48. Excuse me, but you are the one that made the original statement

that I responded to. "You feel bad because you caused a creature to die a horrible, agonizing death... needlessly." You then told the OP to live trap and release. YOU are the one that is asserting releasing won't cause a "horrible, agonizing death".

So, I have to prove my assertion (that it is more likely to die that way after release than not - which I have done, if you think about it for a few seconds - I do have nature on my side, after all), while you claim I am changing the subject (WTF, where did I change any subject?) yet your feel-good recommendation just gets to stand with no evidence, no logic or even ANY rationale whatsoever? Not by me.

And while the OP did not say what kind of poison was used, the most common is an anticoagulant that essentially causes internal bleeding - nasty sounding but basically painless - there is even some debate about just how horrible and agonizing that death is. If the mouse doesn't drown searching for water (I agree not a pleasant way to die) it may just expire from blood loss - simply losing consciousness. Compared to being toyed with by a cat, eaten by some other predator, injured fighting for territory, starving, or slowly dying from exposure as opposed to some minuscule chance of making it after being dumped outdoors, one can reasonably conclude the snap trap is the best way to deal with a domestic pest such as a mouse or rat.

[peruban]

61. My, what a pissing contest I've stumbled onto!

Life is too short to worry about the life of a meager mouse. There are people dying everyday in every way, and many others being sold into slavery (yes, it still happens in some parts of the world). Just kill the damn thing and chalk it up to Darwinism.

[Kali]

67. I tend to agree, however I have some respect for people who

are in a mental place where they wish to reduce the "harm" they cause other life forms. What I have a problem with is self-delusion that an action actually causes less harm. In this case if you aren't going to let the mouse continue its natural existence in its preferred habitat (your house) then the most humane way to dispose of it is to kill it quickly.

Hypocrisy annoys me.

[peruban]

60. Screw that noise.

Kill the vermin and consider it revenge for the Black Plague.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

4. I get mice in the house once in awhile and the cats get them.

I feel a little sad and guilty about this, but if they'd been outside instead of under my refrigerator some other cat would probably have eaten them anyway. The main job of mice, unfortunately for them, is to be food for other animals.

[quakerboy]

22. Naw, thats Job 2

Job one is to make more meese.

[JVS]

6. Now you're going to have a stinking dead mouse in the house.

Always use the old-school traps for the clean kill and then properly dispose of the carcass.

[ThomCat]

7. Yup. If it dies inside a wall there is going to be a stench

for weeks or months as it decomposes. :(

[Drunken Irishman]

14. Once a mouse got into my aunt's heading vent and died...oh boy.

Of course, it was in the middle of the winter. Every time the heater kicked on, the smell would spread throughout the house.

Yikes!

[BrklynLiberal]

18. That is exactly what happened to me the one time I had a mouse and the

landlord put down poison. It died in the heating vent, and in the winter when the heat came on....It was the smell of roasting mouse all over the apt.
Never allowed poison after that.

the humane traps are much easier, safer and less messy. I just let them go in the park a few blocks from the house.

[DS1]

32. that's making me ill just thinking about it

warmed mouse rot in my nostrils

[Midlodemocrat]

30. I had an old landlady that used poison and they never died in the walls.

They left the building in search of water because the poison caused a really horrible thirst.

Once the water hit the poison...well, that was all she wrote.

[Drunken Irishman]

40. I think that's the same poison we use.

[peruban]

62. Stuck in the wall?

Reminds me of Edgar Allen Poe's "The Black Cat".

[rug]

8. It's probably under a piece of furniuture twitching, you bastard.

[Drunken Irishman]

12. Maybe it gave the poison to its kids, kind of like a Thanksgiving meal.

[Robeson]

10. Because you just murdered a life form - who has every right to live - as you do...

...and even killed it with a horrible poisonous death.

On a side note, I remember Mrs. Robeson - an RN for 30+ years told me the worst death she ever saw was in the intensive care unit, and a guy who was brought in, who had swallowed insecticide. He died agonizingly for 2 days.

That's what that mouse - you killed - is going through now.

