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Complete bullshit conspiracy theories. (Why do we tolerate these people?)

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JMDEM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-16-08 12:47 AM
Original message
Complete bullshit conspiracy theories. (Why do we tolerate these people?)
Edited on Mon Jun-16-08 12:49 AM by JMDEM
Here are but a few of the complete bullshit conspiracy theories that have made the rounds:

The US govt planned to blow up a passenger plane and blame it on Cuba.
The US govt let US citizens die of syphilis so it could study what the disease did to them
The US govt was complicit in the assassination of the elected president of Chile
The US govt dosed people, without their knowledge, with LSD and other powerful drugs


I can't believe that we tolerate such theories on DU. In my opinion, anyone propagating such theories should be immediately tombstoned, lest "outsiders" think we are a bunch of lunatics.

Tell you what -- when the majority of people think that there was a conspiracy in the JFK assassination, then maybe we could allow discussions on it. And when the majority of people think the official govt. story or 9/11 is bogus, then we could allow discussions on it too. But not until then.

edited for spelling.
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Diane_nyc Donating Member (714 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-16-08 06:50 AM
Response to Original message
1. Hee hee hee. Seriously, could the "debunkers" here please write out their DEFINITIONS of "CT"? nt
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Bassman66 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-16-08 06:57 AM
Response to Original message
2. There's the bullshit conspiracy theory
that's say's the Government didn't know what was happening in the lead up to 9/11.

I'm pretty sure that the right to freedom of speech is written down somewhere, perhaps on a goddamn piece of paper, I don't know.
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Ghost in the Machine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-16-08 07:13 AM
Response to Original message
3. I think people who display ignorance levels as deep as yours should be tombstoned immediately,
... lest "outsiders" think we are a bunch of ignorant dumbasses.

"Here are but a few of the complete bullshit conspiracy theories that have made the rounds:

The US govt planned to blow up a passenger plane and blame it on Cuba."


Ever heard of Operation Northwoods?

Operation Northwoods, or Northwoods, was a U.S false flag plan from 1962 as a "preliminary submission suitable for planning purposes" for the agenda of generating U.S. public support for military action against the Cuban government of Fidel Castro. The plan says, "The desired resultant from the execution of this plan would be to place the United States in the apparent position of suffering defensible grievances from a rash and irresponsible government of Cuba and to develop an international image of a Cuban threat to peace in the Western Hemisphere." Operation Northwoods was drafted by the Joint Chiefs of Staff and signed by the Chairman Lyman Lemnitzer, to the Secretary of Defense.

{snip}

In response to a request for pretexts for military intervention by the Chief of Operations of the Cuba Project, Brig. Gen. Edward Lansdale, the document lists methods (with, in some cases, outlined plans) the authors believed would garner public and international support for U.S. military intervention in Cuba. These are staged attacks purporting to be of Cuban origin.

"1. Since it would seem desirable to use legitimate provocation as the basis for US military intervention in Cuba a cover and deception plan, to include requisite preliminary actions such as has been developed in response to Task 33 c, could be executed as an initial effort to provoke Cuban reactions. Harassment plus deceptive actions to convince the Cubans of imminent invasion would be emphasized. Our military posture throughout execution of the plan will allow a rapid change from exercise to intervention if Cuban response justifies.

2. A series of well coordinated incidents will be planned to take place in and around Guantanamo to give genuine appearance of being done by hostile Cuban forces.

a. Incidents to establish a credible attack (not in chronological order):

(1) Start rumors (many). Use clandestine radio.

(2) Land friendly Cubans in uniform "over-the-fence" to stage attack on base.

(3) Capture Cuban (friendly) saboteurs inside the base.

(4) Start riots near the base main gate (friendly Cubans).

(5) Blow up ammunition inside the base; start fires.

(6) Burn aircraft on air base (sabotage).

(7) Lob mortar shells from outside of base into base. Some damage to installations.

(8) Capture assault teams approaching from the sea or vicinity of Guantanamo City.

(9) Capture militia group which storms the base.

(10) Sabotage ship in harbor; large fires -- napthalene.

(11) Sink ship near harbor entrance. Conduct funerals for mock-victims (may be lieu of (10)).

b. United States would respond by executing offensive operations to secure water and power supplies, destroying artillery and mortar emplacements which threaten the base.

c. Commence large scale United States military operations.

3. A "Remember the Maine" incident could be arranged in several forms:

a. We could blow up a US ship in Guantanamo Bay and blame Cuba.

b. We could blow up a drone (unmanned) vessel anywhere in the Cuban waters. We could arrange to cause such incident in the vicinity of Havana or Santiago as a spectacular result of Cuban attack from the air or sea, or both. The presence of Cuban planes or ships merely investigating the intent of the vessel could be fairly compelling evidence that the ship was taken under attack. The nearness to Havana or Santiago would add credibility especially to those people that might have heard the blast or have seen the fire. The US could follow up with an air/sea rescue operation covered by US fighters to "evacuate" remaining members of the non-existent crew. Casualty lists in US newspapers would cause a helpful wave of national indignation.

4. We could develop a Communist Cuban terror campaign in the Miami area, in other Florida cities and even in Washington.

The terror campaign could be pointed at refugees seeking haven in the United States. We could sink a boatload of Cubans enroute to Florida (real or simulated). We could foster attempts on lives of Cuban refugees in the United States even to the extent of wounding in instances to be widely publicized. Exploding a few plastic bombs in carefully chosen spots, the arrest of Cuban agents and the release of prepared documents substantiating Cuban involvement, also would be helpful in projecting the idea of an irresponsible government.

5. A "Cuban-based, Castro-supported" filibuster could be simulated against a neighboring Caribbean nation (in the vein of the 14th of June invasion of the Dominican Republic). We know that Castro is backing subversive efforts clandestinely against Haiti, Dominican Republic, Guatemala, and Nicaragua at present and possible others. These efforts can be magnified and additional ones contrived for exposure. For example, advantage can be taken of the sensitivity of the Dominican Air Force to intrusions within their national air space. "Cuban" B-26 or C-46 type aircraft could make cane-burning raids at night. Soviet Bloc incendiaries could be found. This could be coupled with "Cuban" messages to the Communist underground in the Dominican Republic and "Cuban" shipments of arm which would be found, or intercepted, on the beach.

6. Use of MIG type aircraft by US pilots could provide additional provocation. Harassment of civil air, attacks on surface shipping and destruction of US military drone aircraft by MIG type planes would be useful as complementary actions. An F-86 properly painted would convince air passengers that they saw a Cuban MIG, especially if the pilot of the transport were to announce such fact. The primary drawback to this suggestion appears to be the security risk inherent in obtaining or modifying an aircraft. However, reasonable copies of the MIG could be produced from US resources in about three months.

7. Hijacking attempts against civil air and surface craft should appear to continue as harassing measures condoned by the government of Cuba. Concurrently, genuine defections of Cuban civil and military air and surface craft should be encouraged.

8. It is possible to create an incident which will demonstrate convincingly that a Cuban aircraft has attacked and shot down a chartered civil airliner enroute from the United States to Jamaica, Guatemala, Panama or Venezuela. The destination would be chosen only to cause the flight plan route to cross Cuba. The passengers could be a group of college students off on a holiday or any grouping of persons with a common interest to support chartering a non-scheduled flight.

a. An aircraft at Eglin AFB would be painted and numbered as an exact duplicate for a civil registered aircraft belonging to a CIA proprietary organization in the Miami area. At a designated time the duplicate would be substituted for the actual civil aircraft and would be loaded with the selected passengers, all boarded under carefully prepared aliases. The actual registered aircraft would be converted to a drone.

b. Take off times of the drone aircraft and the actual aircraft will be scheduled to allow a rendezvous south of Florida. From the rendezvous point the passenger-carrying aircraft will descend to minimum altitude and go directly into an auxiliary field at Eglin AFB where arrangements will have been made to evacuate the passengers and return the aircraft to its original status. The drone aircraft meanwhile will continue to fly the filed flight plan. When over Cuba the drone will being transmitting on the international distress frequency a "MAY DAY" message stating he is under attack by Cuban MIG aircraft. The transmission will be interrupted by destruction of the aircraft which will be triggered by radio signal. This will allow ICAO radio stations in the Western Hemisphere to tell the US what has happened to the aircraft instead of the US trying to "sell" the incident.