In the future, there are no kill traps you can use, and can easily release them back to the wild. I have one behind my refrigerator as we speak.

But far be it for me to put a guilt trip on you....

[Drunken Irishman]

13. Well I felt sad at first, but now you've made me laugh, so ok.

I feel better. Thanks. :)

[Robeson]

15. Good for you....

...not so much the mouse.

[Drunken Irishman]

16. Well there you go.

I also step on bugs.

I'm evil, sue me.

[emilyg]

19. Reverence for life means

all life. I want you to feel guilty for about an hour. You could have borrowed my cats.

[Sebastian Doyle]

63. But then your cats would be murderers

and you would have to feel guilty about that. :(

[emilyg]

70. I am Catholic. I was born

with guilt. LOL

[Robeson]

20. I'd never sue someone who I agreed with politically, besides...

...anyone who is so big, bad and bold enough to poison mice, and crush insects with their feet, is not someone I'd want to tangle with...:P

[Drunken Irishman]

21. That's what I thought!

*Puffs out chest*

[LisaL]

27. If you think you have one mouse, I bet there are more.

Lots more.

[Drunken Irishman]

42. Oh I know. I just hate thinking about it.

I have visions that my basement is filled with like 100+ mice.

[IntravenousDemilo]

28. Cheer up, you still have finding its badly decomposed remains to look forward to.

:hide:

[Drunken Irishman]

41. Last year I didn't find any.

I think this poison sends them outside searching for water, so I get to avoid the whole mess.

[Midlodemocrat]

29. Hate to tell you this, Sparky, but they travel in packs. If you've seen one

there are others waiting...biding their time...watching...listening... MWAHAHAHAHA.

And, I would have done the same thing. I CANNOT handle rodentia.

[Drunken Irishman]

39. I hate you so much!

I think I heard them last night.

They normally avoid my room until late, late night and then they come out. When I go to bed, though, I can hear them moving. I'm afraid to look, because I have a feeling I'd glance down at the floor and it'd be covered in mice.

EWW

[Mugu]

36. You killed my kin?

[insanity]

38. Don't feel bad

My philosophy is that I do not go into nature and fuck with animals, but if animals come into my domain and fuck with me they die.

[skypilot]

68. That's how I feel about it.

I'm not one to fret over the demise of a mouse. Anything that isn't helping me pay the rent in my apartment doesn't get to run around pissing, shitting and gnawing on my stuff. Mice annoy me even more than flies.

[sinkingfeeling]

43. I live trap mice. Take them to the university and set them free near the tennis courts.

[rvablue]

44. I know this probably goes without saying, but I HOPE you don't have a cat or a dog

b/c it might not have been the mouse that took it/ate it. :scared:

[Drunken Irishman]

49. No animals. Not an animal person.

[Taverner]

45. Too bad you just can't leave out cubes of morphine for the little buggers

They'd still die, but at least they'd enjoy the ride

[azmouse]

46. The mouse probably just mixed that poison in with YOUR food....

HA! :P

<:3)~~~~~~
Poor little mousie....

[Drunken Irishman]

50. So that's why my chili tasted funny last night!

[dawgmom]

47. Traps are better

I don't feel any guilt whatsoever about killing mice. I don't want the filthy little shitbags in my house, shitting and pissing all over everything. However, I do think that traps are better than poison. It's quicker and thus more humane, and also you don't have to deal with the stench when they crawl off and die in the walls.

I live in the country. Mice are a fact of life, and mousetraps are my way of dealing with them.

[Drunken Irishman]

51. A family member bought a weird mouse trap.

I guess it's sticky and the mice feet get stuck to it and they will scream and cry trying to get out.

I could not deal with that shit.