9. It is possible to create an incident which will make it appear that Communist Cuban MIGs have destroyed a USAF aircraft over international waters in an unprovoked attack.

a. Approximately 4 or 5 F-101 aircraft will be dispatched in trail from Homestead AFB, Florida, to the vicinity of Cuba. Their mission will be to reverse course and simulate fakir aircraft for an air defense exercise in southern Florida. These aircraft would conduct variations of these flights at frequent Intervals. Crews would be briefed to remain at least 12 miles off the Cuban coast; however, they would be required to carry live ammunition in the event that hostile actions were taken by the Cuban MIGs.

b. On one such flight, a pre-briefed pilot would fly tail-end Charley at considerable interval between aircraft. While near the Cuban Island this pilot would broadcast that he had been jumped by MIGs and was going down. No other calls would be made. The pilot would then fly directly west at extremely low altitude and land at a secure base, an Eglin auxiliary. The aircraft would be met by the proper people, quickly stored and given a new tail number. The pilot who had performed the mission under an alias, would resume his proper identity and return to his normal place of business. The pilot and aircraft would then have disappeared.

c. At precisely the same time that the aircraft was presumably shot down a submarine or small surface craft would disburse F-101 parts, parachute, etc., at approximately 15 to 20 miles off the Cuban coast and depart. The pilots returning to Homestead would have a true story as far as they knew. Search ships and aircraft could be dispatched and parts of aircraft found."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Northwoods


I'll leave it up to you to research the rest of your post, if you have any interest in educating yourself.

Now, on the other hand, if your post was intended as pure sarcasm, I'll have to say "well done!" and leave it at that.

Ghost

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HamdenRice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-16-08 07:33 AM
Response to Reply #3
4. Hey, Ghost, I think he just forgot his sarcasm smilie
He's being ironic. He is, I think, saying all those things happened.
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Bassman66 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-16-08 07:35 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. Perhaps he is
My sarcasm detector has a temporary fault.

Sorry to the OP if that's the case.
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Ghost in the Machine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-16-08 07:54 AM
Response to Reply #4
6. I *really* hope he *is* being sarcastic, Hamden....
Maybe I should have waited until after my morning wake-up glass of tea before responding... but then again, there *are* people out there who say the same things he just said.... and mean it! Scarey, huh?

Peace!

Ghost

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Bassman66 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-16-08 08:16 AM
Response to Reply #6
7. I just read some of the OP's other posts
he's being sarcastic.
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Ghost in the Machine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-16-08 08:33 AM
Response to Reply #7
8. I did too... my apologies to the OP.... n/t
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JMDEM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-16-08 10:44 AM
Response to Reply #8
11. No problem. nt.
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SidDithers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-16-08 08:42 AM
Response to Original message
9. Existence of real conspiracies does not prove every CT...
Edited on Mon Jun-16-08 08:43 AM by SidDithers
each one must be evaluated individually, on its own merits.

So, how does real evidence at Tuskegee support the case for controlled demolition?
Answer: It doesn't.

Sid

Edit: and it doesn't support the case for your idiotic post about the AIDS/Cancer cure either.
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HamdenRice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-16-08 09:13 AM
Response to Reply #9
10. But it does prove that they are possible
One of the more mind numbing, counter factual allegations of the OCTers is that conspiracies can't happen because "someone would tell" or the "government can never keep secrets."

The existence of proven criminal conspiracies gives lie to these claims, yet OCTers continue to make them.
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Bassman66 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-16-08 05:19 PM
Response to Reply #10
12. It's absurd that OCTer's claim no one could keep a secret.
Anyone know what was discussed at the last Bilderberg meeting?
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wildbilln864 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 04:40 PM
Response to Reply #12
35. Excellent point! How many are keeping those secrets? nt
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Diane_nyc Donating Member (714 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 12:43 PM
Response to Reply #9
31. Again I ask: Define "conspiracy theory"?
Edited on Tue Jun-17-08 12:44 PM by Diane_nyc
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=125&topic_id=210224&mesg_id=210282">SidDithers wrote:

9. Existence of real conspiracies does not prove every CT...

Edited on Mon Jun-16-08 09:43 AM by SidDithers
each one must be evaluated individually, on its own merits.

So, how does real evidence at Tuskegee support the case for controlled demolition?
Answer: It doesn't.


Of course it doesn't. But perhaps it does indicate that there is something wrong with the term "conspiracy theory"?

Several times in the past few days, I've seen people here hollering at each other for not agreeing on the meaning of the term "conspiracy theory." For example, various "debunkers" have hollered things like, "a conspiracy theory is not just a theory about a conspiracy!"

Each time, I've posted a request for a definition of what the person meant by "conspiracy theory." But, so far, no "debunker" here has yet been willing to provide an explicit definition.

The best response I've gotten, so far, has been http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=125&topic_id=207795&mesg_id=210256">boloboffin's recommendation of Chip Berlet's writings about "conspiracism". It so happens that I was already familiar with Chip Berlet's writings (see my http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=125&topic_id=207795&mesg_id=210257">reply to boloboffin). But simply referring us to Chip Berlet's or anyone else's writings, or to the Wikipedia article on "conspiracy theory" (as someone else did) is not the same thing as providing a definition. Such external writings may be useful as a further explanation of one's perspective, but, as a means of resolving misunderstandings caused by different people's differing uses of the term "conspiracy theory," they are no substitute for giving us a definition, in your own words.

So again I ask all "debunkers" here: Please provide your definition of the term "conspiracy theory."
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leftofthedial Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-16-08 06:00 PM
Response to Original message
13. conspiracies are not possible
no conspiracy has ever happened, because the conspirators can't keep a secret.
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nebenaube Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-16-08 06:31 PM
Response to Original message
14. uh... your bullshit meter is broken...
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hack89 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-16-08 07:09 PM
Response to Original message
15. None of those CTs violate the laws of physics
Edited on Mon Jun-16-08 07:15 PM by hack89
And were not seen by millions as they happened.

The only 911 Ct that is similar to your examples is LIHOP (or perhaps a modified MIHOP whereby the government duped a bunch of Arab patsies into pulling it off). A small group of plotters could certainly keep a secret like that. The planes hit the towers and the combined structural damage and fires led to their collapse - end of story.

Where the truth movement derails is when it forwards more "esoteric" theories like CD, thermate, no-planes, nukes, space rays, etc. Those cases are not similar to your examples at all - we all saw the towers collapse, we all saw the photos of the Pentagon damage. The government does not monopolize the knowledge to analyze what we all saw. Anyone with a decent engineering background can figure out that the towers did not need CD to collapse. Anyone with a background in digital processing can understand that holo-planes were impossible. Anyone with the proper background understands why nukes were not used.

If the truth movement stuck to LIHOP, then you would be correct. It is all the other pseudo science BS that the truth movement embraces that blows your argument away.
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Bassman66 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 02:11 AM
Response to Reply #15
16. "If the truth movement stuck to LIHOP"
Actually this is true.

Unfortunately we have a COINTELPRO going on to create every distraction possible under the sun.

Dig for LIHOP on the rest will follow if there is anything.
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Diane_nyc Donating Member (714 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 08:00 AM
Response to Reply #16
17. COINTELPRO
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=125x210224#210513">Bassman66 wrote:

Unfortunately we have a COINTELPRO going on to create every distraction possible under the sun.


We have a possible, indeed likely COINTELPRO-like operation going on. But it's not yet an established historical fact. Correct me if I'm wrong, but, as far as I am aware, there haven't yet been any 9/11 Truth movement agent whistleblowers, whereas there were plenty of former FBI agents who blew the whistle on the COINTELPRO operations of the 1960's.

(Some of the latter whistleblowers, and some specific known historical COINTELPRO incidents, are mentioned in the Visibility 9-11 podcasts http://visibility911.libsyn.com/index.php?post_id=178475#">Me and My Shadow, 4 February 2007, and http://visibility911.libsyn.com/index.php?post_id=183849#:URL">Visibility 9-11 Welcomes Dr. William F. Pepper, 19 February 2007. Unfortunately, in http://visibility911.com/reports-cointelpro01.php">other podcasts in that series, some people make thoroughly undocumented claims about COINTELPRO allegedly going on right now. It is certainly possible, indeed likely, that something like COINTELPRO is going on right now, but it's premature to treat any specific allegations about current COINTELPRO in the 9/11 Truth movement as established fact.)
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Bassman66 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 08:41 AM
Response to Reply #17
20. COINTELPRO in the 60's involved feet on the ground
in the age of the microchip it's just fingers on keyboards and not many required at all.

It's a different virtual ballgame.
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Diane_nyc Donating Member (714 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 08:57 AM
Response to Reply #20
23. It's true that COINTELPRO in today's world would have to be a very different ball game, but ....
Edited on Tue Jun-17-08 09:03 AM by Diane_nyc
... but that, in itself, is no answer to the question of whether and why any of today's COINTELPRO allegations, in the context of the 9/11 Truth movement, should be considered established facts.

As far as you are aware, is there any evidence for any of these allegations besides "agent-like" behaviors of certain people, plus guilt by association?

As I said, it is indeed likely that there are COINTELPRO-like operations happening now. But we shouldn't assert any such allegation as established fact unless we can provide good evidence.

It doesn't help our credibility for us to be jumping to conclusions. Too many "agent" or "shill" accusations just make us look paranoid, and can also be very divisive.