[Arkansas Granny]

52. I agree with you about not feeling guilt over the mice, but I let my cat handle

them. She really enjoys it and I just have to dispose of the body when she has killed it. For some reason emptying a trap grosses me out, but picking up the cat's kill doesn't.:shrug:

[dawgmom]

53. It's not pleasant, I agree

I buy those traps that look like little black houses that they go into. All you see is their rear end and tail sticking out the back, and the release lever is on the outside. All I have to do is pick up the trap, hold it over the garbage bag, push down on the lever, and the carcass drops out. Sometimes I don't even bother with that, and just buy the cheap old fashioned traps, and throw the whole thing away -- trap and all. I use one of the reacher-grabber things to pick it up. (Discovered that tool after I had surgery one time, and couldn't bend over to pick things up.) Handy little bugger....

[Resuscitated Ethics]

54. Poison is bad on many levels-- use traps

A poisoned mouse can puke on your flatware then you eat poison too. Also any predators who may eat the dead mouse are eating poison and it gets food chained. Once the poison leaves your sight where did it go? Was it eaten or dragged somewhere else for a visiting child to wade through? Also mice are survivors. They will smell the poison on the dead and not eat it themselves, so no matter how effective first time it never lasts.

Leave mass rodent poisoning to the pros. You will find they have differing thoughts on it.

Use traps: snap or live. Read the instructions, bait well and sparingly, set in pathways.

Call in a licensed pro if they are nibbling you in your sleep.

Mice are not "the Borrowers". They are disturbing disease vectors. Don't feed them (?) Of course they eat anything: wax, the glue used to adhere soundproofing in old printers, leather. But poison is not a controllable solution and it is way too readily available.

My thoughts on the matter, informed by repeated viewings of the Ernest Borgnine "Willard".

[applegrove]

55. I had to kill a few mice with traps last year. I hated doing it but I hated living with mice more.

Cats were no help.

[harmonicon]

56. I know - I can't do it

There's a mouse that lives here, and I want him gone, but I don't have the heart to try to kill him. When I told the landlord that there were mice, he put down traps and poison when I was out of town for a week or so... well, it didn't work, so I got rid of them. Months later, I found another trap in a corner, which the wily mouse never killed himself with. I should get some sort of live trap.... though I actually feel a little bad leaving him out in the cold, but I think I could get over that.

[Kali]

57. I obviously prefer snap traps (see above) but I have a lot of experience

with this problem. One thing you can try with either kind of trap is to bait it for a few days to weeks but DON'T set it to catch. After you see the bait disappearing regularly then set it. Make sure there are no other sources of food anywhere. A small piece of chocolate stuck in a bit of peanutbutter is a very effective bait.

[harmonicon]

58. I just can't kill things

I could never do it. I need a live trap or something..... I want him out, but not dead by my hand.

[peruban]

64. It's only a mouse, not Mother Theresa or something.

If you're bold enough to eat a chicken salad sandwich you should have no qualms about destroying a disease carrying rodent. I respect life in all of its forms as I am a Buddhist Catholic, from amoeba to elephants, but killing is part of the natural order of things and so is death. You're just moving this creature's due date up a little. Trust me, it's probably not the worst thing you've ever done.

[peruban]

59. I hate the guilt, too.

But some species just can't coexist and humans and vermin are a perfect example. Consider it or justify it as a matter of natural selection. Darwin wins on this one, the stronger species wins out.

[sohndrsmith]

65. little Havahart traps cost like 2 bucks, maybe 4 - reusable and

no icky guilty sick feeling... worth a try maybe?

Just don't handle them if you find them - if you're in an area where vector borne disease is epidemic (NY, PA, CT, etc) white footed mouse is the primary carrier at this point. Especially in homes. If you find a dead one, wear rubber gloves. If you find a tick, get it analyzed if you're in an endemic area or state.

I'm sorry you feel bad - I would too... it's tough when dealing with something like this. That's why I suggest havaharts. I guess it depends on the type of house and how big the problem is, too.

Good luck! : ( (hugs).

[Deep13]

66. It's because through whatever cause, you have learned to personify animals. nt

[Runcible Spoon]

69. If you don't want mice be vigilant about cleaning up food messes, lock up all dry goods in metal

containers, thoroughly clean your cabinets, under the fridge, etc. Also lock up things you might not think of, like grass seeds in the garage and your garbage cans. It might not solve the problem if you live next to piggy neighbors, however but you won't be supporting a colony in your own home.