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Bassman66 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 09:14 AM
Response to Reply #23
24. No planes, nukes, holograms
all of them and their adherents bear the signature of COINTELPRO.

It's all a distraction.

"and can also be very divisive."

Divisive? I'm being divisive by pointing that out? COINTELPRO is intended to be divisive.

The real issues are in "Press for Truth", the rest is a circus.


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Diane_nyc Donating Member (714 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 09:36 AM
Response to Reply #24
25. It's fine to say you SUSPECT that these things are COINTELPRO, but ....
Edited on Tue Jun-17-08 09:38 AM by Diane_nyc
--- But there's a big difference between suspicion and assertions of fact.

Do you have any smoking-gun evidence of where the "no planes theories" and other such ridiculous claims actually come from? How do you know that they don't just come from very irresponsible people?

I agree with you that the nuttier claims are, in and of themselves, divisive. However, jumping to conclusions about other people's motives, in the absence of strong evidence, is also divisive. Even worse, it also makes us look like a bunch of paranoids, thereby damaging our own credibility.

I agree with your endorsement of "9/11: Press for Truth," by the way.


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Bassman66 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 09:50 AM
Response to Reply #25
26. No planes and the rest
is credible?

OK.

You're worried about credibility?

OK.

People have to wake up to what's happening. It's classic COINTELPRO.

If it looks like a duck and walks like a duck it's a duck.
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SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-18-08 06:46 PM
Response to Reply #26
45. "If it looks like a duck and walks like a duck it's a duck."
Edited on Wed Jun-18-08 06:48 PM by SDuderstadt
I'm just curious....is the above an exception to your "we can't know anything for certain" rule? Or, are you abandoning the previous position? Actually, if we can't know anything for certain, how do we even know there is such a thing as a duck? I need to know before I get into another debate.
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Bassman66 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 10:01 AM
Response to Reply #25
29. Sorry, in addition
"Even worse, it also makes us look like a bunch of paranoids, thereby damaging our own credibility."

There is no US!

No US!

I have no connection with people who push no planes, I don't see myself as part of any group who push no planes, there is no single "truth movement", I don't care about people pushing the goofy stuff, they can take a hike, I don't trust them.

The OCTers want to pretend that there is such a thing as a single entity "troofers movement" so they can use the COINTELPRO to smear everyone in the classic way, look at this forum, they're always doing it.

There is a wide spectrum of questions about 9/11 and each must be judged on it's own merits. The good questions get lost in the no planes circus, but that's the intention.

In my opinion it should be kept as simple as possible in the way "Press for Truth" does it. Just why did the Government obstruct the 9/11 CR? That's the simplest and most effective weapon there is.

The rest is deliberate distraction, some people are duped and some are dupers, I apologise to the duped and wish for them to wake up soon.






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SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 07:52 PM
Response to Reply #29
40. So, you're saying the "no-planes" claim is bullshit?
You're so transparent. You're obviously COINTELPRO.
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Anarcho-Socialist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 10:38 AM
Response to Reply #24
30. Hmmm I disagree
Edited on Tue Jun-17-08 10:40 AM by Anarcho-Socialist
There seem to be plenty of people with overly-active imaginations who believe in no-planes, nukes, holograms and directed-energy beam theories. A lot of them are evidently present on DU. My ex-brother-in-law is an adamant no-planer I'm sad to say and he's certainly not COINTELPRO, he just happens to be attracted to these highly speculative conspiracy theories.

With someone like Alex Jones who pushes these types of theories, I don't think he's COINTELPRO, he's just a man out to make a buck. Most rational observers know what he is about. The right-wing populism that Alex Jones, Lyndon LaRouche and their fellow travellers revel in is very much hostile to the Bush administration from a right-ward perspective. They have latched on to the "Truth Movement" (or if you prefer, its highly disagreeing and divergent factions) to further their own agenda.
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Bassman66 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 03:13 PM
Response to Reply #30
34. You missed my point
There's the dupers and the duped.

I'm sure your brother didn't invest a large amount of money getting the no planes videos and web sites out on the internet.

COINTELPRO, some people are creating it and some have fallen for it, they need to wake up and focus on the real 9/11 issues.
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SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 07:49 PM
Response to Reply #20
39. This is Agent X543YGM filing my Tuesday evening Report
My control # is 126578....oh, crap. I accidentally posted this here.


Mods...could you please delete this> This was supposed to be a secure communication with my COINTELPRO handler. My apologies.
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Grateful for Hope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 07:46 PM
Response to Reply #17
38. Hey Diane
I tried to send you a PM, but, I guess you do not have enough posts yet. Just wanted to say that I hope you do not give up on this forum, and that you continue to post here.

I already value your input very much.

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Anarcho-Socialist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 08:17 AM
Response to Original message
18. How's this for a bullshit conspiracy theory?
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 08:41 AM
Response to Reply #18
19. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Anarcho-Socialist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 08:44 AM
Response to Reply #19
21. LOL
OK, that was a bit random of you. I'm an atheist so really I don't really know what you're getting at.
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jberryhill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 10:01 AM
Response to Reply #21
28. Do you remember the guy...

...who used to put random Buy-bull quotes at the end of his rantings, on the same apparent assumption that it would "appeal" to skeptics?

Just weird.
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Bassman66 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 08:47 AM
Response to Reply #19
22. It makes no difference
Pope John Paul II had literally millions of Catholics praying for him every day. It didn't prevent his blooper when he publically prayed in Jordan that St John the Baptist protect Islam.

From the Vatican web site:
http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/john_paul_ii/travels/documents/hf_jp-ii_spe_20000321_wadi-al-kharrar_en.html

You heard the joke response "is the Pope a Catholic", well with JPII it was a serious question.

All those people praying for him as well!
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jberryhill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 09:59 AM
Response to Reply #19
27. Which of "you OCTabots" engages in that nonsense?

No doubt, things are bizarre in freeperville.

The religious delusions of folks in the Bush Administration are a primary reason why we are in the mess we are in.

If you want to argue with non-reality-based freeper wingnuts, go sign up for an account there.

(reminds me of the guy in a thread recently that thought my avatar - an image from an artifact which radio-carbon dates to around 1390 - was some sort of expression of religious belief)
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HamdenRice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 01:07 PM
Response to Reply #27
32. Scardy cats!
The point is that you guys are on the "same side." The "Bush talks to Jesus" crowd also believe completely in the official 9/11 story. Ergo, you believe Bush talks to Jesus.

Why are you so terrified that the messages of your cohorts remain on this board? Which one of you scardy cats went crying, begging and pleading that it be deleted?
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Anarcho-Socialist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 03:10 PM
Response to Reply #32
33. Why don't you take responsibility for your posts?
rather than whining publicly that they were deleted and/or reported on.
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HamdenRice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 06:27 PM
Response to Reply #33
37. And why don't you take responsibility for arguing

that George W. has a hotline to Jesus?

I've never seen an OCTabot take responsibility for that.

So what do you say, how do you defend the idea that George talks to God every night?

Let's hear your response!
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SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 07:55 PM
Response to Reply #37
41. Because he's stupid....
that was easy.
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Anarcho-Socialist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 08:51 PM
Response to Reply #37
42. I'm an atheist. End of discussion.
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HamdenRice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 06:26 PM
Response to Reply #32
36. delete -- wrong place
Edited on Tue Jun-17-08 06:27 PM by HamdenRice
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jberryhill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 09:55 PM
Response to Reply #32
43. That is the most broken syllogism you've come up with yet
Edited on Tue Jun-17-08 09:59 PM by jberryhill
The "believe completely in the official 9/11 story" is a nice touch.

You share more beliefs in common with George Bush than beliefs you do not.

Do you believe that a released object will fall under the influence of gravity?

Do you believe that 2+2=4?

I'd guess that George Bush believes those things. Well, maybe both... with a little practice and some finger work, he might be able to figure out the math problem.

Some people believe that a person named Jesus lived in Palestine some 2000 years ago. If such a person lived at that time and place, it is a certainty that George Bush does not talk to him.

But you want to know who else thinks they talk to Jesus?

Alex Jones.

So, Alex Jones believes in Biblical prophecy, Jesus, and the whole works. Alex Jones is a truther. Therefore, truthers are Buy-bull thumpers, just like Jones.

It's an idiotic construct, and I'm sure there is a range of religious beliefs that do not correlate in any particular manner with 9/11 "inside job" stuff.

And need we mention Dr. Jones and his published work on how Jesus visited the Americas? Yah... thermite, golden plates, and magic underwear. Hmmmmm....
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SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 10:04 PM
Response to Reply #43
44. For the record...
I also talk to Jesus every night. Jesus Saavedra is my next door neighbor and he pronounces it "hay-zoos". I am thinking of printing up some bumperstickers that say, "WWJSD?" (What would Jesus Saavedra do?)
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